2019-2020 College/Draft thread (Part 3)

[malik959]

For the first time in my life I'm not upset that we aren't top 3 (so far) in this draft. Wiseman, LaMelo, and Edwards in any previous draft would probably end up in the 5-8 range. LaMelo shoots worse than Frank at his age yet plays defense like young. But because of his "passing skills" people act like he's the next Jason Kidd (without the defense). Edwards is a chucker in the form of like a Buddy Heild, and Wiseman I just haven't seen enough of to say I'd take him although we already have Mitch.

The more and more film I watch on Cole the more and more I like him. 1) He's no slouch on the defense of end, but he's still very aggressive on the offensive end. RJ himself has not failed us when it comes to bringing the ball up/ distributing and their skill set combined actually compliment each other. I keep looking at Cole as the glass half full because without a true team we really didn't see him relax. 2) He was constantly playing 1 on 5 and succeeding. 3) This is the way the NBA has gone these days - Athletic point guards that are score first , learn to be the distributor later. 4) He's nothing like any of our previous guards so maybe he's the guard we are actually needing. He's that Dame, James Harden, Westbrook, Rose, Irving type of guard that's like F it I want to score so try to stop me type of guard that we haven't had sense Marbury. So yeah he's high on my list and increasing.

Haliburton is my safer pick and I would be very satisfied with him. Tyrese gives you more of a full package with his only flaws being his shot form and he needs to bulk up. He's more of a safe pick and is this years Mikal Bridges type.

Killian Hayes is VERY intriguing. Young, athletic, gifted. From watching his film you wonder why he's not sought to be a top 3. He's all over the draft boards from 5 to 16, but the only time you see him high up is when it has to do with the Knicks, well that's with all of the top point guards really. But he's Frank on defense, yet DWill on offense so I'm all for it.

[EMG518]

He is ranked as a late 1st rounder. We have to grab him. He should be a lottery pick, his ability to get the basket and finish with ease is very high level, he is long and super quick/shifty. Very young and productive as well, with a decent shot.

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[Oscirus]

tre jonessssssss. Yea I know nothing but him at this point. lolz

[blanko]

Nico mannion opinion? wouldn't mind him in late lottery, he is an underrated athelete.. would be a legit nba shooter from day 1. Great passer. Lacks elite length and not the best penetrator but on the Knicks he would be a floor spacer.

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[malik959]

Fun game to watch, Anthony went off in the second half

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[knickstape21]

He is ranked as a late 1st rounder. We have to grab him. He should be a lottery pick, his ability to get the basket and finish with ease is very high level, he is long and super quick/shifty. Very young and productive as well, with a decent shot.

Watch on YouTube

If Lewis adds more shake and bounce to his dribble game to go along with his straight line speed...........

[knickstape21]

How does Cole Anthony compare to Donovan Mitchell coming out of College? Sounds like theyre of a similar mold (although Donovan has a wider wingspan.)

Edit: took a look at some per game and advanced stats - looks like Donovan was either better or at least similar across almost all stats. Remembering that even then people were not convinced about this ability to impact in the NBA and it took him a substantial leap/right system in the NBA for him to flourish, doesnt this make Cole a much more risky propsect?

Like someone said before, Donovan is much more explosive, craftier, athletic, and physical than Anthony.

Only reason Mitchell really fell is because we had amateurs saying “is he a 1 or is he a 2?” and “he’s undersized for a guard.” Like positions even matter anymore. Give the man the ball and get out the way is how I see it. His college highlights are incredible and I remember watching Louisville vs NC State and surprise surprise... Mitchell made Dennis “I could absolutely care less” Smith his ******.

[Deeeez Knicks]

He is ranked as a late 1st rounder. We have to grab him. He should be a lottery pick, his ability to get the basket and finish with ease is very high level, he is long and super quick/shifty. Very young and productive as well, with a decent shot.

Watch on YouTube

Yea, I like Kira Lewis. He would be a great pickup in the late first if we can get him there.

[moocow007]

So here's the deal...

NO ONE on this team right now should be untouchable. NO ONE on this team right now has screamed to me that they are MUST to build around. It is what it is...

So the notion that you have to start trying to fit whomever you draft into the guys on this team is a reach. No, you don't say can player 'x' fit with "a, b and c". You look at player 'x' and you ask yourself, can this guy be a legit star? A game changer? On and by the way, can he theoretically also fit with the guys I do have.

The reason we are talking PG's is because it just so happens that there's a heavy concentration of them slotted to go in the top part of this draft. It shouldn't be because that's what this team needs. This team is probably the 2nd least talented team in the NBA right now. It's a stinker of a team. It has no Zion like player. It doesn't even have a Ja like player. Nothing. So stop trying to fit the guy that they'll be drafting into this current mix so much so that it clouds judgement. If I was the Pelican's, then yeah, I'm probably ready to look at fit more than anything else. But we aren't at that point yet.

Who I like if I were in charge?

I'd be looking for game changer players, guys that can become legit stars in the NBA. So I'd be looking at guys who's game and mentality can dominate and do well in the NBA. REGARDLESS of who I got on this team.

