KAT To The Knicks Part 2

[Knicksfan1992]

Blows my mind that people are still ignoring the fact that we very likely take the celtics 6 or 7 if we just have OG out there. Bottom line is that we traded away all our depth and picks for pieces we didn't really NEED. All we NEEDED was a center replacement for iHart after he left us for OKC and a secondary PG to facilitate things while Brunson rests

We didn't NEED mikal and we definitely didn't NEED kat. We were already a top 3 team in the league as is.

If you applied this logic to the Boston Celtics they likely don't win a title last year because they wouldn't have traded for Jrue and KP because they didn't "need' either of them. They gave up useful depth pieces and assets to get them and were clearly a top 3-5 team when healthy already.

Not saying this is the exact same situation but, you shouldn't avoid improving your talent level just because you may lose some depth in the process.

The Celtics gave up Brogdon, Smart, and Timelord for KP and Jrue. 3 rotation pieces for 2, and those 2 were major upgrades, and they were already so deep they couldn't find minutes for Pritchard, Hauser, and Kornet in the playoffs. Hell even with KP out last year they couldn't find minutes for Tillman, they have a solid 10 maybe 11 (depends on how you feel about Oshae) players worthy of a playoff rotation.

We needed every bit of depth last season, if anything we weren't deep enough. That's why I didn't mind the Bridges trade, getting less deep without majorly upgrading our ceiling isn't the move.

I just don't buy that a lack of depth is what caused the Knicks downfall last season.

No team has the requisite amount of depth to deal with losing the below players at various points and at the same time in the playoffs.

Randle
OG
Mitch
Bojan

and

Brunson and Hart also missed parts of big games.

Look at what happened to Milwaukee when they lost their guys. The Cavs lost Mitchell and Allen and got worked by the Celtics. While depth is nice to have in the regular season it generally isn't going to change your luck in the playoffs.

Whether you blame the injuries on Thibs or just chit luck is up to personal opinion but just to put it in perspective this would be similar injury luck to Boston losing the below players:

Jaylen Brown
Derrick White
Al Horford
Sam Hauser

from their rotation. Do we really think they have the depth to win a title without those guys in the postseason? Maybe... but I highly doubt it.

[The Vo Show]

OG doesn’t sound too thrilled about the trade

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OG never sounds thrilled anyway lol. But I think he thought he was going to be a legit 3rd option on the team, especially given who was traded for him (the two guys who were the 3rd options on most nights). Then they brought in Mikal.

Circling back, doing the Bridges trade first instead of the KAT trade may have ruined the good vibes. I hope not but theres a chance of that now as opposed to what we probably all thought at the beginning of the offseason when the Bridges trade first happened.

[Context]

Knick Richards and Trey INCOMING!!!!

that would be so fing sweet

I dont have any inside info but just being hopeful based on the teams that keep popping up in the rumors.

I figured that...

[jvsimonetti0514]

Just bought tickets to the Knicks wolves in January

[prophet_of_rage]

Blows my mind that people are still ignoring the fact that we very likely take the celtics 6 or 7 if we just have OG out there. Bottom line is that we traded away all our depth and picks for pieces we didn't really NEED. All we NEEDED was a center replacement for iHart after he left us for OKC and a secondary PG to facilitate things while Brunson rests

We didn't NEED mikal and we definitely didn't NEED kat. We were already a top 3 team in the league as is.

Nobody was going 6 with the Celtics last year, the only team that had any shot would have been a healthy Nuggets team, because they could go at KP directly and no amount of switching helped them against Jokic. The Mavs had elite creators and rim runners, they got their culos blasted, we would have been beaten down by them if we stayed the same, they are built to exploit rim running teams and it's why we were 1-4 against them last year.

Mavs didn't defend.

Sent from my SM-S9080 using RealGM mobile app

[E-Balla]

why are you throwing me in?

You been a KAT guy since 2015 man lol.

Oh no I havent! check my post history...I've always called him soft...Not to mention,
if I was a Kat guy - I had plenty of times to trade for him in BAF and I didnt...

I love the Kat trade for us "in context". I saw some of the guys you wanted us to take instead- they dont give us a chance to win it all..
And even if you hate Kat and think he will flop you cant argue that if he fits in and plays to his potential that we DO NO T have a chance bro...
I'll give you the health concerns but disagree with almost everything else

Since you wanted to throw me in nothing but love for you though...

