2020-2021 College/Draft Thread 2

[robillionaire]

Idk Cal comparing him to Jarred Vanderbilt says a lot. I’m not against taking a flyer but I wouldn’t expect lottery talent. The kid was raw.

he was raw, but how do you go from being considered a top 8 pick to undrafted after only playing in 8 games?

He’ll go second round. Probably before 58 too

The issue is he played really bad for half his 8 games and 7 of those were losses, and then he got injured, also that 8th game was the only one he played in after the injury and it was horrible. The norm is he goes back to improve his draft stock. A lot of players in his situation go back, and try to have a successful season to be drafted as a Sophmore.

I don't disagree with that but I'm just not sure how you go from ESPN recruiting database having him as the 10th best high school prospect, he plays in 5 games while 100% healthy on a dysfunctional team before an ankle injury, and we are to believe the potential completely disappeared? I'd definitely take a swing in the 2nd round and stash him somewhere. if nobody else does

[WargamesX]

he was raw, but how do you go from being considered a top 8 pick to undrafted after only playing in 8 games?

He’ll go second round. Probably before 58 too

The issue is he played really bad for half his 8 games and 7 of those were losses, and then he got injured, also that 8th game was the only one he played in after the injury and it was horrible. The norm is he goes back to improve his draft stock. A lot of players in his situation go back, and try to have a successful season to be drafted as a Sophmore.

I don't disagree with that but I'm just not sure how you go from ESPN recruiting database having him as the 10th best high school prospect, he plays in 5 games while 100% healthy on a dysfunctional team before an ankle injury, and we are to believe the potential completely disappeared? I'd definitely take a swing in the 2nd round and stash him somewhere. if nobody else does

That’s a fair assessment, but scouts got to scout based on what they see and top 10 HS recruits turn into duds all the time. Unless he completely slays the workouts he is going in the second round, and he should feel lucky to be drafted there too because there are going to be FO who say “Why didn’t he go back and show he was worth a better draft spot?” And skip him.

[knickstape4ever]

i'd love to get both but im tryna think realistically. i don't see the knicks trading obi to move up. there's even a chance both might be gone by our pick

im curious to hear your thoughts on tre mann though. i know you like them shot creators like me

from what I've seen, both are ranked mid-lottery (15-20 range) which seems feasible. obviously media/teams have differing views, so we never truly know. maybe the fact both he and Bouknight are sophomores might work against them. I thought it was crazy when Haliburton fell to 12 last draft

I like Mann a lot. his shot creation is definitely something we need, especially from a PG. having a PG who can shoot off the dribble would really help our offense and help Mitch IMO because defenses will have to respect the pull-up off the P&R. has a nice handle too

I also think he's also a better passer than the AST/TO ratio. would suggest. he made some nice, crafty passes, some off the live-dribble which is what you want from your PG and what distinguishes him from a scoring guard like IQ (basic reads/passing skills)

would be great to land him

another reason why I've abandoned the tank is that I like players that are currently outside the top 10. I'm not in love w/ players in the 6-10 range: K. Johnson, J. Johnson, Barnes, Kispert; the 1st 3 have nice potential, but we need shooting and that's the swing skill for all. and Kispert to me is Doug McDermott

really hoping players like Mann and Bouknight are available w/ at least 1 of our picks. and I think it would make a lot of sense to try to move up as well and land a potentially higher impact player....wouldn't hurt if they sign w/ CAA

I also like Cam Thomas and Josh Christopher (less so than Mann, Bouknight) b/c both are good shot creators too. I think there's also potential w/ Boston and Ziaire in buy-low situations but their freshman seasons did kinda scare me

Im not really a big fan of the players in the 6-10 range too. I think I only like Jalen Johnson out of those players you mentioned. Wagner, Isaiah Jackson, Alperen Sengun seem like meh players as well.

