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PG: Deuce McBrunson School Curry's Kids

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Re: PG: Deuce McBrunson School Curry's Kids 

Post#281 » by mpharris36 » Tue Mar 19, 2024 5:17 pm

Capn'O wrote:
Knicksfan1992 wrote:The people who complain about minutes load have probably never played a sport above high school level before. These guys practice, work out, travel. and recover WAY more than they actually play in the games. And it's been reported that Thibs has really cut back on practice time this season because of all of the injuries they've suffered. All of those factors probably play more into injuries than the games themselves do but we as fans and media don't have access to those types of things so they become an "out of sight out of mind" variable that doesn't help fit certain narratives...

While I understand NBA game speed is more intense than anything these guys do in training/practice, 10 extra minutes a game for a month isn't going to determine if someone is going to get hurt or break down or whatever you want to call it. Especially, if the injury isn't a soft tissue leg injury. Those are really the only kinds of injuries that are tied to overuse or poor preparation.

These guys are abnormally large human beings being tasked with playing in an extremely confined space and making explosive movements repetitively over the course of what has now become a 365 day a year job with all the outside training that goes into this. Injuries are going to happen and especially the ones the Knicks have don't seem to have correlation with overuse of the legs which is what most people's complaints about Thibs minute distribution would lead to. Maybe Hartenstein's? That's about it though.


Beyond this though, Thibs is a maniac. He keeps playing guys when they're obviously hurting or beyond gassed and it's just wild to me. I was at the Portland game - I've never seen a guy in such consistently obvious pain as OG remain in the game outside of do or die playoff situations.


basically this.

its a medical staff thing but thibs is a part of that. Because his tenure in NY isn't the first time this has happened. He played Derrick Rose and Loul Deng and Noah huge minutes and a lot of those guys had much shorter careers. Can everything be blamed on him...no absolutely not and he is a successful coach and people certainly compliment him on his relentless attention to detail and preparation especially in the regular season.

But like you said there is a reason sports scientists brought in load management and minutes restrictions because while you can't prevent every injury you can also be smart about certain things to not compound them.

He's got that "if he dies, he dies" mentality as long as we are wining.
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Re: PG: Deuce McBrunson School Curry's Kids 

Post#282 » by Capn'O » Tue Mar 19, 2024 5:24 pm

DOT wrote:Of course I would hire him (Spo).


I wonder why Leon Rose doesn't.
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Re: PG: Deuce McBrunson School Curry's Kids 

Post#283 » by stuporman » Tue Mar 19, 2024 5:25 pm

Screaming youtube video guy likes Thibs...does that mean nothing anymore?
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Re: PG: Deuce McBrunson School Curry's Kids 

Post#284 » by Capn'O » Tue Mar 19, 2024 5:27 pm

stuporman wrote:Screaming youtube video guy likes Thibs...does that mean nothing anymore?


Probably his illegitimate son.
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Re: PG: Deuce McBrunson School Curry's Kids 

Post#285 » by DOT » Tue Mar 19, 2024 5:28 pm

Capn'O wrote:
DOT wrote:Of course I would hire him (Spo).


I wonder why Leon Rose doesn't.

I thought we were going off a hypothetical wherein Spo was available and wanted to come here

I didn't think we were just doing a gotcha, but I guess that's the case

Oh well you got me, I'm a big dumb moron for not considering that. Guess that makes me wrong about everything, Thibs is a top 5 coach, Brunson is a top 5 player, and the rest of the team is great until we lose and then they all sucked all along and Thibs was single-handedly dragging them to relevance :lol:
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Re: PG: Deuce McBrunson School Curry's Kids 

Post#286 » by thebuzzardman » Tue Mar 19, 2024 5:29 pm

Don't be cowards everyone. Answer my question regarding who is the true architect of this Knick team. Put your answer down for posterity.
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Re: PG: Deuce McBrunson School Curry's Kids 

Post#287 » by stuporman » Tue Mar 19, 2024 5:29 pm

Capn'O wrote:
stuporman wrote:Screaming youtube video guy likes Thibs...does that mean nothing anymore?


Probably his illegitimate son.


