Shams: Knicks preparing to offer Thibs an extension

[MrDollarBills]

I think one thing ppl need to understand, Brunson is 100% all in on Thibs. If the teams superstar player is publicly endorsing the guy after a crushing game 7 loss, that means something, especially coming from a guy like Brunson who is very measured in his media comments.

The lack of depth has to be addressed but I don't see Thibs going anywhere. But something has to change because while I don't buy the argument that these injuries are Thibs fault, playing 48 mins is not sustainable.

The Thibs Paradox is he likes guys who can produce under the duress of a heavy workload, yet he can only find out if a player is that kind of guy by giving him those extended minutes to test them out. It is why he prefers veterans. They've already been stress tested.

He will play a bigger rotation earlier in the season, but he will tend to reduce heading into the playoffs. We did not have the depth left for him to play his preferred 8 guy rotation so he played a 7-8 man rotation with the last men available.

If we had 12 quality players that can be in the rotation at any time, odds are we'd withstand any injuries as long as they are not your top 2-3 players.

My only question is if this FO will keep drafting players to develop or just keep making the kinds of deals that have brought them success these past seasons?

Of our drafted players, Deuce, Grimes, RJ, IQ and Mitch, there's only 2 left and only 1 still standing. We "developed" RJ 5 years and IQ 3 years before trading them which basically says we have no pipeline left to draw upon from past draft picks.

I think Leon has to aim to have 10 guys out of 15 that Thibs will feel comfortable playing, if that means no developmental players going forward, so be it. The window is open for the Knicks and you've gotta do whatever it takes.

[spree8]

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Nets owners son Folksssssssssss!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

lol not Nets owner’s son, but this needs to happen. Every basketball fan wants it, and we got the assets. Don’t be a party pooper Marks. LFG

Marks is a f*cking tool and so is Joe Tsai. If the Knicks overpay for Bridges I have a feeling that the answer will still be no.

Bridges has to be the one to get this ball rolling and I don't think he has the guts to do it.

Besides the fanbase, I don’t see a reason for any animosity between our FO and Marks. Apparently, Leon n Co communicate with every team always going over a bunch of possibilities. So odds are they probably already discussed something.

I think Mikal’s actions speak volumes, but yea he’s gotta go the extra mile here or it could end up like Donovan Mitchell getting shipped elsewhere. The time for the subliminal stuff is over, gotta man up n put his foot down as plenty of others have done before.

[MrDollarBills]

lol not Nets owner’s son, but this needs to happen. Every basketball fan wants it, and we got the assets. Don’t be a party pooper Marks. LFG

Marks is a f*cking tool and so is Joe Tsai. If the Knicks overpay for Bridges I have a feeling that the answer will still be no.

Bridges has to be the one to get this ball rolling and I don't think he has the guts to do it.

This isn't the thread for Mikal talk. Let's get back on track.

My bad GONYK, I get triggered and I start going off. Back onto Thibs

[jvsimonetti0514]

I think one thing ppl need to understand, Brunson is 100% all in on Thibs. If the teams superstar player is publicly endorsing the guy after a crushing game 7 loss, that means something, especially coming from a guy like Brunson who is very measured in his media comments.

The lack of depth has to be addressed but I don't see Thibs going anywhere. But something has to change because while I don't buy the argument that these injuries are Thibs fault, playing 48 mins is not sustainable.

The Thibs Paradox is he likes guys who can produce under the duress of a heavy workload, yet he can only find out if a player is that kind of guy by giving him those extended minutes to test them out. It is why he prefers veterans. They've already been stress tested.

He will play a bigger rotation earlier in the season, but he will tend to reduce heading into the playoffs. We did not have the depth left for him to play his preferred 8 guy rotation so he played a 7-8 man rotation with the last men available.

If we had 12 quality players that can be in the rotation at any time, odds are we'd withstand any injuries as long as they are not your top 2-3 players.

My only question is if this FO will keep drafting players to develop or just keep making the kinds of deals that have brought them success these past seasons?

