2023-24 NY Knicks trade ideas, Part 3

[cgf]

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Hopefully this is turns out just like the IQ stuff did last year

But not how the IQ stuff turned out this year.

I guess that would depend on who next season's OG would be

[sol537]

Keep your dirty paws off my Grimes.

His upside is worth keeping him. He’s elite 3&d.

[iLLmatic860]

yeah im all for keeping grimes..if we really do make a big move this summer as woj is suggesting that we are aiming for...someone like grimes is going to have to be in that deal

[mpharris36]

yeah im all for keeping grimes..if we really do make a big move this summer as woj is suggesting that we are aiming for...someone like grimes is going to have to be in that deal

he's really not looked like that anymore...especially with only one more year on his rookie deal...a team wont value him more than a throw in late 1st round value.

[cgf]

again your not addressing the factor of when we acquire that additional shot creator what happens to Grimes minutes? If he plays a very limited role even less than right now (situational)...what really are we valuing Grimes, insurance?...at that point you probably value a future 1st over grimes because that pick last longer than Grimes rookie contract which comes to an end after the following season.

No injuries & DDV stays hot, my rotation would be

Brunson 36 | Brogdon 12
DiVincenzo 24 | Grimes 12-14 | Brogdon 10-12
Anunoby 24 | Hart 24
Randle 36 | Anunoby 12
RobinHart 48

Plus McBride, Sims/Achiuwa, and I'd flip Flynn for a depth wing defender...Jae'Sean Tate feels gettable & very thibsy for that role.

Not a ton of minutes for Quentin, but a) I think he'd do a lot better in the non-Brunson minutes with Brogdon next to him & Randle, and b) I think having Grimes defense as an option when teams just aren't respecting Josh's 3ball, could make those minutes very valuable even if they are very situational.

I also just think this team can make a really deep run like the Heat have done in recent years...if our depth holds up, so I wouldn't expect us to go the rest of the season without some injuries that opened more minutes up for Quentin. Who has been playing better since the trade even though his 3ball has been MIA these past 3 games.

So now you are playing Grimes even a smaller role and think he is just going to magically improve? Mcbride can handle 12 minutes a night in that role. At that point I would rather just keep the extra 1st round pick and trade Grimes.

And Grimes has played 2 really good game this month since the trade (in blowouts)...otherwise he has been pretty pedestrian.

Mcbride has been far better since the trade

A) I don't think we'd be 100% the rest of the season and I'm nervous Donte will turn back into a pumpkin

B) I do think that just not having to worry about if he'll be traded tomorrow will be a huge weight off Grimes' shoulders that Deuce isn't currently carrying because he can't be traded after his extension

C) I think Quentin has been playing better since the trade, even in some of the games he hasn't shot well in. He's defending really well, and the 5.3 3PA/G he's averaging this month are the most this season...per 36 that's 10.6 3PA, which would smoke his previous career high.

He still passes up too many shots and doesn't have that same swagger he had last season, but he's flashing it again...that dunk two games ago, the snazzy layup he had against the nets, those are plays that I feel like I haven't seen from him in months...if at all this season.

D) I haven't done any scouting of this class myself, but with the way people talk about it, it doesn't sound like there's much chance of getting someone that even has the same kind of potential Grimes does with either of the FRPs we'll have this spring.

And if teams are so low on this class that they're expected to give away 24 FRPs like candy at this deadline, it's unlikely that holding onto an extra 24 FRP will impact any offseason trade.

[j4remi]

Hopefully this is turns out just like the IQ stuff did last year

But not how the IQ stuff turned out this year.

I guess that would depend on who next season's OG would be

That Grimes/McBride/1st round pick package will hurt my soul until Vince Williams and Santi Aldama turn out to be exactly what we needed all along

(Disclaimer: not a trade or players I particularly advocate for, I just picked a couple of random young guys I happen to enjoy watching hoop when I randomly watch Memphis).

[mpharris36]

No injuries & DDV stays hot, my rotation would be

Brunson 36 | Brogdon 12
DiVincenzo 24 | Grimes 12-14 | Brogdon 10-12
Anunoby 24 | Hart 24
Randle 36 | Anunoby 12
RobinHart 48

Plus McBride, Sims/Achiuwa, and I'd flip Flynn for a depth wing defender...Jae'Sean Tate feels gettable & very thibsy for that role.

Not a ton of minutes for Quentin, but a) I think he'd do a lot better in the non-Brunson minutes with Brogdon next to him & Randle, and b) I think having Grimes defense as an option when teams just aren't respecting Josh's 3ball, could make those minutes very valuable even if they are very situational.

