Hot Topic - Quite Frankly; All Things Frank

[mpharris36]

its not like we are even playing good sound basketball to warrant these ridiculous rotations either...we are playing like **** and playing horrible defense...how is that building anything?

[Knicksfan1992]

Yet he somehow is in almost every 2-3-4-5 man top rated unit on the team. So I don't get this he doesn't want to use his talent. He is struggling with confidence in his shooting right now and that is making him overthink sh*t. Its the same reason he looked great in the Charlotte game where he was stroking it from all over. What Fiz needs to do is reinforce that if your jumper isn't working we have enough confidence in you with the other aspects of your games (distributing...defense...ect). To warrant playing time because we think you are a good player.

The inconsistent minutes and in and out of the rotation while other guys who are struggling to shoot just as much is confusing the sh*t out of the kid. Even he said he wasn't aware he was going to get benched...that is simply horrible coaching and a lack of communication which a young team desperately needs.

Fiz isn't all doom and gloom, I like a few things he is doing...but he is totally botching franks development right now.

I mean we can go back and forth all day on it.. you're right on a lot of points but I think you're overly optimistic that Frank would be doing things different with more minutes. I'm just not totally there yet. I don't want it to be misconstrued either... I'm not totally anti-Frank. I just don't see PG in him and never really saw the high ceiling that others saw. I still think he can be a good player in time, but by that I mean like 4th-6th best player on a contending team with limited duty on offense. Something like Avery Bradley. Just so we're straight on that because I know my posts can come off as negative. I'm actually really only replying because I'm confused where you got your numbers.... NBA.com says our best 2 man unit net rating wise with at least 200 minutes is Vonleh/Trier with a + 7.3. Frank/Dot is 4th with a - 0.4

thats why I said he is almost near the top in every 2-3-4-5 man lineup...

my point is I just don't see the focus and development on the kid. If that means the d-league then that means the d-league. THat is no knock. Plenty of good players have spent on the dleague...but this in and out of the lineup clearly doesn't help confidence. Just come up with a clear plan.

But don't tell me you yanked him when he is struggling with THjr/Burke have the green light and they aren't struggling? Where is the consistency?

Yeah I get your frustration. I mean Burke has been benched as much as Frank and Hardaway plays a different position but I get it I really do. My guess is Fiz thinks he needs constant motivation and benching him so far is the only thing that seems to have gotten something out of Frank. Its not how I would handle it but I'm just not outraged over it I guess.... Frank doesnt really factor in how I would build this team. He's more of a complementary piece to me. So if he doesn't work out he doesn't work out. It sucks but teams miss on picks all the time.

[mpharris36]

I mean we can go back and forth all day on it.. you're right on a lot of points but I think you're overly optimistic that Frank would be doing things different with more minutes. I'm just not totally there yet. I don't want it to be misconstrued either... I'm not totally anti-Frank. I just don't see PG in him and never really saw the high ceiling that others saw. I still think he can be a good player in time, but by that I mean like 4th-6th best player on a contending team with limited duty on offense. Something like Avery Bradley. Just so we're straight on that because I know my posts can come off as negative. I'm actually really only replying because I'm confused where you got your numbers.... NBA.com says our best 2 man unit net rating wise with at least 200 minutes is Vonleh/Trier with a + 7.3. Frank/Dot is 4th with a - 0.4

thats why I said he is almost near the top in every 2-3-4-5 man lineup...

my point is I just don't see the focus and development on the kid. If that means the d-league then that means the d-league. THat is no knock. Plenty of good players have spent on the dleague...but this in and out of the lineup clearly doesn't help confidence. Just come up with a clear plan.

But don't tell me you yanked him when he is struggling with THjr/Burke have the green light and they aren't struggling? Where is the consistency?

Yeah I get your frustration. I mean Burke has been benched as much as Frank and Hardaway plays a different position but I get it I really do. My guess is Fiz thinks he needs constant motivation and benching him so far is the only thing that seems to have gotten something out of Frank. Its not how I would handle it but I'm just not outraged over it I guess.... Frank doesnt really factor in how I would build this team. He's more of a complementary piece to me. So if he doesn't work out he doesn't work out. It sucks but teams miss on picks all the time.

they do and I'm not sitting here telling you Frank needs to be a key piece...but currently he is a piece for the fuutre because of his age + contract. That simply gives him a developmental edge over some of these guys especailly with our plans to clear max cap space.