Of our drafted players, Deuce, Grimes, RJ, IQ and Mitch, there's only 2 left and only 1 still standing. We "developed" RJ 5 years and IQ 3 years before trading them which basically says we have no pipeline left to draw upon from past draft picks.

realistically teams usually don't have 12 guys that can play on their rosters. The starting line up wasn't fitting together as well as it did in the previous season and a change had to be made and that sacrificed the teams depth. Than OG and Randle had freak injuries at the same time. If only one of them got hurt or Randle came back before the season ended I don't think the NOVA guys would have been as dead as they were in the back half of this series. They need to turn this summer picks into drafted players or trade for more guys that fit into the rotation but if everyone gets healthy they've have a 9 man rotation. Which could be possibly 10 if they talk Rokas into coming over. I'd prefer they start drafting people again cuz this team is going to get expensive really quickly, if they don't add anymore cheap contracts.

[Mr_President]

The Knicks had the 7th best offense in the league during the regular season and the third best offense in the league during the playoffs (after being #1 until game 4 of the Pacers series).

That's after having to revamp the entire offensive philosophy after Randle went down.

I think those numbers come from extremely hot shooting and great individual play from Brunson and others. I've watched our offense play iso-ball and be stagnant for many, many plays then a guy, mainly brunson makes a shot. Credit to our guys. But, you cannot in good faith tell me we run an NBA offense worthy of praise.

Praiseworthiness isn't really an objective metric. Offensive efficiency is, and we maintained the 7th most efficient offense over an 82 game season, half of which was played without Julius Randle. We then followed that up with the 3rd most efficient offense in the playoffs.

Was Brunson on an all-time heater? Sure. But plenty was going on to enable Brunson to make the plays he did as both a scorer and a passer in terms of picks, player movement, and offensive rebounding.

I don't know what effect an offensive coordinator is supposed to have. A more egalitarian offense probably won't be a significantly more effective one, since the one Thibs runs has objectively provided a top 5-10 offense.

With all due respect, I can't count how many times during offensive possessions I screamed at my TV "What are we running!?" Then the all-time heater, as you admit, makes a shot. That's why we had a top offense all year. Brunson's run for two years were insane. Also, I credit the player development staff. Guys like Randle, and almost everyone simply became better basketball players. Those reasons aren't a result of an offensive system, but they will impact our offensive ranking.

I'm not asking for a more egalitarian offense from a top offensive assistant coach either. Even D'antoni in Houston ran an offensive system centered on Harden's elite playmaking and ball dominance at the time. It was historic numbers. But it wasn't necessarily based on ball distribution.

I'm simply saying I like Thibs. But we went from Randle-RJ, your turn, my turn, iso-ball to Brunson my turn all-the-time kickout to Donte ball. It worked. Thanks, Brunson. But that not an offensive identity that survives without Brunson.

Small sample size, but we struggled MIGHTLY in quarters Brunson was out - if McBride wasn't saving our ass or Bogey wasn't hitting 3s/paint turnarounds.

[8516knicks]

haven't seen anyone talk about this so i made a thread on it. i think this is a good idea. knicks have been overachieving almost every year with him . pretty awesome that we have a elite coach after going through so many bad ones.

Read on Twitter

I voted yes. But I think Leon needs to tell him something like "when we hired you it was to make the playoffs. Well done. This contract is seeing us advance to the ECF or beyond. You've take big strides toward that but please no foolish 4th quarter injuries to our starters, o.k.???"

[8516knicks]

I think one thing ppl need to understand, Brunson is 100% all in on Thibs. If the teams superstar player is publicly endorsing the guy after a crushing game 7 loss, that means something, especially coming from a guy like Brunson who is very measured in his media comments.

The lack of depth has to be addressed but I don't see Thibs going anywhere. But something has to change because while I don't buy the argument that these injuries are Thibs fault, playing 48 mins is not sustainable.

The Thibs Paradox is he likes guys who can produce under the duress of a heavy workload, yet he can only find out if a player is that kind of guy by giving him those extended minutes to test them out. It is why he prefers veterans. They've already been stress tested.

He will play a bigger rotation earlier in the season, but he will tend to reduce heading into the playoffs. We did not have the depth left for him to play his preferred 8 guy rotation so he played a 7-8 man rotation with the last men available.

If we had 12 quality players that can be in the rotation at any time, odds are we'd withstand any injuries as long as they are not your top 2-3 players.

My only question is if this FO will keep drafting players to develop or just keep making the kinds of deals that have brought them success these past seasons?

