Knicks players and coaches frustrated with KAT

[kNicksGmen]

I think at this point...it might have to be a choice between Towns and Thibs. I feel like Thibs and Towns will both want to try and work it out, but I feel if the Knicks want to really try and work shat out with KAT and Brunson, more creativity and out of the box thinking will be required. We have one of the best shooters at C and for some reason, he takes the fewest amount of 3s he's taken ever since 2019...when he should be spamming that shat over and over again with no remorse. And if we're committed to Thibs...I think he really tried this year with Towns at C, but to me, he's more of a traditionalist, who would prefer to have a bruiser at C.

It feels weird...like last year, we got further against Indiana with a more injured roster, but the biggest thing in my book...if we played that series against Indiana with the effort and brain-dead strategy we gave this series, we would have gotten our asses blown out in 4 games. That's the most disappointing thing for me.

Youre prolly right on breaking em up. But idk, we were a bullchit lucky shot from being in a game 7 tonight.


I think the reason last years team did better was cause the defense was better. Even if they weren't as talented they could get stops. This team just struggled so bad at getting stops.

To my point above, Indiana was better this year too and their improvement was largely based on reps and folding new actions and strategies into a team that was already familiar with one another. Last year they got Siakam at the deadline and even though he put up good stats I didn't really notice him in our series. This year he won ECF MVP and kept killing us in key moments. They knew how to deploy him better.

you didn't notice siakam last year? we couldn't guard him from what I remember. we tried OG and he got torched, then hart kept getting torched. I think we even tried putting ihart on him. he was their go to guy whenever they couldn't get easy transition/early offense.

he averaged 20/6/3 on 53/40 and was a +51 overall. I felt like he made key shots in a lot of games too. But the series as a whole is a blur. I just remember we should have won game 3 and gone up 3-0. There was actually a missed goal tend late in that game that was a 5 point swing also (like this year in game 1 OT). Game 4 we got blown out. Game 5 we blew them out. Game 6 and 7 they blew us out (game 7 not as much but it felt like a blowout even though they were only up like 10-12 most of the game)

[Capn'O]

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Yeah. That's just distasteful and disrespectful. Both to KAT and the groups it denigrates by proxy.

But I'd also like to push back against the idea that Towns is soft. He really isn't. He's brolic AF, battling for rebounds, battling the biggest players in the league on defense, and attacking the basket. He took out two Pacers in that last game and played through injury all season. He ain't soft. He just sucks at shotblocking and help defense, which is a problem but not a toughness problem.

KAT is the farthest thing from soft.

He is a dummy, with fouling and messing up defensive coverages...or barreling into defenders and picking up dumb offensive fouls.

But soft is wild...his drives and rebounding are like anti soft. He plays a more physical style than like 95% of the league for a dude that can shoot the way he does I don't get why he gets the "soft' mantra.

On offense, he plays like Ewing with brute finesse

[Jeff Van Gully]

The writing is on the wall.

not that i disagree w/ moving on from a spatially compromised player like kat but can we not give melo a dedicated canvas to paint all his hate about a player he's overtly been biased against before he played a single minute for the team?

like we get it melo - you don't like kat and randle getting traded will cost you decades in therapy but you need to let it go dude

The post that started this thread was misleading by making it seem like the team was crashing during the playoffs and nobody could talk to Towns. Except that's NOT what the article in The Athletic said.

The article was talking about all throughout the season. It was about each player needing to learn about each other. PJ Tucker was signed late in the season to help with this issue, and PJ said it got better. This is how it was described in The Athletic:

Publicly, Knicks players made veiled comments all season about poor communication causing their inconsistencies. Behind the scenes, they and coaches expressed frustration with Towns’ defensive habits — less concerned with his talent level and more with his process on that end. Too often, Towns executed incorrect coverages without communicating why he did it. After it became a theme, players worried Towns didn’t grasp the importance of the matter.

The ability to constructively critique became a point of emphasis.

“They all talk to me,” Tucker said after Game 1 of the Boston series when asked what he witnessed with a set of fresh eyes. “But they didn’t talk to each other in real-time, in those situations.”

Some people in the organization wanted to use the 15th roster spot to sign a player who could contribute on the floor, while others wanted a veteran who would be OK with not playing and helping behind the scenes, per league sources. The latter group won out and Tucker signed with the team near the end of the regular season to be a veteran voice.

“The situations to get stops, to have help, you know what I’m saying?” Tucker continued. “That, to me, we have talent, but that’s 80 percent of everything else — being able to communicate, be able to get stops, to be on the same page on offense and be able to read each other. We needed to do those things instead of putting our hands up and looking at each other.

