KNICKS - Houston PG

[Gravy]

Ah, here's a thought exercise.

Are the Utah Jazz:

a)A Playoff team
b) On the Treadmill

According to some fans they have been a failure for the last 5 years because they only won 50 games. They should have got rid of Mitchell and Gobert and win 17 games until they draft the next Lebron

[Buttah304]

If we're trading for Beal, we're giving him the max, that's like 40% of the cap gone, Randle getting resigned takes us over 60% of the cap used on two non-top 10 players. There are a lot of paths to competing, but trading your assets for Beal, resigning Randle and then hoping on some unknown FA isn't the right way.

My problem is the rush to build these meh teams, in his lineup he still has Bullock, and Beal is playing the 3 Also, we're playing in a conference where the best teams are still fairly young, so you can't even wait them out.

I wouldn't trade for Beal for the exact reason what he costs now and what he'll cost in picks and even young assets, even though it's the picks that the Wiz will be after.

I MIGHT be interested in LaVine, in an "it depends" kind of way, but I'd say he costs too much in draft capital as well.

I know I've said this before, but feels like the Knicks are a year away from doing moves like this, where they have a good draft (assumption here) and then still have an extra pick (2023) and maybe use some combination from the group of Randle/Knox/RJ/Mitch/Obi to try and make that "upgrade" trade next year. I left out IQ and RJ as fan favorites, but basically I'm listing the players that might interest a team with a good player.

The rub is, Knicks no longer have 2 extra picks, but 1, and a "star" might cost 2, which might mean dealing one of their own. Unless they get another by this deadline and that doesn't feel likely with their roster.

LaVine is fine if he's signed in free agency, anything that requires assets is just foolish, like you pointed out, you have to keep draft capital to get the next star. You don't want a situation like the Bucks had, when Harden listed them as a team he'd play for but they already blew everything they had on getting Holiday.

We'd be building around non top 10 players, so we'd never have a shot at a title.

Truthfully I mostly agree with the overall context of what you are ultimately saying. And you are not wrong. Having said that, Miami is a perfect example (last season) of where you can have a Top 15 Player (Butler) and a Top 30 Player (Bam) and a boatload of depth/shooting and at least be good to enough to make a scary run in the playoffs. Especially if that group competes defensively and buys into the coaches philosophy.

I’m not advocating for Beal or LaVine. Even though I would like to acquire Zach if the price was not crippling to the franchise.

Just pointing out that I don’t believe you need a generational talent to win it all. You can be considered a dark horse contender if everything clicks and not just with the players. The coaching staff, the front office and more.

[Richard4444]

Completely disagree. The Knicks had the assets to build a good team around Melo (and they did, for a time), the issue is that they were too attached to Amar'e when he was clearly the problem.

The Knicks were good only when Amar'e was hurt and couldn't play.

Our payroll was too attached to Amare (who was untradable). We have no cap space and no high picks to get talent. We had to overpay to get Chandler. Our team was only Melo and Chandler versus everybody.

We episodically got some good players for cheap. But we could not hold them for long. Houston took Lin from us. The food took Felton from us. Father time took Kidd, Wallace and Davis.

The Knicks could've amnestied Amar'e instead of Billups.

The Knicks could've matched the offer for Lin.

We didn't overpay to get Chandler, we just paid a lot of money for a DPOY. That was a reasonable thing to do.

Shumpert and JR were decent contributors, at least for a time. They were rotation players on a championship team. JR, of course, quit on us.

Dolan forced the FO to trade a first round pick for Bargnani.

The Knicks had a trade for Lowry but Dolan vetoed it.

The Knicks had the flexibility to build a contender, just not enough to afford to make too many mistakes. They just made a lot of bad decisions. The first mistake was amnestying Billups instead of Amar'e. That's the original sin that torpedoed the Melo era. The Knicks were mediocre at best, bad at worst whenever Amar'e was playing. That's a fact. Dolan vetoing the Lowry trade just as he was entering his prime was the nail in the coffin.