He's legit his illegitimate son... :lol:
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Re: PG: Deuce McBrunson School Curry's Kids 

Post#288 » by Knick4Real » Tue Mar 19, 2024 5:30 pm

seren wrote:Deuce was amazing last night. Hope his minutes are not cut dramatically once we have a healthy roster.


Deuce is everything we wanted Quickley and Grimes to be -- all in one!
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Re: PG: Deuce McBrunson School Curry's Kids 

Post#289 » by stuporman » Tue Mar 19, 2024 5:32 pm

thebuzzardman wrote:Don't be cowards everyone. Answer my question regarding who is the true architect of this Knick team. Put your answer down for posterity.

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Re: PG: Deuce McBrunson School Curry's Kids 

Post#290 » by Meat » Tue Mar 19, 2024 5:36 pm

thebuzzardman wrote:Don't be cowards everyone. Answer my question regarding who is the true architect of this Knick team. Put your answer down for posterity.


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Re: PG: Deuce McBrunson School Curry's Kids 

Post#291 » by mpharris36 » Tue Mar 19, 2024 5:40 pm

thebuzzardman wrote:Don't be cowards everyone. Answer my question regarding who is the true architect of this Knick team. Put your answer down for posterity.


Jalen Brunson becoming a top 10 player in the NBA is why we are where we are...all the other stuff is nice and good but you need an elite player to win in the NBA...and we now have one.

Now having that player doesn't guarantee anything....Leon/WWW/Thibs culture has helped along with us identifying good tough hard working role players.

Like I said before we basically have built the modern day AI sixers model. With Brunson being a more EFF 3 level scorer then AI.
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Re: PG: Deuce McBrunson School Curry's Kids 

Post#292 » by Capn'O » Tue Mar 19, 2024 5:41 pm

DOT wrote:
Capn'O wrote:
DOT wrote:Of course I would hire him (Spo).


I wonder why Leon Rose doesn't.

I thought we were going off a hypothetical wherein Spo was available and wanted to come here

I didn't think we were just doing a gotcha, but I guess that's the case

Oh well you got me, I'm a big dumb moron for not considering that. Guess that makes me wrong about everything, Thibs is a top 5 coach, Brunson is a top 5 player, and the rest of the team is great until we lose and then they all sucked all along and Thibs was single-handedly dragging them to relevance :lol:


Indeed. Turns out you're not the only one who can play straw man.
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Re: PG: Deuce McBrunson School Curry's Kids 

Post#293 » by Capn'O » Tue Mar 19, 2024 5:43 pm

mpharris36 wrote:
thebuzzardman wrote:Don't be cowards everyone. Answer my question regarding who is the true architect of this Knick team. Put your answer down for posterity.


Jalen Brunson becoming a top 10 player in the NBA is why we are where we are...all the other stuff is nice and good but you need an elite player to win in the NBA...and we now have one.

Now having that player doesn't guarantee anything....Leon/WWW/Thibs culture has helped along with us identifying good tough hard working role players.

Like I said before we basically have built the modern day AI sixers model. With Brunson being a more EFF 3 level scorer then AI.


More like the Rose Bulls imo.
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SF: J Brown | Dorture Chamber
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Re: PG: Deuce McBrunson School Curry's Kids 

Post#294 » by DOT » Tue Mar 19, 2024 5:44 pm

mpharris36 wrote:
thebuzzardman wrote:Don't be cowards everyone. Answer my question regarding who is the true architect of this Knick team. Put your answer down for posterity.


Jalen Brunson becoming a top 10 player in the NBA is why we are where we are...all the other stuff is nice and good but you need an elite player to win in the NBA...and we now have one.

Now having that player doesn't guarantee anything....Leon/WWW/Thibs culture has helped along with us identifying good tough hard working role players.

Like I said before we basically have built the modern day AI sixers model. With Brunson being a more EFF 3 level scorer then AI.