I don’t really see it with Boston. I watched a video the other day that had all of his buckets this season and his handle isn’t all that. His handle is like a little better than Knox’s. I like Ziarie more. I think he’s a better shot creator imo.

This may be a hot take but if we were to take a gamble on a Kentucky kid, it should be Terrence Clarke. His handle is really good and can hit a variety of shots off the dribble. He was just hurt this season so he couldn’t really show out

I buy Boston's jumper more than I do Clarke, which is why I'd give a slight edge to him; I do like Clark tho since he's athletic, 6'7 and can handle, but that jumper is a huge swing skill. would definitely take a chance on him w/ that late 2nd we got.

my issue w/ Boston tho is his body control when driving to the rim. looks like he's off-balanced, same thing I noticed w/ Kevin Knox at Kentucky. could be a strength issue, but at the same time, there are other wiry players who can absorb contact at the rim much better (Jalen Green for example). not an issue for Clarke tho

I like the idea of taking a chance on some of these 5 star recruits whose stock fell this past season, especially this year since it couldn't be easy for incoming freshman during a pandemic

[knickstape4ever]

I think the FO should consider moving Obi and even use him to move up from the Mavs pick

IMO he's never going to have a role here w/ Randle. Thibs has shown he plays Julius and Obi strictly at the PF and he likes having a rim protecting C. + Thibs plays his starters big minutes, so I don't see how Obi's role will expand past 10-15 minutes

keeping him another year in such a reduced role will further decrease his trade value, so might as well sell as high as possible while he has 3 years left on a rookie deal

as much as it sucks, Obi might just be a sunk cost. not necessarily b/c of talent (tho I do think he's been bad) but because of his role and the fact that we currently have an all-star starting at his position

I'd rather trade Obi to get from pick 22 into the 12-14 range and take a player who could actually play for us....like a guard, lord knows we could use a few of those

in 2017 the Utah Jazz traded #24 and Trey Lyles for #13.....Donovan Mitchell. and that was after Lyles 2nd season. moving up could be worthwhile and the chances of getting lucky w/ a star talent is higher in the 12-14 range than in the 20-22 range

[newyorker4ever]

I guess I'm in the minority but I still love the depth of this draft. Sure, there will be some busts, but talking about guys like Moody or Bouknight or Kispert or Ziaire being late lottery picks--that's pretty damn good to me.

I don't think you're in the minority and are still in the majority that thinks this draft is pretty deep especially the lottery.

[3toheadmelo]

Wonder where he goes in the draft now

Read on Twitter

[cgf]

I think the FO should consider moving Obi and even use him to move up from the Mavs pick

IMO he's never going to have a role here w/ Randle. Thibs has shown he plays Julius and Obi strictly at the PF and he likes having a rim protecting C. + Thibs plays his starters big minutes, so I don't see how Obi's role will expand past 10-15 minutes

keeping him another year in such a reduced role will further decrease his trade value, so might as well sell as high as possible while he has 3 years left on a rookie deal

as much as it sucks, Obi might just be a sunk cost. not necessarily b/c of talent (tho I do think he's been bad) but because of his role and the fact that we currently have an all-star starting at his position

I'd rather trade Obi to get from pick 22 into the 12-14 range and take a player who could actually play for us....like a guard, lord knows we could use a few of those

in 2017 the Utah Jazz traded #24 and Trey Lyles for #13.....Donovan Mitchell. and that was after Lyles 2nd season. moving up could be worthwhile and the chances of getting lucky w/ a star talent is higher in the 12-14 range than in the 20-22 range

I think Obi's future role depends a lot on whether Thibs & co. think they'll be able to teach him to defend like Taj. Cause even if they think he's another year away from being able to start doing that, if they believe he will get there and become the kind of 3rd big who can fill in for both Mitch & Julius, then I don't think his trade-value will be greater than his internal value.

