PG: Knicks smack Hicks

[Jeff Van Gully]

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puts **** into perspective a bit, doesn't it?

sure does... and the dads seems like really cool people...but it wont stop be from hating on Haliburton while he's playing against us

not even a little bit, war machine. not even a little bit.

[Jeff Van Gully]

Read on Twitter

puts **** into perspective a bit, doesn't it?

Yeah. The league is bytch made these days. Everybody grows up playing together and now the whole damn summer they play together. It takes away from the real rivalry teams of the past. Bunch of hugs and kisses for everyone!

eh, i hear where you're coming from. but patrick, jordan, and reggie were all homies. tearing up scores and crap tables all around the country. they didn't really show it the same way, but the offseason that was gang. we lived in a different world with way less transparency into that.

[BKlutch]

I don’t agree. Knicks fans really do care about defense. But at the same time every player doesn’t have to be a good defender though. Brunson is a terrible defensive player but we know what he brings to our team and he is a beloved player and well deserved. It might be more accurate to say fans love hustle type guys, and a lot of the time hustle and defense goes hand in hand.

The takeaway I have is that we tend to treat drafted players like they are our children and are willing to overlook their glaring flaws and will try to end the careers of actually good players and coaches if they think they are standing in the way or their children are being slighted

The narrative I always heard was folks saying “you can’t rebuild in NY” because fans aren’t patient, that’s hilariously wrong from what I can tell. Most fans would rather lose forever, so they don’t have to deal with any kind of expectations, scout international and ncaa prospects and watch hype videos of young players while we lose 60+ games every year. We could do this forever and fans would be thrilled and excited.

We are in year 1 of having this very talented roster post the Towns and Bridges additions, having a good season even with the natural time to build cohesion that comes with a new team. Not even to the all star break yet, and people are trying to put a ceiling on it, say it’s over for 5 years, it’s back to Isaiah, fire and trade everyone(I assume so we can go back to hitting the tank crack pipe) I sort of wonder when the demands for players to be removed or people to be fired when Kolek Dadiet and Hukporti don’t amount to much, because that’s more important and exciting than winning games.

We have a top 5 record in the league and fans hate it. People need to change that saying. You can’t try to win in NY.

Thibs still needs to go

Well maybe so. Let’s see how the season ends. The players do like Thibs and he’s a big part of the team identity and he’s helped turned the franchise around. But if we try and try and can’t get over the top and it still doesn’t work out at some point ultimately you have to make a change and go another direction. I say that from a perspective of wanting the team to be successful.

Now many others have been trying to get him fired since the day he stepped off the plane. Because the fact of the matter is as long as he is the coach, tanking is impossible, and whatever kid you like probably ain’t playing much. And many are still seeking revenge for the years of blaming him because we overhyped a bunch of busts who didn’t pan out and need him to be fired to feel vindicated for it. The good news is that even if he is fired, those players aren’t coming back and the picks we sent out for Mikal aren’t coming back. The option to start losing on purpose again is gone for the rest of this decade and it is not coming back any time soon. So whoever else replaces him is also coming in to win games and take us to the next level, not be fizdale and run a daycare. So that’s at least something to take solace in

The case of Nick Nurse gives me pause. When he was in Toronto and won, many of us thought he was the future savior. Now that I see him stinking up Philly with Embiid, I don't think so. Not every great coach wins, and giving Thibs one year to win a chip seems too fast. We said he couldn't develop the kids. The good ones developed. Meh players like Obi didn't.
He was running our guys into the ground with too many minutes, but now he's using the bench early and late, and has mostly cut down starters' minutes.
He was a defensive only coach, but now he's running a top offense.

So maybe he is entitled to a bit more leeway from all of us know-it-alls, because winning isn't easy even for great coaches with great teams.

[TheGreenArrow]

This is the best or second-best Knicks team in the last quarter century.

They're behind only Boston and OKC, who are clearly a step ahead of them. We're in that second tier with Cleveland, Denver, LA and Memphis.