1) Stat was not a lost cause by the time we amnestied Billups. Its unthinkable to give away 80M to save cap space waiving a star player if everybody thinks he can be recovered.

2) Tyson is a rim protector role player (Mitch style). We paid him 13M/y. Its like 22% of cap space back then. It would be 24M today.

3) It would be stupid to match Lin offer. Its was a big mistake made by Houston. Lin was good. But he was not a star to deserve that kind of salary.

4) JR was a wild card. Sometimes he was a great asset. Sometimes a bun.

5) Shumpert was never a really great prospect. Especially after his injury. Besides, he was signed after the Melo trade. And it's hard to find talent with 17th pick. We should not expect too much from a 17th pick. You got lucky getting a useful player like him.

6) We traded for Bargs because we were desperate for any talent. The roster was too unqualified to be a contender. We were desperate because we traded all our roster to get Melo (without cap space and with few picks).

7) Trading for Lowry would be epic. But it was a very unique opportunity that we did not take. We were in a bad spot and only a bad decision for another team could have saved us.

[Richard4444]

The Magic spent the last 5 years making bad trades and drafting busts at the top of the draft. Drafting high picks didn't save them. They are more proof that getting high picks wont automatically make you a great team.

Some Disappointing Top10 drafted players by unlucky tanking teams in last decade:

Magic (Gordon, Payton, Mario, Injured Isaac, Bamba) Exception: Oladipo
Kings (Fridette, Thomas Robinson, Ben Mclemore, Nik Stauskas, WCS, Bagley) Exception: Fox
Charlotte (Byombo, MKG, Zeller, Vonleh, Kaminsky) Exception: Kemba
Suns (Len, Bender, Marquese, Josh Jackson). Exception: Ayton and Mikal.
Sixers (Noel, Okafor and Fultz). Exception: Simmons and Embiid.
Cavs (Waiters, Benett, Wiggins). Exception: Irving, Tristan and Sexton. Maybe Garland.
Wolves (Derrick Williams, Dunn, Culver).
Utah (Kanter, Burke, Exum)
Detroit (Knight, Stanley Johnson) Exception: Drumond
Bucks (Jabari, Thon Maker)
Pelicans (Rivers, Hayes). Exception: Zion
Knicks (Frank, Knox) Exception: KP. Maybe RJ

A Top 10 pick does not guarantee talent. Only a few teams like Lakers (Randle, DLo, Ingram, Lonzo), Boston (Smart, Brown, Tatum), Portland (CJ, Lillard), Atlanta (Trae, Hunter and maybe Cam), Memphis (JJJ and Morant), Dallas (Doncic despite DSJr) and Wizards (Beal, maybe Rui, despite Vasey) had a positive retrospective in drafting Top 10 past decade.

We don't need to rush to make a team better. We can delay major trades and can wait for injured players to get 100% before use them. But making the team worse just to pick higher picks can be a bad move.

So having lottery picks are worthless because a lot of them end up as busts....got it. I'll go ahead and take my chances that we hit with a S.Curry or K.Durant or P.Pierce or Dirk or B.Simmons or Zion or Ja or Kyrie or J.Wall or AD or P.Ewing or T.Duncan or...................................................

I did not say that. I said we can't put all the eggs in lottery picks. It's a very risky strategy to tank all the time. Especially if we cant guarantee a Top5 draft pick (it's very tough with the current odds,).

We have to try to build a team and keep improving our roster. But I am against trading for a star or rushinf injured players recovery. We might guarantee a good pick (who knows a top4 if strike luck in the lottery). And at the same time, we can build a team, develop players, gain respectability, improve the value of our players, and attract FAs.

[K_ick_God]

Knicks fans having a rookie guard playing like Quick.

[TheGreenArrow]

Knicks fans having a rookie guard playing like Quick.

I’m absolutely in love Aoc!!!!!!!!!!!!

Absolutely in love!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[stuporman]

What's wrong with IQ's layup form? It looks like his floater but in an abbreviated way. Does he even finish underhanded? It's weird...just like the rest of his shots.

