[Build A Team 4.0] Discussion Thread Part 3 - I LOVE MY TEAM

[I am Ra]

.

Any interest in trading your high and low 12th rounders for my back to back mid 12th rounders?

[TheBluest]

Well according to KLN ....

he thinks

Heat....Kings....Knick....Nuggets....Wizards are Top 5

Not saying I disagree because after looking at the rosters, I can see how these teams could crack a Top. There's also a trend....

Howard
Lebron
Carmelo
Rose
Deron

Now let's ask ourselves this question..... if we continue to do B.A.T.'s and you don't have a Top 15 pick, let's face it you're never going to win B.A.T. Top 20 you might have a chance but highly doubtful. Out of the Top 20 forget about it. Everyone here knows what they are doing according to most participating.... if you name drop that doesn't impact anything because most GMs participating know what they are doing right? So if you have a Top 15 pick how could any GM F up their team right?

It's gets back to the email I sent swisscheeseD...... the B.A.T. doesn't quite make a lot of sense to me because it's really determined by draft order and it includes all players in the league. This alone makes it extremely flawed. Once Draft Order is established the B.A.T. winner is pretty much established. To be honest I wouldn't want a Top 15 pick based on how the system is weighted right now. I appreciate flipping the draft board every round but sorry that doesn't cut it. This should be fun and fair for everyone, not just a select few. That's why some sort of Simulation should at least be a factor on the point system. Not that it should skew the competition but it should be a factor..... point blank period. We need to provide additional categories which to base points off of.

I mean being that this is the 4rth one we've done.... how come the poster/team that won the first B.A.T. doesn't automatically end up with the 30th pick the next B.A.T? You know like a real draft? Who are we kidding here...... you have a Top 15 player or Top 10 player there's almost no reason you should fair bad in any B.A.T. Also it's becoming obvious as each B.A.T. goes by all you have to do is get rid of a combination of picks 8-13 maybe coupled with a player and complete your roster by the 8th round. So what if you're skipped round 8,10,12,13 your team is basically complete and you have a Top 10 player on it coupled with a couple Top 60 players on it.


We need a very intuitive and innovative committee established first before we do the next B.A.T.

We need to establish what the main objectives are

We need to make it fair for everyone involved

We must absolutely enforce strict rules

We must be deliberate in conducting it in a timely manner

[Rich2Hassan]

To add on with what TheBluest just posted:

I think we should bring in other posters to help with judging in this BAT. Maybe gather up mods from other team forums here on RealGM, and have them rank the teams along with the current GM's. You know some GM's are gonna base their vote on the relationship they have with other posters, etc.. Just a suggestion.

[2010]

*No Order* *Guys, don't take it personal... it's just my opinion.*

Top 5:
Nuggets, Wizards, Kings, Heat, Knicks

Top 10:
Bucks, Lakers, Hawks, Hornets, Blazers

Botton 5:
Bobcats, Cavs, Clippers, Spurs, Raptors

I looked at the top 5 and this is what I noticed.

The Wizards players are getting older, but they still have Dwight Howard.

The Kings aren't winning a championship built around Deron Williams and Rudy Gay

The Heat have Carmelo who is expiring and that team doesn't exactly give Carmelo a reason to stay.

The Knicks have Lebron for the next 5 or 6 years (not sure how long he signed for irl) so they'll always be in the mix

The Nuggets have young players Rose, Johnson, Pietrus, and Gortat locked into longterm contracts, Oden for the next 2 seasons, and cap space for a max fa next season.

Now am I wrong for saying my team is in the best position for a potential dynasty?

Dude...I usually try not to get involved in this back and forth but honestly, the "heat has **** but Melo" is just a bunch of nonsense and no reason for me to sit here and take it. I think you may be riding one really good comment about Wesley Johnson and letting it go to your head.

I'm going to still refrain from talking about any of the other top 5 teams in detail, but as far as the Heat goes? "not giving him any reason to stay"? Are you kidding me? Stop the nonsense, he's on the DEEPEST team in terms of talent in this league (HINT: there are NO 3 Queens in BAT). The core of the team are all in their prime. They have young talent, a flexible cap and while also being built to win now. If there is any team that ranks near the top in all 3 main categories that have been judged (win-now, future, cap) it's the Heat.

But let's take a look at your team shall we?

PG: Derrick Rose/Delonte West
SG: MIckael Pietrus/Reggie Williams
SF: Wes Johnson/Richard Jefferson
PF: Zach Randolph/Joe Smith
C: Greg Oden/Marcin Gortat

Dude...you have ONE SINGLE proven stud. Derrick Rose...if you want to talk about a team not having anything else you just need to look at your own team. If there's any team that falls in the "but what do they have besides their best player", it's your team.And you have a psycho backing him up in West.