Seems like a large portion of the fanbase is just waiting for the playoffs. I think there are also a lot of KAT haters who are hedging their bet a bit, waiting to see how this team compares to last year's team.

Let me be clear that this observation obviously does not concern our boy melo. But unfortunately a lot of folks are homophobic, and I think is a lot of the "sassy" or "zesty" comments you see on social media (let alone "pause") are veiled ways of distancing themselves from KAT because they feel his character is "gay". And these fans already have one foot out the door in case the team fails to reach another round - "I knew it wasn't going to work out so I was never all in".

All we need is health. This team is a threat for anyone.

Post of the year Folksssssssss!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

So ******* True Cb!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[BKlutch]

This is the best or second-best Knicks team in the last quarter century.

They're behind only Boston and OKC, who are clearly a step ahead of them. We're in that second tier with Cleveland, Denver, LA and Memphis.

Seems like a large portion of the fanbase is just waiting for the playoffs. I think there are also a lot of KAT haters who are hedging their bet a bit, waiting to see how this team compares to last year's team.

Let me be clear that this observation obviously does not concern our boy melo. But unfortunately a lot of folks are homophobic, and I think is a lot of the "sassy" or "zesty" comments you see on social media (let alone "pause") are veiled ways of distancing themselves from KAT because they feel his character is "gay". And these fans already have one foot out the door in case the team fails to reach another round - "I knew it wasn't going to work out so I was never all in".

All we need is health. This team is a threat for anyone.

Post of the year Folksssssssss!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

So ******* True Cb!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You know, I never once thought of KAT as having a gay character. Maybe it's just because he's a great player and I'm interested in that, and he seems tougher in the game than previously reporte. We do have the best team in decads, and I'm enjoying this, looking forward to seeing how far this goes!

[3toheadmelo]

Hyping up Obi, they tried to convince us Jericho Sims with a mid 3 ball is better than Randle...the madness

The Obi lovers went out sad. Lost his starting spot and the pacers are trying to trade him.

I remember so many posts year ago that if only Obi got to play instead of Julius, we'd win so much more. They all blamed Thibs for refusing to give Obi a chance. As it turns out, the coaching staff was able to evaluate Obi in practice, and they knew he wasn't it. But it really pissed off a lot of folks!

They exposed their basketball IQ with those awful awful takes.

[DOT]

puts **** into perspective a bit, doesn't it?

Yeah. The league is bytch made these days. Everybody grows up playing together and now the whole damn summer they play together. It takes away from the real rivalry teams of the past. Bunch of hugs and kisses for everyone!

eh, i hear where you're coming from. but patrick, jordan, and reggie were all homies. tearing up scores and crap tables all around the country. they didn't really show it the same way, but the offseason that was gang. we lived in a different world with way less transparency into that.

[robillionaire]

Yeah. The league is bytch made these days. Everybody grows up playing together and now the whole damn summer they play together. It takes away from the real rivalry teams of the past. Bunch of hugs and kisses for everyone!

eh, i hear where you're coming from. but patrick, jordan, and reggie were all homies. tearing up scores and crap tables all around the country. they didn't really show it the same way, but the offseason that was gang. we lived in a different world with way less transparency into that.

What’s funny is that Brunson and Haliburton literally did a wrestling bit together. You guys think they really hate each other or something? It’s a regular season game, and besides that players are always chatting. And recruiting. I don’t see anything wrong with it. Maybe don’t be all buddy buddy in the playoffs when it really matters but beyond that whatever.

[robillionaire]

Knicks fans say they care about defense but the reality most Knicks fans don't really care about defense.

They just pretend to.

It's one of my key takeaways from supporting this team for nearly 20 years.

I don’t agree. Knicks fans really do care about defense. But at the same time every player doesn’t have to be a good defender though. Brunson is a terrible defensive player but we know what he brings to our team and he is a beloved player and well deserved. It might be more accurate to say fans love hustle type guys, and a lot of the time hustle and defense goes hand in hand.