“It’s changed. Do I think it needs to get better? One hundred percent. But it’s come a long way since I’ve got here, for sure.”

i'll say it. it was a bad faith start to the thread. this kind of thing will be called out more consistently going forward.

the athletic shares blame by releasing the components of the article in bad faith as well. as a former journalist, i feel awful for fred katz. he deserves better, but the game hasn't been about journalistic integrity for a while now.

we know kat's shortcomings. a deep read of the article shows that the team does too and is on a journey of working through it. it would be hella triumphant for brunson and KAT to come back with this worked out. i really want this for them. and for our fallen knick fam jackie.

my first drink when we finally get to the promised land will be for the ones who ain't make it out the desert.

[TheGreenArrow]

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He’s usually never wrong!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Somethings in the works!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[SARGO127]

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?s=46&t=W09F6FrMDfp5_y1gKYgF1g

He’s usually never wrong!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Somethings in the works!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

What’s he know? He’s posting pics of Brunson, Thibs, KAT, Hart. Hate this cryptic Bs

[KnicksGadfly]

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Yeah. That's just distasteful and disrespectful. Both to KAT and the groups it denigrates by proxy.

But I'd also like to push back against the idea that Towns is soft. He really isn't. He's brolic AF, battling for rebounds, battling the biggest players in the league on defense, and attacking the basket. He took out two Pacers in that last game and played through injury all season. He ain't soft. He just sucks at shotblocking and help defense, which is a problem but not a toughness problem.

KAT is the farthest thing from soft.

He is a dummy, with fouling and messing up defensive coverages...or barreling into defenders and picking up dumb offensive fouls.

But soft is wild...his drives and rebounding are like anti soft. He plays a more physical style than like 95% of the league for a dude that can shoot the way he does I don't get why he gets the "soft' mantra.

I think the only time I'd call KAT soft is when he lets himself get taken out of a game. He sucks at defense and I get that. Even with his shooting...I'm okay with him jacking up more threes. He doesn't always need to barrel into the paint. Take 10 threes a game, seriously. But if he ever lets himself get taken out...we're screwed.

We sometimes blame others for when KAT gets taken out of the game by Tobias Harris or somebody...I think it's also incumbent on KAT to step up and demand that ball. Go up to the top of the key and get that shyt if you need to. Demand it. And I love Brunson...but yea, KAT, take it out of his hands too, if you need to.

[HEZI]

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He’s usually never wrong!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Somethings in the works!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Anything this early after a playoff exit usually signals a coaching fire not a trade. This is all assuming this dude has any actual sources. A trade, especially anything blockbuster would be premature at this stage of the offseason. Can teams even make trades before the draft yet?

[SARGO127]

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?s=46&t=W09F6FrMDfp5_y1gKYgF1g

He’s usually never wrong!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Somethings in the works!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Anything this early after a playoff exit usually signals a coaching fire not a trade. This is all assuming this dude has any actual sources. A trade, especially anything blockbuster would be premature at this stage of the offseason. Can teams even make trades before the draft yet?

I remember we made the QRich deal during the playoffs years ago. Really dating myself there

[TheGreenArrow]

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?s=46&t=W09F6FrMDfp5_y1gKYgF1g

He’s usually never wrong!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Somethings in the works!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

What’s he know? He’s posting pics of Brunson, Thibs, KAT, Hart. Hate this cryptic Bs

Read on Twitter

?s=46&t=W09F6FrMDfp5_y1gKYgF1g

He does have a source!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

He called the Rj extension deadline in the Dmitch talksss wayyyy before anyone else did!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

And he’s called other things too before it happened!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I think it may have be something with thibs and or Kat!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Spree2Houston]

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He’s usually never wrong!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Somethings in the works!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It’ll be something out of left field like Leon stepping down and Thibs becoming POBO

[Jeff Van Gully]

Yeah. That's just distasteful and disrespectful. Both to KAT and the groups it denigrates by proxy.

But I'd also like to push back against the idea that Towns is soft. He really isn't. He's brolic AF, battling for rebounds, battling the biggest players in the league on defense, and attacking the basket. He took out two Pacers in that last game and played through injury all season. He ain't soft. He just sucks at shotblocking and help defense, which is a problem but not a toughness problem.

KAT is the farthest thing from soft.

He is a dummy, with fouling and messing up defensive coverages...or barreling into defenders and picking up dumb offensive fouls.

But soft is wild...his drives and rebounding are like anti soft. He plays a more physical style than like 95% of the league for a dude that can shoot the way he does I don't get why he gets the "soft' mantra.

On offense, he plays like Ewing with brute finesse

excuse me?

easy clydeism missed opportunity here.

[TheGreenArrow]

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Thibs may be gone folksssssssssss!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Spree2Houston]

We’re going to hire Mike Dantoni as an offensive assistant

[Pr0nzingis]

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?s=46&t=W09F6FrMDfp5_y1gKYgF1g

He’s usually never wrong!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Somethings in the works!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

What’s he know? He’s posting pics of Brunson, Thibs, KAT, Hart. Hate this cryptic Bs

Read on Twitter

?s=46&t=W09F6FrMDfp5_y1gKYgF1g

He does have a source!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

He called the Rj extension deadline in the Dmitch talksss wayyyy before anyone else did!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

And he’s called other things too before it happened!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I think it may have be something with thibs and or Kat!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

If i shoot in every direction i'm sure to hit something.

