PG: Knicks-Suns, where the SL squad plays basketball better

[F N 11]

Pointless watching games with Randle as your “best player”. Going to be dark times trading everybody else to build around him.

[F N 11]

We’ll damn Randles trainer again…………..

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Clearly Randle is the player other starters are subtweeting about!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Led astray, can’t wait until he is gone. Should of never dedicated yourself to him after drafting Obi smh.

[TheGreenArrow]

We’ll damn Randles trainer again…………..

Read on Twitter

Clearly Randle is the player other starters are subtweeting about!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Led astray, can’t wait until he is gone. Should of never dedicated yourself to him after drafting Obi smh.

Read on Twitter

Trade Randle!!!!!!!!!

[Gravy]

It could be worse; we could have Lebron, AD, Melo, Dwight Howard and still be under .500

[DaGawd]

I think a positive to come from this game is the way the starters played for the first 12 minutes… Fournier was getting his shots in rhythm, Kemba looks a little better running the offense, Randle was not playing as much as iso-ball and Mitch was cleaning up everything…

We really missed D.Rose running the bench offense and Burks should never run the point over IQ (which Thibs did in the beginning— big fail)…

I think we just gotta extrapolate that first quarter into a full 48 minutes and with time and more experience playing together I think we can do that

Unless RJ comes to life, Randle finds his shooting stroke this offense is cooked. Team is built around Randle and RJ. They're missing right now.

Starters need a shake up in the worst way. Thibs has to stop being so damn stubborn

Thibs probably feels like there’s really no fixing this without some roster moves

[HarthorneWingo]

We’ll damn Randles trainer again…………..

Read on Twitter

Clearly Randle is the player other starters are subtweeting about!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Led astray, can’t wait until he is gone. Should of never dedicated yourself to him after drafting Obi smh.

Read on Twitter

Trade Randle!!!!!!!!!

For the "team leader" Julius sure has bad body language. And then he tries to do too much.

[bearadonisdna]

Kinda funny Mitch on bball ref his injury update has him being on the bears .

https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/r/robinmi01.html

At 7 ppg and 7 rpg this isn’t the guy anybody thought he would be. It’s like year 4 for this dude and given the free pass except for a few on the board .

Why does the team play so terrible with him ? At this point I can’t call for his replacement because there is no hope . It’s better to get answers and solutions I guess at this point.
Thibs has history sticking to guys that had marginal nba value.
Bogans
Boozer
Bogans started while Kyle freakin Korver was on the bench and Ronnie brewer . Even cj Watson if you like him .

Boozer started over Taj while taj was in his prime . And boozer was out of the league in like a year .

This might be the path I see for Mitch, possibly out of the league as the main culprit for a history worst unit.

[WajaBawl]

I was going through the lineup numbers just for sh*ts and giggles and after 2 minutes you can tell that the problem with the team is Kemba.

Our starting 5 man lineup (which has the most minutes of any 5 man unit in the NBA) has a net rating of -15.5. Which is god awful. And most people would look at those numbers and just say all the starters suck

However, when you check the 3-man lineup of Randle, RJ and Fournier their net rating is only -5.5.

Considering how much that lineup plays with Kemba it is pretty crazy that the lineup is 10 points better just from the few minutes they play without Kemba.

Futhermore, if you check the 4-man lineup of Rose, RJ, Randle and Fournier (that have played 73 minutes total this season) that group has a net rating of 26.6!!!

We can’t pretend anymore. Kemba is washed. You don’t put together the worst starting lineup in history, with starting level NBA players, without there something being something deeper. It’s beyond basketball. While we can’t see it the numbers don’t lie. Kemba is not playing like an NBA player right now, he needs to sit

I've been saying this from the start. When people initially started to turn on Randle and sour on him as a whole, I said the bigger issue is our backcourt and more specifically backcourt defense. Both Kemba and Fournier are revolving doors and it breaks down the entire teams defense. Now while I still have hope that Fourniers offensive production will be able to slightly mitigate that (it has to, with the contract we gave him), Kemba is straight up playing like Jose Calderon out there. He's washed and the FO has to face the music.

It's time to look inwards and develop our own youth like every other respectable NBA franchise does. We didn't draft any projects, but rather went for prospects that could contribute right away; Grimes with his shooting and McBride with his defense and playmaking.
Play the freaking kids. Let IQ start, let Grimes take his backup slot and give McBride plenty of opportunities to shine in the G-League while he waits his turn. Stop giving opportunities to over-the-hill vets and start playing faster and younger.

[Adelheid]

The microscope is now focused on Julius. Every face he makes, every bad body language he displays, is being magnified and scrutinized in great detail; especially now that the team isnt looking well.