The takeaway I have is that we tend to treat drafted players like they are our children and are willing to overlook their glaring flaws and will try to end the careers of actually good players and coaches if they think they are standing in the way or their children are being slighted

The narrative I always heard was folks saying “you can’t rebuild in NY” because fans aren’t patient, that’s hilariously wrong from what I can tell. Most fans would rather lose forever, so they don’t have to deal with any kind of expectations, scout international and ncaa prospects and watch hype videos of young players while we lose 60+ games every year. We could do this forever and fans would be thrilled and excited.

We are in year 1 of having this very talented roster post the Towns and Bridges additions, having a good season even with the natural time to build cohesion that comes with a new team. Not even to the all star break yet, and people are trying to put a ceiling on it, say it’s over for 5 years, it’s back to Isaiah, fire and trade everyone(I assume so we can go back to hitting the tank crack pipe) I sort of wonder when the demands for players to be removed or people to be fired when Kolek Dadiet and Hukporti don’t amount to much, because that’s more important and exciting than winning games.

We have a top 5 record in the league and fans hate it. People need to change that saying. You can’t try to win in NY.

There’s a massive difference between fans being annoyed about a lack of developing lotto players like Obi and being annoyed about role playing 2nd rounders not getting burn to spell a 7 man rotation early in the season. Nobody ever wanted Thibs fired because they expected Kolek, Huk, or Dadiet to be franchise players. That’s disingenuous to say the least.

Fans don’t hate the success.. everyone wants the team to win, but understand that this current team isn’t at that level. Whether that’s because the players aren’t a match for the coach (anti KAT fans) or because the coach isn’t a match for the players (anti Thibs fans), or we gave up all the assets to get to that next level (anti Mikal trade/bench sucks fans), there's some truth to all of it. I get all sides.

Saying fans just want to tank isn’t right either… at the end of the day fans are just starved for a savior. Most people feel we have two of them already in Jalen/KAT, others feel they don’t have what it takes, and I get that too.

What I don’t get is the fans who act like criticism of anything is wrong and your fan card should be pulled if you do. That’s nuts. That’s why we’re all here lol. To vent, celebrate, share ideas, hot takes etc. Everyone wants to win, but we all have different ideas or opinions on how to get there. It’s just that simple. There’s nothing wrong with that.

Hey I’m not saying anybody’s fan card should be pulled. Just not everyone seems to want to watch the same product or in the same way that I do. And that’s ok. We all enjoy things differently. Some people, by my estimate, seem to be happier watching the team lose. In fact they seem to revel in the Knicks are doomed and hopeless identity the team has cultivated by being an embarrassment for the media and fans to laugh at for two decades. I am more happy when the Knicks are winning and want to shake off that negative identity and be known as a good organization for a change. I’m ready to get over that loser era for good. And for many this doesn’t appear to be the case. That’s just my observation though. My god how long I’ve waited and suffered to see the Knicks playing good basketball. I hate to see people try to tear it down or shrug it off and think we need to go back to misery. “Needing a savior” is a mindset for teams in the bottom 5 on tankathon, not for top 5 nba teams. Towns and Brunson are in the top 8 on the MVP ladder and both all star starters aka top 10. So what are we even doing here?

[K_ick_God]

Read on Twitter

puts **** into perspective a bit, doesn't it?

It does yes, full stop. I also do wonder, some, though, if it's a bit more like exchanging pleasantries at a Christmas party with the guy who you don't like to work with and who's up for the same promotion.

[robillionaire]

Read on Twitter

puts **** into perspective a bit, doesn't it?

It does yes, full stop. I also do wonder, some, though, if it's a bit more like exchanging pleasantries at a Christmas party with the guy who you don't like to work with and who's up for the same promotion.

My outlook. The nba players are athletes but the nba is an entertainment company. The team owners work together to make as much money as possible. The players are in a union and they’re trying to get as big of a slice of the pie as possible. They compete against one another but at the end of the day they’re in the same club. Not saying there’s anything wrong with it, that’s what they should do. The only difference between that and wrestling is that wrestling is scripted with predetermined outcomes and with the nba it only seems like it’s scripted or rigged half the time but I’m sure that’s just a coincidence. And then let’s forget the ref scandals and player gambling scandals that we know about. Imagine what we don’t know about or what doesn’t get out. I can’t sit here and say that I believe with 100% certainty that some outcomes aren’t manipulated or tilted in some way especially now with all the gambling injected everywhere.