You're relying on Greg Oden, who has not been able to show he can play even half a season in any of his 3 NBA seasons as the "backbone" (and honestly, only real member) of your defense. PS: looks like Oden hasn't made as much progress in his latest endeavor to recover from injury as Blazer management had expected.

You have a backup backup caliber player as your starting SG in Pietrus.

An offensive blackhole at PF who you've referred to as more of an expiring contract than anything else, with a guy that may retire in Joe Smith as his backup? Dude...you need to get a real backup PF. This isn't 2006-2007 (the last time Joe Smith was remotely effective), it's 2010-2011. Joe Smith is that Thanksgivings Day turkey that was left in the oven for too long.

Keep your hype about your own team to yourself.

[2010]

To add on with what TheBluest just posted:

I think we should bring in other posters to help with judging in this BAT. Maybe gather up mods from other team forums here on RealGM, and have them rank the teams along with the current GM's. You know some GM's are gonna base their vote on the relationship they have with other posters, etc.. Just a suggestion.

100% Agreed! As of what I've read throughout the discussion board this is ending up becoming a high school popularity poll. We need some neutral blood in here to do the rankings. BTW, I love my teams skill level!

[Rich2Hassan]

To add on with what TheBluest just posted:

I think we should bring in other posters to help with judging in this BAT. Maybe gather up mods from other team forums here on RealGM, and have them rank the teams along with the current GM's. You know some GM's are gonna base their vote on the relationship they have with other posters, etc.. Just a suggestion.

100% Agreed! As of what I've read throughout the discussion board this is ending up becoming a high school popularity poll. We need some neutral blood in here to do the rankings. BTW, I love my teams skill level!

Yup. A previous post, in which a poster was ranking the teams, got mad at me and went back and edited, ranking my team from a top 10, to a bottom 10 team.

[I am Ra]

To add on with what TheBluest just posted:

I think we should bring in other posters to help with judging in this BAT. Maybe gather up mods from other team forums here on RealGM, and have them rank the teams along with the current GM's. You know some GM's are gonna base their vote on the relationship they have with other posters, etc.. Just a suggestion.

100% Agreed! As of what I've read throughout the discussion board this is ending up becoming a high school popularity poll. We need some neutral blood in here to do the rankings. BTW, I love my teams skill level!

exactly. we should all write a quick writeup on the direction of our team and why it is good for that. Then 4 judges from outside should rank us.

[nyknicks2k2]

Honestly, next BAT needs to be done via some kind of simming. I know, I know but the only time one of these things were actually finished was via a sim. A sim is about as neutral as things will get. Judging would be awesome but it's almost impossible to get done. I'd be up for running a future BAF (franchise, not team) based on simming.

[NBA Fan 1234]

Well according to KLN ....

he thinks

Heat....Kings....Knick....Nuggets....Wizards are Top 5

Not saying I disagree because after looking at the rosters, I can see how these teams could crack a Top. There's also a trend....

Howard
Lebron
Carmelo
Rose
Deron

Now let's ask ourselves this question..... if we continue to do B.A.T.'s and you don't have a Top 15 pick, let's face it you're never going to win B.A.T. Top 20 you might have a chance but highly doubtful. Out of the Top 20 forget about it. Everyone here knows what they are doing according to most participating.... if you name drop that doesn't impact anything because most GMs participating know what they are doing right? So if you have a Top 15 pick how could any GM F up their team right?

It's gets back to the email I sent swisscheeseD...... the B.A.T. doesn't quite make a lot of sense to me because it's really determined by draft order and it includes all players in the league. This alone makes it extremely flawed. Once Draft Order is established the B.A.T. winner is pretty much established. To be honest I wouldn't want a Top 15 pick based on how the system is weighted right now. I appreciate flipping the draft board every round but sorry that doesn't cut it. This should be fun and fair for everyone, not just a select few. That's why some sort of Simulation should at least be a factor on the point system. Not that it should skew the competition but it should be a factor point blank period. We needs to provide additional categories in which to base points off of.

I mean being that this is the 4rth one we've done.... how come the poster/team that won the first B.A.T. doesn't automatically end up with the 30th pick the next B.A.T? You know like a real draft? Who are we kidding here...... you have a Top 15 player or Top 10 player there's almost no reason you should fair bad in any B.A.T. Also it's becoming obvious as each B.A.T. goes by all you have to do is get rid of a combination of picks 8-13 maybe coupled with a player and complete your roster by the 8th round. So what if you're skipped round 8,10,12,13 your team is basically complete and you have a Top 10 player on it coupled with a couple Top 60 players on it.


We need a very intuitive and innovative committee established first before we do the next B.A.T.