[DOT]

Knicks fans having a rookie guard playing like Quick.

I’m absolutely in love Aoc!!!!!!!!!!!!

Absolutely in love!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Calm down there Ben Shapiro

[TheGreenArrow]

Knicks fans having a rookie guard playing like Quick.

I’m absolutely in love Aoc!!!!!!!!!!!!

Absolutely in love!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Calm down there Ben Shapiro

[DOT]

I’m absolutely in love Aoc!!!!!!!!!!!!

Absolutely in love!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Calm down there Ben Shapiro

Watch on YouTube

[TheGreenArrow]

Calm down there Ben Shapiro

Watch on YouTube

Wtf did I just listen to!!!?!?!

[vallen]

Or you can get some luck and hit big on your picks and you can build through the draft and be successful like GSW, Phoenix, Utah, Denver, Boston, Philly and others have done or are doing. You add the vets when you already have a good young core that you've built through the draft like Phoenix did by adding CP3 and some of the others have done. GSW became a championship team by drafting Steph, Klay and Dray.

If the Knicks would of hit with SGA over Knox or D.Mitchell over Frank or if we got a higher pick in some past drafts then we'd be a good team built through the draft right now.

I never said to build through the draft only, i want to build through the draft and keep getting better and then when that right free agent comes available to us and the Knicks are actually a destination that big names are once again looking at you get that player or those players to sign with us and the same with if we can trade for one. We're slowly getting to where we could become an attractive destination again, but we aren't there yet.

You are reaching hard with a lot of "If's". "If's" are irrelevant when they are hypothetical. Yes GS did it for a season before Durant. Those other teams haven't won anything. And as I said rookie deals don't last forever so how do you keep those rooks while maintaining flexibility for FA's??. There is a window between drafting and signing FA's. We have a nice young core already thats going to continue to develop. You make moves that will help that process and further our progress. Counting on "Luck" to build a contender is not smart basketball management.

It's not a lot of "If's" it's a lot of truth. What's it matter how many seasons GSW did it when the fact is they did it and they did it through the draft. A "If" would be that we don't know if they would of won another without KD or not. I would lean towards a yes that they would of. Adding KD just made it an easier path for them.

I never said any of those teams won a championship besides GSW, i was simply saying that those are all good teams that have built through the draft. Only one team wins the championship every year.

We have a few good young players and only a few and to trade for a star or super star level player we'll need a hell of a lot more than a few good young players. You think a super star will want to come play with K.Knox, Frank and whatever other bench type players we have after we trade Randle, RJ, Obi and draft picks to get him here?

We don't have to re-sign every young player we have. Right now we have Mitch, RJ, Obi, IQ and Randle that are really worth keeping and then a bunch of bench pieces that can be replaced easily. Adding two more good young pieces in next years draft will do nothing but help whther that's help our future in winning games or if it's to help with more valuable assets to use in a trade.

Sometimes the Pics are more valuable than the players you use them on. Your overrating our ability to draft well. Like when you said "if we drafted him instead of him 2 different times". We dont know if the two pics next year will help or be busters. We could just as easily end up with a couple Franks or Knox's when those pics could have lead to something more stable in a trade. And you exaggerate the amount we have to trade in order to get another solid piece. We are competitive night in and night out. We dont need to sell the whole store to get what we need. Obi, Knox and some pics are a good starting point for a player wanting out of a crappy situation.

Randle, Mitch, Quick, RJ dont have to go anywhere.

[prophet_of_rage]

The point you are missing is Thibs is purposely using the bench as a change of pace lineup. The starting unit is designed to run through Randle and attack the basket. They will grind out possessions. Then the bench comes in and tries to catch them sleeping. I am not opposed to improving the starting lineup but not at the expense of diminishing the strength of the bench.

It makes sense what you stated but I think the key factor here is that we need to play at a better level with whomever is starting so that our bench players don’t have to play catch-up. Also, Randle can still play His game we’re just having at least Quickley Starting with or without Derrick Rose. Maybe you have a Derrick Rose continue playing from the bench with the second unit makes more sense and when they come in quickly can stay with that unit because he plays really well with them. Of course that will increase his minutes per game but that’s how Thibs plays his money guys such as Randle and to some extent RJ Although he has been decreasing RJ’s minutes Because he hasn’t been producing and missing too many sides.