Personally I'd probably agree with you and at least explore using Obi to move up from one of our firsts, same way I'd look into using Knox & Frank to move around on draft night as well. But I'm curious about whether the FO sees more of a role for Obi moving forward than does a lot of our fanbase...cause if he can become a good defender in the Taj-mold and successfully polish his shot/handle, as he finishes growing into his new body, he'd be a really nifty fit as our 3rd big.

[cgf]

he was raw, but how do you go from being considered a top 8 pick to undrafted after only playing in 8 games?

He’ll go second round. Probably before 58 too

The issue is he played really bad for half his 8 games and 7 of those were losses, and then he got injured, also that 8th game was the only one he played in after the injury and it was horrible. The norm is he goes back to improve his draft stock. A lot of players in his situation go back, and try to have a successful season to be drafted as a Sophmore.

I don't disagree with that but I'm just not sure how you go from ESPN recruiting database having him as the 10th best high school prospect, he plays in 5 games while 100% healthy on a dysfunctional team before an ankle injury, and we are to believe the potential completely disappeared? I'd definitely take a swing in the 2nd round and stash him somewhere. if nobody else does

Sometimes it's less about losing potential as facing better competition showing that suspected potential isn't actually there. Like I mentioned with Scottie Lewis a few pages ago, his potential as a ballhandler turned out not to be there when his athletic advantages shrunk. Now both Boston & Clarke still intrigue me later on, as I think that both suffered greatly from the chaotic season & Kentucky's lack of a veteran guard...but often enough there's a reason why top recruits don't end up top draft picks.

[knickstape4ever]

I think the FO should consider moving Obi and even use him to move up from the Mavs pick

IMO he's never going to have a role here w/ Randle. Thibs has shown he plays Julius and Obi strictly at the PF and he likes having a rim protecting C. + Thibs plays his starters big minutes, so I don't see how Obi's role will expand past 10-15 minutes

keeping him another year in such a reduced role will further decrease his trade value, so might as well sell as high as possible while he has 3 years left on a rookie deal

as much as it sucks, Obi might just be a sunk cost. not necessarily b/c of talent (tho I do think he's been bad) but because of his role and the fact that we currently have an all-star starting at his position

I'd rather trade Obi to get from pick 22 into the 12-14 range and take a player who could actually play for us....like a guard, lord knows we could use a few of those

in 2017 the Utah Jazz traded #24 and Trey Lyles for #13.....Donovan Mitchell. and that was after Lyles 2nd season. moving up could be worthwhile and the chances of getting lucky w/ a star talent is higher in the 12-14 range than in the 20-22 range

I think Obi's future role depends a lot on whether Thibs & co. think they'll be able to teach him to defend like Taj. Cause even if they think he's another year away from being able to start doing that, if they believe he will get there and become the kind of 3rd big who can fill in for both Mitch & Julius, then I don't think his trade-value will be greater than his internal value.

Personally I'd probably agree with you and at least explore using Obi to move up from one of our firsts, same way I'd look into using Knox & Frank to move around on draft night as well. But I'm curious about whether the FO sees more of a role for Obi moving forward than does a lot of our fanbase...cause if he can become a good defender in the Taj-mold and successfully polish his shot/handle, as he finishes growing into his new body, he'd be a really nifty fit as our 3rd big.

Obi ain't turning into Taj. Taj has been a good defender back since his USC days and he's a defense-first player, always has been

Obi just isn't that type of player, so I wouldn't bet on him becoming that. Thibs doesn't even trust Obi defensively

if they come back next year w/ Mitch and Noel at C (which they should b/c Noel has been great), that doesn't leave any minutes at C for Randle/Obi, putting Obi in the same situation as he is now: backing up Randle for 10-15 minutes (at best)

[robillionaire]

I think the FO should consider moving Obi and even use him to move up from the Mavs pick

