Julius Randle IS a 'cornerstone' player

[Oscirus]

Go look at the BKN game thread and PG thread. If you ever wanted to see how ridiculously impatient this base is, that's it in a nutshell.

There's also massive impatience to wait for things to materialize through smart decision making.

Downplaying draft position, asset acquisition and youth development has been proven wrong time and again, yet it's always going to come up b/c ppl don't have the patience for the long term view. They want progress now.

For once we have kids pushing this forward, so both sides get something from our current position. Yet neither side is happy

What kids are pushing this forward? RJ's on the verge if hes not already out of the closing line up and iq is a few bad shooting games from falling out of the rotation. Everybody else getting significant burn are vets.

What are you talking about? RJ is 6th in the NBA in minutes; Julius leads the entire league in playing time; Mitch was 3rd on our team in mpg before getting hurt; IQ has seen his role continue to increase as the season goes along & he grows more consistent; while Obi is getting regular minutes...even if ideally he would get ~4 minutes more a game.

Their mpg are the least of my worries and how has iqs role increased when even he likened his new back court to a case of whoever gets it gets it?

[nedleeds]

Yup.. and further more most of these guys didn’t win with only the team that drafted them..they switch situations at some point. If the Knicks start committing to building solid teams that can lead to attracting on of these mythical creatures to lead us to the promise land

LeBron
Kawhi
Curry
Dirk

all won titles with the teams that drafted them. That's actually everyone on the list except Durant. Who made the Finals at least. We need to draft and develop a difference maker instead of trying the free agents will like us limp dick plan. It seems like we'll never get a number 1 pick, or have a team pass on Durant and pick Oden ahead of us but it's the best route to real finals level contention.

*Edit: Yes technically the Bucks picked Dirk and he was traded on draft night for Tractor Trailor.

*Edit 2: I just learned Tractor Traylor is dead. RIP.

Lebron had to leave Cleveland and win his first two with the heat before deciding he had unfinished business and went back. Kawhi won one with a loaded spurs team and he wasn’t even really the man yet until later on but they didn’t win another title with him as the lead guy and he decided he wanted out.. Curry and Dirk are the only ones that really stand out and true winners with their drafted team

OK that's fair but a bunch of histrionics required to make it stick. LeBron made a finals in his first stint with a trash roster similar to ours. Kawhi also made another finals with the Spurs and was a Ray Allen miracle away from destroying the narrative here. Anyway, my point is drafting finals level talent is a better path than the failed free agent crap intermingled with fake winning we've been trying for 20 years.

[KnixtapeH20]

We're 14-16 in a garbage conference with Julius in rarified air. Randle is shooting 40% from 3, vs. 28% last year (and 22%, 27%, 34% and 28% in his other years). Maybe this is permanent change in his outside shooting or it's small sample size. He's mostly in rarified air because we start the worst point guard in organized basketball and Randle runs our offense (that is currently 108.2 (24th of 30)).

So rah rah we're 14-16 in the East. All his numbers have created a bottom 6 offense in the league. If the league thinks he's "LeBron Lite" and some of the bonkers stuff in this thread then he'd net a massive haul because LeBron is a top 3 player in the league.

Bro I'm not sure why u keep bringing up record when Elfrid Payton is our pg. the worst starting point that wouldn't rven be most teams backup pg.. . . How many of our starting players would start for the other 29 teams in the league?

I'm not sure the point u just argued... ? That its crazy to call Randle LeBron lite in this stretch of games hes showing?

How many games do you think LeBron is winning on our team? Please dont even mention Cleveland because they had a much more talented roster. We have journey men and backups -- as starters on 1 year contracts.

LeBron swapped for Randle and we'd be a top 3 seed easily. LeBron, IQ, Bullock, RJ and Mitch. You and me on the bench is a top 3 seed. That's how good LeBron is and how immensely far away from him Randle is ... the LeBron lite stuff in this thread is what I was responding to. It's like saying a candle is Sun lite.

Because we're below .500 in a historically awful conference. Losing to bad teams without 3 starters. Floating one of the worst 6 offenses on Earth. All while having the best covid luck in the league.

We don't even have 3 starters.

Mitch is a monster on defense but adds no offensive game bc we refuse to run p&r's for some strange reason even w.o elf...

RJ is still finding himself.


Is LeBron going to make Payton shoot better? You list IQ in your lineup like he gets consistent burn. Bullock is just starting to shoot better but went on a horrid stretch where everyone on here wanted him gone asap.

LeBron does not make this team top 3 no matter how much more talented he is than Randle... you're buggin... Elfrid Payton is the starting point.