The bench really isn't playing catch up as much as you think. The starting unit is not being blown out down 10+ when the bench comes in. The starting unit is capable of keeping the game close on a nightly basis. Thibs knows what he is doing and has a good sense to know what is and isn't working during a particular game.

It doesn't suit the Payton must be killed crew to say that, though.

Sent from my SM-N970W using Tapatalk

[NoDopeOnSundays]

I wouldn't trade for Beal for the exact reason what he costs now and what he'll cost in picks and even young assets, even though it's the picks that the Wiz will be after.

I MIGHT be interested in LaVine, in an "it depends" kind of way, but I'd say he costs too much in draft capital as well.

I know I've said this before, but feels like the Knicks are a year away from doing moves like this, where they have a good draft (assumption here) and then still have an extra pick (2023) and maybe use some combination from the group of Randle/Knox/RJ/Mitch/Obi to try and make that "upgrade" trade next year. I left out IQ and RJ as fan favorites, but basically I'm listing the players that might interest a team with a good player.

The rub is, Knicks no longer have 2 extra picks, but 1, and a "star" might cost 2, which might mean dealing one of their own. Unless they get another by this deadline and that doesn't feel likely with their roster.

LaVine is fine if he's signed in free agency, anything that requires assets is just foolish, like you pointed out, you have to keep draft capital to get the next star. You don't want a situation like the Bucks had, when Harden listed them as a team he'd play for but they already blew everything they had on getting Holiday.

We'd be building around non top 10 players, so we'd never have a shot at a title.

Truthfully I mostly agree with the overall context of what you are ultimately saying. And you are not wrong. Having said that, Miami is a perfect example (last season) of where you can have a Top 15 Player (Butler) and a Top 30 Player (Bam) and a boatload of depth/shooting and at least be good to enough to make a scary run in the playoffs. Especially if that group competes defensively and buys into the coaches philosophy.

I’m not advocating for Beal or LaVine. Even though I would like to acquire Zach if the price was not crippling to the franchise.

Just pointing out that I don’t believe you need a generational talent to win it all. You can be considered a dark horse contender if everything clicks and not just with the players. The coaching staff, the front office and more.

The way Miami did it isn't the way a lot of people want to do it though, they were patient and got him to S&T. A lot of fans here want to skip that step altogether to trade for LaVine/Beal and do the exact same thing we did with Melo, which is sacrifice depth and assets instead of just waiting to sign them with space. The Miami way was draft right, develop and attract that player in free agency.

A team that signs LaVine is going to be on much better ground than one that trades picks and young players for him.

[Clyde_Style]

LaVine is fine if he's signed in free agency, anything that requires assets is just foolish, like you pointed out, you have to keep draft capital to get the next star. You don't want a situation like the Bucks had, when Harden listed them as a team he'd play for but they already blew everything they had on getting Holiday.

We'd be building around non top 10 players, so we'd never have a shot at a title.

Truthfully I mostly agree with the overall context of what you are ultimately saying. And you are not wrong. Having said that, Miami is a perfect example (last season) of where you can have a Top 15 Player (Butler) and a Top 30 Player (Bam) and a boatload of depth/shooting and at least be good to enough to make a scary run in the playoffs. Especially if that group competes defensively and buys into the coaches philosophy.

I’m not advocating for Beal or LaVine. Even though I would like to acquire Zach if the price was not crippling to the franchise.

Just pointing out that I don’t believe you need a generational talent to win it all. You can be considered a dark horse contender if everything clicks and not just with the players. The coaching staff, the front office and more.

The way Miami did it isn't the way a lot of people want to do it though, they were patient and got him to S&T. A lot of fans here want to skip that step altogether to trade for LaVine/Beal and do the exact same thing we did with Melo, which is sacrifice depth and assets instead of just waiting to sign them with space. The Miami way was draft right, develop and attract that player in free agency.

