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Carmelo to OKC getting finalized. Updates PG 36&7

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Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: Carmelo to OKC getting finalized. Updates PG 36&7 

Post#1901 » by GONYK » Sat Sep 23, 2017 10:09 pm

vallen wrote:
GONYK wrote:
vallen wrote:

really ? a team that once thought Bargnani was a missing link, and overpaid noah and thj. hes very much in their plans.
I strongly disagree. I think he'll come off the bench and be sent on his way by the end of the season.

None of our current decision makers were involved with Bargnani.



sent on his way ? bench ? you dont think he has any value what so ever ? that hes just going to walk at the end of the season. hes so bad we cant trade him ? but hes good enough to pass up on 19 million contract ? and get a better one ?
I think he'll score plenty off the bench. It's what he does. He'll also be a sieve on D.

I think the Knicks will try to trade him, but probably won't be able to.

If he opts in to his final year, so be it. I just don't think he's being considered a core piece in any way.
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Re: Carmelo to OKC getting finalized. Updates PG 36&7 

Post#1902 » by Greenie » Sat Sep 23, 2017 10:10 pm

FutureKnicksGM wrote:
Thugger HBC wrote:
Greenie wrote:Not really.
I wanted Ferguson.
Not a 2nd, a garbage wing and Willy's minute eater.

We are supposed to be developing who we have.

It really is.

You weren't getting Ferguson, they just drafted him. Did you want the Knicks to offer up a package for Kyrie by offering Frank?

That 2nd could very well be the equiv of a late 1st...without guaranteed money attached.

McD really doesn't matter to me, but he's cheap. I still believe kanter comes off the bench. Only time will tell.


There is absolutely no need to up the offer. It's called negotiation. The difference between Melo & Kanter is more than an early second, at least for a competent front office. We always come short on the value side, and it all adds up over time.

But hey we get rid of Melo so who cares.

Bingo
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Re: Carmelo to OKC getting finalized. Updates PG 36&7 

Post#1903 » by chs234 » Sat Sep 23, 2017 10:10 pm

II thought we did fine here. Any problems in regarding a trade of Melo happened months/years ago. That is when he should have been traded. The Knicks are currently going the opposite of Melo. The Knicks are trying to get younger and rebuild. Melo is old and trying to win a ring. Getting older in age the Knicks weren't going to net a first round pick for him. The Knicks got younger by getting Kanter and McDermott and acquired a 2nd round pick. It's not a great return, but Melo wasn't going to bring back much, and they had to get rid of him as bringing him back this season was just out of the question if the Knicks FO was serious about actually moving forward the franchise.

I actually think the Knicks will be a fun team to watch this season. They aren't going to be very good, but they're pretty young and Hornacek without Phil being in the way and with a young roster will be able to really play in transition and through the p&r which is what he did with Phoenix. A front-court of Porzingis/Kanter/Hernangomez should be difficult to guard. Unless the French PG is good from day 1, the Knicks won't make the post-season but I think they'll be a fun team to watch.
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Re: Carmelo to OKC getting finalized. Updates PG 36&7 

Post#1904 » by FutureKnicksGM » Sat Sep 23, 2017 10:11 pm

Traveyknicks23 wrote:
Triple C wrote:
god shammgod wrote:
no. that's a series or a movie ? i did watch akira years ago and some other movies. haven't watched one in a minute though.


It's a 38 episodes anime of 20 minutes, it's one of the best stuff i've ever see, on par with Breaking Bad, The Wire etc.


Up there next to code geass and attack on titan !


**** Love AoT!
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Re: Carmelo to OKC getting finalized. Updates PG 36&7 

Post#1905 » by SpikJagger » Sat Sep 23, 2017 10:11 pm

Red Vines wrote:So per ESPN it sounds like Portland had a preferable offer but Melo wouldn't agree to go...

https://t.co/W0TQBDSEZJ


I don't doubt that one bit but i never once believed that Melo would have opened his list to include a borderline team like the Blazers when his initial picks were all superstar caliber teams (Cavs, Hou, OKC).

Probably could've came out with Harkless, Leonard, and 1st rnd pick though.
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Re: Carmelo to OKC getting finalized. Updates PG 36&7 

Post#1906 » by FutureKnicksGM » Sat Sep 23, 2017 10:14 pm

ibraheim718 wrote:You fired Phil for this??? THJR and Enes Kanter?


Still better than Derrick Rose and Ryan Anderson/Myers Leonard
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Re: Carmelo to OKC getting finalized. Updates PG 36&7 

Post#1907 » by Tron Carter » Sat Sep 23, 2017 10:16 pm

RHODEY wrote:
Tron Carter wrote:if kanter is who we aspire willy to be then trade willy now


Willy is Kanter with Passing , IQ and growth potential. So no.


so he's not kanter
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Re: Carmelo to OKC getting finalized. Updates PG 36&7 

Post#1908 » by FutureKnicksGM » Sat Sep 23, 2017 10:18 pm

Billy Goat wrote:
FutureKnicksGM wrote:
moocow007 wrote:The Knicks don't have the ball movement or shot creators to maximize Kanter's skills. He's going to end up grinding and holding the ball while everyone else watches. His fg% will drop and folks will be bitching about him well before the All Star break. McDermott also is not a guy that can create his own shots AND would be better off as a spot up guy that can hit shots from someone that can drive the lane, draw defenses and dish out (ie. Not what the Knicks have). Both are also poor defenders. So regardless of their individual skill sets, neither player should be expected ty of do better than they have nor are good fits on paper. It's better than Ryan Anderson in that at least were not getting an extra years of salary. Unless they can deal both guys, it may actually have been better, from a move forward and get your core guys more involved pov to just buy Anthony out.


