Mitchell Robinson - Rim runners and the playoffs.

[Ghetto Gospel]

Playoff series are always won or lost based on matchups and who you matchup with is generally the luck of the draw. The clippers last year got the nuggets and got caught lacking cause they were putting trez harrell, kawhi, marcus morris, etc. and all these littler guys on jokic and he cooked all of them. for us in the east, the sixers will always be players for the foreseeable future so long as they have embiid, and ultimately if we lose mitch, we can't get caught lacking having to put randle or obi toppin on embiid

[nedleeds]

Counting the $25.6 million he got paid this year to have the offensive skills of a 4th grader Gobert is owed $185 through 25-26. When he'll be 36. Jazz committed franchise suicide by paying him north of $40 million a year, even if the cap goes to $200 million you're still kneecapping yourself paying somebody with a devout commitment to not learning how to do anything with a basketball.

[nedleeds]

How many jokics will Mitch be running into in the east!

You don't need to run into Jokic, Brad Stevens is still in the east and has absolutely no respect for rim running centers, neither does Nurse or Spoelstra who will run a zone.


The future of the NBA is heading in the Rockets and Celtics direction, you can neutralize rim runners simply by switching on screens if you have enough wings. Steven Adams is almost unplayable against the Rockets.

It's the rules. Basically the small on a switch now just has to fall down if a big actually uses a traditional drop step or a back down. 10 years of flopping on the switch, or undercutting the big on help defense and falling down for the charge have made it really hard to punish switching.

It's miserable to watch but Stern and Silver don't seem to give a ****.

[3toheadmelo]

Gobert got exposed because he and the Jazz aren’t able to guard the perimeter. Mitch can do that are his game should translate better because you can’t hunt him for a mismatch to shoot 3’s.

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No, you're missing the point here. It's not about whether or not Mitch or any rim runner can get out on shooters, it's that you're handicapping yourself on offense because your big cannot punish the smaller team for being small. Your center has to be able to get buckets to make them pay for being small. A team that can play 5 out is going to beat a team that plays 4 out 1 in if that 1 can't score and can't make free throws at a decent rate. We've reached a point now where a big wing can realistically guard offensively challenged centers, do you really think Mitch would have scored enough to make the Clippers think twice about putting Morris or Batum on him?

It’s basically why Ben has been ineffective in these playoffs. Ability to guard the perimeter doesn’t mean anything if you’re a complete zero on offense. Hopefully we trade Mitch for someone like Myles Turner

[3toheadmelo]

Watch on YouTube

2016/2017 Tory was great

[JXL]

Mitch will get his own offense. Mark my words, he will be unstoppable.

[F N 11]

Mitch can guard the perimeter. Is the issue for spacing on offense?

[WargamesX]

Gobert got exposed because he and the Jazz aren’t able to guard the perimeter. Mitch can do that are his game should translate better because you can’t hunt him for a mismatch to shoot 3’s.

Read on Twitter

No, you're missing the point here. It's not about whether or not Mitch or any rim runner can get out on shooters, it's that you're handicapping yourself on offense because your big cannot punish the smaller team for being small. Your center has to be able to get buckets to make them pay for being small. A team that can play 5 out is going to beat a team that plays 4 out 1 in if that 1 can't score and can't make free throws at a decent rate. We've reached a point now where a big wing can realistically guard offensively challenged centers, do you really think Mitch would have scored enough to make the Clippers think twice about putting Morris or Batum on him?

It’s basically why Ben has been ineffective in these playoffs. Ability to guard the perimeter doesn’t mean anything if you’re a complete zero on offense. Hopefully we trade Mitch for someone like Myles Turner

Ben is a different case because he is being paid too much for his lack of offense and his approach to the game isn’t as a center who can guard the paint but a scoreless perimeter player who doesn’t play tough defense because he has value as a playmaker. This is thread is such a shortsighted concept. Gobert would have played heavy minutes against the Suns in the WCF but it was a bad mismatch against the clippers going small and 5-out. Snyder cost them them series by not playing small and adapting to the mismatch.