A team that signs LaVine is going to be on much better ground than one that trades picks and young players for him.

I think this FO is not going to repeat the mistakes of the Melo deal. I hope so. That kind of gutting just doesn't work for anyone except generational talents. Lebron changed every team he played for, but even he signed as a free agent.

[TheDavinciCHODE]

Package RJ and a Mavs pick for Lavine before his value drops further.

Last week people were saying RJ was untouchable in a Beale trade.

It's crazy how up and down we are on him.

Before this season, I said that Mitch was our only bona-fide NBA prospect. Meaning he was the only guy you could point to and say "that guy is going to be a starter on a playoff team".

RJ still has a long way to go to be a high-level NBA player. A good stretch here or there doesn't change that.

I'm not saying we have to trade him. But I agree with you that he shouldn't be untouchable. Right now Mitch and Quickly are the only 2 young players on this team that should be untouchable moving forward.

Also, RJ is a tough player to build around. Mitch and IQ fit with literally anyone. And they have 1 elite skill that translates to any situation. RJ has no elite skills. In fact, I don't know if RJ even has 1 star level skill for his position yet.

I'm not giving up, but RJ should definitely be at least available for the right deal.

Not saying that's definitely Lavine, but just saying he shouldn't be untouchable.

Like imagine if Washington called us tomorrow and said "hey, we'll take RJ, Knox, Frank, Dallas pick, and your pick next year for Beale".

I think we'd be stupid not to take that. None of those players are really any good right now, and the Dallas pick will probably be late lotto. Our pick next would be high too.

Imagine

Quick/Rose
Bullock/Burke
Beale/Burke
Randal/Obi
Mitch/Noel

That's a really solid on both ends.

RJ is definitely not a good enough prospect to be untouchable as much as I like him.

Beal isn't going to want to play in NY, he's going to want to go to a contender, and that team isn't beating the Sixers, Bucks, Celtics or Heat in a playoff series. Why does everyone want to hastily throw some mediocre team together that might win 45-48 games at best.

I don't want to hastily do anything, but the NBA is a super star league and you win by getting super star talent. I definitely don't want to gut the whole team for a Beale type player either. But a deal like the one I proposed should be a no brainer. The level of value incoming vs outgoing is not even close.

The value of our assets isn't nearly as high as this board thinks it is. Frank, Knox are fringe NBA players at best. Our pick won't be that good this year and it looks like the Dallas one won't either. Obi is barely getting minutes. And RJ, as much as I like him, isn't a blue-chip prospect. He's most likely going to be a very solid NBA glue-guy borderline star guy, which is 100% fine, just not as valuable as we think itis.

And I'm not saying we should be shopping RJ or going all-in on Beale at this point either. I'm just saying that RJ shouldn't be untouchable in the right deal.

As far as Beale in playing in NY. He's only 27 and the league's leading scorer. And we'd still have plenty of talent, picks, and cap space to build a true contender around him. It wouldn't be the Melo situation where we had no cap, Amare making the max but sidelined, no picks, and nothing really to trade.

That team might win 47 games, but there'd be a ton of room to grow.

Personally, I prefer just staying the course and playing this year out as it may. I don't think we should make a big splash at all. We should try to make some fringe move for more assets, and go into the draft with a lot flexibility. See what we've got with the talent we have. That's the best idea in my opinion.

I'm just saying that RJ isn't nearly as good as people think he is. We'd be insane not to offer him for Beale.

He's high usage, low efficiency, trouble shooting, no single elite skill, etc. That doesn't bode well.

I'm rambling at this point but take what you will from it.

[NoDopeOnSundays]

Last week people were saying RJ was untouchable in a Beale trade.

It's crazy how up and down we are on him.

Before this season, I said that Mitch was our only bona-fide NBA prospect. Meaning he was the only guy you could point to and say "that guy is going to be a starter on a playoff team".

RJ still has a long way to go to be a high-level NBA player. A good stretch here or there doesn't change that.

