Russia-Ukraine War Part 2

[HopelessKnick]

The U.S. wanted war with Russia and regime change without having to send own soldiers for close to 30 years at least. The Neocons wanted to fight the russians for decades now. They planned every step along the way to create a situation where their wish could come true and they succeeded.

[MrDollarBills]

Russia blowing up Ukrainian grain reserves and halting exports impacts the entire world. You folks who think that NATO shouldn't support Ukraine are out of your minds, and that's not even counting the multiple human atrocities Putin's dogs have committed.

For example, Ukraine is a trading partner for many countries in the Caribbean. By Putin deciding to be a c*nt and disrupting grain exports, the people in those countries now will see higher costs for grain based products and shortages. But yeah, keep parroting that Russian agitprop. Putin's favorite marks are Americans who regurgitate Kremlin propaganda word for word.

And it's hilarious to see right wing Americans wagging a finger at Ukraine for unfortunately having nazis among their population like the rest of Eastern Europe does. Look in the f*cking mirror and who you support here at home before casting stones from within your glass houses, you look foolish.

[rajajackal]

Russia blowing up Ukrainian grain reserves and halting exports impacts the entire world. You folks who think that NATO shouldn't support Ukraine are out of your minds, and that's not even counting the multiple human atrocities Putin's dogs have committed.

For example, Ukraine is a trading partner for many countries in the Caribbean. By Putin deciding to be a c*nt and disrupting grain exports, the people in those countries now will see higher costs for grain based products and shortages. But yeah, keep parroting that Russian agitprop. Putin's favorite marks are Americans who regurgitate Kremlin propaganda word for word.

And it's hilarious to see right wing Americans wagging a finger at Ukraine for unfortunately having nazis among their population like the rest of Eastern Europe does. Look in the f*cking mirror and who you support here at home before casting stones from within your glass houses, you look foolish.

i'm not parroting anything personally. i think any form of invasion is wrong and will always root for the underdog in any such situation. i just think that, considering this is a proxy war, our responsibility (the u.s.) is to achieve true diplomatic compromise whether or not putin is a ****

also for the record i'm not a conservative

[HopelessKnick]

Russia blowing up Ukrainian grain reserves and halting exports impacts the entire world. You folks who think that NATO shouldn't support Ukraine are out of your minds, and that's not even counting the multiple human atrocities Putin's dogs have committed.

For example, Ukraine is a trading partner for many countries in the Caribbean. By Putin deciding to be a c*nt and disrupting grain exports, the people in those countries now will see higher costs for grain based products and shortages. But yeah, keep parroting that Russian agitprop. Putin's favorite marks are Americans who regurgitate Kremlin propaganda word for word.

And it's hilarious to see right wing Americans wagging a finger at Ukraine for unfortunately having nazis among their population like the rest of Eastern Europe does. Look in the f*cking mirror and who you support here at home before casting stones from within your glass houses, you look foolish.

As a european I can wholeheartedly say that the U.S. is the biggest instigator of war and instability outside it's own borders and outside some european allied countries. You just have to look at recent history throughout south america, east asia and especially the middle east. The U.S. unprovoked wars of aggression in the middle east cost 4.5-4.6 million lives, so you are completely right that you should be looking in the mirror. Absolutely I support your statement. It should be a big mirror at that.

[NowWHYcee7]

The Nazi problem in Ukraine is akin to the Islamic fundamentalism problem in Libya, when Obama and home girl Hilary destabilized the the middle east it created ISIL/ISIS and gave them a stronghold in the region. That’s what supporting BS wars and regime change will get you. It’s sad you will unquestionably buy everything the establishment is selling, hook line and sinker.

Someone's mad I actually read his linked article instead of just taking him at his word lol

Isn't that what free thinking actually is?

I’m fully aware of what the article said. Putin is capitalizing off of a very real problem to bolster his own efforts. Real-politik 101. What you are doing is hand waving away things that don’t fit your narrative. The left in America likes to call anyone who disagrees with “progressivism” a “nazi,” but real, actual, hitler praising, swastika brandishing Nazis don’t get a peep out of them. What happened to the left that was so anti war back during the bush era? Oh yeah, your political masters told you to do a 180. Malcolm warned us about fork tongued liberals.