Of our drafted players, Deuce, Grimes, RJ, IQ and Mitch, there's only 2 left and only 1 still standing. We "developed" RJ 5 years and IQ 3 years before trading them which basically says we have no pipeline left to draw upon from past draft picks.

I think Leon has to aim to have 10 guys out of 15 that Thibs will feel comfortable playing, if that means no developmental players going forward, so be it. The window is open for the Knicks and you've gotta do whatever it takes.

Gotta figure OG and MItch miss 40-50 games between them. How can we keep that to the regular only?

[Adelheid]

I think one thing ppl need to understand, Brunson is 100% all in on Thibs. If the teams superstar player is publicly endorsing the guy after a crushing game 7 loss, that means something, especially coming from a guy like Brunson who is very measured in his media comments.

The lack of depth has to be addressed but I don't see Thibs going anywhere. But something has to change because while I don't buy the argument that these injuries are Thibs fault, playing 48 mins is not sustainable.

Oh, i would definitely agree with that. Even before the postseason, the thibs extension rumors were put out already, so its more likely a done deal but the knicks brass would demand thibs he change something up in exchange for that meaty 10m extension

[TheGreenArrow]

We will never ever have a healthy team with him as our coach.

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[WaltFrazier]

I hope we can get another rotation player or two that will allow guys to play under 40 minutes in season. Mikal would be great because he's so versatile.

Someone told me on here that Thibs had played a 9-10 rotation a year or two ago before I was following the team. But the magical January run with OG and Randle healthy should have been a good test. The team was pretty deep then, missing only Robinson. I don't remember specifically but how were the rotations that month? I feel like a few guys did play in the 40s and others like Deuce and Precious could have played more. Hopefully he will trust those guys more next year after they proved themselves

[JayTWill]

I hope we can get another rotation player or two that will allow guys to play under 40 minutes in season. Mikal would be great because he's so versatile.

Someone told me on here that Thibs had played a 9-10 rotation a year or two ago before I was following the team. But the magical January run with OG and Randle healthy should have been a good test. The team was pretty deep then, missing only Robinson. I don't remember specifically but how were the rotations that month? I feel like a few guys did play in the 40s and others like Deuce and Precious could have played more. Hopefully he will trust those guys more next year after they proved themselves

In January Thibs ran a pretty standard 9 man rotation with Brunson/DDV/OG/Randle/iHart and McBride/Grimes/Hart/Precious off the bench. I don't remember anyone playing crazy minutes often but Thibs did have his Thibs moments where he treats every game like game 7 of the finals.

He had a very quick hook for McBride if the offense struggled for a moment when Brunson went to the bench and started ramping up iHart's minutes because he didn't seem to trust Precious. Considering iHart had been dealing with achilles soreness for a year it is one of the times where you could easily accuse Thibs of overusing a player since iHart did get injured and was eventually put on a minutes restriction after Thibs ramped up his minutes again after he returned leading to him re-aggravating the injury.

Then when Brunson missed a few games Thibs all of a sudden wanted to play McBride for an entire half rather than give Flynn a single minute in the second half against Memphis' G-League team. He did the same thing with Precious after other injuries.

If the entire team was healthy including Robinson Thibs would have probably ran a 9 man rotation with Robinson replacing Precious. I don't think anyone would have played crazy minutes except for Brunson and OG at times since Thibs relies on them so much on different ends of the court.

I just wish Thibs would use the regular season as a way to prepare guys for the playoffs. If McBride is going to be the backup point guard he needs to be able to play through his struggles in the regular season without Brunson on the court next to him instead of immediately pulling Brunson back into the game to right the ship in random games in January and February. He even benched McBride completely for one half of a game rather than risk losing a single minute of a regular season game with Deuce running the offense.

[Galvationknicks]

https://www.instagram.com/reel/C7Mf-jxuZxq/?igsh=OG12YTQxY2ViNzhq

Thibs ain't F ing leaving

[nedleeds]

Your evaluation is MySpace worthy.

Great response. Your next white paper on Elfrid Payton awaits.

You're like an ex. Leave the hate and do your life girlfriend.

Another basketball related response. But I guess given how your basketball related takes turn out maybe that's for the better. I guess being so optimistic that you thought Elfrid Payton was good would be comforting.