I also just think this team can make a really deep run like the Heat have done in recent years...if our depth holds up, so I wouldn't expect us to go the rest of the season without some injuries that opened more minutes up for Quentin. Who has been playing better since the trade even though his 3ball has been MIA these past 3 games.

So now you are playing Grimes even a smaller role and think he is just going to magically improve? Mcbride can handle 12 minutes a night in that role. At that point I would rather just keep the extra 1st round pick and trade Grimes.

And Grimes has played 2 really good game this month since the trade (in blowouts)...otherwise he has been pretty pedestrian.

Mcbride has been far better since the trade

A) I don't think we'd be 100% the rest of the season and I'm nervous Donte will turn back into a pumpkin

B) I do think that just not having to worry about if he'll be traded tomorrow will be a huge weight off Grimes' shoulders that Deuce isn't currently carrying because he can't be traded after his extension

C) I think Quentin has been playing better since the trade, even in some of the games he hasn't shot well in. He's defending really well, and the 5.3 3PA/G he's averaging this month are the most this season...per 36 that's 10.6 3PA, which would smoke his previous career high.

He still passes up too many shots and doesn't have that same swagger he had last season, but he's flashing it again...that dunk two games ago, the snazzy layup he had against the nets, those are plays I haven't seen from him in months.

D) I haven't done any scouting of this class myself, but with the way people talk about it, it doesn't sound like there's much chance of getting someone that even has the same kind of potential Grimes does with either of the FRPs we'll have this spring.

And if teams are so low on this class that they're expected to give away 24 FRPs like candy at this deadline, it's unlikely that holding onto an extra 24 FRP will impact any offseason trade.

thats a very simplistic way of looking at it...the guy we draft would have 4 years of control on a rookie contract...while Grimes would have 1 year of control after this year. We will be continue to devaluing him as an asset if he's just going to be "situational" going forward and into next year.

[cgf]

But not how the IQ stuff turned out this year.

I guess that would depend on who next season's OG would be

That Grimes/McBride/1st round pick package will hurt my soul until Vince Williams and Santi Aldama turn out to be exactly what we needed all along

(Disclaimer: not a trade or players I particularly advocate for, I just picked a couple of random young guys I happen to enjoy watching hoop when I randomly watch Memphis).

Just need to make sure we're the team to capitalize the next time AK decides to do something dumb in Chicago, so we can steal Coby White & Patrick Williams to finish off our rotation...

[j4remi]

A) I don't think we'd be 100% the rest of the season and I'm nervous Donte will turn back into a pumpkin

B) I do think that just not having to worry about if he'll be traded tomorrow will be a huge weight off Grimes' shoulders that Deuce isn't currently carrying because he can't be traded after his extension

C) I think Quentin has been playing better since the trade, even in some of the games he hasn't shot well in. He's defending really well, and the 5.3 3PA/G he's averaging this month are the most this season...per 36 that's 10.6 3PA, which would smoke his previous career high.

He still passes up too many shots and doesn't have that same swagger he had last season, but he's flashing it again...that dunk two games ago, the snazzy layup he had against the nets, those are plays that I feel like I haven't seen from him in months...if at all this season.

D) I haven't done any scouting of this class myself, but with the way people talk about it, it doesn't sound like there's much chance of getting someone that even has the same kind of potential Grimes does with either of the FRPs we'll have this spring.

And if teams are so low on this class that they're expected to give away 24 FRPs like candy at this deadline, it's unlikely that holding onto an extra 24 FRP will impact any offseason trade.

This is what's given me pause too. If he gets going early, he starts to look like last season's Grimes. I can recall a couple of games where Randle went with the second unit in the first quarter closing minutes and targeted Grimes for his post-up kick out...you could see Grimes turn up in real-time.

I agree that Grimes >>> Our FRPs in this class too. There are always a few guys that slip through the cracks, but I feel like I'm gonna have to hunt for Euro Tape to find the players I see the most potential in for our 18-30 ranged picks.

[j4remi]

Just need to make sure we're the team to capitalize the next time AK decides to do something dumb in Chicago, so we can steal Coby White & Patrick Williams to finish off our rotation...

I was proposing Grimes/middling pick for Caruso/P-Will for a while back. White would be awesome, but I think he's shown Chicago too much to let him go. Shout out to fifth year leaps

[mpharris36]

A) I don't think we'd be 100% the rest of the season and I'm nervous Donte will turn back into a pumpkin

B) I do think that just not having to worry about if he'll be traded tomorrow will be a huge weight off Grimes' shoulders that Deuce isn't currently carrying because he can't be traded after his extension

C) I think Quentin has been playing better since the trade, even in some of the games he hasn't shot well in. He's defending really well, and the 5.3 3PA/G he's averaging this month are the most this season...per 36 that's 10.6 3PA, which would smoke his previous career high.