[DOT]

Oh yeah, your political masters told you to do a 180. Malcolm warned us about fork tongued liberals.

lol y'all are the easiest people to control

Still seething you didn't actually read the thing you posted

[BKlutch]

The Nazi problem in Ukraine is akin to the Islamic fundamentalism problem in Libya, when Obama and home girl Hilary destabilized the the middle east it created ISIL/ISIS and gave them a stronghold in the region. That’s what supporting BS wars and regime change will get you. It’s sad you will unquestionably buy everything the establishment is selling, hook line and sinker.

Someone's mad I actually read his linked article instead of just taking him at his word lol

Isn't that what free thinking actually is?

More importantly, it says something very important about a poster who chooses an out of context quote to "prove his point," knowing full well he is grossly misrepresenting the overall content of an article. In other contexts, we have a name for such people (but here on RGM, we try not to call names)

[NowWHYcee7]

Oh yeah, your political masters told you to do a 180. Malcolm warned us about fork tongued liberals.

lol y'all are the easiest people to control

Still seething you didn't actually read the thing you posted

Who’s y’all? Why aren’t you addressing the issue?

The Azov Brigade is rooted in Nazi ideology and serves as Ukraines national guard. Are you disputing this, yes or no? Simple question.

[Zenzibar]

Russia blowing up Ukrainian grain reserves and halting exports impacts the entire world. You folks who think that NATO shouldn't support Ukraine are out of your minds, and that's not even counting the multiple human atrocities Putin's dogs have committed.

For example, Ukraine is a trading partner for many countries in the Caribbean. By Putin deciding to be a c*nt and disrupting grain exports, the people in those countries now will see higher costs for grain based products and shortages. But yeah, keep parroting that Russian agitprop. Putin's favorite marks are Americans who regurgitate Kremlin propaganda word for word.

And it's hilarious to see right wing Americans wagging a finger at Ukraine for unfortunately having nazis among their population like the rest of Eastern Europe does. Look in the f*cking mirror and who you support here at home before casting stones from within your glass houses, you look foolish.

My Guy, Russia, like the U.S. and China are legitimate super powers. and have warned about targeting Crimea and in the case of China, Taiwan What did you think would happen after another attack on that Bridge? Or what will happen if we keep fkn with China and Taiwan?

BTW, only 3% of the grains were reaching Africa via Ukraine, which was what Ukraine agreed to, so RU has promised to send free grain to the neediest of African countries to make up the difference.

In any event, we just adopted a pretty large country that we'll have to take care of not only militarily but share our $ economically. This is not Puerto Rico.
Good luck to our kid's 401s and future elderly social security checks.

But we'll bounce on Ukr like we did in destroyed Vietnam, Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya to name the most well known. But there have been less documented trashed countries like El Salvador in the 70s/80s etc.

[MrDollarBills]

Russia blowing up Ukrainian grain reserves and halting exports impacts the entire world. You folks who think that NATO shouldn't support Ukraine are out of your minds, and that's not even counting the multiple human atrocities Putin's dogs have committed.

For example, Ukraine is a trading partner for many countries in the Caribbean. By Putin deciding to be a c*nt and disrupting grain exports, the people in those countries now will see higher costs for grain based products and shortages. But yeah, keep parroting that Russian agitprop. Putin's favorite marks are Americans who regurgitate Kremlin propaganda word for word.

And it's hilarious to see right wing Americans wagging a finger at Ukraine for unfortunately having nazis among their population like the rest of Eastern Europe does. Look in the f*cking mirror and who you support here at home before casting stones from within your glass houses, you look foolish.

My Guy, Russia, like the U.S. and China are legitimate super powers. and have warned about targeting Crimea and in the case of China, Taiwan What did you think would happen after another attack on that Bridge? Or what will happen if we keep fkn with China and Taiwan?

BTW, only 3% of the grains were reaching Africa via Ukraine, which was what Ukraine agreed to, so RU has promised to send free grain to the neediest of African countries to make up the difference.

In any event, we just adopted a pretty large country that we'll have to take care of not only militarily but share our $ economically. This is not Puerto Rico.
Good luck to our kid's 401s and future elderly social security checks.

But we'll bounce on Ukr like we did in destroyed Vietnam, Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya to name the most well known. But there have been less documented trashed countries like El Salvador in the 70s/80s etc.

I'm not sure what to make of your comment. I mentioned Ukraine being trade partners with countries in the Caribbean that rely on grain exports, what does that have to do with Africa? Africa is not The Caribbean.

Also, please explain how providing military aid to an ally will destroy American 401ks and social security?