With great money comes great responsibility

[bearadonisdna]

this team 2.5 games from 2nd seed.
why so serious?
This team is healthy, other teams are dipping into their reserves, plan B's, and it aint even 20 games in .
what if this thibs playing chess, or doing rope a dope on the league?

[GettinitDone]

I think we just need to accept the team will be average at best until a big trade happens. Might even be in the lottery and might be a couple years too. Temper expectations

Do lottery properly (tank) and you won't even need to count on a big trade, which with the assets we have is a long shot.

KP, before he requested a trade, was a lottery hit done right. He was unstoppable before he tore his ACL, averaging 30ppg and 10rpg, looking every bit of a legit franchise player, he led us to wins too.

Yeah there are lottery busts but the point is to keep playing until we get it right. We can't keep half assing getting 7th - 9th range, we gotta tank right, get into top 3-4 pick for 3 straight years (preferably 2 hits for only 2 years, but 3 years is VERY acceptable considering we have been in **** for decades), then I guarantee we will have something.

If I were Leon or Dolan, I would have definitely done it, I'd be willing to be thrown eggs at, I'd take an egg for the team.

[bearadonisdna]

but yea i get it.
this team tonight had more turnovers than assist.
only 1 block.
And the starting lineup is historically bad.
None of us signed up for this .

The playoffs was a bad taste of thibs not sticking to his guns. Everybody got on board with his style then he abandoned it at the 1st sign of trouble.

Its kinda like torture, kinda like head games. Like he is disciplining a dog but we graduated too fast. Like he got to get them beatings in.
Or the dangling carrot. Its enough to warp you.

Somewhere down the line we have to believe there is a positive to playing a historically bad lineup, over and over again as long as it is standing. Objectively there are pros and cons.
To me the major con is that its historically bad and that outweighs most positivity.

My next step is Can the FO demand a lineup change? Save thibs from himself . Does it poison the relationship. Would thibs oblige? Its not like jerry jones an owner dictating personnel moves, the FO is directly involved the on court product etc.

[Celo]

I'm seriously wondering why Kemba's always (or at least most of the time) the scapegoat here

I've rewatched the first quarter - which obviously is neither representative of the whole game nor of Kemba's whole season. But I think it's more than enough to get a glimpse of our problems. Let's start first with the matchups: Suns had Mikal (arguably their best perimeter defender) guarding Kemba - which to me shows that he's still commanding enough respect around the league. We on the other hand had Kemba defending the POA. Everyone and their momma knows that that's a recipe for failure. And that's also why the Kemba-Fournier BC is not working: If you have RJ defending the best opposing wing, you need someone in the starting five to defend the POA. That's why to me the easiest solution would be starting IQ instead of Fournier. But do you know who's an even worse PnR-Defender (at the moment)? Our precious franchise player Julius Randle. If you guys have the league pass or dvr'd the game just watch the 1st quarter at the 8 min mark. Kemba and Randle defend (tbh it's an insult calling that defending lol) a CP3-Crowder PnP. I don't know what Randle is doing in that possession, I bet he doesn't even know himself. That **** was embarrassing. If I'm the Knicks opponent, I'm running 1-4 PnRs/PnPs all game long. But let's move on to the offense.

Our offense looked the best (in the 1st quarter) when we ran Kemba PnRs. I've counted 6 PnRs, the results were the following: 1 wide-open Kemba mid-range (miss), 1 wide-open Fournier 3-pointer (made), 1 Kemba lay-up (made), 1 Kemba pull-up 3 (made), 1 TO (miscommunication with Mitch on an Alley-attempt) and 1 open Randle Mid-Range shot (made). Didn't count the possessions Randle initiated, but I know there was an unnecessary long 2 that was heavily contested as well as a TO out of a post up. I'm not saying let's run Kemba PnRs all game. But it's the easiest way for us to create offense because Kemba was the only one getting into the paint and thus breaking down the defense. As much as I love IQ, he isn't there yet. Hence why I'd like to start him next to Kemba.

Long story short: Make a starting lineup change, hide Kemba off-ball and make him initiate the offense more. I don't see him as the reason why we are so bad. Kemba's still a good enough player to help us win games. We just need to do a better job of hiding his weaknesses and playing him more to his strengths on offense.

[NoDopeOnSundays]

:-? Every GM makes the same "mistakes" with this owner. The way we don't prioritize the development of young players is a feature, not a bug with any particular GM. Our biggest hope is that Evan absolutely balls out so we can move him and one of our young guys breaks out massively so they have to play him. Otherwise, young players are a means to an end to acquire established names.

The next GM won't do it differently.