Mitch is the equivalent of Capela who is seeing heavy minutes in the Philly series and who wouldn’t have been nearly effect in the Knicks series if Mitch and Noel had been healthy. Centers are essential they just have a limit to what you can pay them and you probably only want to pay them on their second contract.

The real lesson from all this is Centers are the equivalent of RB’s in the NFL. You don’t want to pay them too much money because while you need them, but they have a limited use. It’s essential to have them as low cost contract because once they lose a step they’ll be taken advantage of by guards and wings. Trading for Turner isn’t the smart move…. He’s being paid more than Mitch is right now. Also that isn’t a bad contract for a center about 15-17 Mil. The reason the pacers need to move him is because between him and Sabonis they are paying too much for Centers (30+ Mil). Hell Gobert is making about 5 mil too much and when you add Conley to that the Jazz have too much invested in limited players.

On the low Mitch and Noel are better centers for the modern nba than they get credit for. You just can’t over pay them and once they lose a step they become a liability. I would be good keeping Mitch for around 15 Mil a year on the next contract. The one after that though is a different case. The odds he’ll be a perimeter defender going into his 30s are low.

[Capn'O]

He does need to let it fly.

Also, Donovan Mitchell is garbage because he can't guard the perimeter either.

[Phish Tank]

Mitch needs to be able to do 1-2 things on offense when he has the ball. That'll involve handling the ball too. That'll also involve passing the ball as well - as Taj & Noel have shown to be decent passers as big men. Doesn't mean shooting 3s.... hell he'd be better off learning how to make a hook shot or a short turnaround bucket in his arsenal.

[NoDopeOnSundays]

Mitch can guard the perimeter. Is the issue for spacing on offense?

The issue is that the teams going small are doing it because they don't fear the offense of the big, that's what I said in my first post here about rim runners, it's that their lack of offense can hurt you the further you go in the playoffs now. Your big has to be able to score, pass or shoot now, teams are willing to put wings on centers because they are choosing speed & versatility on defense and floor spacing on the other end, they are sacrificing rim protection by being small and not much else. The Clippers had the same amount of offensive rebounds as the Jazz, because their wings are more athletic than the Jazz wings and Rudy was almost always outside the paint defending someone. The Clippers whose tallest player in the starting lineup was 6'8" had two less total rebounds for the series.

Mitch isn't a better scorer than Gobert and he's not a better passer than Boban, both of these guys were pretty much useless against the small lineup. Everyone saying Mitch can guard the perimeter is missing the point, can he punish the smaller team for being small? If we're going to keep Randle we need to look at him as a smallball center now, and load up on big wings that can shoot and attack closeouts so we can take advantage of teams, leave no place for someone like Trae to hide on defense and make Capela come out the paint. We can keep Mitch, but that player type is becoming more situational than anything else, Capela is the last high paid rim runner left in the playoffs and he's getting thoroughly outplayed by a guy with a torn meniscus.

[NoDopeOnSundays]

Watch on YouTube

2016/2017 Tory was great

He had so many hits around that time, Tim Duncan is another great song

[NoDopeOnSundays]

Playoff series are always won or lost based on matchups and who you matchup with is generally the luck of the draw. The clippers last year got the nuggets and got caught lacking cause they were putting trez harrell, kawhi, marcus morris, etc. and all these littler guys on jokic and he cooked all of them. for us in the east, the sixers will always be players for the foreseeable future so long as they have embiid, and ultimately if we lose mitch, we can't get caught lacking having to put randle or obi toppin on embiid

We're not going to beat the Sixers with a healthy Embiid if our center can only catch lobs and get putbacks, the centers that have the most success against Embiid are floor spacers who can defend, he overreacts to the threat of their shooting and gets tired closing out on them (Horford/Baynes, Gasol/Ibaka). He completely dominates his matchups with rim runners, look at what he's doing to Capela while injured.

You can't go small against the offensive centers like Embiid, Jokic and AD, and in Embiid & AD's case their defense makes you pay for having a big out there who can't do much on offense since they'll play a 1 man zone guarding the rim. We'd have to figure something else out against Embiid, cause Mitch won't be the answer there either.