Nah, it's all Thibs

Brunson is a bum, OG sucks, Randle sucks, everyone sucks. Any other coach in the league would have us looking like the Wizards.
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Re: PG: Deuce McBrunson School Curry's Kids 

Post#295 » by mpharris36 » Tue Mar 19, 2024 5:48 pm

Capn'O wrote:
mpharris36 wrote:
thebuzzardman wrote:Don't be cowards everyone. Answer my question regarding who is the true architect of this Knick team. Put your answer down for posterity.


Jalen Brunson becoming a top 10 player in the NBA is why we are where we are...all the other stuff is nice and good but you need an elite player to win in the NBA...and we now have one.

Now having that player doesn't guarantee anything....Leon/WWW/Thibs culture has helped along with us identifying good tough hard working role players.

Like I said before we basically have built the modern day AI sixers model. With Brunson being a more EFF 3 level scorer then AI.


More like the Rose Bulls imo.


well yes but the Bulls were also modeled after the Sixers.

Those type of guys...eric snow, aaron mckie, theo ratliff...all are tough minded role playing dogs. Let AI do his thing and go to work. Obviously the bulls teams were a bit more talented (fully healthy) when Bulter started to emerge with Deng and Noah/Taj.
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Re: PG: Deuce McBrunson School Curry's Kids 

Post#296 » by Knicksfan1992 » Tue Mar 19, 2024 5:48 pm

mpharris36 wrote:
Capn'O wrote:
Knicksfan1992 wrote:The people who complain about minutes load have probably never played a sport above high school level before. These guys practice, work out, travel. and recover WAY more than they actually play in the games. And it's been reported that Thibs has really cut back on practice time this season because of all of the injuries they've suffered. All of those factors probably play more into injuries than the games themselves do but we as fans and media don't have access to those types of things so they become an "out of sight out of mind" variable that doesn't help fit certain narratives...

While I understand NBA game speed is more intense than anything these guys do in training/practice, 10 extra minutes a game for a month isn't going to determine if someone is going to get hurt or break down or whatever you want to call it. Especially, if the injury isn't a soft tissue leg injury. Those are really the only kinds of injuries that are tied to overuse or poor preparation.

These guys are abnormally large human beings being tasked with playing in an extremely confined space and making explosive movements repetitively over the course of what has now become a 365 day a year job with all the outside training that goes into this. Injuries are going to happen and especially the ones the Knicks have don't seem to have correlation with overuse of the legs which is what most people's complaints about Thibs minute distribution would lead to. Maybe Hartenstein's? That's about it though.


Beyond this though, Thibs is a maniac. He keeps playing guys when they're obviously hurting or beyond gassed and it's just wild to me. I was at the Portland game - I've never seen a guy in such consistently obvious pain as OG remain in the game outside of do or die playoff situations.


basically this.

its a medical staff thing but thibs is a part of that. Because his tenure in NY isn't the first time this has happened. He played Derrick Rose and Loul Deng and Noah huge minutes and a lot of those guys had much shorter careers. Can everything be blamed on him...no absolutely not and he is a successful coach and people certainly compliment him on his relentless attention to detail and preparation especially in the regular season.

But like you said there is a reason sports scientists brought in load management and minutes restrictions because while you can't prevent every injury you can also be smart about certain things to not compound them.

He's got that "if he dies, he dies" mentality as long as we are wining.


Rose was on a one way track to getting injured regardless of who is coach was IMO. The way he moved so violently had no long term viability and that was pre-modern sports science emphasis where they could have taught him how to land better, move more efficiently, etc. Most of those uber athletic point guards from that era have had pretty short lived peaks or have struggled with injuries. John Wall, Eric Bledsoe, Gilbert Arenas, Steve Francis, Baron Davis, Ja Morant and countless other examples.

I'd argue Luol Deng and Noah had pretty standard length careers with normal peaks and fall off. Maybe a tad bit early but both basically found their way out of the league at around 34 years old which is pretty standard for non top 10 star level talents. Noah may have been a bit earlier than he should have been I can give you that one because once he hit 30 he basically couldn't start anymore.

Also Taj and Jimmy sort of debunk that narrative as well.
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Re: PG: Deuce McBrunson School Curry's Kids 

Post#297 » by aggo » Tue Mar 19, 2024 5:53 pm

thebuzzardman wrote:Since Thibs is a mediocre loser who elevates nothing and his ability to f*ck up as a front office executive is well documented from his time in Minnesota, and Leon Rose is a pastrami eating clown who leaves basketball decisions to others, who is the architect of of the current Knick team, whose vision are we seeing in system\player acquisition?

