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PG: Knicks + Denny's Grand Slam The Jazz

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Re: PG: Knicks + Denny's Grand Slam The Jazz 

Post#321 » by cgmw » Wed Nov 16, 2022 7:46 pm

E-Balla wrote:
Capn'O wrote:Then your draft board was solid. I really liked Obi though admittedly was fairly MIA that year overall since I wasn't drafting for BAF. I liked Haliburton but didn't really look to closely at him after January or so. I also really, really liked Killian Hayes.

Who do you like in the 22-27 range this year. Asking for a friend.

Man it was more solid than I remember I was being modest. Even after seeing LaMelo in Australia I had Hali over him. What the hell were the Knicks scouts even watching? :banghead:

1. James Wiseman - I think this is obvious, especially in a down year like this.

2. Tyrese Haliburton - Great defense, shooting, and passing but lacks the upside you'd like this high most years. Luckily for him this is a weak year and he's almost guaranteed to be an above average starter at the deepest position in the league. I think he's probably the player I least see being a star of the top 6 guys but outside of Wiseman he's also the one I see as having the highest chance of contributing to a champion which is the real end goal here.

3. LaMelo Ball - I think his shot is busted but it's not slow and it's not awkward for him to pull up off the bounce like it was for Lonzo. His handles are also great, he's fast enough to consistently get to the hole, and he plays like a tall Jason Williams. Most of all I love his rapid improvement, work ethic, and mindset but if that shot doesn't work itself out those positives can easily become his biggest negatives.

4. Anthony Edwards - Living in GA I've seen him a lot and my impression is mixed. His athleticism is great and give him a high upside but my issue with him is that he doesn't use his athletic advantages nearly as much as he should and I've seen players like that before (Wiggins comes to mind) that never learned how to use their athleticism. On the other end of that guys like Oladipo did figure it out. Upside is a borderline superstar though so it's hard to drop him too much.


viewtopic.php?f=24&t=1926909&p=81054000#p81054000

Spoiler:
That's a huge whiff on Tyler Bey though lmaoooooo. He's averaging like 23/9 in Israel right now not even in the league.


As far as the 22-27 range now I'm sure everyone I'm looking at will shoot up the draft boards but Jordan Walsh and Emoni Bates are the two I'm watching the most. Hopefully Emoni doesn't raise his stock too much lol.

You’re making the assumption that the Knicks scouts have much of a say in who gets drafted. Sammy Rose got paid. Knicks got a traditional Jordan Hill “win now” big man who can win the dunk contest and oh yeah is the oldest prospect in the draft (Thibs).

This was a no-brainer giftwrap idiot pick for the idiot MSG shotcallers. Scouts? These Knicks? Please. :lol:
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Re: PG: Knicks + Denny's Grand Slam The Jazz 

Post#322 » by E-Balla » Wed Nov 16, 2022 8:07 pm

j4remi wrote:
E-Balla wrote:
god shammgod wrote:
i was a big iq guy but i kind of backed off because he just doesn't hit enough shots. it's confounding because he looks good, the shots look good mostly but they just don't go in enough. and they really haven't since year 1. they say he's in the gym all day and night, more than anyone, so it aint about practicing more. who knows.

You don't need to hit shots when you defend like IQ. Even if the shots don't start dropping more he's still above average efficiency (due to his low turnovers) and absolutely spectacular on defense.

The work he's putting in is showing up on that end.


I feel like he could/should draw more FTAs and I'm hoping that'll trend up and his jumper will pick up with, for rhythm reasons.

But yeah, his defense has been a bit downplayed, and he's doing so many other things well that I think even the struggles from range aren't enough to give up on dude. He rebounds as well as any guard we've got too.

He gets to the line a ton for someone with as few 2 point attempts as he has. That's really the main reason he's efficient. He averages 4.3 FTA and 7.1 2PA per 36 in his career.
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PG: Knicks + Denny's Grand Slam The Jazz 

Post#323 » by DowNY » Wed Nov 16, 2022 8:08 pm

KnicksNext wrote:Cam is everything we wish RJ was. An athlete with above average NBA level athleticism who can do it all. He's faster, quicker, can jump out of the gym, can hit contested shots, can even potentially be a closer if he keeps progressing.