[Ghetto Gospel]

Playoff series are always won or lost based on matchups and who you matchup with is generally the luck of the draw. The clippers last year got the nuggets and got caught lacking cause they were putting trez harrell, kawhi, marcus morris, etc. and all these littler guys on jokic and he cooked all of them. for us in the east, the sixers will always be players for the foreseeable future so long as they have embiid, and ultimately if we lose mitch, we can't get caught lacking having to put randle or obi toppin on embiid

We're not going to beat the Sixers with a healthy Embiid if our center can only catch lobs and get putbacks, the centers that have the most success against Embiid are floor spacers who can defend, he overreacts to the threat of their shooting and gets tired closing out on them (Horford/Baynes, Gasol/Ibaka). He completely dominates his matchups with rim runners, look at what he's doing to Capela while injured.

You can't go small against the offensive centers like Embiid, Jokic and AD, and in Embiid & AD's case their defense makes you pay for having a big out there who can't do much on offense since they'll play a 1 man zone guarding the rim. We'd have to figure something else out against Embiid, cause Mitch won't be the answer there either.

Sure if you put a shooting C out there it'll draw Embiid away from the paint, which opens the lane. But then what about matchups against other teams. Playoff series are always all about matchups and if you take for example the raptors duo Gasol/Ibaka they can't guard the perimeter anymore and are liable to getting hunted on pick and rolls. See celtics/raptors in the 2020 playoffs.

Going back to Utah, I believe it was just a matchup difference. The roster construction of this Utah team has it so that they are a jump shooting/poor perimeter defending team with a rim running big that is heavily relied on to protect the paint. If you pull him out of the paint, it's a free run to the basket everytime. The Clippers were breaking their man off the dribble and drawing Gobert into the paint at will. Had they played a small ball 5, I firmly believe that defensively nothing would have changed.

This brings us to the jazz offensively and what Rudy Gobert can offer there if he isn't offering anything on defense. I believe this is an issue of Utah's roster construction because we've seen rim running bigs be successful on offense even this year, see Clint Capela against us. Trae Young runs a pnr forcing Gibson/Noel/Randle to switch over and contest the shot, and if Trae Young shoots a floater and misses, Clint Capela isn't getting boxed out by Rose/Bullock/Payton and was grabbing offensive rebounds against us at will. Utah just isn't that type of team that can utilize Goberts offensive rebounding the way the Hawks utilize Capelas. Now, Capela isn't grabbing a ton of offensive boards against the 76ers like he did us, but that's because he doesn't have it as easy against us as them as he has to box out either Ben Simmons or Joel Embiid.

The Utah Jazz are more or less a jump shooting team that swing the ball around and shoot 3's leading to long rebounds that are quite often not picked up by bigs :

[3toheadmelo]

Watch on YouTube

2016/2017 Tory was great

He had so many hits around that time, Tim Duncan is another great song

Chixtape 4 and New Toronto 2 were classics. One of his recent albums Loner was crazy. don’t know if you ever checked that out

Watch on YouTube

He also just dropped this. #1 trending on YouTube right now. He never misses

Watch on YouTube

[NoDopeOnSundays]

Playoff series are always won or lost based on matchups and who you matchup with is generally the luck of the draw. The clippers last year got the nuggets and got caught lacking cause they were putting trez harrell, kawhi, marcus morris, etc. and all these littler guys on jokic and he cooked all of them. for us in the east, the sixers will always be players for the foreseeable future so long as they have embiid, and ultimately if we lose mitch, we can't get caught lacking having to put randle or obi toppin on embiid

We're not going to beat the Sixers with a healthy Embiid if our center can only catch lobs and get putbacks, the centers that have the most success against Embiid are floor spacers who can defend, he overreacts to the threat of their shooting and gets tired closing out on them (Horford/Baynes, Gasol/Ibaka). He completely dominates his matchups with rim runners, look at what he's doing to Capela while injured.