I'm not saying we have to trade him. But I agree with you that he shouldn't be untouchable. Right now Mitch and Quickly are the only 2 young players on this team that should be untouchable moving forward.

Also, RJ is a tough player to build around. Mitch and IQ fit with literally anyone. And they have 1 elite skill that translates to any situation. RJ has no elite skills. In fact, I don't know if RJ even has 1 star level skill for his position yet.

I'm not giving up, but RJ should definitely be at least available for the right deal
Not saying that's definitely Lavine, but just saying he shouldn't be untouchable.

Like imagine if Washington called us tomorrow and said "hey, we'll take RJ, Knox, Frank, Dallas pick, and your pick next year for Beale".

I think we'd be stupid not to take that. None of those players are really any good right now, and the Dallas pick will probably be late lotto. Our pick next would be high too.

Imagine

Quick/Rose
Bullock/Burke
Beale/Burke
Randal/Obi
Mitch/Noel

That's a really solid on both ends.

RJ is definitely not a good enough prospect to be untouchable as much as I like him.

Beal isn't going to want to play in NY, he's going to want to go to a contender, and that team isn't beating the Sixers, Bucks, Celtics or Heat in a playoff series. Why does everyone want to hastily throw some mediocre team together that might win 45-48 games at best.

I don't want to hastily do anything, but the NBA is a super star league and you win by getting super star talent. I definitely don't want to gut the whole team for a Beale type player either. But a deal like the one I proposed should be a no brainer. The level of value incoming vs outgoing is not even close.

The value of our assets isn't nearly as high as this board thinks it is. Frank, Knox are fringe NBA players at best. Our pick won't be that good this year and it looks like the Dallas one won't either. Obi is barely getting minutes. And RJ, as much as I like him, isn't a blue-chip prospect. He's most likely going to be a very solid NBA glue-guy borderline star guy, which is 100% fine, just not as valuable as we think itis.

And I'm not saying we should be shopping RJ or going all-in on Beale at this point either. I'm just saying that RJ shouldn't be untouchable in the right deal.

As far as Beale in playing in NY. He's only 27 and the league's leading scorer. And we'd still have plenty of talent, picks, and cap space to build a true contender around him. It wouldn't be the Melo situation where we had no cap, Amare making the max but sidelined, no picks, and nothing really to trade.

That team might win 47 games, but there'd be a ton of room to grow.

Personally, I prefer just staying the course and playing this year out as it may. I don't think we should make a big splash at all. We should try to make some fringe move for more assets, and go into the draft with a lot flexibility. See what we've got with the talent we have. That's the best idea in my opinion.

I'm just saying that RJ isn't nearly as good as people think he is. We'd be insane not to offer him for Beale.

He's high usage, low efficiency, trouble shooting, no single elite skill, etc. That doesn't bode well.

I'm rambling at this point but take what you will from it.

It's funny you bring up that Rj isn't nearly as good as people think, Beal averaged 17.1ppg on .419 shooting his 2nd year in theleague, virtually the same type of numbers as RJ is averaging now, except RJ is already a better defender than any version of Beal. It wasn't until his 5th season that he turned into a 20ppg scorer, he was up and down his first 4 years getting injured and taking long 2s before he finally started to put it together. I say that to say you have no idea how RJ will turn out and it's too early to give up on somebody that is playing with no spacing and is still incredibly young.

That team doesn't have much room to grow either, it would be using 75% of it's cap on between Mitch, Beal and Randle and would still have questions at other positions. Beal is the type of player you trade for if you're 1 or 2 moves away, he could put a team over the hump that already has a better player than him, for the Sixers, Nuggets, Heat he would be a great pickup, but for a team like ours it would be a terrible trade in the long run. You're not winning anything if Beal is your best player and Randle is your 2nd best, people really need to be realistic about that.

[3toheadmelo]

Finally finished the game. Not much to say. Everybody looked pretty good besides RJ. Not too worried about RJ though. He missed some good looks and wasn’t really forcing it. He threw some nice lobs.