I don't want to go overboard so I'm not going to buy into Cam too much yet, because we've been burned so many times when these players get to their contract years and then dedicate themselves that year. I don't think he has the mental makeup to be that guy, but we'll see. I'll keep some hope alive that he can mature and evolve as he gets older.

Others have said this and it's so damn true. If you take Cam's abilities and combine them RJ's mental makeup, you have that elite potential right there. That player would be something to get really, really excited about. RJ is just not in Cam's league when it comes to pure NBA athleticism, which is too bad. He will be a damn good player for a long time, but he just doesn't have those elite qualities that every star in the NBA has. It's not something that can be coached either, it's what he was born with.

Maybe RJ can work with Cam on how to approach life and how to be a professional NBA player. Maybe he's been doing it already, who knows. But that is where the hope has to be at this point.

These posts have been posted hundreds of times since they’ve both been drafted. Since Cam was with the Hawks. Cam just isn’t consistent. That’s who he is. He’ll explode some games then come back down to earth. Idk if it’s motor or what but he’s a microwave guy. He can be all those things over RJ, doesn’t make him a star or anything.

Michael Beasley and multiple players are out the league and are more talented than guys sitting on NBA benches right now but they’re not in the league.

It’s not as easy as you make it sound. RJ has always been ahead of Cam in terms of work ethic and just getting his.

I like what Cam has done this season. Improvements. Taking advantage of opportunities thanks to Evan and Grimes regression or injuries. But I’m not there yet. He’s in a contract year and has to be more consistent. Idk why people continue to try to pit him and RJ against each other when they’re playing in the same damn lineup. They’re also a close friends. It’s no jealousy going on between the 2 because they both can thrive.
They’re both starters. Neither are “the guy”.

The real thing is, we keep RJ & Cam in the starting lineup to progress together over the next few seasons and we still end up with a shot at Zion.
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Re: PG: Knicks + Denny's Grand Slam The Jazz 

Post#324 » by E-Balla » Wed Nov 16, 2022 8:10 pm

cgmw wrote:You’re making the assumption that the Knicks scouts have much of a say in who gets drafted. Sammy Rose got paid. Knicks got a traditional Jordan Hill “win now” big man who can win the dunk contest and oh yeah is the oldest prospect in the draft (Thibs).

This was a no-brainer giftwrap idiot pick for the idiot MSG shotcallers. Scouts? These Knicks? Please. :lol:

Rose is new. Fumbling picks in this very specific way is not. It's lasted through Mills, Phil, etc.

Also nothing about Obi is traditional or similar to Jordan Hill. He shoots 40+% from deep!
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Re: PG: Knicks + Denny's Grand Slam The Jazz 

Post#325 » by PeteW » Wed Nov 16, 2022 9:01 pm

RJ is just a SF version of Randle, obviously not as bad as Randle but they're comparable. The inefficiency, the lack a of 3pt shot, the turnstile defense.

Brunson
IQ
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Obi
Mitch

I need that starting lineup too bad it will never happen given the politics and the contracts given to RJ and Randle.
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Re: PG: Knicks + Denny's Grand Slam The Jazz 

Post#326 » by K_ick_God » Wed Nov 16, 2022 9:04 pm

Kind of cool that they're giving Cam this shot. What does he not like about Obi?

Quickley playing better, glad to be wrong. RJ doesn't look so good does he, sad to be wrong.
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Re: PG: Knicks + Denny's Grand Slam The Jazz 

Post#327 » by Clyde_Style » Wed Nov 16, 2022 9:12 pm

KnicksGod wrote:Kind of cool that they're giving Cam this shot. What does he not like about Obi?

Quickley playing better, glad to be wrong. RJ doesn't look so good does he, sad to be wrong.


Thibs played RJ even though he's been ill (not sure if just last night or last two games, but he's sick)
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Re: PG: Knicks + Denny's Grand Slam The Jazz 

Post#328 » by Deeeez Knicks » Wed Nov 16, 2022 9:23 pm

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Re: PG: Knicks + Denny's Grand Slam The Jazz 

Post#329 » by GONYK » Wed Nov 16, 2022 9:27 pm

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It turns out if you get athletes with good size who like to play fast, you might score some points. Who knew?
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Re: PG: Knicks + Denny's Grand Slam The Jazz 

Post#330 » by KnicksNext » Wed Nov 16, 2022 9:28 pm

god shammgod wrote:
KnicksNext wrote:IQ back to being a keeper again?


i was a big iq guy but i kind of backed off because he just doesn't hit enough shots. it's confounding because he looks good, the shots look good mostly but they just don't go in enough. and they really haven't since year 1. they say he's in the gym all day and night, more than anyone, so it aint about practicing more. who knows.