On the other hand I want to enjoy my life and my hobby, pretending the players really hate each other makes it more fun, and maybe it’s just best to ignore what could be behind the curtain. And after all, I still like wrestling.

[K_ick_God]

puts **** into perspective a bit, doesn't it?

It does yes, full stop. I also do wonder, some, though, if it's a bit more like exchanging pleasantries at a Christmas party with the guy who you don't like to work with and who's up for the same promotion.

My outlook. The nba players are athletes but the nba is an entertainment company. The team owners work together to make as much money as possible. The players are in a union and they’re trying to get as big of a slice of the pie as possible. They compete against one another but at the end of the day they’re in the same club. Not saying there’s anything wrong with it, that’s what they should do. The only difference between that and wrestling is that wrestling is scripted with predetermined outcomes and with the nba it only seems like it’s scripted or rigged half the time but I’m sure that’s just a coincidence. And then let’s forget the ref scandals and player gambling scandals that we know about. Imagine what we don’t know about or what doesn’t get out. I can’t sit here and say that I believe with 100% certainty that some outcomes aren’t manipulated or tilted in some way especially now with all the gambling injected everywhere.

On the other hand I want to enjoy my life and my hobby, pretending the players really hate each other makes it more fun, and maybe it’s just best to ignore what could be behind the curtain. And after all, I still like wrestling.

But a big thing you're not mentioning is that they each stand to make a lot more by being just slightly better than other guys. Making a few more shots. Winning a few more games.

Still, good stuff.

[spree8]

I don’t agree. Knicks fans really do care about defense. But at the same time every player doesn’t have to be a good defender though. Brunson is a terrible defensive player but we know what he brings to our team and he is a beloved player and well deserved. It might be more accurate to say fans love hustle type guys, and a lot of the time hustle and defense goes hand in hand.

The takeaway I have is that we tend to treat drafted players like they are our children and are willing to overlook their glaring flaws and will try to end the careers of actually good players and coaches if they think they are standing in the way or their children are being slighted

The narrative I always heard was folks saying “you can’t rebuild in NY” because fans aren’t patient, that’s hilariously wrong from what I can tell. Most fans would rather lose forever, so they don’t have to deal with any kind of expectations, scout international and ncaa prospects and watch hype videos of young players while we lose 60+ games every year. We could do this forever and fans would be thrilled and excited.

We are in year 1 of having this very talented roster post the Towns and Bridges additions, having a good season even with the natural time to build cohesion that comes with a new team. Not even to the all star break yet, and people are trying to put a ceiling on it, say it’s over for 5 years, it’s back to Isaiah, fire and trade everyone(I assume so we can go back to hitting the tank crack pipe) I sort of wonder when the demands for players to be removed or people to be fired when Kolek Dadiet and Hukporti don’t amount to much, because that’s more important and exciting than winning games.

We have a top 5 record in the league and fans hate it. People need to change that saying. You can’t try to win in NY.

There’s a massive difference between fans being annoyed about a lack of developing lotto players like Obi and being annoyed about role playing 2nd rounders not getting burn to spell a 7 man rotation early in the season. Nobody ever wanted Thibs fired because they expected Kolek, Huk, or Dadiet to be franchise players. That’s disingenuous to say the least.

Fans don’t hate the success.. everyone wants the team to win, but understand that this current team isn’t at that level. Whether that’s because the players aren’t a match for the coach (anti KAT fans) or because the coach isn’t a match for the players (anti Thibs fans), or we gave up all the assets to get to that next level (anti Mikal trade/bench sucks fans), there's some truth to all of it. I get all sides.

Saying fans just want to tank isn’t right either… at the end of the day fans are just starved for a savior. Most people feel we have two of them already in Jalen/KAT, others feel they don’t have what it takes, and I get that too.