IMO he's never going to have a role here w/ Randle. Thibs has shown he plays Julius and Obi strictly at the PF and he likes having a rim protecting C. + Thibs plays his starters big minutes, so I don't see how Obi's role will expand past 10-15 minutes

keeping him another year in such a reduced role will further decrease his trade value, so might as well sell as high as possible while he has 3 years left on a rookie deal

as much as it sucks, Obi might just be a sunk cost. not necessarily b/c of talent (tho I do think he's been bad) but because of his role and the fact that we currently have an all-star starting at his position

I'd rather trade Obi to get from pick 22 into the 12-14 range and take a player who could actually play for us....like a guard, lord knows we could use a few of those

in 2017 the Utah Jazz traded #24 and Trey Lyles for #13.....Donovan Mitchell. and that was after Lyles 2nd season. moving up could be worthwhile and the chances of getting lucky w/ a star talent is higher in the 12-14 range than in the 20-22 range

I think Obi's future role depends a lot on whether Thibs & co. think they'll be able to teach him to defend like Taj. Cause even if they think he's another year away from being able to start doing that, if they believe he will get there and become the kind of 3rd big who can fill in for both Mitch & Julius, then I don't think his trade-value will be greater than his internal value.

Personally I'd probably agree with you and at least explore using Obi to move up from one of our firsts, same way I'd look into using Knox & Frank to move around on draft night as well. But I'm curious about whether the FO sees more of a role for Obi moving forward than does a lot of our fanbase...cause if he can become a good defender in the Taj-mold and successfully polish his shot/handle, as he finishes growing into his new body, he'd be a really nifty fit as our 3rd big.

putting Obi in the same situation as he is now: backing up Randle for 10-15 minutes (at best)

I'd be glad if he is able to play 10-15 minutes as a backup next year (as opposed to being completely gone from the rotation). He clearly isn't ready for any kind of expanded role beyond that. I don't even think it's all about Randle either, he just hasn't played very well or flashed very much potential. If they wanted to give it up and trade him, I wouldn't complain. But I'd also be fine if they want to continue to develop him in a backup role. Maybe you get lucky and he breaks out and makes Randle a little more expendable.

Main point though, is that his minutes being limited this year and probably next year aren't even so much about our other personnel or Randle/Mitch/Noel/Taj blocking him from getting minutes as it is him not being that good

[cgf]

I think the FO should consider moving Obi and even use him to move up from the Mavs pick

IMO he's never going to have a role here w/ Randle. Thibs has shown he plays Julius and Obi strictly at the PF and he likes having a rim protecting C. + Thibs plays his starters big minutes, so I don't see how Obi's role will expand past 10-15 minutes

keeping him another year in such a reduced role will further decrease his trade value, so might as well sell as high as possible while he has 3 years left on a rookie deal

as much as it sucks, Obi might just be a sunk cost. not necessarily b/c of talent (tho I do think he's been bad) but because of his role and the fact that we currently have an all-star starting at his position

I'd rather trade Obi to get from pick 22 into the 12-14 range and take a player who could actually play for us....like a guard, lord knows we could use a few of those

in 2017 the Utah Jazz traded #24 and Trey Lyles for #13.....Donovan Mitchell. and that was after Lyles 2nd season. moving up could be worthwhile and the chances of getting lucky w/ a star talent is higher in the 12-14 range than in the 20-22 range

I think Obi's future role depends a lot on whether Thibs & co. think they'll be able to teach him to defend like Taj. Cause even if they think he's another year away from being able to start doing that, if they believe he will get there and become the kind of 3rd big who can fill in for both Mitch & Julius, then I don't think his trade-value will be greater than his internal value.

Personally I'd probably agree with you and at least explore using Obi to move up from one of our firsts, same way I'd look into using Knox & Frank to move around on draft night as well. But I'm curious about whether the FO sees more of a role for Obi moving forward than does a lot of our fanbase...cause if he can become a good defender in the Taj-mold and successfully polish his shot/handle, as he finishes growing into his new body, he'd be a really nifty fit as our 3rd big.