He still passes up too many shots and doesn't have that same swagger he had last season, but he's flashing it again...that dunk two games ago, the snazzy layup he had against the nets, those are plays that I feel like I haven't seen from him in months...if at all this season.

D) I haven't done any scouting of this class myself, but with the way people talk about it, it doesn't sound like there's much chance of getting someone that even has the same kind of potential Grimes does with either of the FRPs we'll have this spring.

And if teams are so low on this class that they're expected to give away 24 FRPs like candy at this deadline, it's unlikely that holding onto an extra 24 FRP will impact any offseason trade.

This is what's given me pause too. If he gets going early, he starts to look like last season's Grimes. I can recall a couple of games where Randle went with the second unit in the first quarter closing minutes and targeted Grimes for his post-up kick out...you could see Grimes turn up in real-time.

I agree that Grimes >>> Our FRPs in this class too. There are always a few guys that slip through the cracks, but I feel like I'm gonna have to hunt for Euro Tape to find the players I see the most potential in for our 18-30 ranged picks.

are you factoring in team control? Are we going to extend Grimes at this point?

If we aren't we basically have him under control for 1 more season and we are looking to diminish his role even farther by acquiring another guard. So even if you believe Grimes will be a better player early we have to make a decision on Grimes future soon.

I was rather take another shot at the end of the 1st this year and get that full rookie contract control if we don't think there is much of a future with Grimes gong forward.

[cgf]

So now you are playing Grimes even a smaller role and think he is just going to magically improve? Mcbride can handle 12 minutes a night in that role. At that point I would rather just keep the extra 1st round pick and trade Grimes.

And Grimes has played 2 really good game this month since the trade (in blowouts)...otherwise he has been pretty pedestrian.

Mcbride has been far better since the trade

A) I don't think we'd be 100% the rest of the season and I'm nervous Donte will turn back into a pumpkin

B) I do think that just not having to worry about if he'll be traded tomorrow will be a huge weight off Grimes' shoulders that Deuce isn't currently carrying because he can't be traded after his extension

C) I think Quentin has been playing better since the trade, even in some of the games he hasn't shot well in. He's defending really well, and the 5.3 3PA/G he's averaging this month are the most this season...per 36 that's 10.6 3PA, which would smoke his previous career high.

He still passes up too many shots and doesn't have that same swagger he had last season, but he's flashing it again...that dunk two games ago, the snazzy layup he had against the nets, those are plays I haven't seen from him in months.

D) I haven't done any scouting of this class myself, but with the way people talk about it, it doesn't sound like there's much chance of getting someone that even has the same kind of potential Grimes does with either of the FRPs we'll have this spring.

And if teams are so low on this class that they're expected to give away 24 FRPs like candy at this deadline, it's unlikely that holding onto an extra 24 FRP will impact any offseason trade.

thats a very simplistic way of looking at it...the guy we draft would have 4 years of control on a rookie contract...while Grimes would have 1 year of control after this year. We will be continue to devaluing him as an asset if he's just going to be "situational" going forward and into next year.

Again, I haven't watched this class and even the legendarily bad drafts had some competent players so this will be another over-simplification, but 4 years of team control on a player no one wants doesn't mean much. If this class really sucks as hard as people are saying teams think it does, then whoever we draft with that pick is unlikely to make much of a difference in any future trades unless they are shockingly good out of the gates.

So even if Grimes didn't earn more PT and injuries didn't give him that opportunity either, and his value would decline...which again, I'm far from certain would be the case even if that was the post-deadline plan at full health...that wouldn't make much long term difference, but could make a big difference this season.

[j4remi]

We're past page 100, folks. Would anyone like to do the honors of making the Part 4 thread sticky before I lock this up?

[mpharris36]

A) I don't think we'd be 100% the rest of the season and I'm nervous Donte will turn back into a pumpkin

B) I do think that just not having to worry about if he'll be traded tomorrow will be a huge weight off Grimes' shoulders that Deuce isn't currently carrying because he can't be traded after his extension

C) I think Quentin has been playing better since the trade, even in some of the games he hasn't shot well in. He's defending really well, and the 5.3 3PA/G he's averaging this month are the most this season...per 36 that's 10.6 3PA, which would smoke his previous career high.