What I don’t get is the fans who act like criticism of anything is wrong and your fan card should be pulled if you do. That’s nuts. That’s why we’re all here lol. To vent, celebrate, share ideas, hot takes etc. Everyone wants to win, but we all have different ideas or opinions on how to get there. It’s just that simple. There’s nothing wrong with that.

Hey I’m not saying anybody’s fan card should be pulled. Just not everyone seems to want to watch the same product or in the same way that I do. And that’s ok. We all enjoy things differently. Some people, by my estimate, seem to be happier watching the team lose. In fact they seem to revel in the Knicks are doomed and hopeless identity the team has cultivated by being an embarrassment for the media and fans to laugh at for two decades. I am more happy when the Knicks are winning and want to shake off that negative identity and be known as a good organization for a change. I’m ready to get over that loser era for good. And for many this doesn’t appear to be the case. That’s just my observation though. My god how long I’ve waited and suffered to see the Knicks playing good basketball. I hate to see people try to tear it down or shrug it off and think we need to go back to misery. “Needing a savior” is a mindset for teams in the bottom 5 on tankathon, not for top 5 nba teams. Towns and Brunson are in the top 8 on the MVP ladder and both all star starters aka top 10. So what are we even doing here?

I getcha. I think the root of it has to do more with believing in truly being contenders vs pretenders. Are we better than the times where we trotted out lineups like Shved, Amundson, Galloway? Obviously, but I can understand how fans still aren’t 100% satisfied with this other worldly team we have now because the ultimate goal is a championship, and there are legitimate concerns when it comes to winning one.

I’m just saying it’s not so binary. We’re trash or we’re perfect. Be happy or you’re miserable. It’s more nuanced than that and as complex as people are in a complex world I think it’s ok to be critical as we strive for the top prize. I don’t think fans are reveling in losses as much as it is fans just venting after enduring decades of poor decisions. It’ll never be perfect and teams who win titles don’t have to be perfect, but title team’s fans complain too, it’s just part of fandom and human nature. People have their opinions of what they want for the team and strive for that perfection. Nobody should take it personal or hold it against anyone. We’re all crazy to some degree.

[ctorres]

Read on Twitter

I am pretty sure a while back, Haliburton said that he has a group text with the Nova boys

Also, I'm still bummed that these guys weren't able to at least win Bronze in the World Cup. If they had won a medal, it would increase their chances of being core players in the Olympics. Don't know if Team USA would trust Brunson, Hart, and Bridges as top guys even if they have the talent for it.

[robillionaire]

There’s a massive difference between fans being annoyed about a lack of developing lotto players like Obi and being annoyed about role playing 2nd rounders not getting burn to spell a 7 man rotation early in the season. Nobody ever wanted Thibs fired because they expected Kolek, Huk, or Dadiet to be franchise players. That’s disingenuous to say the least.

Fans don’t hate the success.. everyone wants the team to win, but understand that this current team isn’t at that level. Whether that’s because the players aren’t a match for the coach (anti KAT fans) or because the coach isn’t a match for the players (anti Thibs fans), or we gave up all the assets to get to that next level (anti Mikal trade/bench sucks fans), there's some truth to all of it. I get all sides.

Saying fans just want to tank isn’t right either… at the end of the day fans are just starved for a savior. Most people feel we have two of them already in Jalen/KAT, others feel they don’t have what it takes, and I get that too.

What I don’t get is the fans who act like criticism of anything is wrong and your fan card should be pulled if you do. That’s nuts. That’s why we’re all here lol. To vent, celebrate, share ideas, hot takes etc. Everyone wants to win, but we all have different ideas or opinions on how to get there. It’s just that simple. There’s nothing wrong with that.