I will. He's not that guy. 19ppg on mediocre shooting percentages isn't taking us over the edge. The Pacers scored 124 points per 100 against us. The Sixers scored 118 points per 100 against us. He don't fix the reason we lost last year (lack of depth and defense). If OG and Mitch out again I don't see how he improves us even a little bit unless we trying to outgun Indiana and Philly with less offensive talent than they have.

[aggo]

kat's 29 in a month but he's gonna pass a lot more now, he's gonna play defense, i hear he's gonna start performing surgery at cornell weill too on his off days

I don't know about the defense part, but passing is just something he's always done, nobody is saying he's Jokic, but replacing Randles passing isn't hard especially if they use him like they did IHart.


Touches per game last year

KAT - 53.2 (3.3apg)
Randle - 72.5 (5.0apg)


2022-2023

KAT - 60.7 (4.8apg)
Randle - 69.4 (4.1apg)


Even if you played him at the 4, there's virtually nothing Randle does better when you take into account how much Randle needs the ball and how many possessions he used, he had the ball more than Giannis last year in the frontcourt.

Include usg% so we can laugh at Randle

[Context]

You been a KAT guy since 2015 man lol.

Oh no I havent! check my post history...I've always called him soft...Not to mention,
if I was a Kat guy - I had plenty of times to trade for him in BAF and I didnt...

I love the Kat trade for us "in context". I saw some of the guys you wanted us to take instead- they dont give us a chance to win it all..
And even if you hate Kat and think he will flop you cant argue that if he fits in and plays to his potential that we DO NO T have a chance bro...
I'll give you the health concerns but disagree with almost everything else

Since you wanted to throw me in nothing but love for you though...

I will. He's not that guy. 19ppg on mediocre shooting percentages isn't taking us over the edge. The Pacers scored 124 points per 100 against us. The Sixers scored 118 points per 100 against us. He don't fix the reason we lost last year (lack of depth and defense). If OG and Mitch out again I don't see how he improves us even a little bit unless we trying to outgun Indiana and Philly with less offensive talent than they have.

Did you watch every one of our games bro in the playoffs?

[E-Balla]

All I needed to certify you a dummy.

The Warriors were 33-22 with Draymond and 13-14 without him last year. He's still one of the 5 best defensive players in the league that can't be understated.

Draymond's impact is big on the Warriors but place him on any other team and it'll be negligible. You know that.
This knucklehead cost the Warrors 1 title, which is HUGE.

What title? And that same knucklehead would be a Finals MVP if Steph could average more turnovers than assists in the Finals lol.

And his impact is big on the Warriors because he's a one man defense. I don't even think the Warriors is his best fit, if he was on the Kings they're an instant contender. If he was on the Pacers they'd be amazing. If he's on the Mavs they might've won it all. Basically every high powered offense with smart cutters is the exact type of roster he'd feast on and in 2024 with everyone attempting to copy the Warriors playstyle and a bunch of players of the Draymond archetype running around he's never been more valuable league wide.

[F N 11]

A little dive into Bodega’s efficiency on a list with Jokic, Curry, KD, and Greek.

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[3toheadmelo]

OG doesn’t sound too thrilled about the trade

Read on Twitter

OG never sounds thrilled anyway lol. But I think he thought he was going to be a legit 3rd option on the team, especially given who was traded for him (the two guys who were the 3rd options on most nights). Then they brought in Mikal.

Circling back, doing the Bridges trade first instead of the KAT trade may have ruined the good vibes. I hope not but theres a chance of that now as opposed to what we probably all thought at the beginning of the offseason when the Bridges trade first happened.

I think he wanted to be here with Mikal. He resigned with us after we traded for Mikal. But he definitely sounds different about losing Randle and Donte imo.

[thebuzzardman]

Now Mikal is catching strays during the great bash KAT fest.

Only a matter of time before Hart and Brunson start getting theirs.

I'll start.

Brunson's lack of defense at the point means Knicks never win anything with him and even with the discount he got he's vastly overpaid.

[TheGreenArrow]

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[Knicksfan1992]

The Warriors were 33-22 with Draymond and 13-14 without him last year. He's still one of the 5 best defensive players in the league that can't be understated.