Hate? I hate being a loser franchise that hero worships not winning. Every other franchise would wait and see, off the back of a failed season. Instead we are the battered wife groping for anything resembling hope.

He will get extended. But not because he's an elite coach. It's because he and Rick Brunson are CAA.

We would have finished 5th in the West. Yet all you down trodden used to failure posters are ready to hang the 2nd seed banner next to the 4th seed banner. Go read the embarrassing posts after Thibs last fake CotY beat down in the playoffs?

It was a bad season. We aren't a rebuilding team, we're capped out and it's getting worse. We don't have any meaningfully high picks.

We ended the season with all 5 starters injured. But I'm sure it's a fluke.

I can imagine the Celtics, Nuggets, Mavs fans laughing their cocks off at us sucking the balls of a re-tread fossil coach who obliterated our roster, got bounced by a lower seed, had the worst defense in the playoffs, made TJ McConnell look like Jerry West -- and us stanning to sign him long term.

Have higher standards.

[WaltFrazier]

I hope we can get another rotation player or two that will allow guys to play under 40 minutes in season. Mikal would be great because he's so versatile.

Someone told me on here that Thibs had played a 9-10 rotation a year or two ago before I was following the team. But the magical January run with OG and Randle healthy should have been a good test. The team was pretty deep then, missing only Robinson. I don't remember specifically but how were the rotations that month? I feel like a few guys did play in the 40s and others like Deuce and Precious could have played more. Hopefully he will trust those guys more next year after they proved themselves

In January Thibs ran a pretty standard 9 man rotation with Brunson/DDV/OG/Randle/iHart and McBride/Grimes/Hart/Precious off the bench. I don't remember anyone playing crazy minutes often but Thibs did have his Thibs moments where he treats every game like game 7 of the finals.

He had a very quick hook for McBride if the offense struggled for a moment when Brunson went to the bench and started ramping up iHart's minutes because he didn't seem to trust Precious. Considering iHart had been dealing with achilles soreness for a year it is one of the times where you could easily accuse Thibs of overusing a player since iHart did get injured and was eventually put on a minutes restriction after Thibs ramped up his minutes again after he returned leading to him re-aggravating the injury.

Then when Brunson missed a few games Thibs all of a sudden wanted to play McBride for an entire half rather than give Flynn a single minute in the second half against Memphis' G-League team. He did the same thing with Precious after other injuries.

If the entire team was healthy including Robinson Thibs would have probably ran a 9 man rotation with Robinson replacing Precious. I don't think anyone would have played crazy minutes except for Brunson and OG at times since Thibs relies on them so much on different ends of the court.

I just wish Thibs would use the regular season as a way to prepare guys for the playoffs. If McBride is going to be the backup point guard he needs to be able to play through his struggles in the regular season without Brunson on the court next to him instead of immediately pulling Brunson back into the game to right the ship in random games in January and February. He even benched McBride completely for one half of a game rather than risk losing a single minute of a regular season game with Deuce running the offense.

Yeah he needs to end the quick hooks for guys like Deuce and Precious, let them play through mistakes a bit.

Maybe the answer is for every Knick to have a minutes restriction like Hartenstein did with the Achilles. Even if they're not hurt yet, do it preventively.

[Zenzibar]

Great response. Your next white paper on Elfrid Payton awaits.

You're like an ex. Leave the hate and do your life girlfriend.

Another basketball related response. But I guess given how your basketball related takes turn out maybe that's for the better. I guess being so optimistic that you thought Elfrid Payton was good would be comforting.

Hate? I hate being a loser franchise that hero worships not winning. Every other franchise would wait and see, off the back of a failed season. Instead we are the battered wife groping for anything resembling hope.

He will get extended. But not because he's an elite coach. It's because he and Rick Brunson are CAA.

We would have finished 5th in the West. Yet all you down trodden used to failure posters are ready to hang the 2nd seed banner next to the 4th seed banner. Go read the embarrassing posts after Thibs last fake CotY beat down in the playoffs?

It was a bad season. We aren't a rebuilding team, we're capped out and it's getting worse. We don't have any meaningfully high picks.

We ended the season with all 5 starters injured. But I'm sure it's a fluke.