Hey I’m not saying anybody’s fan card should be pulled. Just not everyone seems to want to watch the same product or in the same way that I do. And that’s ok. We all enjoy things differently. Some people, by my estimate, seem to be happier watching the team lose. In fact they seem to revel in the Knicks are doomed and hopeless identity the team has cultivated by being an embarrassment for the media and fans to laugh at for two decades. I am more happy when the Knicks are winning and want to shake off that negative identity and be known as a good organization for a change. I’m ready to get over that loser era for good. And for many this doesn’t appear to be the case. That’s just my observation though. My god how long I’ve waited and suffered to see the Knicks playing good basketball. I hate to see people try to tear it down or shrug it off and think we need to go back to misery. “Needing a savior” is a mindset for teams in the bottom 5 on tankathon, not for top 5 nba teams. Towns and Brunson are in the top 8 on the MVP ladder and both all star starters aka top 10. So what are we even doing here?

I getcha. I think the root of it has to do more with believing in truly being contenders vs pretenders. Are we better than the times where we trotted out lineups like Shved, Amundson, Galloway? Obviously, but I can understand how fans still aren’t 100% satisfied with this other worldly team we have now because the ultimate goal is a championship, and there are legitimate concerns when it comes to winning one.

I’m just saying it’s not so binary. We’re trash or we’re perfect. Be happy or you’re miserable. It’s more nuanced than that and as complex as people are in a complex world I think it’s ok to be critical as we strive for the top prize. I don’t think fans are reveling in losses as much as it is fans just venting after enduring decades of poor decisions. It’ll never be perfect and teams who win titles don’t have to be perfect, but title team’s fans complain too, it’s just part of fandom and human nature. People have their opinions of what they want for the team and strive for that perfection. Nobody should take it personal or hold it against anyone. We’re all crazy to some degree.

Yeah that’s fair. Just being in a “are they contenders or pretenders” conversation means we made it as far as I’m concerned. I mean you could have that conversation about any of these teams besides Boston since they just won. Cleveland has a great regular season record but is anybody convinced they’re gonna win it? OKC is good but they choked in the second round last year. You know, the same second round we get crap over. What are the Grizzlies? We smoked them recently and beat Denver twice too. So I mean I don’t think it’s an insult at all to debate this about the Knicks it’s more of a compliment than folks realize

But then there’s a difference between that and a woe is me this team sucks because it’s not doing things exactly how I wanted so I’m not watching games anymore. Like ok that’s your(generic you not you personally) right as a fan but really?

[NoDopeOnSundays]

Read on Twitter

Watch on YouTube

[prophet_of_rage]

40/10/5 AND 30/10/5 from 2 guys on the same team? when does that happen?

Also anyone notice how Hart has gone from 6'7" to 6'6" to 6'5" to now under 6''5" over the years?

Reality. Never was close tp 6'7.

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[prophet_of_rage]

Knicks fans wanted to put Obi Toppin in our starting lineup because supposedly the team plays better with him whatever thats supposed to mean. Thats why I let Leon and Thibs do their thing or we'd have Obi at center instead of Towns lol

They don’t know ball

They just hated Julius!

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[prophet_of_rage]

Even if he’s ineffective sometimes, I really appreciate KAT’s effort on defense.

I’m even growing to love his constant O-Faces of disbelief at the ref on clear fouls.

His "OH MY GODDDDDDDDDDDDDD!!!!" screams when he doesn't get a foul call are hilarious, he's so non-threatening that despite yelling at the top of his lungs the refs don't give him a tech.

Really true. Something uncannily innocent minded and approachable about the guy.

It's also crazy that he's as good a passer as he is. I don't think people really noted the no-look pass in the open court yesterday lol.

He's just fun to watch and his flaws are not annoying at all.

He has a soft voice and a home girl speech pattern.

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[prophet_of_rage]

Read on Twitter

?s=46&t=ZScbCOS-e1RwvSq7ABkKLQ

Knicks fans say they care about defense but the reality most Knicks fans don't really care about defense.

They just pretend to.

It's one of my key takeaways from supporting this team for nearly 20 years.

Shortsighted and harsh. We grasp for hope. The starphuckers, the frank hive, the barbs, the January Knicks stan, all of it is just wanting whats best for the knicks to win. And sometimes in the case of obi over randle is the hope in the young unknown over randle. Its easier to dismiss his lack of defense thsn someone we saw not try on defense for awhile.

So they don't really know.

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