[nedleeds]

Bro I'm not sure why u keep bringing up record when Elfrid Payton is our pg. the worst starting point that wouldn't rven be most teams backup pg.. . . How many of our starting players would start for the other 29 teams in the league?

I'm not sure the point u just argued... ? That its crazy to call Randle LeBron lite in this stretch of games hes showing?

How many games do you think LeBron is winning on our team? Please dont even mention Cleveland because they had a much more talented roster. We have journey men and backups -- as starters on 1 year contracts.

LeBron swapped for Randle and we'd be a top 3 seed easily. LeBron, IQ, Bullock, RJ and Mitch. You and me on the bench is a top 3 seed. That's how good LeBron is and how immensely far away from him Randle is ... the LeBron lite stuff in this thread is what I was responding to. It's like saying a candle is Sun lite.

Because we're below .500 in a historically awful conference. Losing to bad teams without 3 starters. Floating one of the worst 6 offenses on Earth. All while having the best covid luck in the league.

We don't even have 3 starters.

Mitch is a monster on defense but adds no offensive game bc we refuse to run p&r's for some strange reason even w.o elf...

RJ is still finding himself.


Is LeBron going to make Payton shoot better? You list IQ in your lineup like he gets consistent burn. Bullock is just starting to shoot better but went on a horrid stretch where everyone on here wanted him gone asap.

LeBron does not make this team top 3 no matter how much more talented he is than Randle... you're buggin... Elfrid Payton is the starting point.

LeBron is the starting point guard and has been for 15+ league? Are we watching the same league? Elfrid Payton wouldn't play a minute if we had LeBron.

[NewKnicks]

My g u realize thats the second time in this same topic you just made up a statement that I aint even say anything close to?

I said we're a gritty defensive team like the 90s Knicks. Stop me when you have a problem with that statement.

i will stop you. Those 90's Knicks battled MJ and the Bulls year in and year out. Our D is not even close to those Knicks teams.

So we're not a gritty team?

Are we not a defensive minded team?
Are we not a top 2 defensive team in the entire league?

Why u gotta add statements that I never said? Where did I said this was the 90s Knicks?

I said "We're a gritty defensive team like the 90s Knicks"


Where in that statement did I say anything not factual?

Ok.. I apologize if I took your statements the wrong way. I guess I get a little tired reading posts on here comparing our team or our players to other great franchises or great past players.

I took it a little too far with responses to your posts.

[dakomish23]

Only thing the kids are pushing is the theragun into their thighs on the **** bench. But I'd ask pushing what forward? We basically have the same trash record as the Bulls. We aren't .500 in a train wreck terrible East. AND we're doing this with NO lost games to COVID. So we have a bad record and have had the best covid luck in the league basically.

You guys are nuts if you don't see that RJB Mitch IQ have been the biggest contributors to this team this season outside of Randle. We're hovering around .500 instead of being putrid and it's in large part to the kids.

Progress. Did you expect them to go from basement to unbeatable in one season?

Rj went from at one point averaging the most minutes in the league to not even finishing games anymore. Iqs minutes have been wildly inconsistent and teams are starting to figure him out. Mitch has been the same but with less offense. They've all legit regressed over the course of a half-season.

In other words, the development of our youngsters has been a huge fail partially due to this win at all costs narrative that thibs employs. Hell, thibs can't even be asked to develop the rookie that he wanted.

RJB has not finished games TWICE. Not 5 times in a row. 2x the entire season. He's had how many good performances for us?

It's not even one week since IQ showed out against HOU.

Mitch has been the anchor of our defense and has been great on that end except for a few games. He's not a focal point in the offense.

I'm not talking about development. We all know they would never be the #1 priority by this franchise. I'm talking about their output and it's correlation to the WL column. That's it.

[iLLmatic860]

Hear me out guys


What if Juluis Randle is our version of Clippers Tobias Harris

Whos a team that want to make a playoff push in the west that could give us assets for Randle?

Warriors and Blazers come to mind

Randle, knox, frank mitch
For Wiseman and 1st rd picks

Or

Blazers offer us a package of picks and Trent Jr

Bong. Nowwww its summer time

We sign Kawahi and trade for a guy who he pushed to come to LA Beal. Then we save enough assets for a 3rd star. Idk who

[Isiahthomass]

Too bad Kenny Payne can't get coach of the year but Thibs may deserve it as well for Randle's turn around this year.

[cgf]

You guys are nuts if you don't see that RJB Mitch IQ have been the biggest contributors to this team this season outside of Randle. We're hovering around .500 instead of being putrid and it's in large part to the kids.

Progress. Did you expect them to go from basement to unbeatable in one season?