Draymond's impact is big on the Warriors but place him on any other team and it'll be negligible. You know that.
This knucklehead cost the Warrors 1 title, which is HUGE.

What title? And that same knucklehead would be a Finals MVP if Steph could average more turnovers than assists in the Finals lol.

And his impact is big on the Warriors because he's a one man defense. I don't even think the Warriors is his best fit, if he was on the Kings they're an instant contender. If he was on the Pacers they'd be amazing. If he's on the Mavs they might've won it all. Basically every high powered offense with smart cutters is the exact type of roster he'd feast on and in 2024 with everyone attempting to copy the Warriors playstyle and a bunch of players of the Draymond archetype running around he's never been more valuable league wide.

Oddly enough with KAT here, I think Draymond (personality aside) would be a dream target

Financially we can't really make it work but in my own fantasy world the Warriors would be the first team I would call

[F N 11]

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[thebuzzardman]

Draymond's impact is big on the Warriors but place him on any other team and it'll be negligible. You know that.
This knucklehead cost the Warrors 1 title, which is HUGE.

What title? And that same knucklehead would be a Finals MVP if Steph could average more turnovers than assists in the Finals lol.

And his impact is big on the Warriors because he's a one man defense. I don't even think the Warriors is his best fit, if he was on the Kings they're an instant contender. If he was on the Pacers they'd be amazing. If he's on the Mavs they might've won it all. Basically every high powered offense with smart cutters is the exact type of roster he'd feast on and in 2024 with everyone attempting to copy the Warriors playstyle and a bunch of players of the Draymond archetype running around he's never been more valuable league wide.

Oddly enough with KAT here, I think Draymond (personality aside) would be a dream target

Financially we can't really make it work but in my own fantasy world the Warriors would be the first team I would call

KAT would miss 60 games with a contused nutsack after Draymond got to him in practice

[Context]

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not to mention, I love ANT- love him! but today. He's not as mature and wise as Brunson. ANother aspect thats being underestimated in this Kat deal...

[E-Balla]

I just don't buy that a lack of depth is what caused the Knicks downfall last season.

No team has the requisite amount of depth to deal with losing the below players at various points and at the same time in the playoffs.

Randle
OG
Mitch
Bojan

and

Brunson and Hart also missed parts of big games.

Look at what happened to Milwaukee when they lost their guys. The Cavs lost Mitchell and Allen and got worked by the Celtics. While depth is nice to have in the regular season it generally isn't going to change your luck in the playoffs.

Whether you blame the injuries on Thibs or just chit luck is up to personal opinion but just to put it in perspective this would be similar injury luck to Boston losing the below players:

Jaylen Brown
Derrick White
Al Horford
Sam Hauser

from their rotation. Do we really think they have the depth to win a title without those guys in the postseason? Maybe... but I highly doubt it.

The Celtics won easily without KP. They went 16-3 in the playoffs winning by an average of 8 ppg.

If you're saying injuries are why we lost the way to combat that is more depth not less, right? Like without a doubt injuries ended our season early.

OKC has 10 guys now.
BOS has 11 or 12 guys.
MIN has 10 guys now.
PHI has 10 guys now.
DAL has like 11 or 12 guys.

All the serious contenders are getting DEEPER now. Depth has never been more important, there's just a large gap between rotation worthy players and everyone else right now and there's too many injuries to not be able to risk losing 3 guys outside of your #1 guy for large stretches of the season.

[Moose]

As a neutral, I absolutely love this for the Knicks. I've never been a Randle fan and the team proved they can win without him in the playoffs. KAT has his flaws but he's a great fit for the current team, especially with Brunson. The defense and depth will definitely be a problem, especially since guys like OG, KAT and Robinson get hurt so much. But it's easier to find depth on the fringes.

Offensively this team will be fantastic (health permitting). Brunson/KAT pick & roll with bridges and OG in the corners and Hart crashing the boards. Defensively will be a challenge but they have the flexibility of playing Robinson with KAT in the playoffs (again, health permitting).

Odds are, Knicks don't make a move until near the trade deadline, but trading Mitch for a healthier rim protecting big like Kessler + a depth piece, or perhaps Grant Williams + Nick Richards, I think could set us up for a big time playoff run.

[TerrenceClarke]

The Nastiest of Works....

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