[Zenzibar]

Russia blowing up Ukrainian grain reserves and halting exports impacts the entire world. You folks who think that NATO shouldn't support Ukraine are out of your minds, and that's not even counting the multiple human atrocities Putin's dogs have committed.

For example, Ukraine is a trading partner for many countries in the Caribbean. By Putin deciding to be a c*nt and disrupting grain exports, the people in those countries now will see higher costs for grain based products and shortages. But yeah, keep parroting that Russian agitprop. Putin's favorite marks are Americans who regurgitate Kremlin propaganda word for word.

And it's hilarious to see right wing Americans wagging a finger at Ukraine for unfortunately having nazis among their population like the rest of Eastern Europe does. Look in the f*cking mirror and who you support here at home before casting stones from within your glass houses, you look foolish.

My Guy, Russia, like the U.S. and China are legitimate super powers. and have warned about targeting Crimea and in the case of China, Taiwan What did you think would happen after another attack on that Bridge? Or what will happen if we keep fkn with China and Taiwan?

BTW, only 3% of the grains were reaching Africa via Ukraine, which was what Ukraine agreed to, so RU has promised to send free grain to the neediest of African countries to make up the difference.

In any event, we just adopted a pretty large country that we'll have to take care of not only militarily but share our $ economically. This is not Puerto Rico.
Good luck to our kid's 401s and future elderly social security checks.

But we'll bounce on Ukr like we did in destroyed Vietnam, Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya to name the most well known. But there have been less documented trashed countries like El Salvador in the 70s/80s etc.

I'm not sure what to make of your comment. I mentioned Ukraine being trade partners with countries in the Caribbean that rely on grain exports, what does that have to do with Africa? Africa is not The Caribbean.

Also, please explain how providing military aid to an ally will destroy American 401ks and social security?

Allow me to step back on my post as it is a mixture of hyperbole and sarcasm.

The following list show how much Ukraine grain goes to the Caribbean:
Which Countries Rely on Ukraine’s Wheat?
https://www.cfr.org/in-brief/russia-killed-black-sea-grain-deal-these-countries-could-suffer-most

Wheat imports from Ukraine as a share of total wheat imports, most recent year available. A bar chart of which countries rely on Ukraine's wheat exports, showing Lebanon, Pakistan, Libya, and Ethiopia as the most reliant.
Lebanon (2022)
74%
Pakistan (2021)
59%
Libya (2019)
49%
Ethiopia (2021)
45%
Tunisia (2021)
31%
Indonesia (2021)
26%
Mauritania (2021)
23%
Saudi Arabia (2021)
22%
Turkey (2022)
22%
Madagascar (2021)
20%
Spain (2022)
19%
Greece (2022)
19%
Nigeria (2021)
18%
Yemen (2019)
15%
Palestinian territories (2021)
14%
Kenya (2021)
14%
Thailand (2021)
13%
Zambia (2021)
13%
Uganda (2020)
12%
Cyprus (2022)
10%

The major importers such as India and China are not shown.

Secondly,
In terms of an ally, this is the report from Cato.org in 2021: https://www.cato.org/commentary/when-did-ukraine-become-important-us-ally

The U.S. government has taken on an abundance of highly questionable security commitments over the decades. That trend has become even worse during the post‐​Cold War era than it was during the Cold War itself. Washington’s growing political and military ties with Ukraine epitomize an especially reckless policy.

President George W Bush strongly lobbied to bring Ukraine (as well as Georgia) into NATO in 2008, despite Russia’s strenuous objections. However, two key allies, France and Germany, balked at that proposal. They were uneasy about the continuing corruption and authoritarian tendencies in Kiev, despite the professed democratic ideals of Ukraine’s “Orange Revolution.” French and German officials also worried (with good reason) that making Ukraine a NATO member would provoke Russia beyond endurance and risk a dire East‐​West military confrontation. Allied intransigence on the membership issue persisted when Barack Obama continued the U.S. effort to bring Kiev into NATO.
*********

Regardless of your views, MrDollarBill, not everyone in the U.S. or Caribbean share your views. As a matter, I whatapps peeps in the DR, and the vast majority agree that the Minsk agreement should have been honored after its agreement and signature. This could have spared the unnecessary destruction of yet another country. People of fkn tired of the constant fighting and wars, TIRED!

Check it my dude:

Since 1776, the U.S. has only been at peace for 17 years.

American colonists took up arms against Britain to win independence. European settlers then wiped out North America's indigenous people in order to expand westward.