Yep complain about Iso Melo. Trade for a guy who is going to have to get his posting up, from the center position, in 2017, while he does nothing **** else on the floor.


People complained about ISO Melo because ISO Melo resulted in the 12 seed every year.


No that was because we make moves like signing Noah when we try to 'win now'.
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Re: Carmelo to OKC getting finalized. Updates PG 36&7 

Post#1909 » by Traveyknicks23 » Sat Sep 23, 2017 10:18 pm

FutureKnicksGM wrote:
Traveyknicks23 wrote:
Triple C wrote:
It's a 38 episodes anime of 20 minutes, it's one of the best stuff i've ever see, on par with Breaking Bad, The Wire etc.


Up there next to code geass and attack on titan !


**** Love AoT!


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Re: Carmelo to OKC getting finalized. Updates PG 36&7 

Post#1910 » by nytonm » Sat Sep 23, 2017 10:19 pm

Moving on from Melo was paramount and nearly impossible without taking on long term money and we were able to do that. Couldn't be happier. Let's give our young guys the ball, try to a establish a culture and hopefully get another lottery pick next summer.
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Re: Carmelo to OKC getting finalized. Updates PG 36&7 

Post#1911 » by Traveyknicks23 » Sat Sep 23, 2017 10:22 pm

nytonm wrote:Moving on from Melo was paramount and nearly impossible without taking on long term money and we were able to do that. Couldn't be happier. Let's give our young guys the ball, try to a establish a culture and hopefully get another lottery pick next summer.



Your establishing a losing culture this year by default maybe next year
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Re: Carmelo to OKC getting finalized. Updates PG 36&7 

Post#1912 » by DOT » Sat Sep 23, 2017 10:24 pm

Was at work all day, so I missed all the overreactions

Honestly, it's a bit underwhelming as Perry's first big move
It really doesn't do much for us, unless McDermott or the 2nd this year become a core player, which I'm not expecting, and I don't think Kanter stays with us for more than a year, possibly less as we probably could trade him at the deadline

It's not a great move, but it doesn't f*ck us either, so I'm lukewarm on it. Probably gets us from the 8-11 pick range to the 5-9 pick range which is good, I guess

We really couldn't get a first or Ferguson though? Damn.
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Re: Carmelo to OKC getting finalized. Updates PG 36&7 

Post#1913 » by N8isScofield » Sat Sep 23, 2017 10:25 pm

The BSPN bias is real though. Now Sam Presti is a genius for acquiring the guy they ranked 64th in the league? Hmmm. How does that work? :lol:
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Re: Carmelo to OKC getting finalized. Updates PG 36&7 

Post#1914 » by BLACKFEET 2010 » Sat Sep 23, 2017 10:25 pm

Traveyknicks23 wrote:
nytonm wrote:Moving on from Melo was paramount and nearly impossible without taking on long term money and we were able to do that. Couldn't be happier. Let's give our young guys the ball, try to a establish a culture and hopefully get another lottery pick next summer.



Your establishing a losing culture this year by default maybe next year


Establishing?
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Re: Carmelo to OKC getting finalized. Updates PG 36&7 

Post#1915 » by BowlRips » Sat Sep 23, 2017 10:26 pm

Not a great package but we didn’t have many options
Per wojs article, Perry made the decision that he had to be gone before training camp so that we could have a normal season. I completely agree with that.
End of day it was either, Ryan Anderson, Shumpert and Frye or this package.
Yes I would’ve liked to squeeze a Feurgon or Huentis from OKC but it wasn’t worth risking Carmelo still being on the Knicks come Monday.
I think Kanter will be eventually moved as his contract is not terrible and he’s still young. McDermott is still young and we could use a shooters and Bulls early second rounder could actually be an asset.

I know as a fan I would not be excited to watch a Melo-Knicks team when this should’ve been clearly been a rebuilding year. Knicks waited til the very last day and squeezed as much as they can given the situation.

I’m excited to see the 2017-2018 Knicks and the next set of trades to come
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Re: Carmelo to OKC getting finalized. Updates PG 36&7 

Post#1916 » by Capn'O » Sat Sep 23, 2017 10:28 pm

N8isScofield wrote:The BSPN bias is real though. Now Sam Presti is a genius for acquiring the guy they ranked 64th in the league? Hmmm. How does that work? :lol:


We're gonna see a revival of his image right quick. A few of his biggest detractors here are already turning the tables and wondering how we didn't get much more.