You can't go small against the offensive centers like Embiid, Jokic and AD, and in Embiid & AD's case their defense makes you pay for having a big out there who can't do much on offense since they'll play a 1 man zone guarding the rim. We'd have to figure something else out against Embiid, cause Mitch won't be the answer there either.

Sure if you put a shooting C out there it'll draw Embiid away from the paint, which opens the lane. But then what about matchups against other teams. Playoff series are always all about matchups and if you take for example the raptors duo Gasol/Ibaka they can't guard the perimeter anymore and are liable to getting hunted on pick and rolls. See celtics/raptors in the 2020 playoffs.

Going back to Utah, I believe it was just a matchup difference. The roster construction of this Utah team has it so that they are a jump shooting/poor perimeter defending team with a rim running big that is heavily relied on to protect the paint. If you pull him out of the paint, it's a free run to the basket everytime. The Clippers were breaking their man off the dribble and drawing Gobert into the paint at will. Had they played a small ball 5, I firmly believe that defensively nothing would have changed.

This brings us to the jazz offensively and what Rudy Gobert can offer there if he isn't offering anything on defense. I believe this is an issue of Utah's roster construction because we've seen rim running bigs be successful on offense even this year, see Clint Capela against us. Trae Young runs a pnr forcing Gibson/Noel/Randle to switch over and contest the shot, and if Trae Young shoots a floater and misses, Clint Capela isn't getting boxed out by Rose/Bullock/Payton and was grabbing offensive rebounds against us at will. Utah just isn't that type of team that can utilize Goberts offensive rebounding the way the Hawks utilize Capelas. Now, Capela isn't grabbing a ton of offensive boards against the 76ers like he did us, but that's because he doesn't have it as easy against us as them as he has to box out either Ben Simmons or Joel Embiid.

The Utah Jazz are more or less a jump shooting team that swing the ball around and shoot 3's leading to long rebounds that are quite often not picked up by bigs :

I wouldn't use the Raptors going 7 without Kawhi as an example of anything, that game came down to the last couple possession, and it was really Gasol who couldn't play, Ibaka was a positive but their offense couldn't do anything so they had to go smaller.

The Jazz used Rudy all throughout the season as a roll threat, he scored 14.5ppg to Clint's 15.2ppg, they are essentially the same threat on offense. The playoffs are about matchups yes, but I think we've seen enough now to say that the right matchup to negate a rim runner is to go 5 out and make them pay for having a big on the floor who cannot do anything on offense. The Rockets played Adams off the floor last year, the Clippers made Gobert a liability this year and one of the greatest lineups in history has a 6'7" guy playing C. The book is out on rim runners, play small, live with their rebounding and penalize them for a lack of offensive skill. This being a copycat league more teams are going to look at what the Clippers just did to Gobert and try to build their teams with at least 1 lineup capable of going small like that.


You're talking about what happens on defense and the boards, and I keep coming back to this, a smallball team that is built properly will be able to defend the rim runner. The Clippers had no fear of Rudy's offense, and he's a better scorer than Mitch to this point. We should be looking for big wings who can guard perimeter and catch rollmen. We lost because we kept playing a rim runner who clogged the paint and let Capela just have his way on defense. The Hawks actually went to a smallball C lineup when Capela was off the floor, Gallo played some minutes at C and we couldn't make them pay because Nerlens/Taj do not leave the lane. What happened to Gobert happened to us on a smaller timeframe. Having a rim runner in there allowed Capela to just hang out and guard space, it's why he got a few huge blocks on Randle, because he was always 1 step away from helping, he has blocked 2.2bpg against us and is at 0.5bpg against the Sixers because he cannot leave Embiid to help & he does leave the lane.


We actually could have played a smallball lineup to help free up our offense, but Thibs is a rigid idiot in the playoffs. If Ty Lue was our coach there's no doubt in my mind we would have found a lineup with Randle at C that would have worked better against the Hawks. It's also why I really hope the Hornets do not get Turner, he would unlock their offense just by giving them the option to go 5 out with size and multiple ball handlers.