We have a few of those guys...its not about frank...its about knox, dotson, mitch, trier....that group right there if you can find 3-4 solid rotational piece to hopefully add to the top 3 of KP/a max FA/top draft pick we would be onto something. So I don't want to make this all about Frank. But he has a skillset that a lot of our pieces currently don't have. He is a very good perimeter defender and you need those cheap pieces when you have a good team.

Houston desperetly is missing guys like ariza and luc who do the little things and defend. We will need that when we are good.

Looks like Knox and Trier have carved out there niches...now is time to focus on the frank/dotson/mitch combo because those guys could be energy defensive guys that this team will need when we hopefully start getting good.

[Knicksfan1992]

thats why I said he is almost near the top in every 2-3-4-5 man lineup...

my point is I just don't see the focus and development on the kid. If that means the d-league then that means the d-league. THat is no knock. Plenty of good players have spent on the dleague...but this in and out of the lineup clearly doesn't help confidence. Just come up with a clear plan.

But don't tell me you yanked him when he is struggling with THjr/Burke have the green light and they aren't struggling? Where is the consistency?

Yeah I get your frustration. I mean Burke has been benched as much as Frank and Hardaway plays a different position but I get it I really do. My guess is Fiz thinks he needs constant motivation and benching him so far is the only thing that seems to have gotten something out of Frank. Its not how I would handle it but I'm just not outraged over it I guess.... Frank doesnt really factor in how I would build this team. He's more of a complementary piece to me. So if he doesn't work out he doesn't work out. It sucks but teams miss on picks all the time.

they do and I'm not sitting here telling you Frank needs to be a key piece...but currently he is a piece for the fuutre because of his age + contract. That simply gives him a developmental edge over some of these guys especailly with our plans to clear max cap space.

We have a few of those guys...its not about frank...its about knox, dotson, mitch, trier....that group right there if you can find 3-4 solid rotational piece to hopefully add to the top 3 of KP/a max FA/top draft pick we would be onto something. So I don't want to make this all about Frank. But he has a skillset that a lot of our pieces currently don't have. He is a very good perimeter defender and you need those cheap pieces when you have a good team.

Houston desperetly is missing guys like ariza and luc who do the little things and defend. We will need that when we are good.

Looks like Knox and Trier have carved out there niches...now is time to focus on the frank/dotson/mitch combo because those guys could be energy defensive guys that this team will need when we hopefully start getting good.

Yeah I agree I think those guys could be a nice bench unit/spot starters when we're a fully functional contender. Yeah Houston got a little too cute this offseason trying to replicate Ariza and LRMAM with Ennis. 2 way capable wings are very valuable in the league today.

I'm not as big on perimeter D as you are, but yes you can't be filled with terrible defensive guys on the perimeter and plan on going anywhere relevant.

[prophet_of_rage]

whether your a frank supporter or hater I see no point to him riding on the bench. His problem is shooting and confidence how exactly does that get better sitting on the bench for development purposes. Give him a couple weeks down in the G-league and once we get back from the west coast trip maybe the roster glut will finally be dealt with and he can go back to playing 25 minutes consistently every night where he should be.

This downplays it a little bit too much for my liking... It isn't just shooting. There's a lot more issues than just that... I think the lack of shooting sticks out more because we all hoped that if he gained anything offensively it would be a more consistent jumper based on his form and limitations elsewhere offensively and it's just been bad... Basically if Frank can't shoot even at a slightly below average clip he's barely a replacement player IMO.

I don't see you actually suggesting a plan to help develop him you just giving your opinion on him as a player which is a take for most people who don't care for him. I don't see how it does him any good to ride on the bench (especially for replacement level players that are on contract years). However playing time is the most important right now, so if that means he actually gets legit playing time down in the G-league so be it.

This take 2 shots and if he misses he gets taken out while other guys can miss 14 shots without penalty is ridiculous.

Let him keep working in practice, put him in where he can take advantage of a few matchups and build slowly.

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[prophet_of_rage]

whether your a frank supporter or hater I see no point to him riding on the bench. His problem is shooting and confidence how exactly does that get better sitting on the bench for development purposes. Give him a couple weeks down in the G-league and once we get back from the west coast trip maybe the roster glut will finally be dealt with and he can go back to playing 25 minutes consistently every night where he should be.

This downplays it a little bit too much for my liking... It isn't just shooting. There's a lot more issues than just that... I think the lack of shooting sticks out more because we all hoped that if he gained anything offensively it would be a more consistent jumper based on his form and limitations elsewhere offensively and it's just been bad... Basically if Frank can't shoot even at a slightly below average clip he's barely a replacement player IMO.