There were an estimated 10 million native people living on the continent when the settlers arrived. By 1900, the estimated indigenous population was less than 300,000.

In an almost unbroken stream of wars and fighting, the U.S. expanded from 13 colonies to 50 states.

The U.S. has also annexed or conquered five territories. It has military bases in about 80 foreign countries and territories. Since 1776, the U.S. has been at peace for just one out of every 20 years.

[HopelessKnick]

Psssst Zenzibar, people here do not like to hear about truths and facts too much. Can't we just resort to the Russia-China-Iran-Iraq-Afghanistan-Syria-Libya etc. are all just evil mantra that usually does the trick for a vast majority of americans? Too much detail and facts will only confuse people here and make the mad. The mainstream media clearly states that all actors outside the U.S. and a couple allies are just evil. Please leave it at that. No one here is going to reply to facts much anyways because they have close to zero knowledge outside MSM alternative facts and talking points.

[HopelessKnick]

I personally do not put too much stock into the Neo-Nazi debate as I think the war was mainly about NATO enlargement and profit (like most wars are about profit/power). I think almost all countries around the world do have their share of far right people and even Nazis etc. but I can't help being reminded of this video:

Watch on YouTube

;t=181s

AN UKRAINIAN-american journalist who calls U.S. media "north korean level propaganda" (at 11:30 to 12:00). This is what I have been saying from the beginning....the western MSM do north korean level propaganda. Anyone that has gone deeper into all these wars and proxy wars can only be stunned at the level of propaganda---just complete lies day in and day out....Trump has told more lies than anyone can count but one thing he was right about is the level of lies by the MSM--alternative facts. But wait....I guess this ukrainian-american journalist is also a Putin bot.

[drekwins]

Russia blowing up Ukrainian grain reserves and halting exports impacts the entire world. You folks who think that NATO shouldn't support Ukraine are out of your minds, and that's not even counting the multiple human atrocities Putin's dogs have committed.

For example, Ukraine is a trading partner for many countries in the Caribbean. By Putin deciding to be a c*nt and disrupting grain exports, the people in those countries now will see higher costs for grain based products and shortages. But yeah, keep parroting that Russian agitprop. Putin's favorite marks are Americans who regurgitate Kremlin propaganda word for word.

And it's hilarious to see right wing Americans wagging a finger at Ukraine for unfortunately having nazis among their population like the rest of Eastern Europe does. Look in the f*cking mirror and who you support here at home before casting stones from within your glass houses, you look foolish.

My Guy, Russia, like the U.S. and China are legitimate super powers. and have warned about targeting Crimea and in the case of China, Taiwan What did you think would happen after another attack on that Bridge? Or what will happen if we keep fkn with China and Taiwan?

BTW, only 3% of the grains were reaching Africa via Ukraine, which was what Ukraine agreed to, so RU has promised to send free grain to the neediest of African countries to make up the difference.

In any event, we just adopted a pretty large country that we'll have to take care of not only militarily but share our $ economically. This is not Puerto Rico.
Good luck to our kid's 401s and future elderly social security checks.

But we'll bounce on Ukr like we did in destroyed Vietnam, Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya to name the most well known. But there have been less documented trashed countries like El Salvador in the 70s/80s etc.

Russia is not a superpower. Russia is in the C-league compared to USA and China. Russias economy is a fraction of the size of California.

[drekwins]

The U.S. wanted war with Russia and regime change without having to send own soldiers for close to 30 years at least. The Neocons wanted to fight the russians for decades now. They planned every step along the way to create a situation where their wish could come true and they succeeded.

Hold on, once second. You do realize that what you are demonizing America for, is precisely the reason why Russian started this war lol to "decapitate" the Ukrainian government, install their own pro-russian regime and move on. Except... it wasn't as easy as they thought it would be. Isn't it such a shame when you try to do something bad to someone, but they end up doing that bad thing to you, instead? How sad.

[drekwins]

i do not support us spending money on this war. it is a thinly-veiled proxy battle and a clear step towards more significant international conflict

I think that the opposite could be argued more successfully. Russia has been displaying aggressive imperialistic practices for too long. They grew overconfident. Resistance is the best way to stop the future invasion of neighbors, especially into the Baltics.

[DOT]

Hold on, once second. You do realize that what you are demonizing America for, is precisely the reason why Russian started this war lol to "decapitate" the Ukrainian government, install their own pro-russian regime and move on. Except... it wasn't as easy as they thought it would be.