Good to see Obi starting to look better

[Clyde_Style]

Beal isn't going to want to play in NY, he's going to want to go to a contender, and that team isn't beating the Sixers, Bucks, Celtics or Heat in a playoff series. Why does everyone want to hastily throw some mediocre team together that might win 45-48 games at best.

I don't want to hastily do anything, but the NBA is a super star league and you win by getting super star talent. I definitely don't want to gut the whole team for a Beale type player either. But a deal like the one I proposed should be a no brainer. The level of value incoming vs outgoing is not even close.

The value of our assets isn't nearly as high as this board thinks it is. Frank, Knox are fringe NBA players at best. Our pick won't be that good this year and it looks like the Dallas one won't either. Obi is barely getting minutes. And RJ, as much as I like him, isn't a blue-chip prospect. He's most likely going to be a very solid NBA glue-guy borderline star guy, which is 100% fine, just not as valuable as we think itis.

And I'm not saying we should be shopping RJ or going all-in on Beale at this point either. I'm just saying that RJ shouldn't be untouchable in the right deal.

As far as Beale in playing in NY. He's only 27 and the league's leading scorer. And we'd still have plenty of talent, picks, and cap space to build a true contender around him. It wouldn't be the Melo situation where we had no cap, Amare making the max but sidelined, no picks, and nothing really to trade.

That team might win 47 games, but there'd be a ton of room to grow.

Personally, I prefer just staying the course and playing this year out as it may. I don't think we should make a big splash at all. We should try to make some fringe move for more assets, and go into the draft with a lot flexibility. See what we've got with the talent we have. That's the best idea in my opinion.

I'm just saying that RJ isn't nearly as good as people think he is. We'd be insane not to offer him for Beale.

He's high usage, low efficiency, trouble shooting, no single elite skill, etc. That doesn't bode well.

I'm rambling at this point but take what you will from it.

It's funny you bring up that Rj isn't nearly as good as people think, Beal averaged 17.1ppg on .419 shooting his 2nd year in theleague, virtually the same type of numbers as RJ is averaging now, except RJ is already a better defender than any version of Beal. It wasn't until his 5th season that he turned into a 20ppg scorer, he was up and down his first 4 years getting injured and taking long 2s before he finally started to put it together. I say that to say you have no idea how RJ will turn out and it's too early to give up on somebody that is playing with no spacing and is still incredibly young.

That team doesn't have much room to grow either, it would be using 75% of it's cap on between Mitch, Beal and Randle and would still have questions at other positions. Beal is the type of player you trade for if you're 1 or 2 moves away, he could put a team over the hump that already has a better player than him, for the Sixers, Nuggets, Heat he would be a great pickup, but for a team like ours it would be a terrible trade in the long run. You're not winning anything if Beal is your best player and Randle is your 2nd best, people really need to be realistic about that.

RJ hit a rough patch the past week, but the month or a little more prior to that he was outstanding and consistent in all facets of the game. He was both productive and efficient. If he didn't hit his current slump I doubt we'd be hearing talk like this.

He's 20 years old. I'm not sure what standard people hold him up to sometimes, but he has already come pretty far in a short period of time if you ask me.

If anything, RJ has consistently shown the ability to analyze what is not working and make adjustments. Right now that process has a longer gestation, but in the future he should be able to bounce back the next game when he doesn't have a good game. Even the best players have terrible games or mini-slumps. I'm not going to let 4-5 games erase the memory of what he accomplished in the previous 15-20 games.

Also, RJ was making assists and playing defense. He was also taking good shots, but his timing was off. I wouldn't call his last game a disaster like some were doing.

[DowNY]

Finally finished the game. Not much to say. Everybody looked pretty good besides RJ. Not too worried about RJ though. He missed some good looks and wasn’t really forcing it. He threw some nice lobs.

Good to see Obi starting to look better

Yeah, rewatched the game myself. Easy to kill the youth when they’re not efficient or scoring at a consistent high level but RJ was dishing nice assists, understanding that others were having the hotter hands and focused on keeping them up in the game & playing defense.