Rj went from at one point averaging the most minutes in the league to not even finishing games anymore. Iqs minutes have been wildly inconsistent and teams are starting to figure him out. Mitch has been the same but with less offense. They've all legit regressed over the course of a half-season.

In other words, the development of our youngsters has been a huge fail partially due to this win at all costs narrative that thibs employs. Hell, thibs can't even be asked to develop the rookie that he wanted.

RJB has not finished games TWICE. Not 5 times in a row. 2x the entire season. He's had how many good performances for us?

It's not even one week since IQ showed out against HOU.

Mitch has been the anchor of our defense and has been great on that end except for a few games. He's not a focal point in the offense.

I'm not talking about development. We all know they would never be the #1 priority by this franchise. I'm talking about their output and it's correlation to the WL column. That's it.

It's like people don't want to see development unless a player goes from tank-commander to MVP overnight.

[cgf]

Hear me out guys


What if Juluis Randle is our version of Clippers Tobias Harris

Whos a team that want to make a playoff push in the west that could give us assets for Randle?

Warriors and Blazers come to mind

Randle, knox, frank mitch
For Wiseman and 1st rd picks

Or

Blazers offer us a package of picks and Trent Jr

Bong. Nowwww its summer time

We sign Kawahi and trade for a guy who he pushed to come to LA Beal. Then we save enough assets for a 3rd star. Idk who

Kawhi isn't leaving the clippers.

[Gravy]

The last time we got our best player another great player to help him while they were both in their primes was the 70s. Ewing and Melo had no stars next to them, then we blamed them for not being MJ and Lebron. Great players need help, get Randle some help.

[nedleeds]

The last time we got our best player another great player to help him while they were both in their primes was the 70s. Ewing and Melo had no stars next to them, then we blamed them for not being MJ and Lebron. Great players need help, get Randle some help.

Wow. Randle is Ewing level now. Even the Melo comp makes me throw up a little. Dudes never sniffed an all NBA team.

[Meat]

The last time we got our best player another great player to help him while they were both in their primes was the 70s. Ewing and Melo had no stars next to them, then we blamed them for not being MJ and Lebron. Great players need help, get Randle some help.

Wow. Randle is Ewing level now. Even the Melo comp makes me throw up a little. Dudes never sniffed an all NBA team.

all nba?? he aint even sniffed the playoffs

[Gravy]

The last time we got our best player another great player to help him while they were both in their primes was the 70s. Ewing and Melo had no stars next to them, then we blamed them for not being MJ and Lebron. Great players need help, get Randle some help.

Wow. Randle is Ewing level now. Even the Melo comp makes me throw up a little. Dudes never sniffed an all NBA team.

He still needs another good player with him on offense. The next best player is RJ who cant throw the ball in the ocean most nights. We usually win when at least 1 other person besides Randle steps up.

[KnixtapeH20]

LeBron swapped for Randle and we'd be a top 3 seed easily. LeBron, IQ, Bullock, RJ and Mitch. You and me on the bench is a top 3 seed. That's how good LeBron is and how immensely far away from him Randle is ... the LeBron lite stuff in this thread is what I was responding to. It's like saying a candle is Sun lite.

Because we're below .500 in a historically awful conference. Losing to bad teams without 3 starters. Floating one of the worst 6 offenses on Earth. All while having the best covid luck in the league.

We don't even have 3 starters.

Mitch is a monster on defense but adds no offensive game bc we refuse to run p&r's for some strange reason even w.o elf...

RJ is still finding himself.


Is LeBron going to make Payton shoot better? You list IQ in your lineup like he gets consistent burn. Bullock is just starting to shoot better but went on a horrid stretch where everyone on here wanted him gone asap.

LeBron does not make this team top 3 no matter how much more talented he is than Randle... you're buggin... Elfrid Payton is the starting point.

LeBron is the starting point guard and has been for 15+ league? Are we watching the same league? Elfrid Payton wouldn't play a minute if we had LeBron.

Thibs is not starting Quickley even if LeBron is on the team unless LeBron maybe advocates for it. Even still our shooting is still some of the worst in the league with Bullock, Burks, RJ, Rivers, Toppin, Knox... Thinking about it now u said we'd be a top 3 team in the east that's probably true but we're 6th right now, we're not far off... And thats largely due to Julius Randle.

[KnixtapeH20]

i will stop you. Those 90's Knicks battled MJ and the Bulls year in and year out. Our D is not even close to those Knicks teams.

So we're not a gritty team?

Are we not a defensive minded team?
Are we not a top 2 defensive team in the entire league?

Why u gotta add statements that I never said? Where did I said this was the 90s Knicks?