Masai was the guy that would have been able to do it for us

[NoDopeOnSundays]

I'm seriously wondering why Kemba's always (or at least most of the time) the scapegoat here

I've rewatched the first quarter - which obviously is neither representative of the whole game nor of Kemba's whole season. But I think it's more than enough to get a glimpse of our problems. Let's start first with the matchups: Suns had Mikal (arguably their best perimeter defender) guarding Kemba - which to me shows that he's still commanding enough respect around the league. We on the other hand had Kemba defending the POA. Everyone and their momma knows that that's a recipe for failure. And that's also why the Kemba-Fournier BC is not working: If you have RJ defending the best opposing wing, you need someone in the starting five to defend the POA. That's why to me the easiest solution would be starting IQ instead of Fournier. But do you know who's an even worse PnR-Defender (at the moment)? Our precious franchise player Julius Randle. If you guys have the league pass or dvr'd the game just watch the 1st quarter at the 8 min mark. Kemba and Randle defend (tbh it's an insult calling that defending lol) a CP3-Crowder PnP. I don't know what Randle is doing in that possession, I bet he doesn't even know himself. That **** was embarrassing. If I'm the Knicks opponent, I'm running 1-4 PnRs/PnPs all game long. But let's move on to the offense.

Our offense looked the best (in the 1st quarter) when we ran Kemba PnRs. I've counted 6 PnRs, the results were the following: 1 wide-open Kemba mid-range (miss), 1 wide-open Fournier 3-pointer (made), 1 Kemba lay-up (made), 1 Kemba pull-up 3 (made), 1 TO (miscommunication with Mitch on an Alley-attempt) and 1 open Randle Mid-Range shot (made). Didn't count the possessions Randle initiated, but I know there was an unnecessary long 2 that was heavily contested as well as a TO out of a post up. I'm not saying let's run Kemba PnRs all game. But it's the easiest way for us to create offense because Kemba was the only one getting into the paint and thus breaking down the defense. As much as I love IQ, he isn't there yet. Hence why I'd like to start him next to Kemba.

Long story short: Make a starting lineup change, hide Kemba off-ball and make him initiate the offense more. I don't see him as the reason why we are so bad. Kemba's still a good enough player to help us win games. We just need to do a better job of hiding his weaknesses and playing him more to his strengths on offense.

It's not that easy to hide Kemba, especially not in a lineup with Fournier who also needs to be hidden. Even if you put Fournier on the bench it's going to be hard to hide Kemba because he's small, so putting him on a non offensive SF could still lead to clean looks for his opponent. He's going to be a defensive liability against any perimeter team that has a solid to great PG, SG and SF lineup.

[Celo]

I'm seriously wondering why Kemba's always (or at least most of the time) the scapegoat here

I've rewatched the first quarter - which obviously is neither representative of the whole game nor of Kemba's whole season. But I think it's more than enough to get a glimpse of our problems. Let's start first with the matchups: Suns had Mikal (arguably their best perimeter defender) guarding Kemba - which to me shows that he's still commanding enough respect around the league. We on the other hand had Kemba defending the POA. Everyone and their momma knows that that's a recipe for failure. And that's also why the Kemba-Fournier BC is not working: If you have RJ defending the best opposing wing, you need someone in the starting five to defend the POA. That's why to me the easiest solution would be starting IQ instead of Fournier. But do you know who's an even worse PnR-Defender (at the moment)? Our precious franchise player Julius Randle. If you guys have the league pass or dvr'd the game just watch the 1st quarter at the 8 min mark. Kemba and Randle defend (tbh it's an insult calling that defending lol) a CP3-Crowder PnP. I don't know what Randle is doing in that possession, I bet he doesn't even know himself. That **** was embarrassing. If I'm the Knicks opponent, I'm running 1-4 PnRs/PnPs all game long. But let's move on to the offense.

Our offense looked the best (in the 1st quarter) when we ran Kemba PnRs. I've counted 6 PnRs, the results were the following: 1 wide-open Kemba mid-range (miss), 1 wide-open Fournier 3-pointer (made), 1 Kemba lay-up (made), 1 Kemba pull-up 3 (made), 1 TO (miscommunication with Mitch on an Alley-attempt) and 1 open Randle Mid-Range shot (made). Didn't count the possessions Randle initiated, but I know there was an unnecessary long 2 that was heavily contested as well as a TO out of a post up. I'm not saying let's run Kemba PnRs all game. But it's the easiest way for us to create offense because Kemba was the only one getting into the paint and thus breaking down the defense. As much as I love IQ, he isn't there yet. Hence why I'd like to start him next to Kemba.

Long story short: Make a starting lineup change, hide Kemba off-ball and make him initiate the offense more. I don't see him as the reason why we are so bad. Kemba's still a good enough player to help us win games. We just need to do a better job of hiding his weaknesses and playing him more to his strengths on offense.