[prophet_of_rage]

We're not going to beat the Sixers with a healthy Embiid if our center can only catch lobs and get putbacks, the centers that have the most success against Embiid are floor spacers who can defend, he overreacts to the threat of their shooting and gets tired closing out on them (Horford/Baynes, Gasol/Ibaka). He completely dominates his matchups with rim runners, look at what he's doing to Capela while injured.

You can't go small against the offensive centers like Embiid, Jokic and AD, and in Embiid & AD's case their defense makes you pay for having a big out there who can't do much on offense since they'll play a 1 man zone guarding the rim. We'd have to figure something else out against Embiid, cause Mitch won't be the answer there either.

Sure if you put a shooting C out there it'll draw Embiid away from the paint, which opens the lane. But then what about matchups against other teams. Playoff series are always all about matchups and if you take for example the raptors duo Gasol/Ibaka they can't guard the perimeter anymore and are liable to getting hunted on pick and rolls. See celtics/raptors in the 2020 playoffs.

Going back to Utah, I believe it was just a matchup difference. The roster construction of this Utah team has it so that they are a jump shooting/poor perimeter defending team with a rim running big that is heavily relied on to protect the paint. If you pull him out of the paint, it's a free run to the basket everytime. The Clippers were breaking their man off the dribble and drawing Gobert into the paint at will. Had they played a small ball 5, I firmly believe that defensively nothing would have changed.

This brings us to the jazz offensively and what Rudy Gobert can offer there if he isn't offering anything on defense. I believe this is an issue of Utah's roster construction because we've seen rim running bigs be successful on offense even this year, see Clint Capela against us. Trae Young runs a pnr forcing Gibson/Noel/Randle to switch over and contest the shot, and if Trae Young shoots a floater and misses, Clint Capela isn't getting boxed out by Rose/Bullock/Payton and was grabbing offensive rebounds against us at will. Utah just isn't that type of team that can utilize Goberts offensive rebounding the way the Hawks utilize Capelas. Now, Capela isn't grabbing a ton of offensive boards against the 76ers like he did us, but that's because he doesn't have it as easy against us as them as he has to box out either Ben Simmons or Joel Embiid.

The Utah Jazz are more or less a jump shooting team that swing the ball around and shoot 3's leading to long rebounds that are quite often not picked up by bigs :

I wouldn't use the Raptors going 7 without Kawhi as an example of anything, that game came down to the last couple possession, and it was really Gasol who couldn't play, Ibaka was a positive but their offense couldn't do anything so they had to go smaller.

The Jazz used Rudy all throughout the season as a roll threat, he scored 14.5ppg to Clint's 15.2ppg, they are essentially the same threat on offense. The playoffs are about matchups yes, but I think we've seen enough now to say that the right matchup to negate a rim runner is to go 5 out and make them pay for having a big on the floor who cannot do anything on offense. The Rockets played Adams off the floor last year, the Clippers made Gobert a liability this year and one of the greatest lineups in history has a 6'7" guy playing C. The book is out on rim runners, play small, live with their rebounding and penalize them for a lack of offensive skill. This being a copycat league more teams are going to look at what the Clippers just did to Gobert and try to build their teams with at least 1 lineup capable of going small like that.


You're talking about what happens on defense and the boards, and I keep coming back to this, a smallball team that is built properly will be able to defend the rim runner. The Clippers had no fear of Rudy's offense, and he's a better scorer than Mitch to this point. We should be looking for big wings who can guard perimeter and catch rollmen. We lost because we kept playing a rim runner who clogged the paint and let Capela just have his way on defense. The Hawks actually went to a smallball C lineup when Capela was off the floor, Gallo played some minutes at C and we couldn't make them pay because Nerlens/Taj do not leave the lane. What happened to Gobert happened to us on a smaller timeframe. Having a rim runner in there allowed Capela to just hang out and guard space, it's why he got a few huge blocks on Randle, because he was always 1 step away from helping, he has blocked 2.2bpg against us and is at 0.5bpg against the Sixers because he cannot leave Embiid to help & he does leave the lane.