We need to establish what the main objectives are

We need to make it fair for everyone involved

We must absolutely enforce strict rules

We must be deliberate in conducting it in a timely manner

While I agree with a bunch of things you said, the bolded part I do not agree with. I was the Raptors before I went on vacation and lost my GM spot because I was unable to draft, and I had a very good team on the rise. JJ, Al Jefferson, Mo Williams, Troy Murphy (whom I was going to use to trade for a starting center), Leandro Barbosa, Hickson, Martell Webster, and Brandon Bass (I was going to trade him or Hickson later on) is definitely one of the better teams in the league. Championship worthy? Probably not...but definitely a playoff team. I had a bunch of people say the exact same thing.

You just need to manage your team correctly and figure out what type of team/players you want early on so you can mold your team. Is it hard? Yes, but no matter where you draft you are screwed in some way. Early picks-yeah, they get the "superstars" because they have a top pick, but after they make that pick, they don't pick for a very long time.

The key is to pick a player (or a few) and mold a team around that. That's what makes it fun, bro.

With that being said, you did make a bunch of good points.

[Rich2Hassan]

Honestly, next BAT needs to be done via some kind of simming. I know, I know but the only time one of these things were actually finished was via a sim. A sim is about as neutral as things will get. Judging would be awesome but it's almost impossible to get done. I'd be up for running a future BAF (franchise, not team) based on simming.

Yeah i agree. Because whom ever wins the SIM, have the real bragging rights. We don't have to hear how good someone team is, and blah blah blah. The SIM don't lie.

[Fury]

If the top picking teams always win, why not switch it up and make it an All-Time NBA Draft. Even if you get Jordan with the first pick, there are still tons of superstars left. Would make this way better.

[I am Ra]

If the top picking teams always win, why not switch it up and make it an All-Time NBA Draft. Even if you get Jordan with the first pick, there are still tons of superstars left. Would make this way better.

not good for the younger generation of basketball fans aka me.

[Fury]

This would probably be good for you to learn something then. It's not difficult. You can look up tons of sites to help you.

[I am Ra]

This would probably be good for you to learn something then. It's not difficult. You can look up tons of sites to help you.

Too much time consuming considering Im starting school soon.

[I am Ra]

Bluest I sent you a reply.

[TheBluest]

To add on with what TheBluest just posted:

I think we should bring in other posters to help with judging in this BAT. Maybe gather up mods from other team forums here on RealGM, and have them rank the teams along with the current GM's. You know some GM's are gonna base their vote on the relationship they have with other posters, etc.. Just a suggestion.

100% Agreed! As of what I've read throughout the discussion board this is ending up becoming a high school popularity poll. We need some neutral blood in here to do the rankings. BTW, I love my teams skill level!

Boys Club Fraternity Clique should have stopped a long time ago. I also find debates in this B.A.T. to be hypocritical.....

Takes for instance you got knocked for the Yao pick and his health being suspect. Alright I'll buy this as a valid slight towards your team, although going into the B.A.T. I thought it would always be logical to assume health...... unless a player just got injured in the midst of us conducting the B.A.T.

At the same time you won't hear as strong an argument for drafted players who were injured last year or have shown signs to be injury prone throughout their career or recently.... in particular on teams who have these players as starters with dung for backups or fecal depth. Some of these players were drafted extremely high too like

CP3
Granger
Bogut
Bynum
Martin
Randolph
Oden
Jefferson
Deng
Griffin
Arenas
Roy
Duncan
Ginobli
Tyson Chandler
Tayshaun Prince
Ben Gordon
Charlie Vill
Rip Hamilton


Just to name a few.

So if you are knocking someone for picking a player as an injury candidate before the team is complete you'd have to do the same across the board. Otherwise since teams are being judged based on construction why assume injuries? If we were running a SIM then I could understand the criticism of picking such players. But getting back to Yao if I'm a GM looking at your team I wouldn't assume injury but instead look at Yao for what he is/has been when healthy.....Top 30 player. Now if you have no one backing him up that's adequate I may start to consider things like health because 82gms of Yao at starters minutes with no reinforcement would be suspect.

[Fury]

All-Time Draft fixes everything. I don't understand why it has to be contemporary. This could be fun if it weren't taken so seriously.

[Smoke24]

All-Time Draft fixes everything. I don't understand why it has to be contemporary. This could be fun if it weren't taken so seriously.

Sorry, but competition trumps fun every time.

[Ayonick07]

All-Time Draft fixes everything. I don't understand why it has to be contemporary. This could be fun if it weren't taken so seriously.

I'm so against doing anything such as that because the amount of research we would have to do would be ridiculous. I don't have time to do research on players from the 50's, 60's, 70's

[Fury]

I thought more people knew their basketball history.