Obi ain't turning into Taj. Taj has been a good defender back since his USC days and he's a defense-first player, always has been

Obi just isn't that type of player, so I wouldn't bet on him becoming that. Thibs doesn't even trust Obi defensively

if they come back next year w/ Mitch and Noel at C (which they should b/c Noel has been great), that doesn't leave any minutes at C for Randle/Obi, putting Obi in the same situation as he is now: backing up Randle for 10-15 minutes (at best)

This is what, Obi's 3rd season as a big? He should still very moldable, and despite my initial doubts about his lateral quickness, he has the physical tools to play that Taj/Horford game on D. Now I don't think they'd just run with him as the backup C next year, but starting the season with Obi as our 3C, while Taj sits around on standby, on top of backing up Julius?

That, I can see being their plan; hoping that Obi shows well enough at that spot when called into action so that by year 3 he will be ready to step in as the primary back up at both bigman spots after Noel leaves to chase a starting job elsewhere...or we cheap out on Mitch b/c of how well Nerlens has kept the D together. So that after seeing a little bump in PT next year, the season after he starts hitting 20+ minutes regularly.


Not necessarily arguing that that's a particularly good plan or one I agree with; just trying to imagine how the FO is thinking given that they were so much higher on Obi than me in the first place.

[WargamesX]

I think the FO should consider moving Obi and even use him to move up from the Mavs pick

IMO he's never going to have a role here w/ Randle. Thibs has shown he plays Julius and Obi strictly at the PF and he likes having a rim protecting C. + Thibs plays his starters big minutes, so I don't see how Obi's role will expand past 10-15 minutes

keeping him another year in such a reduced role will further decrease his trade value, so might as well sell as high as possible while he has 3 years left on a rookie deal

as much as it sucks, Obi might just be a sunk cost. not necessarily b/c of talent (tho I do think he's been bad) but because of his role and the fact that we currently have an all-star starting at his position

I'd rather trade Obi to get from pick 22 into the 12-14 range and take a player who could actually play for us....like a guard, lord knows we could use a few of those

in 2017 the Utah Jazz traded #24 and Trey Lyles for #13.....Donovan Mitchell. and that was after Lyles 2nd season. moving up could be worthwhile and the chances of getting lucky w/ a star talent is higher in the 12-14 range than in the 20-22 range

I think Obi's future role depends a lot on whether Thibs & co. think they'll be able to teach him to defend like Taj. Cause even if they think he's another year away from being able to start doing that, if they believe he will get there and become the kind of 3rd big who can fill in for both Mitch & Julius, then I don't think his trade-value will be greater than his internal value.

Personally I'd probably agree with you and at least explore using Obi to move up from one of our firsts, same way I'd look into using Knox & Frank to move around on draft night as well. But I'm curious about whether the FO sees more of a role for Obi moving forward than does a lot of our fanbase...cause if he can become a good defender in the Taj-mold and successfully polish his shot/handle, as he finishes growing into his new body, he'd be a really nifty fit as our 3rd big.

Obi ain't turning into Taj. Taj has been a good defender back since his USC days and he's a defense-first player, always has been

Obi just isn't that type of player, so I wouldn't bet on him becoming that. Thibs doesn't even trust Obi defensively

if they come back next year w/ Mitch and Noel at C (which they should b/c Noel has been great), that doesn't leave any minutes at C for Randle/Obi, putting Obi in the same situation as he is now: backing up Randle for 10-15 minutes (at best)

I still think Obi is a Boris Diaw type player and I wonder would it hurt him to get a little fat like Diaw,

However Third big is not a curse he can just get stronger.

[knickstape4ever]

I think Obi's future role depends a lot on whether Thibs & co. think they'll be able to teach him to defend like Taj. Cause even if they think he's another year away from being able to start doing that, if they believe he will get there and become the kind of 3rd big who can fill in for both Mitch & Julius, then I don't think his trade-value will be greater than his internal value.