The whole deal is kinda meh. I would have liked to have seen a small, decent young piece attached but we didn't have a whole lot of leverage here. It is what it is. We move on to a new era now. Hope Frank is the real deal and that we get a stud next draft season.
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Re: Carmelo to OKC getting finalized. Updates PG 36&7 

Post#1917 » by K_ick_God » Sat Sep 23, 2017 10:30 pm

If Bill and KP pan out, Frank is at least solid, and we get another very high pick, we could be good.

We probably don't have an elite scorer but that's okay as long as KP doesn't overtry for that -- he has a chance to be but if he's not able, just play D and find your spots for O.

THJ will be next season's best scorer, maybe Kanter close.
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Re: Carmelo to OKC getting finalized. Updates PG 36&7 

Post#1918 » by nytonm » Sat Sep 23, 2017 10:32 pm

Traveyknicks23 wrote:
nytonm wrote:Moving on from Melo was paramount and nearly impossible without taking on long term money and we were able to do that. Couldn't be happier. Let's give our young guys the ball, try to a establish a culture and hopefully get another lottery pick next summer.



Your establishing a losing culture this year by default maybe next year

There is a difference between losing because you don't yet have the experience to succeed in the toughest leage in the world and losing because your 'leader' is an low energy ball stopping premadonna.
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Re: Carmelo to OKC getting finalized. Updates PG 36&7 

Post#1919 » by Captain_Caveman » Sat Sep 23, 2017 10:33 pm

dakomish23 wrote:
Captain_Caveman wrote:
dakomish23 wrote:
If this guy was on your team you and every other Boston fan would worship the ground he walks on.

This defense mechanism of "he's not that great" is seethrough.

Thanks for stopping by. :wave: :wave: :wave:

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Well... Boston fans know the difference between good and great, and don't oversell their players or teams. We have parades for championships, not putting up 18/7 on a 31-win team. There are literally dozens of Boston athletes in the past 17 years or so that ended up far better than even the biggest Boston homers claimed they'd be. Brady, Papa, Pierce, IT, Pedroia, Edelman, etc etc etc...

Feel free to name the guys we've oversold on. I'll wait. Not in here telling you Jaylen, Tatum or Smart are going to be franchise guys, even though Tatum is as good a prospect as KP, and all three were drafted high like KP was.

More to the point, our franchises are well-run and know how to build contending teams. Belichick and Ainge aren't sentimental in the least. I can see Ainge overpaying for KP because he completes the team we have assembled, but would he build around him, like you guys might do? Hell no. Look at IT. Dude just had as good a season as any Knick player has ever had, and Ainge couldn't wait to trade him just because he isn't a guy who can lead you to banners in a featured role.

Again, no doubt in my mind that AInge would take Tatum/Lakers-Kings pick for KP in your shoes, before tanking this year. Because he is a good GM who knows what he is doing.


You're comparing

building around a 29 year old undersized PG coming off a hip injury due for a huge deal into his 30's best year

to

building around a healthy 22 year old 7 footer with an insane skill set who's still on his rookie year

Image

You're damn right Ainge would trade Tatum and the pick for KP. The kid is special and everyone around the league knows it. It wasn't even a bad offer. My problem is your failed attempt at trashing the player you claim is going to be a superstar, yet are here making a big offer for.

We only throw parades for championships too. Boston homers like yourself should know this all too well. It came at the expense of your Sox and your Patriots multiple times.


I brought up IT to demonstrate that Ainge not dumb enough to prop up a non-franchise player as a franchise player. Still led us to the ECFs, which the Knicks haven't done in seventeen years.

As to KP, put the hype aside. He's a nice player who might make a couple of all-star teams some day. He's long and mobile, he can score and rebound. Certainly fits Boston very well. But you have to be tripping to think the dude has top 10 player potential.

Again, more to the point, you guys should be trying to get as many top 5 picks as possible. Probably gonna take at least three of them to get you off the mat someday. Given your management, you will probably do something else, though.

Oh well... fare thee well.
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Re: Carmelo to OKC getting finalized. Updates PG 36&7 

Post#1920 » by N8isScofield » Sat Sep 23, 2017 10:33 pm

Capn'O wrote:
N8isScofield wrote:The BSPN bias is real though. Now Sam Presti is a genius for acquiring the guy they ranked 64th in the league? Hmmm. How does that work? :lol:


We're gonna see a revival of his image right quick. A few of his biggest detractors here are already turning the tables and wondering how we didn't get much more.

The whole deal is kinda meh. I would have liked to have seen a small, decent young piece attached but we didn't have a whole lot of leverage here. It is what it is. We move on to a new era now. Hope Frank is the real deal and that we get a stud next draft season.

Totally agree. I wish we had done more to help him while he was here and I wish he had done more to help himself as well but he it's good to close the chapter and start fresh. The deal is very meh. I don't see how we wouldn't have done much better waiting until near the deadline. The absolute worst case scenario then was Melo packing his bags and going for nothing next season. Kanter and McDermott are pointless in our situation and the 2nd rounder is more than underwhelming. Hopefully his drafts are better than this. But yes the about face on Melo's worth as a player is moving at a stunning rate. It's incredible how much this franchise is hated.

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