I don't see you actually suggesting a plan to help develop him you just giving your opinion on him as a player which is a take for most people who don't care for him. I don't see how it does him any good to ride on the bench (especially for replacement level players that are on contract years). However playing time is the most important right now, so if that means he actually gets legit playing time down in the G-league so be it.

This take 2 shots and if he misses he gets taken out while other guys can miss 14 shots without penalty is ridiculous.

Frank's problem isn't missing the 2 shots. It's that he does nothing else. Doesn't rebound, doesn't create for teammates, doesn't slash to the hoop. He'a just there if he misses his first few shots.

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[Fat Kat]

Knicks are dummies.. Send the kid to the GLeague... they had no problem sending Dotson, Kornet and Baker down there to develop last year... who give a fck where he was drafted. That's what a GL team is for....

Dumb azz Knicks... SMH

What happens when he sh*ts the bed in the gleague? Has Frank ever dominated a summer league game?

[cuyankees]

This downplays it a little bit too much for my liking... It isn't just shooting. There's a lot more issues than just that... I think the lack of shooting sticks out more because we all hoped that if he gained anything offensively it would be a more consistent jumper based on his form and limitations elsewhere offensively and it's just been bad... Basically if Frank can't shoot even at a slightly below average clip he's barely a replacement player IMO.

I don't see you actually suggesting a plan to help develop him you just giving your opinion on him as a player which is a take for most people who don't care for him. I don't see how it does him any good to ride on the bench (especially for replacement level players that are on contract years). However playing time is the most important right now, so if that means he actually gets legit playing time down in the G-league so be it.

This take 2 shots and if he misses he gets taken out while other guys can miss 14 shots without penalty is ridiculous.

Frank's problem isn't missing the 2 shots. It's that he does nothing else. Doesn't rebound, doesn't create for teammates, doesn't slash to the hoop. He'a just there if he misses his first few shots.

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As a Frank fan, agree, which is why he becomes unplayable. G League won’t fix that IMO, there’s just a fundamental difference in what Fiz wants out of his PGs and what Frank can offer. This Frank “thing” won’t end well and it started w him publicizing getting caught off guard by a benching. It’s only a matter of time bc it looks like Dotson has already caught onto Fiz’ BS, more players will as well.

[Knicksfan1992]

I don't see you actually suggesting a plan to help develop him you just giving your opinion on him as a player which is a take for most people who don't care for him. I don't see how it does him any good to ride on the bench (especially for replacement level players that are on contract years). However playing time is the most important right now, so if that means he actually gets legit playing time down in the G-league so be it.

This take 2 shots and if he misses he gets taken out while other guys can miss 14 shots without penalty is ridiculous.

Frank's problem isn't missing the 2 shots. It's that he does nothing else. Doesn't rebound, doesn't create for teammates, doesn't slash to the hoop. He'a just there if he misses his first few shots.

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As a Frank fan, agree, which is why he becomes unplayable. G League won’t fix that IMO, there’s just a fundamental difference in what Fiz wants out of his PGs and what Frank can offer. This Frank “thing” won’t end well and it started w him publicizing getting caught off guard by a benching. It’s only a matter of time bc it looks like Dotson has already caught onto Fiz’ BS, more players will as well.

I dont understand how you can say Fiz wants something that is fundamentally different than what Frank is when the guy coached Mike Conley for multiple years and has nothing but praise for him. Hes like the most quintessential pg of this generation if we're being honest. This is where the Frank footers sometimes lose me. Yeah I get Fiz hasnt handled Frank's minutes great but acting like all this guy wants or expects is Iso ball from his pg just isn't backed up by anything besides posters personal biases here.

[prophet_of_rage]

Frank's problem isn't missing the 2 shots. It's that he does nothing else. Doesn't rebound, doesn't create for teammates, doesn't slash to the hoop. He'a just there if he misses his first few shots.

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As a Frank fan, agree, which is why he becomes unplayable. G League won’t fix that IMO, there’s just a fundamental difference in what Fiz wants out of his PGs and what Frank can offer. This Frank “thing” won’t end well and it started w him publicizing getting caught off guard by a benching. It’s only a matter of time bc it looks like Dotson has already caught onto Fiz’ BS, more players will as well.

I dont understand how you can say Fiz wants something that is fundamentally different than what Frank is when the guy coached Mike Conley for multiple years and has nothing but praise for him. Hes like the most quintessential pg of this generation if we're being honest. This is where the Frank footers sometimes lose me. Yeah I get Fiz hasnt handled Frank's minutes great but acting like all this guy wants or expects is Iso ball from his pg just isn't backed up by anything besides posters personal biases here.

