Donovan Mitchell Thread #5 - Don't worry, nothing happens in this one

[knicksstuff]

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Im good with that trade wonder if its 3 unprotected and two of the extra picks

[ctorres]

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Holy cow, if we pulled off the trade without giving up Quickley, I am excited about our guard rotation.

[Ghetto Gospel]

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Didn't this herb guarantee the deal was going to happen last Tuesday?

they're just gonna keep saying it until it happens

[Fury]

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Im good with that trade wonder if its 3 unprotected and two of the extra picks

That guy is full of ****

[knicks1999]

We need a Woj or Shams bomb

[Catchall]

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Im good with that trade wonder if its 3 unprotected and two of the extra picks

That guy is full of ****

That guy is a wannabe.

[mpharris36]

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that's my prediction on the players too. 2 guys who were barely gonna play anyway.

I mean outside of trying not to include Obi this is exactly what I thought the deal would look like. I don't think he has any sources though.

[Deeeez Knicks]

I am not listening to Utah talk radio. Probably a trap to get us into a cult

I listened for 10 hours yesterday and today I'm sitting in holy underwear and have a request in to change my username to Buzzerdiah

You should be able to hear the voices that tell you how many draft picks the Knicks trade and how many wives you will get.

[Ghetto Gospel]

there's no way all of these nobodies are hearing it before anyone credible

[DOT]

Mate, that's Buddhism.

DOT...Anything apart from Christ can sound similar to the carnal understanding but without Christ you can't have Son-ship.

Essentially, Christ had to take on the nature of man so we could have the nature of God.....it was the purpose of God taking on the nature of the flesh and dying to it and being reserrected. It was so we could share in his death (to the flesh reality) and enter into his nature (God/Kingdom reality)

i'll smoke what you smoking

Yeah, I'm not knocking anyone's religion or nothing, I'm just saying this is some wild sh*t that people just kinda accept as being more normal than some of the wilder stories from other religions, like that time Loki transformed into a female horse, got impregnated, then birthed a horse with 8 legs which Odin rides into battle.

[3toheadmelo]

Yeah it’s not happening. Tony Jones is the guy who broke the initial talks with Shams.

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Where do you take anything from this that it’s not happening

Ainge is waiting for the Knicks to cave. No deal is imminent

[thebuzzardman]

I am not listening to Utah talk radio. Probably a trap to get us into a cult

Utah fan LMFAO... I was reading your board over the last 3 - 4 pages trying to get your read on a trade for Donovan. I thought it was strange that a few Knick fans are discussing "Christianity" on this board (That the hell). Then I read the post above. The Utah radio talk show host Pat Kinahan that has been discussed here in the past few pages is from New Jersey and I am pretty sure he is not Mormon or if he is he is definitely what we call Jack Mormon (not one with a corn cob up his...)

Jack Mormon is like a modern Mormon?

I'm learning things.

Is the guy lucking in the bushes a Jack-off Mormon?

[mpharris36]

there's no way all of these nobodies are hearing it before anyone credible

to be honest that is a way a some of news has been breaking...didn't some nobody break the George Springer to the Blue Jays.

[Chanel Bomber]

The Millsap doctrine will have you looking at player projections differently, especially when they're already efficient like Obi.

The article is interesting but I think it is outdated, and can be refuted on several levels. I don't say this as a criticism of the piece, as it was - remarkably - well ahead of its time when it was published in 2007.

My first comment, before I get to the core of the article, is specific to Obi. The article mentions how the minutes of bench players are often staggered, and frequently overlap with the starters. That is largely true, and it definitely applies to a player like D-Rose, who often closed games for the Knicks, but I don't think it really does for Obi. Thibs doesn't really stagger line-ups, and Obi (being stuck behind Randle, and playing for a coach who doesn't play him at the 5 either) has predominantly played against bench units. So in his case, the separation between starters and bench is particularly relevant.

My second and more important point is that the article uses boxscore numbers (and boxscore-heavy metrics like PER, which is now fairly obsolete) and per-40 minutes, which I think is an inaccurate and outdated way of projecting impact. I agree with the article's premise that production doesn't necessarily suffer, and can in fact improve by going from bench player to starter, especially if they get minutes in bigger chunks. But production doesn't necessarily translate to impact. And I think the more modern metrics like RAPM and RAPTOR, which are primarily plus/minus- and/or on/off-based statistics that aim to extract the noise from raw plus/minus or on/off by adjusting for context, are far more interesting and accurate for player projection.

I never doubted that Obi could be a productive player in the NBA, even a starter. I believe I even said that when I was more vehemently opposed to the pick around draft time. My worry about him is about the impact that he can have as a 4 with little positional versatility who has yet to demonstrate that he can be a reliable 3-point shooter and a plus defender. I actually like him more now than I did before, since he has improved a lot on defense, and his finishing at the basket has been truly impressive, but those questions remain largely unanswered in my opinion.

The piece gives interesting insights about projecting production, but has little value (by today's standards) in terms of projecting impact.

What exactly are we doing here Chanel? If you think he can be a productive starter, then what else is there? How about we find out whether or not he can be an impact player, but if your point is that you think he can already be a productive starter, I don't know what else you're trying to argue.

If you have Donovan Mitchell, why would Obi then need to be an impact player, provided he's still on the team? Considering at his absolute best he would be a 4th option, and 4th best player on the team, why is "Can he be an impact guy" even in your mind?

Because he could potentially put up numbers i.e. produce yet also hurt spacing, thus indirectly hurting the efficiency of the players around him, and also hurt the defense, whereas an inherently less talented and possibly less productive player like current-day PJ Tucker could have a bigger impact in his role.

A lot of players can put up numbers. But they don't all impact winning in the same way.

[stuporman]

I am still not convinced Obi will get traded until I see it actually happen, IQ, sure, Grimes, absolutely but Obi seems like is sentimentally untouchable to this FO and they'll trade Randle for WB to pay $45mil buyout just so Obi can start before they trade him as a throw in to a 'star' deal.

[Rooster8]

Shams said at least 2-3 weeks. It's been a week. I don't believe **** unless it's from Shams or Woj.

[B8RcDeMktfxC]

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Im good with that trade wonder if its 3 unprotected and two of the extra picks

I think the Knicks should make their 2023 pick #1 protected, even if that means adding an extra swap somewhere. Victor is that good of a prospect.

[DOT]

Also, in fact, Christianity was, whether by chance or not, the cradle of an insane rate of human technological development over the last ~350 years. That's a pretty interesting thing.

Islam did it first.

[Bob Ross]

Hope its Quick in place of Grimes or Obi

[3toheadmelo]

Tony Jones is as official as it gets and if he’s saying ainge is waiting on the Knicks to meet his price then I highly doubt anything is happening