What I'd be interested in most is not to figure out if LaMelo Ball can ever learn to shoot, it's to figure out what his mentality really is (not the assumed drama mentality being a Ball) or anything like that.

Honestly, my top priority would be to try to get a real feel for James Wiseman and how much of a competitor he really is and what really is his capacity to step up and elevate his game when the competition gets harder. That would be my no.1 task? Why? Cause of all the players in this draft, Wiseman is the guy that absolutely can dominate if everything clicks on. More than anyone else. And no, if Wiseman can give me the warm and fuzzy feeling it absolutely does not matter if we already have Mitch Robinson or how good Mitch is or can be. Why? Cause I can flip Robinson for something else I can maximize value on.

Then it's onto LaMelo Ball and try to figure out if his mentality and makeup, and game, will translate better than his brother Lonzo's and what will I be getting once the lights AND pressure AND criticism turn on here. Would my assumption that he's made more for NY than any other player in this draft be correct?

So Ball and Wiseman, Wiseman and Ball, would be my top 2. Then I go from there.

Finding a shooter? Look. I'm not discounting shooting. Nor am I discounting how shooting could open up the floor for some of the other guys on the team. And yep, the NBA now puts a premium on shooting. But unless there's a Steph Curry in this draft (there isn't) the Knicks have a bigger need than a shooter at the top of their no.1 need list. So, again, no, shooting isn't the most important thing when figuring out who to draft. You can find shooting. You can't find a premium talent, an alpha lead, a game changer remotely as easily. If it were then we wouldn't be in the situation we've been in for over 2 decades running.

So, yeah, Wiseman and Ball would be at the top of my list. Then it's everyone else in some form.

So what happens if the Knicks don't end up with a top 3 or so pick (what you need to get Wiseman or Ball)? Killian Hayes next.

What if Hayes, Wiseman and Ball are gone? BPA Anthony Edwards would be where I'd lean. What about Barrett? What about him? IF Edwards is who I believe he can be and he lives up to the billing then I can: a) move Barrett to SF, b) move Barrett.

What if Edwards, Hayes, Wiseman and Ball are gone? I'd start moving to Deni Avdija and seeing how I feel about his game (and he's probably one of the most talented young players in this draft with a mentality that you find more here in the stats than anything else)? Where would he play? SF? What does it mean for Knox? It means if Knox can't step his game up then he's not going to be playing and/or be around for long.

Next? I have said this before, I think Onyeka Okongwu can be a special player in the NBA. He has the physical tools, the feel, the defensive chops and a pretty unique evolving offensive game. I do think he can become a Pascall Siakam level player (no obviously they don't play the same position or have the same exact skills).

Cole Anthony then would come in after that as, again, while I don't think he'll win you games with his PG skills, he can make an impact on the offensive end and as a high intensity attack dog type. A tough competitor that can at least help set a tone that I want my team to have.

That's 7 right? Those would be the guys I focus on. That would be my 7. That's the high talent and/or IMO the legit high upside guys. Obviously depending on what happens till draft time (more games and standing change, lottery results, etc.) If I end up with one of them I'd be anywhere from ecstatic to at least solidly ok with.

The rest of the guys? There are a lot of guys that are putting up stats and looking great in college that I honestly don't think will be able to translate to the NBA and/or that doesn't have much in the way of ceiling (Haliburton headlines this group). Doesn't mean they can't contribute, just means that it's not going to be someone that likely will push the needle for me enough. And I'm absolutely looking for a guy that can move the needle for me be it immediately (unlikely) or 2 or 3 years from now (much more realistic). I'm not shopping for role players or secondary guys where I am. Role players and secondary guys? That's what free agency is for since I'd be pretty clear that no needle movers will be signing with my schlep of a team.

There are also guys that I think will flub out completely (RJ Hampton to me is going to be the another Dante Exum). Yep it's most of the rest of the guys in the Tankathon mock lottery. If the Knicks end up at a spot where the the guys I mentioned already are all gone...then I move on and see if I which of the rest of these guys can give me a solid role player down the road and not flub out on me by not being able to mentally (or game wise) adjust to not being "da main man" in the NBA.

[3toheadmelo]

So here's the deal...

NO ONE on this team right now should be untouchable. NO ONE on this team right now has screamed to me that they are MUST to build around. It is what it is...

So the notion that you have to start trying to fit whomever you draft into the guys on this team is a reach. No, you don't say can player 'x' fit with "a, b and c". You look at player 'x' and you ask yourself, can this guy be a legit star? A game changer? On and by the way, can he theoretically also fit with the guys I do have.

The reason we are talking PG's is because it just so happens that there's a heavy concentration of them slotted to go in the top part of this draft. It shouldn't be because that's what this team needs. This team is probably the 2nd least talented team in the NBA right now. It's a stinker of a team. It has no Zion like player. It doesn't even have a Ja like player. Nothing. So stop trying to fit the guy that they'll be drafting into this current mix so much so that it clouds judgement. If I was the Pelican's, then yeah, I'm probably ready to look at fit more than anything else. But we aren't at that point yet.

Who I like if I were in charge?