I can imagine the Celtics, Nuggets, Mavs fans laughing their cocks off at us sucking the balls of a re-tread fossil coach who obliterated our roster, got bounced by a lower seed, had the worst defense in the playoffs, made TJ McConnell look like Jerry West -- and us stanning to sign him long term.

Have higher standards.

Excellent reply post

[nedleeds]

You're like an ex. Leave the hate and do your life girlfriend.

Another basketball related response. But I guess given how your basketball related takes turn out maybe that's for the better. I guess being so optimistic that you thought Elfrid Payton was good would be comforting.

Hate? I hate being a loser franchise that hero worships not winning. Every other franchise would wait and see, off the back of a failed season. Instead we are the battered wife groping for anything resembling hope.

He will get extended. But not because he's an elite coach. It's because he and Rick Brunson are CAA.

We would have finished 5th in the West. Yet all you down trodden used to failure posters are ready to hang the 2nd seed banner next to the 4th seed banner. Go read the embarrassing posts after Thibs last fake CotY beat down in the playoffs?

It was a bad season. We aren't a rebuilding team, we're capped out and it's getting worse. We don't have any meaningfully high picks.

We ended the season with all 5 starters injured. But I'm sure it's a fluke.

I can imagine the Celtics, Nuggets, Mavs fans laughing their cocks off at us sucking the balls of a re-tread fossil coach who obliterated our roster, got bounced by a lower seed, had the worst defense in the playoffs, made TJ McConnell look like Jerry West -- and us stanning to sign him long term.

Have higher standards.

Excellent reply post

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Sounds like Brunson agrees with me. At least he has a winners mentality.

[Zenzibar]

Another basketball related response. But I guess given how your basketball related takes turn out maybe that's for the better. I guess being so optimistic that you thought Elfrid Payton was good would be comforting.

Hate? I hate being a loser franchise that hero worships not winning. Every other franchise would wait and see, off the back of a failed season. Instead we are the battered wife groping for anything resembling hope.

He will get extended. But not because he's an elite coach. It's because he and Rick Brunson are CAA.

We would have finished 5th in the West. Yet all you down trodden used to failure posters are ready to hang the 2nd seed banner next to the 4th seed banner. Go read the embarrassing posts after Thibs last fake CotY beat down in the playoffs?

It was a bad season. We aren't a rebuilding team, we're capped out and it's getting worse. We don't have any meaningfully high picks.

We ended the season with all 5 starters injured. But I'm sure it's a fluke.

I can imagine the Celtics, Nuggets, Mavs fans laughing their cocks off at us sucking the balls of a re-tread fossil coach who obliterated our roster, got bounced by a lower seed, had the worst defense in the playoffs, made TJ McConnell look like Jerry West -- and us stanning to sign him long term.

Have higher standards.

Excellent reply post

Read on Twitter

Sounds like Brunson agrees with me. At least he has a winners mentality.

The only dude that can sincerely say that the season was a failure is Brunson himself. We, as Knicks fans, should be fkn grateful for this season. GTFO

[Ghetto Gospel]

I hope we can get another rotation player or two that will allow guys to play under 40 minutes in season. Mikal would be great because he's so versatile.

Someone told me on here that Thibs had played a 9-10 rotation a year or two ago before I was following the team. But the magical January run with OG and Randle healthy should have been a good test. The team was pretty deep then, missing only Robinson. I don't remember specifically but how were the rotations that month? I feel like a few guys did play in the 40s and others like Deuce and Precious could have played more. Hopefully he will trust those guys more next year after they proved themselves

In January Thibs ran a pretty standard 9 man rotation with Brunson/DDV/OG/Randle/iHart and McBride/Grimes/Hart/Precious off the bench. I don't remember anyone playing crazy minutes often but Thibs did have his Thibs moments where he treats every game like game 7 of the finals.

He had a very quick hook for McBride if the offense struggled for a moment when Brunson went to the bench and started ramping up iHart's minutes because he didn't seem to trust Precious. Considering iHart had been dealing with achilles soreness for a year it is one of the times where you could easily accuse Thibs of overusing a player since iHart did get injured and was eventually put on a minutes restriction after Thibs ramped up his minutes again after he returned leading to him re-aggravating the injury.

Then when Brunson missed a few games Thibs all of a sudden wanted to play McBride for an entire half rather than give Flynn a single minute in the second half against Memphis' G-League team. He did the same thing with Precious after other injuries.