We actually could have played a smallball lineup to help free up our offense, but Thibs is a rigid idiot in the playoffs. If Ty Lue was our coach there's no doubt in my mind we would have found a lineup with Randle at C that would have worked better against the Hawks. It's also why I really hope the Hornets do not get Turner, he would unlock their offense just by giving them the option to go 5 out with size and multiple ball handlers.

I would love to get a big like Turner.

Sent from my SM-N970W using Tapatalk

[frothbrain]

Mitch is a rich man's Nerlens Noel which is still just a 20 million a year player at most if you want to build a contender, see Clint Capela.

[Ghetto Gospel]

We're not going to beat the Sixers with a healthy Embiid if our center can only catch lobs and get putbacks, the centers that have the most success against Embiid are floor spacers who can defend, he overreacts to the threat of their shooting and gets tired closing out on them (Horford/Baynes, Gasol/Ibaka). He completely dominates his matchups with rim runners, look at what he's doing to Capela while injured.

You can't go small against the offensive centers like Embiid, Jokic and AD, and in Embiid & AD's case their defense makes you pay for having a big out there who can't do much on offense since they'll play a 1 man zone guarding the rim. We'd have to figure something else out against Embiid, cause Mitch won't be the answer there either.

Sure if you put a shooting C out there it'll draw Embiid away from the paint, which opens the lane. But then what about matchups against other teams. Playoff series are always all about matchups and if you take for example the raptors duo Gasol/Ibaka they can't guard the perimeter anymore and are liable to getting hunted on pick and rolls. See celtics/raptors in the 2020 playoffs.

Going back to Utah, I believe it was just a matchup difference. The roster construction of this Utah team has it so that they are a jump shooting/poor perimeter defending team with a rim running big that is heavily relied on to protect the paint. If you pull him out of the paint, it's a free run to the basket everytime. The Clippers were breaking their man off the dribble and drawing Gobert into the paint at will. Had they played a small ball 5, I firmly believe that defensively nothing would have changed.

This brings us to the jazz offensively and what Rudy Gobert can offer there if he isn't offering anything on defense. I believe this is an issue of Utah's roster construction because we've seen rim running bigs be successful on offense even this year, see Clint Capela against us. Trae Young runs a pnr forcing Gibson/Noel/Randle to switch over and contest the shot, and if Trae Young shoots a floater and misses, Clint Capela isn't getting boxed out by Rose/Bullock/Payton and was grabbing offensive rebounds against us at will. Utah just isn't that type of team that can utilize Goberts offensive rebounding the way the Hawks utilize Capelas. Now, Capela isn't grabbing a ton of offensive boards against the 76ers like he did us, but that's because he doesn't have it as easy against us as them as he has to box out either Ben Simmons or Joel Embiid.

The Utah Jazz are more or less a jump shooting team that swing the ball around and shoot 3's leading to long rebounds that are quite often not picked up by bigs :

I wouldn't use the Raptors going 7 without Kawhi as an example of anything, that game came down to the last couple possession, and it was really Gasol who couldn't play, Ibaka was a positive but their offense couldn't do anything so they had to go smaller.

The Jazz used Rudy all throughout the season as a roll threat, he scored 14.5ppg to Clint's 15.2ppg, they are essentially the same threat on offense. The playoffs are about matchups yes, but I think we've seen enough now to say that the right matchup to negate a rim runner is to go 5 out and make them pay for having a big on the floor who cannot do anything on offense. The Rockets played Adams off the floor last year, the Clippers made Gobert a liability this year and one of the greatest lineups in history has a 6'7" guy playing C. The book is out on rim runners, play small, live with their rebounding and penalize them for a lack of offensive skill. This being a copycat league more teams are going to look at what the Clippers just did to Gobert and try to build their teams with at least 1 lineup capable of going small like that.