Personally I'd probably agree with you and at least explore using Obi to move up from one of our firsts, same way I'd look into using Knox & Frank to move around on draft night as well. But I'm curious about whether the FO sees more of a role for Obi moving forward than does a lot of our fanbase...cause if he can become a good defender in the Taj-mold and successfully polish his shot/handle, as he finishes growing into his new body, he'd be a really nifty fit as our 3rd big.

putting Obi in the same situation as he is now: backing up Randle for 10-15 minutes (at best)

I'd be glad if he is able to play 10-15 minutes as a backup next year (as opposed to being completely gone from the rotation). He clearly isn't ready for any kind of expanded role beyond that. I don't even think it's all about Randle either, he just hasn't played very well or flashed very much potential. If they wanted to give it up and trade him, I wouldn't complain. But I'd also be fine if they want to continue to develop him in a backup role. Maybe you get lucky and he breaks out and makes Randle a little more expendable.


Main point though, is that his minutes being limited this year and probably next year aren't even so much about our other personnel or Randle/Mitch/Noel/Taj blocking him from getting minutes as it is him not being that good

I agree, he hasn't earned the minutes either w/ his poor play. that paired w/ his lack of role due to having Randle/Mitch/Noel/Taj (who I'd like to re-sign for vet leadership) makes him expendable to me

I wouldn't want to waste another year of his rookie deal in the same role, decreasing his trade value. Like w/ Knox for example. his value was probably higher after last season than it is rn. Berman reported that Knicks were hesitant to give up Knox in a CP3 deal and that hiring Payne was in part to help Knox.....and now, Knox looks like he was absolutely no future here and only has 1 yr left on his rookie deal, hard to imagine he's worth anything now

use Obi to move up in the draft and take a guard. that Denver-Utah trade should be the blueprint: #24 + Lyles for #13 (Donovan Mitchell). there's more potential in the back half of the lotto than there is in the 20's

[knickstape4ever]

I think Obi's future role depends a lot on whether Thibs & co. think they'll be able to teach him to defend like Taj. Cause even if they think he's another year away from being able to start doing that, if they believe he will get there and become the kind of 3rd big who can fill in for both Mitch & Julius, then I don't think his trade-value will be greater than his internal value.

Personally I'd probably agree with you and at least explore using Obi to move up from one of our firsts, same way I'd look into using Knox & Frank to move around on draft night as well. But I'm curious about whether the FO sees more of a role for Obi moving forward than does a lot of our fanbase...cause if he can become a good defender in the Taj-mold and successfully polish his shot/handle, as he finishes growing into his new body, he'd be a really nifty fit as our 3rd big.

Obi ain't turning into Taj. Taj has been a good defender back since his USC days and he's a defense-first player, always has been

Obi just isn't that type of player, so I wouldn't bet on him becoming that. Thibs doesn't even trust Obi defensively

if they come back next year w/ Mitch and Noel at C (which they should b/c Noel has been great), that doesn't leave any minutes at C for Randle/Obi, putting Obi in the same situation as he is now: backing up Randle for 10-15 minutes (at best)

I still think Obi is a Boris Diaw type player and I wonder would it hurt him to get a little fat like Diaw,

However Third big is not a curse he can just get stronger.

I don't see that comp at all. Boris (and Taj) have always been regarded as defensive-first players, whereas Obi has been regarded as a defensive-deficient player. Diaw could legit guard 1-5, Obi ain't doing that. he's got bad hips and is slow laterally

[cgf]

Obi ain't turning into Taj. Taj has been a good defender back since his USC days and he's a defense-first player, always has been

Obi just isn't that type of player, so I wouldn't bet on him becoming that. Thibs doesn't even trust Obi defensively

if they come back next year w/ Mitch and Noel at C (which they should b/c Noel has been great), that doesn't leave any minutes at C for Randle/Obi, putting Obi in the same situation as he is now: backing up Randle for 10-15 minutes (at best)

I still think Obi is a Boris Diaw type player and I wonder would it hurt him to get a little fat like Diaw,

However Third big is not a curse he can just get stronger.