Exactly

What Russia is doing in Ukraine is exactly the thing the US was doing in the Middle East, and South America if we go back further

I criticize the US for taking imperialist actions, so I'm against Russia when they try to do the same thing.

[drekwins]

Hold on, once second. You do realize that what you are demonizing America for, is precisely the reason why Russian started this war lol to "decapitate" the Ukrainian government, install their own pro-russian regime and move on. Except... it wasn't as easy as they thought it would be.

Exactly

What Russia is doing in Ukraine is exactly the thing the US was doing in the Middle East, and South America if we go back further

I criticize the US for taking imperialist actions, so I'm against Russia when they try to do the same thing.

Yes. There is an attempt to draw a moral equivalency between two events, while at the same time, labeling the original event as demonic and catastrophic... Thus, acknowledging that Russia is KNOWINGLY committing demonic and catastrophic actions. But, it's okay because the United States did so a couple decades ago.

The entire narrative is not genuine. It is simply meant to soften the view of Russia in the minds of Americans. To paint them as no different. Make no mistake, its a psychological tactic by propagandists. Meanwhile, children are being kidnapped and shipped to Belarus/Russia. Civilians killed. Countless lives lost.

[rajajackal]

Hold on, once second. You do realize that what you are demonizing America for, is precisely the reason why Russian started this war lol to "decapitate" the Ukrainian government, install their own pro-russian regime and move on. Except... it wasn't as easy as they thought it would be.

Exactly

What Russia is doing in Ukraine is exactly the thing the US was doing in the Middle East, and South America if we go back further

I criticize the US for taking imperialist actions, so I'm against Russia when they try to do the same thing.

i hear you, but as someone who shares your moral pov, imo the right thing for america to do would be to bargain directly with russia for an end to the invasion at the cost of compromise. instead we're playing "mine not yours" and directly agitating the situation (at the expense of a citizenry that is freaking out over grocery prices). if we succeed, and if ukraine is afterwards admitted to NATO, we're locked into an active cold war 2 as the default

[Zenzibar]

Russia blowing up Ukrainian grain reserves and halting exports impacts the entire world. You folks who think that NATO shouldn't support Ukraine are out of your minds, and that's not even counting the multiple human atrocities Putin's dogs have committed.

For example, Ukraine is a trading partner for many countries in the Caribbean. By Putin deciding to be a c*nt and disrupting grain exports, the people in those countries now will see higher costs for grain based products and shortages. But yeah, keep parroting that Russian agitprop. Putin's favorite marks are Americans who regurgitate Kremlin propaganda word for word.

And it's hilarious to see right wing Americans wagging a finger at Ukraine for unfortunately having nazis among their population like the rest of Eastern Europe does. Look in the f*cking mirror and who you support here at home before casting stones from within your glass houses, you look foolish.

My Guy, Russia, like the U.S. and China are legitimate super powers. and have warned about targeting Crimea and in the case of China, Taiwan What did you think would happen after another attack on that Bridge? Or what will happen if we keep fkn with China and Taiwan?

BTW, only 3% of the grains were reaching Africa via Ukraine, which was what Ukraine agreed to, so RU has promised to send free grain to the neediest of African countries to make up the difference.

In any event, we just adopted a pretty large country that we'll have to take care of not only militarily but share our $ economically. This is not Puerto Rico.
Good luck to our kid's 401s and future elderly social security checks.

But we'll bounce on Ukr like we did in destroyed Vietnam, Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya to name the most well known. But there have been less documented trashed countries like El Salvador in the 70s/80s etc.

Russia is not a superpower. Russia is in the C-league compared to USA and China. Russias economy is a fraction of the size of California.

Ok, a lesson in recent history.
There was once a very vastly rich country which found itself in the mist of total destruction. This by a newly funded and dangerous group.

The country's legitimate leader then calls upon another's help. This country comes in and allows for negotiations and terms with said members of that group. Those who want to leave this/that zone can be accomodated by buses to another area. However, those that choose to remain will get rocked.

This invited country quicly sets up a no fly zone then proceeds to systematically stabilize the country and just as important do away with said group for the safety of not only the host country but all regional, including African countries. Thus many countries and common folks near and far are dearly grateful for it. Millions of kids, men, women young and old were saved. Also those other millions that left paniced can one day return home. And so it was written.

Yeah my Guy, there is only one other country on this planet I know of, that can achieve that.