It's not that easy to hide Kemba, especially not in a lineup with Fournier who also needs to be hidden. Even if you put Fournier on the bench it's going to be hard to hide Kemba because he's small, so putting him on a non offensive SF could still lead to clean looks for his opponent. He's going to be a defensive liability against any perimeter team that has a solid to great PG, SG and SF lineup.

It's not an easy task (at least against good teams), no doubt about that. Nonetheless I think we would've been better defensively if we had Kemba on Mikal for example and then someone else on the POA. I'd rather live with a 3rd/4th option shooting over Kemba then having him die on the first screen while defending the POA and thus breaking down our whole defense, especially since our defensive rotations in the starting lineup are awful.

I'm still dreaming of somehow being able to aquire Brogdon

[knicks94]

This team will eventually go back to being a dumpster fire! Thank goodness I haven’t watched a game at all this season.

[NoDopeOnSundays]

I'm seriously wondering why Kemba's always (or at least most of the time) the scapegoat here

I've rewatched the first quarter - which obviously is neither representative of the whole game nor of Kemba's whole season. But I think it's more than enough to get a glimpse of our problems. Let's start first with the matchups: Suns had Mikal (arguably their best perimeter defender) guarding Kemba - which to me shows that he's still commanding enough respect around the league. We on the other hand had Kemba defending the POA. Everyone and their momma knows that that's a recipe for failure. And that's also why the Kemba-Fournier BC is not working: If you have RJ defending the best opposing wing, you need someone in the starting five to defend the POA. That's why to me the easiest solution would be starting IQ instead of Fournier. But do you know who's an even worse PnR-Defender (at the moment)? Our precious franchise player Julius Randle. If you guys have the league pass or dvr'd the game just watch the 1st quarter at the 8 min mark. Kemba and Randle defend (tbh it's an insult calling that defending lol) a CP3-Crowder PnP. I don't know what Randle is doing in that possession, I bet he doesn't even know himself. That **** was embarrassing. If I'm the Knicks opponent, I'm running 1-4 PnRs/PnPs all game long. But let's move on to the offense.

Our offense looked the best (in the 1st quarter) when we ran Kemba PnRs. I've counted 6 PnRs, the results were the following: 1 wide-open Kemba mid-range (miss), 1 wide-open Fournier 3-pointer (made), 1 Kemba lay-up (made), 1 Kemba pull-up 3 (made), 1 TO (miscommunication with Mitch on an Alley-attempt) and 1 open Randle Mid-Range shot (made). Didn't count the possessions Randle initiated, but I know there was an unnecessary long 2 that was heavily contested as well as a TO out of a post up. I'm not saying let's run Kemba PnRs all game. But it's the easiest way for us to create offense because Kemba was the only one getting into the paint and thus breaking down the defense. As much as I love IQ, he isn't there yet. Hence why I'd like to start him next to Kemba.

Long story short: Make a starting lineup change, hide Kemba off-ball and make him initiate the offense more. I don't see him as the reason why we are so bad. Kemba's still a good enough player to help us win games. We just need to do a better job of hiding his weaknesses and playing him more to his strengths on offense.

It's not that easy to hide Kemba, especially not in a lineup with Fournier who also needs to be hidden. Even if you put Fournier on the bench it's going to be hard to hide Kemba because he's small, so putting him on a non offensive SF could still lead to clean looks for his opponent. He's going to be a defensive liability against any perimeter team that has a solid to great PG, SG and SF lineup.

It's not an easy task (at least against good teams), no doubt about that. Nonetheless I think we would've been better defensively if we had Kemba on Mikal for example and then someone else on the POA. I'd rather live with a 3rd/4th option shooting over Kemba then having him die on the first screen while defending the POA and thus breaking down our whole defense, especially since our defensive rotations in the starting lineup are awful.

I'm still dreaming of somehow being able to aquire Brogdon

I don't disagree that we should try to hide him, but a team like the Suns with CP3 as their PG is always going to find the weak link. If we had put him on Mikal they would have him break on missed shots and cut to the rim non stop in the half court. There's not much we can do against teams like that if he's on the floor, it's the bed we made

[Fat Kat]

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Still the Mecca though!!!!!!!!!!

We could’ve had him. The casuals don’t understand the vision though. Vassell is gonna be the new Mikal. Oh well.

[HEZI]

We’ll damn Randles trainer again…………..

Read on Twitter

Clearly Randle is the player other starters are subtweeting about!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Led astray, can’t wait until he is gone. Should of never dedicated yourself to him after drafting Obi smh.

Read on Twitter

Trade Randle!!!!!!!!!

!!!!!