I said "We're a gritty defensive team like the 90s Knicks"


Where in that statement did I say anything not factual?

Ok.. I apologize if I took your statements the wrong way. I guess I get a little tired reading posts on here comparing our team or our players to other great franchises or great past players.

I took it a little too far with responses to your posts.

Haha all good fam, we all knicks fans here, some ppl lose sight of that

[GONYK]

Rj went from at one point averaging the most minutes in the league to not even finishing games anymore. Iqs minutes have been wildly inconsistent and teams are starting to figure him out. Mitch has been the same but with less offense. They've all legit regressed over the course of a half-season.

In other words, the development of our youngsters has been a huge fail partially due to this win at all costs narrative that thibs employs. Hell, thibs can't even be asked to develop the rookie that he wanted.

RJB has not finished games TWICE. Not 5 times in a row. 2x the entire season. He's had how many good performances for us?

It's not even one week since IQ showed out against HOU.

Mitch has been the anchor of our defense and has been great on that end except for a few games. He's not a focal point in the offense.

I'm not talking about development. We all know they would never be the #1 priority by this franchise. I'm talking about their output and it's correlation to the WL column. That's it.

It's like people don't want to see development unless a player goes from tank-commander to MVP overnight.

That's literally what is happening with Randle

(not saying Randle will win MVP)

[NewKnicks]

So we're not a gritty team?

Are we not a defensive minded team?
Are we not a top 2 defensive team in the entire league?

Why u gotta add statements that I never said? Where did I said this was the 90s Knicks?

I said "We're a gritty defensive team like the 90s Knicks"


Where in that statement did I say anything not factual?

Ok.. I apologize if I took your statements the wrong way. I guess I get a little tired reading posts on here comparing our team or our players to other great franchises or great past players.

I took it a little too far with responses to your posts.

Haha all good fam, we all knicks fans here, some ppl lose sight of that

So true. And we argue with each other while wanting the same result. But, I think that makes for a good forum. There's a bunch of guys in here that are really knowledgeable about basketball and I appreciate their posts. Also, it's good to have extremely different views. Makes for great entertainment.

[nedleeds]

We don't even have 3 starters.

Mitch is a monster on defense but adds no offensive game bc we refuse to run p&r's for some strange reason even w.o elf...

RJ is still finding himself.


Is LeBron going to make Payton shoot better? You list IQ in your lineup like he gets consistent burn. Bullock is just starting to shoot better but went on a horrid stretch where everyone on here wanted him gone asap.

LeBron does not make this team top 3 no matter how much more talented he is than Randle... you're buggin... Elfrid Payton is the starting point.

LeBron is the starting point guard and has been for 15+ league? Are we watching the same league? Elfrid Payton wouldn't play a minute if we had LeBron.

Thibs is not starting Quickley even if LeBron is on the team unless LeBron maybe advocates for it. Even still our shooting is still some of the worst in the league with Bullock, Burks, RJ, Rivers, Toppin, Knox... Thinking about it now u said we'd be a top 3 team in the east that's probably true but we're 6th right now, we're not far off... And thats largely due to Julius Randle.

We're the same amount of games from last man. I don't know what to tell you. I guess we just disagree on his value here making us sub .500 vs. just trading him while he's playing his best basketball. I get where you're coming from though, even seeing barely .500 ball is nice some nights.

[Oscirus]

You guys are nuts if you don't see that RJB Mitch IQ have been the biggest contributors to this team this season outside of Randle. We're hovering around .500 instead of being putrid and it's in large part to the kids.

Progress. Did you expect them to go from basement to unbeatable in one season?

Rj went from at one point averaging the most minutes in the league to not even finishing games anymore. Iqs minutes have been wildly inconsistent and teams are starting to figure him out. Mitch has been the same but with less offense. They've all legit regressed over the course of a half-season.

In other words, the development of our youngsters has been a huge fail partially due to this win at all costs narrative that thibs employs. Hell, thibs can't even be asked to develop the rookie that he wanted.

RJB has not finished games TWICE. Not 5 times in a row. 2x the entire season. He's had how many good performances for us?

It's not even one week since IQ showed out against HOU.

Mitch has been the anchor of our defense and has been great on that end except for a few games. He's not a focal point in the offense.

I'm not talking about development. We all know they would never be the #1 priority by this franchise. I'm talking about their output and it's correlation to the WL column. That's it.

That's cute, act like games like last night aren't happening where technically rj's in the game at the end but clearly not in the closing lineup and act like Robinsons scoring hadn't gone down and that iq hasn't been forcing it even more lately. I'm sure we can ignore those and just chalk these developmental problems up to cherry picking