Because the Knicks certainly have "types" when it comes to role players.

I get that because Brunson is so good, he's elevating the role players, and Brunson has ties to both Leon and Thibs, and it's possible that him being on the team and making it so good is a combination of scouting, type, and possibly luck revolving around CAA ties etc.

But deciding to add the Villanova cats, with their tenacity and commitment to winning above stats etc, adding a tough passing center in iHart who is an excellent fit with them, dealing out real young talent in RJ and IQ for a perfectly fitting piece in OG, keeping McBride over Grimes, the theoretical benefit of Bogs being added, all this is someone's vision.

Aller is supposed to the capologist, the money guy, the valuation guy. That's in support of the vision.

Perrin is supposed to be the college scouting guru. Is he providing input on the pro level? Is he the main driver of which players are acquired?

Zanin, occasionally maligned on here, is pro player scouting. Is this his work?

Is it Rosas? We know he advocated for iHart. Strong pimp hand for a consultant if this is all him.

Is it Thibs, with the main vision, as the executives in the front office dance for this puppet master?
Excellent work for Mr Mediocrity, so called.

Or is it all the result of a committee? Seems unlikely based on anyone's experience working on committees


STATE YOUR CASE. SOMEONE IS RESPONSIBLE FOR THIS.


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Re: PG: Deuce McBrunson School Curry's Kids 

Post#298 » by Knick4Real » Tue Mar 19, 2024 5:53 pm

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- Thibs is not going anywhere. Get used to it!
- Leon is not going anywhere. Get used to it!
- KNICKS will not be trading for Spida. Believe it or not.

EXTRA: Not drafting Haliburton was a blessing in disguise. If we had drafted him, we probably wouldn't have gone after Jalen. 8-)
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Re: PG: Deuce McBrunson School Curry's Kids 

Post#299 » by Capn'O » Tue Mar 19, 2024 5:56 pm

mpharris36 wrote:
Capn'O wrote:
mpharris36 wrote:
Jalen Brunson becoming a top 10 player in the NBA is why we are where we are...all the other stuff is nice and good but you need an elite player to win in the NBA...and we now have one.

Now having that player doesn't guarantee anything....Leon/WWW/Thibs culture has helped along with us identifying good tough hard working role players.

Like I said before we basically have built the modern day AI sixers model. With Brunson being a more EFF 3 level scorer then AI.


More like the Rose Bulls imo.


well yes but the Bulls were also modeled after the Sixers.

Those type of guys...eric snow, aaron mckie, theo ratliff...all are tough minded role playing dogs. Let AI do his thing and go to work. Obviously the bulls teams were a bit more talented (fully healthy) when Bulter started to emerge with Deng and Noah/Taj.


Fair enough. I just see more parallels with iHart/Noah, Boozer/Randle, OG/Butler, Precious/Taj. But yeah, the Sixers were a similar model with the Bad Boy Pistons before them.
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Re: PG: Deuce McBrunson School Curry's Kids 

Post#300 » by thebuzzardman » Tue Mar 19, 2024 5:57 pm

mpharris36 wrote:
thebuzzardman wrote:Don't be cowards everyone. Answer my question regarding who is the true architect of this Knick team. Put your answer down for posterity.


Jalen Brunson becoming a top 10 player in the NBA is why we are where we are...all the other stuff is nice and good but you need an elite player to win in the NBA...and we now have one.

Now having that player doesn't guarantee anything....Leon/WWW/Thibs culture has helped along with us identifying good tough hard working role players.

Like I said before we basically have built the modern day AI sixers model. With Brunson being a more EFF 3 level scorer then AI.

Lazy answer. Clearly star players make a team in the NBA. Yet it's also true that not just any collection of role players supports a star and also teams can lean into certain kinds of role players. Who on the Knicks is driving the roster construction and playing style\approach\vision?

It's interesting that it feels unclear.
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