I'd be looking for game changer players, guys that can become legit stars in the NBA. So I'd be looking at guys who's game and mentality can dominate and do well in the NBA. REGARDLESS of who I got on this team.

What I'd be interested in most is not to figure out if LaMelo Ball can ever learn to shoot, it's to figure out what his mentality really is (not the assumed drama mentality being a Ball) or anything like that. Honestly, my top priority would be to try to get a real feel for James Wiseman and how much of a competitor he really is and what really is his capacity to step up and elevate his game when the competition gets harder. That would be my no.1 task? Why? Cause of all the players in this draft, Wiseman is the guy that absolutely can dominate if everything clicks on. More than anyone else. And no, if Wiseman can give me the warm and fuzzy feeling it absolutely does not matter if we already have Mitch Robinson or how good Mitch is or can be. Why? Cause I can flip Robinson for something else I can maximize value on.

Then it's onto LaMelo Ball and try to figure out if his mentality and makeup, and game, will translate better than his brother Lonzo's and what will I be getting once the lights AND pressure AND criticism turn on here. Would my assumption that he's made more for NY than any other player in this draft be correct?

So Ball and Wiseman, Wiseman and Ball, would be my top 2. Then I go from there.

Finding a shooter? Look. I'm not discounting shooting. Nor am I discounting how shooting could open up the floor for some of the other guys on the team. And yep, the NBA now puts a premium on shooting. But unless there's a Steph Curry in this draft (there isn't) the Knicks have a bigger need than a shooter at the top of their no.1 need list. So, again, no, shooting isn't the most important thing when figuring out who to draft. You can find shooting. You can't find a premium talent, an alpha lead, a game changer remotely as easily. If it were then we wouldn't be in the situation we've been in for over 2 decades running.

So, yeah, Wiseman and Ball would be at the top of my list. Then it's everyone else in some form.

So what happens if the Knicks don't end up with a top 3 or so pick (what you need to get Wiseman or Ball)? Killian Hayes next.

What if Hayes, Wiseman and Ball are gone? BPA Anthony Edwards would be where I'd lean.

What if Edwards, Hayes, Wiseman and Ball are gone? I'd start moving to Deni Avdija and seeing how I feel about his game (and he's probably one of the most talented young players in this draft with a mentality that you find more here in the stats than anything else)? Where would he play? SF? What does it mean for Knox? It means if Knox can't step his game up then he's not going to be playing and/or be around for long.

Next? I have said this before, I think Onyeka Okongwu can be a special player in the NBA. He has the physical tools, the feel, the defensive chops and a pretty unique evolving offensive game. I do think he can become a Pascall Siakam level player (no obviously they don't play the same position or have the same exact skills).

Cole Anthony then would come in after that as, again, while I don't think he'll win you games with his PG skills, he can make an impact on the offensive end and as a high intensity attack dog type. A tough competitor that can at least help set a tone that I want my team to have.

That's 7 right? Those would be the guys I focus on. That would be my 7. That's the high talent and/or IMO the legit high upside guys. Obviously depending on what happens till draft time (more games and standing change, lottery results, etc.) If I end up with one of them I'd be anywhere from ecstatic to at least solidly ok with.

The rest of the guys? There are a lot of guys that are putting up stats and looking great in college that I honestly don't think will be able to translate to the NBA and/or that doesn't have much in the way of ceiling (Haliburton headlines this group). Doesn't mean they can't contribute, just means that it's not going to be someone that likely will push the needle for me enough. There are also guys that I think will flub out completely (RJ Hampton to me is going to be the another Dante Exum). Yep it's most of the rest of the guys in the Tankathon mock lottery. If the Knicks end up at a spot where the the guys I mentioned already are all gone...then I move on and see if I which of the rest of these guys can give me a solid role player down the road and not flub out on me by not being able to mentally (or game wise) adjust to not being "da main man" in the NBA.

I’m with you. We need a legit star on this team and we need to pick that player who has the most star potential despite their position. Nobody on this team should stop us from drafting anybody.

Wiseman can be one of the most dominant bigs in this league. We need someone to battle with Giannis/Embiid, etc in the East. Wiseman can absolutely be that guy.

[robillionaire]

I’m slowly accepting cole will be our guy

[mpharris36]

Kililan Hayes just submitted his paperwork to become eligible for the 2020 draft.

I am leaning towards him as being the best case scenario for us during the draft.

[Triple C]

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[coopnyc74]

I have seen him play multiple times and live and Anthony Edwards is in a class by himself, D-Wade with an even better jumper coming out of college.

[mpharris36]

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[Gravy]

I want a pg. Stop making me warm up to Wiseman!

[3toheadmelo]

I want a pg. Stop making me warm up to Wiseman!

Join the Wiseman bandwagon

[knickstape21]

I have seen him play multiple times and live and Anthony Edwards is in a class by himself, D-Wade with an even better jumper coming out of college.

By far the best talent. If his head is right he’s a star.

[NYF13]

1. LAMELO or 2. DENI or 3. KILLIAN > 4. COLE.

But i am OK with any of these 4.

[mpharris36]

I want a pg. Stop making me warm up to Wiseman!

Join the Wiseman bandwagon

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