Fiz wants talent and aggression. Frank only kinda brings one aspect.

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[mpharris36]

This downplays it a little bit too much for my liking... It isn't just shooting. There's a lot more issues than just that... I think the lack of shooting sticks out more because we all hoped that if he gained anything offensively it would be a more consistent jumper based on his form and limitations elsewhere offensively and it's just been bad... Basically if Frank can't shoot even at a slightly below average clip he's barely a replacement player IMO.

I don't see you actually suggesting a plan to help develop him you just giving your opinion on him as a player which is a take for most people who don't care for him. I don't see how it does him any good to ride on the bench (especially for replacement level players that are on contract years). However playing time is the most important right now, so if that means he actually gets legit playing time down in the G-league so be it.

This take 2 shots and if he misses he gets taken out while other guys can miss 14 shots without penalty is ridiculous.

Frank's problem isn't missing the 2 shots. It's that he does nothing else. Doesn't rebound, doesn't create for teammates, doesn't slash to the hoop. He'a just there if he misses his first few shots.

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ill disagree, I think that is more an issue with Fiz's offense where if you aren't making shots you aren't helping because we play a very ISO centric offense. Take the ATL game for example. He was a -1 with 4 assists in 14 minutes. So while he was in the team was getting killed and even though he clanked 2 shots he still found a way to have the 2nd most assists 8th most minutes in the game. Say he played 25-28 minutes lets say he ended up scoring a few pts but having 7-8 assitss...that is still contributing and playing the good defense (even though he is not at the level he was earlier in the year) he still miles above any other point guard on the roster. So exactly what is the downside again...im trying to find ways to create a better environment for him and make him more confident. Whats going on now isn't conducive to his success.

[Bklyn&company]

Knicks are dummies.. Send the kid to the GLeague... they had no problem sending Dotson, Kornet and Baker down there to develop last year... who give a fck where he was drafted. That's what a GL team is for....

Dumb azz Knicks... SMH

it was a dumb phil and gaines pick Fuz knows it
stop being homer he sucks

LOL... Kid..you sure is a newbie... if you have seen any of my post in the past you would know I'm a DSJ fan and was highly upset about the pick(wanted a now ready player). I'm a Knick fan first, not a player fan.... so with common sense I would want anyone on my Knick teams to do well and be the best they could be. Whether it's to keep them or trade them. The reality for you fckboy109 is that you should want any and all Knick players to play at max potential because they are a asset. An asset you can move or develop.

We all can't be fckboy109's like yourself... so choose the latter; and that's to share intelligent and practical ways in our post on how our players can improve.

We leave the fckboing and sucking to Ohboy's like yourself. Enjoy

[mpharris36]

Knicks are dummies.. Send the kid to the GLeague... they had no problem sending Dotson, Kornet and Baker down there to develop last year... who give a fck where he was drafted. That's what a GL team is for....

Dumb azz Knicks... SMH

What happens when he sh*ts the bed in the gleague? Has Frank ever dominated a summer league game?

how will you know if you don't find out...playing zero minutes isn't helping.

[Bklyn&company]

Knicks are dummies.. Send the kid to the GLeague... they had no problem sending Dotson, Kornet and Baker down there to develop last year... who give a fck where he was drafted. That's what a GL team is for....

Dumb azz Knicks... SMH

What happens when he sh*ts the bed in the gleague? Has Frank ever dominated a summer league game?

So you want him to ride the pine and not play? It's about development he doesn't need to dominate a GL game to be productive... Baker didn't do chit in GL... but you all was praising Brady Brunch.... but I know why... LOL

Seriously though... I'm not even a Frank fan and believe the Kid is not a full time NBA point... but it makes no sense for an asset to sit and not work on his value (his game) against multiple competitors.

[whocares1]

Knicks are dummies.. Send the kid to the GLeague... they had no problem sending Dotson, Kornet and Baker down there to develop last year... who give a fck where he was drafted. That's what a GL team is for....

Dumb azz Knicks... SMH

What happens when he sh*ts the bed in the gleague? Has Frank ever dominated a summer league game?

how will you know if you don't find out...playing zero minutes isn't helping.

Nothing is helping. Playing him a lot of minutes, playing him a little bit of minutes, not playing him at all. Nothing is working and it’s not because of Fiz. Alan Hahn said it on the radio today. Dude lacks confidence out there as soon as he misses a couple shots in a row. Even if Burke and Timmy are struggling a team still has to guard them. When Frank isn’t shooting he’s predictable and that affects his teammates.