You're talking about what happens on defense and the boards, and I keep coming back to this, a smallball team that is built properly will be able to defend the rim runner. The Clippers had no fear of Rudy's offense, and he's a better scorer than Mitch to this point. We should be looking for big wings who can guard perimeter and catch rollmen. We lost because we kept playing a rim runner who clogged the paint and let Capela just have his way on defense. The Hawks actually went to a smallball C lineup when Capela was off the floor, Gallo played some minutes at C and we couldn't make them pay because Nerlens/Taj do not leave the lane. What happened to Gobert happened to us on a smaller timeframe. Having a rim runner in there allowed Capela to just hang out and guard space, it's why he got a few huge blocks on Randle, because he was always 1 step away from helping, he has blocked 2.2bpg against us and is at 0.5bpg against the Sixers because he cannot leave Embiid to help & he does leave the lane.

We actually could have played a smallball lineup to help free up our offense, but Thibs is a rigid idiot in the playoffs. If Ty Lue was our coach there's no doubt in my mind we would have found a lineup with Randle at C that would have worked better against the Hawks. It's also why I really hope the Hornets do not get Turner, he would unlock their offense just by giving them the option to go 5 out with size and multiple ball handlers.

Don't have to go to game 7 of the kawhi-less raptors, there are multiple examples pre-game 7, for example go to game 3 and see how kemba sets up the what should have been game winning assist if not for a miracle pass/shot by lowry/anunoby. Ibaka and gasol were so bad at covering tatum/walker/brown that they went for stretches playing anunoby at C; go back and watch the series. Also, you're admitting Ibaka was a problem on offense, who they are paying 20m+/year for along with Gasol 20m+/year. Regardless of whether or not you have Kawhi because based on certain matchups they are not playable. Yet you suggest them as alternatives to Mitch who would not be worth it at 20m+/year because there are some matchups he may not be playable in. It's just 2 sides of the same coin

I agree that is exactly how you neutralize rim runners, you play 5 out. But 5 out has a weakness too and we saw what Jokic did to them; once again matchups. The Rockets played Adams off the floor last year with 5 out, but what happened to the Rockets when they had to play the best "smallball" 5 in the game in Anthony Davis? They had nothing for him; once again matchups. The greatest lineup in history has a 6'7" guy playing C because he could legitimately protect the paint, guard bigs and had tremendous offensive and defensive basketball IQ which is an unusual player archetype and a rare commodity in this league. There is no player in the league that can come close to what Draymond Green did at his height.

We didn't lose because we kept playing a rim runner who clogged the paint. We lost because we have no talent, this roster is trash. Capela's block rates are that way against the 76ers because they play inside-out. They throw the ball to Embiid who Capela has nothing for and can't stop, then if they double, he can kick it out to open shooters. We play outside-in, Randle catching the ball at the elbow, then maybe driving into the teeth of the defense. If we play 5-out and have Randle try to drive against Capela, I'm not even sure how effective that will be given Randle was at times getting clamped up by Gallo

Who cares if the Hornets get Turner. That team will just be on the treadmill to nowhere; the next orlando magic.

Ultimately with regards to the Knicks, I understand your vision of roster construction and what you're looking for in players and generally speaking, I agree. But it is difficult to obtain fully switchable players that can all shoot and put the ball on the floor, that is just not realistic. There are only so many switchable 5's or big wings that can play the 5 that are "matchup-proof". I believe that there is currently only 1 for sure guy right now (Draymond Green isn't the same player) and it's Anthony Davis. There are a few other young guys that might have the potential for this, but they have yet to turn out that way. With a 5 out lineups, you run into questions about what you're willing to invest into having that option be available, while simultaneously having options to throw at Jokic or Embiid without getting your ass torn apart. That's a lot of money to float around for matchup versatility, which leads me to my last point here which is the most efficient way to have money be spent.

The answer is that money is always most efficient on a superstar because they provide significantly more value than their contract may suggest. Because we have no superstar, our salary cap efficiency will always be terrible and there is no way around it. Now if we were to get a couple of superstars, I believe you can stomach paying a guy like Mitch $15-20m while also having a deep enough bench that would allow us to go 5-out at the same time. The lack of superstar and talent will always the crux of our problem to which the solution will always be to tank

[rickxdel]

Mitch is a rich man's Nerlens Noel which is still just a 20 million a year player at most if you want to build a contender, see Clint Capela.

I definitely think 20M/yr is an overpay for Mitch