I don't see that comp at all. Boris (and Taj) have always been regarded as defensive-first players, whereas Obi has been regarded as a defensive-deficient player. Diaw could legit guard 1-5, Obi ain't doing that. he's got bad hips and is slow laterally

Agree with you here as well. Even if one takes the optimistic viewpoint that he can still learn to be a defense-first player...wouldn't be the first scorer who had to learn to become a defender at this level b/c he couldn't just yam on every possession...Taj or Horford is the prototype you hope he can grow into, not someone as comfortable dealing with perimeter dudes as Diaw.

[WargamesX]

Obi ain't turning into Taj. Taj has been a good defender back since his USC days and he's a defense-first player, always has been

Obi just isn't that type of player, so I wouldn't bet on him becoming that. Thibs doesn't even trust Obi defensively

if they come back next year w/ Mitch and Noel at C (which they should b/c Noel has been great), that doesn't leave any minutes at C for Randle/Obi, putting Obi in the same situation as he is now: backing up Randle for 10-15 minutes (at best)

I still think Obi is a Boris Diaw type player and I wonder would it hurt him to get a little fat like Diaw,

However Third big is not a curse he can just get stronger.

I don't see that comp at all. Boris (and Taj) have always been regarded as defensive-first players, whereas Obi has been regarded as a defensive-deficient player. Diaw could legit guard 1-5, Obi ain't doing that. he's got bad hips and is slow laterally

Not always, and he wasn’t elite at it except maybe one finals with the Spurs. His time with the Spurs basically saved his career and reputation. He was bad on the bobcats

https://swarmandsting.com/2012/05/09/charlotte-bobcats-player-grades-boris-diaw/

Yes it was a effort thing, but defense wasn’t what made Diaw special, it was his passing, and that is what makes obi special too. If he gets strong enough to post centers and pass out if needed he would be an asset offensively. He looks like he at least understands defense so I don’t think he is a lost cause nearly as much as I thought when he was first drafted.

[cgf]

I still think Obi is a Boris Diaw type player and I wonder would it hurt him to get a little fat like Diaw,

However Third big is not a curse he can just get stronger.

I don't see that comp at all. Boris (and Taj) have always been regarded as defensive-first players, whereas Obi has been regarded as a defensive-deficient player. Diaw could legit guard 1-5, Obi ain't doing that. he's got bad hips and is slow laterally

Not always, and he wasn’t elite at it except maybe one finals with the Spurs. His time with the Spurs basically saved his career and reputation. He was bad on the bobcats

https://swarmandsting.com/2012/05/09/charlotte-bobcats-player-grades-boris-diaw/

Yes it was a effort thing, but defense wasn’t what made Diaw special, it was his passing, and that is what makes obi special too. If he gets strong enough to post centers and pass out if needed he would be an asset offensively. He looks like he at least understands defense so I don’t think he is a lost cause nearly as much as I thought when he was first drafted.

Are you forgetting his time with the Suns?

[knickstape4ever]

I still think Obi is a Boris Diaw type player and I wonder would it hurt him to get a little fat like Diaw,

However Third big is not a curse he can just get stronger.

I don't see that comp at all. Boris (and Taj) have always been regarded as defensive-first players, whereas Obi has been regarded as a defensive-deficient player. Diaw could legit guard 1-5, Obi ain't doing that. he's got bad hips and is slow laterally

Not always, and he wasn’t elite at it except maybe one finals with the Spurs. His time with the Spurs basically saved his career and reputation. He was bad on the bobcats

https://swarmandsting.com/2012/05/09/charlotte-bobcats-player-grades-boris-diaw/

Yes it was a effort thing, but defense wasn’t what made Diaw special, it was his passing, and that is what makes obi special too. If he gets strong enough to post centers and pass out if needed he would be an asset offensively. He looks like he at least understands defense so I don’t think he is a lost cause nearly as much as I thought when he was first drafted.