Why should i care he was right on some 50\50 chance events. Tell me about the times he was wrong.

[TheGreenArrow]

What’s he know? He’s posting pics of Brunson, Thibs, KAT, Hart. Hate this cryptic Bs

Read on Twitter

?s=46&t=W09F6FrMDfp5_y1gKYgF1g

He does have a source!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

He called the Rj extension deadline in the Dmitch talksss wayyyy before anyone else did!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

And he’s called other things too before it happened!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I think it may have be something with thibs and or Kat!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

If i shoot in every direction i'm sure to hit something.

Why should i care he was right on some 50\50 chance events. Tell me about the times he was wrong.

I wish I could but that’s the whole point!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

He hasn’t been wrong on anything !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[GONYK]

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?s=46&t=W09F6FrMDfp5_y1gKYgF1g

He’s usually never wrong!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Somethings in the works!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[knicksstuff]

Giannis asking for that trade to the Knicks... they were suppose to met end of last week and no word has come out

[BKlutch]

not that i disagree w/ moving on from a spatially compromised player like kat but can we not give melo a dedicated canvas to paint all his hate about a player he's overtly been biased against before he played a single minute for the team?

like we get it melo - you don't like kat and randle getting traded will cost you decades in therapy but you need to let it go dude

The post that started this thread was misleading by making it seem like the team was crashing during the playoffs and nobody could talk to Towns. Except that's NOT what the article in The Athletic said.

The article was talking about all throughout the season. It was about each player needing to learn about each other. PJ Tucker was signed late in the season to help with this issue, and PJ said it got better. This is how it was described in The Athletic:

Publicly, Knicks players made veiled comments all season about poor communication causing their inconsistencies. Behind the scenes, they and coaches expressed frustration with Towns’ defensive habits — less concerned with his talent level and more with his process on that end. Too often, Towns executed incorrect coverages without communicating why he did it. After it became a theme, players worried Towns didn’t grasp the importance of the matter.

The ability to constructively critique became a point of emphasis.

“They all talk to me,” Tucker said after Game 1 of the Boston series when asked what he witnessed with a set of fresh eyes. “But they didn’t talk to each other in real-time, in those situations.”

Some people in the organization wanted to use the 15th roster spot to sign a player who could contribute on the floor, while others wanted a veteran who would be OK with not playing and helping behind the scenes, per league sources. The latter group won out and Tucker signed with the team near the end of the regular season to be a veteran voice.

“The situations to get stops, to have help, you know what I’m saying?” Tucker continued. “That, to me, we have talent, but that’s 80 percent of everything else — being able to communicate, be able to get stops, to be on the same page on offense and be able to read each other. We needed to do those things instead of putting our hands up and looking at each other.

“It’s changed. Do I think it needs to get better? One hundred percent. But it’s come a long way since I’ve got here, for sure.”

i'll say it. it was a bad faith start to the thread. this kind of thing will be called out more consistently going forward.

the athletic shares blame by releasing the components of the article in bad faith as well. as a former journalist, i feel awful for fred katz. he deserves better, but the game hasn't been about journalistic integrity for a while now.

we know kat's shortcomings. a deep read of the article shows that the team does too and is on a journey of working through it. it would be hella triumphant for brunson and KAT to come back with this worked out. i really want this for them. and for our fallen knick fam jackie.

my first drink when we finally get to the promised land will be for the ones who ain't make it out the desert.

Great post, and I really do admire honest journalism. I actually wonder whether Katz didn't find himself caught in a corporate conundrum. James Edwards is a capable writer who clearly lacks the Knicks insight that Fred has, and he doesn't often come across as Knicks centric. He's a former. Detroit Pistons reporter, and his Knicks bonafides were in question from when he first started. Everybody loves Fred, and he's been joining Edwards on articles since just before the start of the playoffs. Nobody has said this, but I think The Athletic wanted to boost there readership among NY fans at this important time of the season. So the guess is there was pressure to get this article out quickly while folks were still so focused on our team. I'd give Fred a pass on this one, especailly given his statement on the timing and the fact that he's one of the few really knowledgeable, honest reporters who always tries to call him as he sees them.

[Capn'O]

KAT is the farthest thing from soft.

He is a dummy, with fouling and messing up defensive coverages...or barreling into defenders and picking up dumb offensive fouls.

But soft is wild...his drives and rebounding are like anti soft. He plays a more physical style than like 95% of the league for a dude that can shoot the way he does I don't get why he gets the "soft' mantra.

On offense, he plays like Ewing with brute finesse

excuse me?

easy clydeism missed opportunity here.

I'm not seeing it. A little help?

[TheGreenArrow]

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?s=46&t=W09F6FrMDfp5_y1gKYgF1g

He’s usually never wrong!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Somethings in the works!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Read on Twitter

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Read on Twitter

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