Yeah I don't get it either. He's always had that moxie about him too that I thought would take him to greater heights. Maybe a change of scenery is what's best for him at this point. He still has a chance to be a good role player in the league (IMHO).
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Re: PG: Knicks + Denny's Grand Slam The Jazz 

Post#331 » by KnixtapeH20 » Wed Nov 16, 2022 9:31 pm

Clyde_Style wrote:
KnicksGod wrote:Kind of cool that they're giving Cam this shot. What does he not like about Obi?

Quickley playing better, glad to be wrong. RJ doesn't look so good does he, sad to be wrong.


Thibs played RJ even though he's been ill (not sure if just last night or last two games, but he's sick)

Breen mentioned the past two games he's been under the weather which explains him looking so out of it n lethargic. Idk if yall remember I pointed out one of the post games I think it was 2 games ago, he was visibly tired, out of breath. I found that so strange but that's bc nobody told us he was sick. Bang up job from our beat reporters lol
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Re: PG: Knicks + Denny's Grand Slam The Jazz 

Post#332 » by KnicksNext » Wed Nov 16, 2022 9:32 pm

DowNY wrote:
KnicksNext wrote:Cam is everything we wish RJ was. An athlete with above average NBA level athleticism who can do it all. He's faster, quicker, can jump out of the gym, can hit contested shots, can even potentially be a closer if he keeps progressing.

I don't want to go overboard so I'm not going to buy into Cam too much yet, because we've been burned so many times when these players get to their contract years and then dedicate themselves that year. I don't think he has the mental makeup to be that guy, but we'll see. I'll keep some hope alive that he can mature and evolve as he gets older.

Others have said this and it's so damn true. If you take Cam's abilities and combine them RJ's mental makeup, you have that elite potential right there. That player would be something to get really, really excited about. RJ is just not in Cam's league when it comes to pure NBA athleticism, which is too bad. He will be a damn good player for a long time, but he just doesn't have those elite qualities that every star in the NBA has. It's not something that can be coached either, it's what he was born with.

Maybe RJ can work with Cam on how to approach life and how to be a professional NBA player. Maybe he's been doing it already, who knows. But that is where the hope has to be at this point.

These posts have been posted hundreds of times since they’ve both been drafted. Since Cam was with the Hawks. Cam just isn’t consistent. That’s who he is. He’ll explode some games then come back down to earth. Idk if it’s motor or what but he’s a microwave guy. He can be all those things over RJ, doesn’t make him a star or anything.

Michael Beasley and multiple players are out the league and are more talented than guys sitting on NBA benches right now but they’re not in the league.

It’s not as easy as you make it sound. RJ has always been ahead of Cam in terms of work ethic and just getting his.

I like what Cam has done this season. Improvements. Taking advantage of opportunities thanks to Evan and Grimes regression or injuries. But I’m not there yet. He’s in a contract year and has to be more consistent. Idk why people continue to try to pit him and RJ against each other when they’re playing in the same damn lineup. They’re also a close friends. It’s no jealousy going on between the 2 because they both can thrive.
They’re both starters. Neither are “the guy”.

The real thing is, we keep RJ & Cam in the starting lineup to progress together over the next few seasons and we still end up with a shot at Zion.


I agree with a lot of what you said here, but nowhere in my post did I make it sound easy. In fact it's the opposite. I think the chances of it happening are very slim.
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Re: PG: Knicks + Denny's Grand Slam The Jazz 

Post#333 » by Clyde_Style » Wed Nov 16, 2022 9:35 pm

KnixtapeH20 wrote:
Clyde_Style wrote:
KnicksGod wrote:Kind of cool that they're giving Cam this shot. What does he not like about Obi?

Quickley playing better, glad to be wrong. RJ doesn't look so good does he, sad to be wrong.