Diaw w/ the Suns and Spurs played great defense. even locked up Lebron in the finals when he was with the Spurs

I still don't see how Obi is getting more than 15 minutes a game here. Thibs plays Obi and Randle strictly at PF and he likes rim protection from his C (and we have 2 really good one's w/ Mitch, Noel)

it's just a sunk cost IMO. why hold on longer and risk killing his value (like Knox) if he's not gonna have any significant role?

[WargamesX]

I don't see that comp at all. Boris (and Taj) have always been regarded as defensive-first players, whereas Obi has been regarded as a defensive-deficient player. Diaw could legit guard 1-5, Obi ain't doing that. he's got bad hips and is slow laterally

Not always, and he wasn’t elite at it except maybe one finals with the Spurs. His time with the Spurs basically saved his career and reputation. He was bad on the bobcats

https://swarmandsting.com/2012/05/09/charlotte-bobcats-player-grades-boris-diaw/

Yes it was a effort thing, but defense wasn’t what made Diaw special, it was his passing, and that is what makes obi special too. If he gets strong enough to post centers and pass out if needed he would be an asset offensively. He looks like he at least understands defense so I don’t think he is a lost cause nearly as much as I thought when he was first drafted.

Diaw w/ the Suns and Spurs played great defense. even locked up Lebron in the finals when he was with the Spurs

I still don't see how Obi is getting more than 15 minutes a game here. Thibs plays Obi and Randle strictly at PF and he likes rim protection from his C (and we have 2 really good one's w/ Mitch, Noel)

it's just a sunk cost IMO. why hold on longer and risk killing his value (like Knox) if he's not gonna have any significant role?

It was the D’antoni Suns.... any defense looked elite he was good, but his defense isn’t what made him elite or a key part of that Championship Spurs team. That team played great defense and sent several defenders at Lebron per game to keep him from being comfortable. They also had Kawhi and Danny green giving a Lebron that work too.

Obi’s biggest issue is strength. He is highly skilled but got his points off as a 21 year old playing teenagers. If he gets NBA strong he’ll be a useful role player. If he doesn’t he’ll never improve.

[knickstape4ever]

Not always, and he wasn’t elite at it except maybe one finals with the Spurs. His time with the Spurs basically saved his career and reputation. He was bad on the bobcats

https://swarmandsting.com/2012/05/09/charlotte-bobcats-player-grades-boris-diaw/

Yes it was a effort thing, but defense wasn’t what made Diaw special, it was his passing, and that is what makes obi special too. If he gets strong enough to post centers and pass out if needed he would be an asset offensively. He looks like he at least understands defense so I don’t think he is a lost cause nearly as much as I thought when he was first drafted.

Diaw w/ the Suns and Spurs played great defense. even locked up Lebron in the finals when he was with the Spurs

I still don't see how Obi is getting more than 15 minutes a game here. Thibs plays Obi and Randle strictly at PF and he likes rim protection from his C (and we have 2 really good one's w/ Mitch, Noel)

it's just a sunk cost IMO. why hold on longer and risk killing his value (like Knox) if he's not gonna have any significant role?

It was the D’antoni Suns.... any defense looked elite he was good, but his defense isn’t what made him elite or a key part of that Championship Spurs team. That team played great defense and sent several defenders at Lebron per game to keep him from being comfortable. They also had Kawhi and Danny green giving a Lebron that work too.

Obi’s biggest issue is strength. He is highly skilled but got his points off as a 21 year old playing teenagers. If he gets NBA strong he’ll be a useful role player. If he doesn’t he’ll never improve.

Obi's issue isn't just strength, lateral agility as well. + he has very few post moves, doesn't shoot the ball well from 3 (his airball % is ), and doesn't seem to play with any confidence

I'd rather move on from him rather than keep him as a 15 min per game role player. we need guards and there should be some decent one's in this draft