He still passes up too many shots and doesn't have that same swagger he had last season, but he's flashing it again...that dunk two games ago, the snazzy layup he had against the nets, those are plays I haven't seen from him in months.

D) I haven't done any scouting of this class myself, but with the way people talk about it, it doesn't sound like there's much chance of getting someone that even has the same kind of potential Grimes does with either of the FRPs we'll have this spring.

And if teams are so low on this class that they're expected to give away 24 FRPs like candy at this deadline, it's unlikely that holding onto an extra 24 FRP will impact any offseason trade.

thats a very simplistic way of looking at it...the guy we draft would have 4 years of control on a rookie contract...while Grimes would have 1 year of control after this year. We will be continue to devaluing him as an asset if he's just going to be "situational" going forward and into next year.

Again, I haven't watched this class and even the legendarily bad drafts had some competent players so this will be another over-simplification, but 4 years of team control on a player no one wants doesn't mean much. If this class really sucks as hard as people are saying teams think it does, then whoever we draft with that pick is unlikely to make much of a difference in any future trades unless they are shockingly good out of the gates.

So even if Grimes didn't earn more PT and injuries didn't give him that opportunity either, and his value would decline...which again, I'm far from certain would be the case even if that was the post-deadline plan at full health...that wouldn't make much long term difference, but could make a big difference this season.

the class may stink with high end talent but every year there are contributors in the mid to late 1st round that teams find regardless of how good/bad the draft seems.

[cgf]

Just need to make sure we're the team to capitalize the next time AK decides to do something dumb in Chicago, so we can steal Coby White & Patrick Williams to finish off our rotation...

I was proposing Grimes/middling pick for Caruso/P-Will for a while back. White would be awesome, but I think he's shown Chicago too much to let him go. Shout out to fifth year leaps

I know it's unlikely. But this FO is the closest thing the league has to GMIT, and with the run they've been on getting them so close to a playoff spot, I can totally see them doing something really dumb to try and push past the Magic. Especially if their FO deludes themselves into thinking that Dejounte Murray could unlock DeRozan-Lavine-Vucevic the way that Lonzo once did.

That's why until he gets traded to the Lakers, I'm going to continue hoping that we can steal Coby & Pat from the Bulls for helping them land DJM + Kuzma/Grant

[KnixinSix]

Th3 big news is this...Pistons despite their absolutely abominal record are still trying to improve the team right now and are potentially buyers. With that direction if any team made sense to take on LaVine its probably them.

[cgf]

thats a very simplistic way of looking at it...the guy we draft would have 4 years of control on a rookie contract...while Grimes would have 1 year of control after this year. We will be continue to devaluing him as an asset if he's just going to be "situational" going forward and into next year.

Again, I haven't watched this class and even the legendarily bad drafts had some competent players so this will be another over-simplification, but 4 years of team control on a player no one wants doesn't mean much. If this class really sucks as hard as people are saying teams think it does, then whoever we draft with that pick is unlikely to make much of a difference in any future trades unless they are shockingly good out of the gates.

So even if Grimes didn't earn more PT and injuries didn't give him that opportunity either, and his value would decline...which again, I'm far from certain would be the case even if that was the post-deadline plan at full health...that wouldn't make much long term difference, but could make a big difference this season.

the class may stink with high end talent but every year there are contributors in the mid to late 1st round that teams find regardless of how good/bad the draft seems.

Totally. Which is why I included the bolded. But a lot of those hidden gems aren't immediately obvious, so even if we do find the right guy, they're unlikely to have much value in a big consolidation trade this offseason / next season.

So the possibility of Grimes stepping in during the playoffs because DDV's shooting disappears again and he's getting picked on defensively, or because Brogdon gets hurt...neither of which would surprise me...feels a lot more valuable to me.

[dakomish23]

I believe the Knicks can use Obi's TPE along with a 2nd rounder to get Burks saving Fournier's contract for Brogdon. It's something like 25% difference + $200k so I think that covers Burks, fact check me please.

The only problem is if you give Thibs his binky Burks then he destroys what little value and confidence Grimes has because he will ride Burks every chance he can get vs giving any mins to the kid.

The ESPN trade machine says Obi’s TPE is 6.8 & Burks is 10.5. My understanding was that you can’t combine TPEs (RJ is 5.2).

I didn't say combine, I said within 25%+$200K difference, for some reason I thought it was $9.8mil which is probably my terrible eyes not looking close enough,

I believe a TPE has to be the full amount as opposed to that 25% rule when you're trading actual salary. But that was before, who knows with the new CBA