The micro-analysis of why Frank is struggling isn’t worth it. He’s simply not ready and Fiz is neither helping nor hurting Frank’s development. Until he plays with an edge he’s not going to get consistent minutes.

[prophet_of_rage]

I don't see you actually suggesting a plan to help develop him you just giving your opinion on him as a player which is a take for most people who don't care for him. I don't see how it does him any good to ride on the bench (especially for replacement level players that are on contract years). However playing time is the most important right now, so if that means he actually gets legit playing time down in the G-league so be it.

This take 2 shots and if he misses he gets taken out while other guys can miss 14 shots without penalty is ridiculous.

Frank's problem isn't missing the 2 shots. It's that he does nothing else. Doesn't rebound, doesn't create for teammates, doesn't slash to the hoop. He'a just there if he misses his first few shots.

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ill disagree, I think that is more an issue with Fiz's offense where if you aren't making shots you aren't helping because we play a very ISO centric offense. Take the ATL game for example. He was a -1 with 4 assists in 14 minutes. So while he was in the team was getting killed and even though he clanked 2 shots he still found a way to have the 2nd most assists 8th most minutes in the game. Say he played 25-28 minutes lets say he ended up scoring a few pts but having 7-8 assitss...that is still contributing and playing the good defense (even though he is not at the level he was earlier in the year) he still miles above any other point guard on the roster. So exactly what is the downside again...im trying to find ways to create a better environment for him and make him more confident. Whats going on now isn't conducive to his success.

You said he played 24-28 minutes and created 7-8 assists. That playmaking earned him 24 minutes.

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[whocares1]

Knicks are dummies.. Send the kid to the GLeague... they had no problem sending Dotson, Kornet and Baker down there to develop last year... who give a fck where he was drafted. That's what a GL team is for....

Dumb azz Knicks... SMH

What happens when he sh*ts the bed in the gleague? Has Frank ever dominated a summer league game?

So you want him to ride the pine and not play? It's about development he doesn't need to dominate a GL game to be productive... Baker didn't do chit in GL... but you all was praising Brady Brunch.... but I know why... LOL

Frank should realistically get 20 minutes a game and that would fluctuate if he was playing well. Do I disagree with what Fiz is doing? Sure. Is Frank the level player worth crying about if he doesn’t play? No.

[Fat Kat]

Knicks are dummies.. Send the kid to the GLeague... they had no problem sending Dotson, Kornet and Baker down there to develop last year... who give a fck where he was drafted. That's what a GL team is for....

Dumb azz Knicks... SMH

What happens when he sh*ts the bed in the gleague? Has Frank ever dominated a summer league game?

So you want him to ride the pine and not play? It's about development he doesn't need to dominate a GL game to be productive... Baker didn't do chit in GL... but you all was praising Brady Brunch.... but I know why... LOL

Why? Think you barking up the tree, but we can talk.

[Fat Kat]

Knicks are dummies.. Send the kid to the GLeague... they had no problem sending Dotson, Kornet and Baker down there to develop last year... who give a fck where he was drafted. That's what a GL team is for....

Dumb azz Knicks... SMH

What happens when he sh*ts the bed in the gleague? Has Frank ever dominated a summer league game?

how will you know if you don't find out...playing zero minutes isn't helping.

Nothing's helping. He’s been bad on both ends of the ball. Perhaps he simply sucks.

[prophet_of_rage]

Frank's problem isn't missing the 2 shots. It's that he does nothing else. Doesn't rebound, doesn't create for teammates, doesn't slash to the hoop. He'a just there if he misses his first few shots.

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ill disagree, I think that is more an issue with Fiz's offense where if you aren't making shots you aren't helping because we play a very ISO centric offense. Take the ATL game for example. He was a -1 with 4 assists in 14 minutes. So while he was in the team was getting killed and even though he clanked 2 shots he still found a way to have the 2nd most assists 8th most minutes in the game. Say he played 25-28 minutes lets say he ended up scoring a few pts but having 7-8 assitss...that is still contributing and playing the good defense (even though he is not at the level he was earlier in the year) he still miles above any other point guard on the roster. So exactly what is the downside again...im trying to find ways to create a better environment for him and make him more confident. Whats going on now isn't conducive to his success.

You said he played 24-28 minutes and created 7-8 assists. That playmaking earned him 24 minutes.

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Oh sorry you were hypothesizing. So you already know someone was brought in to do more.

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