Thibs played RJ even though he's been ill (not sure if just last night or last two games, but he's sick)

Breen mentioned the past two games he's been under the weather which explains him looking so out of it n lethargic. Idk if yall remember I pointed out one of the post games I think it was 2 games ago, he was visibly tired, out of breath. I found that so strange but that's bc nobody told us he was sick. Bang up job from our beat reporters lol


I said he looked awful in last night's game thread. Two games ago was his best game of the season and then he fell apart. It was clearly due to his health. People want to pounce on that for their agendas says more about them than it does about RJ. Very few people perform well when ill.

In spite of it and being unable to hit the side of a barn last night he was still hustling as well as he could manage. He contributed in other ways, but the best thing for him to do was take less shots and that is a discretion issue on his part.
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Re: PG: Knicks + Denny's Grand Slam The Jazz 

Post#334 » by sol537 » Wed Nov 16, 2022 9:43 pm

Dump Randle and we're good. Dude is toxic.
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Re: PG: Knicks + Denny's Grand Slam The Jazz 

Post#335 » by GONYK » Wed Nov 16, 2022 9:46 pm

KnicksNext wrote:
god shammgod wrote:
KnicksNext wrote:IQ back to being a keeper again?


i was a big iq guy but i kind of backed off because he just doesn't hit enough shots. it's confounding because he looks good, the shots look good mostly but they just don't go in enough. and they really haven't since year 1. they say he's in the gym all day and night, more than anyone, so it aint about practicing more. who knows.


Yeah I don't get it either. He's always had that moxie about him too that I thought would take him to greater heights. Maybe a change of scenery is what's best for him at this point. He still has a chance to be a good role player in the league (IMHO).


He's already an excellent role player. Shooting better/well makes him more than that.
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Re: PG: Knicks + Denny's Grand Slam The Jazz 

Post#336 » by HEZI » Wed Nov 16, 2022 9:46 pm

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Passes the eye test. Randle is terrible. Obi is awesome. Nothing else needs to be said
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Re: PG: Knicks + Denny's Grand Slam The Jazz 

Post#337 » by K_ick_God » Wed Nov 16, 2022 9:53 pm

Cam playing for money now. Sky the limit lol.
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Re: PG: Knicks + Denny's Grand Slam The Jazz 

Post#338 » by KnicksNext » Wed Nov 16, 2022 10:09 pm

KnixtapeH20 wrote:Why the **** did Grimes get a DNP?


I can't stand this **** fossil


He's so untouchable we can't risk playing him
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Re: PG: Knicks + Denny's Grand Slam The Jazz 

Post#339 » by Adelheid » Wed Nov 16, 2022 10:19 pm

KnicksGod wrote:Kind of cool that they're giving Cam this shot. What does he not like about Obi?

Quickley playing better, glad to be wrong. RJ doesn't look so good does he, sad to be wrong.


dont think tom hates obi of any sorts as to not give him minutes; methinks thibs feels obi should just play few minutes because he recognizes obi as julius' backup and he cant allow julius to feel down or bad while obi is basking in the spotlight and opportunity
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Re: PG: Knicks + Denny's Grand Slam The Jazz 

Post#340 » by thebuzzardman » Wed Nov 16, 2022 10:20 pm

Reign23 wrote:
thebuzzardman wrote:Sorry to be really down on RJ. I've gone back and forth on him over first 3 years and had settled into basically pro RJ, lets give him some time, but after the contract and that this is 4th NBA season but he's basically the same player?

He's just not that good. He's ok. It's not a sin to be "ok".

In my opinion, he's more likely to play within the concept than Randle, who seems to freelance out of control, so MAYBE in that regard I'd support RJ starting over Randle, but the reality is, both of them starting is just a horrible fit and nothing would save that tandem. I don't think a star wing next to RJ and Randle would fix them.

One has to go. I'll try to not be too angry at either of them as the Knicks continue to suck because of their pairing until the day one is traded, but as long as they are 2/5ths the starting rotation, team is going nowhere.

Fournier vs Grimes vs Cam vs IQ not changing that equation. They just buff the RJ-Randle treadmill a bit.

dude RJ was sick for the past two games. get off the weed. the whole thread is a monolog from you about RJ :lol:


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