If the entire team was healthy including Robinson Thibs would have probably ran a 9 man rotation with Robinson replacing Precious. I don't think anyone would have played crazy minutes except for Brunson and OG at times since Thibs relies on them so much on different ends of the court.

I just wish Thibs would use the regular season as a way to prepare guys for the playoffs. If McBride is going to be the backup point guard he needs to be able to play through his struggles in the regular season without Brunson on the court next to him instead of immediately pulling Brunson back into the game to right the ship in random games in January and February. He even benched McBride completely for one half of a game rather than risk losing a single minute of a regular season game with Deuce running the offense.

Yeah he needs to end the quick hooks for guys like Deuce and Precious, let them play through mistakes a bit.

Maybe the answer is for every Knick to have a minutes restriction like Hartenstein did with the Achilles. Even if they're not hurt yet, do it preventively.

i think thibs felt like he was coaching for his job this year so the rotation shrunk when things got tight

hopefully after he gets his extension, he can be a little bit more loose at least during the regular season

[The Vo Show]

In January Thibs ran a pretty standard 9 man rotation with Brunson/DDV/OG/Randle/iHart and McBride/Grimes/Hart/Precious off the bench. I don't remember anyone playing crazy minutes often but Thibs did have his Thibs moments where he treats every game like game 7 of the finals.

He had a very quick hook for McBride if the offense struggled for a moment when Brunson went to the bench and started ramping up iHart's minutes because he didn't seem to trust Precious. Considering iHart had been dealing with achilles soreness for a year it is one of the times where you could easily accuse Thibs of overusing a player since iHart did get injured and was eventually put on a minutes restriction after Thibs ramped up his minutes again after he returned leading to him re-aggravating the injury.

Then when Brunson missed a few games Thibs all of a sudden wanted to play McBride for an entire half rather than give Flynn a single minute in the second half against Memphis' G-League team. He did the same thing with Precious after other injuries.

If the entire team was healthy including Robinson Thibs would have probably ran a 9 man rotation with Robinson replacing Precious. I don't think anyone would have played crazy minutes except for Brunson and OG at times since Thibs relies on them so much on different ends of the court.

I just wish Thibs would use the regular season as a way to prepare guys for the playoffs. If McBride is going to be the backup point guard he needs to be able to play through his struggles in the regular season without Brunson on the court next to him instead of immediately pulling Brunson back into the game to right the ship in random games in January and February. He even benched McBride completely for one half of a game rather than risk losing a single minute of a regular season game with Deuce running the offense.

Yeah he needs to end the quick hooks for guys like Deuce and Precious, let them play through mistakes a bit.

Maybe the answer is for every Knick to have a minutes restriction like Hartenstein did with the Achilles. Even if they're not hurt yet, do it preventively.

i think thibs felt like he was coaching for his job this year so the rotation shrunk when things got tight

hopefully after he gets his extension, he can be a little bit more loose at least during the regular season

I don't think Thibs was worried about his job for one second this season. Last season, maybe when things got rough during January but once we made the second round last year, I think he knew he was good. Especially since Brunson is like a son to him and Rick has been on multiple Thibs coaching staffs now. I feel like the organization would ask Brunson if he wanted a coach besides Thibs and I'm pretty sure Brunson would tell them to **** off and focus on getting Mikal over here.

[Ghetto Gospel]

Yeah he needs to end the quick hooks for guys like Deuce and Precious, let them play through mistakes a bit.

Maybe the answer is for every Knick to have a minutes restriction like Hartenstein did with the Achilles. Even if they're not hurt yet, do it preventively.

i think thibs felt like he was coaching for his job this year so the rotation shrunk when things got tight

hopefully after he gets his extension, he can be a little bit more loose at least during the regular season

I don't think Thibs was worried about his job for one second this season. Last season, maybe when things got rough during January but once we made the second round last year, I think he knew he was good. Especially since Brunson is like a son to him and Rick has been on multiple Thibs coaching staffs now. I feel like the organization would ask Brunson if he wanted a coach besides Thibs and I'm pretty sure Brunson would tell them to **** off and focus on getting Mikal over here.

im not sure this upcoming extension was guaranteed if we ended up with a low seed and lose in the 1st round of the playoffs