Knicks Mavs PG: The friends along the way

[god shammgod]

their schedule since vuc is in the lineup
@spurs
@gsw (with curry back)
@suns
@jazz

I don't know how many games are you supposed to win there. even with vuc&lavine

Hey, don't bring up facts around here. Nobody wants to hear it. The Bulls suck, and there is no chance Vuc and Lavine can play together. I know this because they didn't sweep that schedule.

Conversely I thought the point of making a trade like that was so that you could compete and win a game here and there against teams of those caliber? They couldn’t even beat the likes of the Spurs and Warriors who aren’t exactly powerhouses so what’s the point??

here comes 30 more posts in response

[Clyde_Style]

Hey, don't bring up facts around here. Nobody wants to hear it. The Bulls suck, and there is no chance Vuc and Lavine can play together. I know this because they didn't sweep that schedule.

Conversely I thought the point of making a trade like that was so that you could compete and win a game here and there against teams of those caliber? They couldn’t even beat the likes of the Spurs and Warriors who aren’t exactly powerhouses so what’s the point??

here comes 30 more posts in response

SCIENTIFIC FACT: If you put NewKnicks on ignore, RealGM disappears

[GEOLINK]

Orlando was smart. They traded vooch for 2 picks and now they’re a prime target to get a great pick. Leon instead of selling traded a draft asset for DRose. This team continues to be stupid.

And Orlando will continue to be bad for years, so?

Will they actually trade those assets and build a new Big 3? Or will they continue to draft and draft and pray one of these guys turn into LeBron?

I think Orlando has a better chance at acquiring a superstar in the draft than we do. I’d rather be in a position like them where they’re bad enough to have their fortunes changed in the draft than us building around an inefficient player in Randle hoping that we make make the playoffs just to say we did.

And how good will they be? Is the goal to be the Celtics? Cause they ain’t winning any chips.

[DaGawd]

And Orlando will continue to be bad for years, so?

Will they actually trade those assets and build a new Big 3? Or will they continue to draft and draft and pray one of these guys turn into LeBron?

I think Orlando has a better chance at acquiring a superstar in the draft than we do. I’d rather be in a position like them where they’re bad enough to have their fortunes changed in the draft than us building around an inefficient player in Randle hoping that we make make the playoffs just to say we did.

And how good will they be? Is the goal to be the Celtics? Cause they ain’t winning any chips.

People get so caught up on the draft it’s crazy.. even acquiring a star talent in the draft.. if you’re in that position to begin with your team will take a while before it’s good enough to even think about championships. That player you draft likely will be off their rookie contract by the time you can entertain that thought

[GEOLINK]

I think Orlando has a better chance at acquiring a superstar in the draft than we do. I’d rather be in a position like them where they’re bad enough to have their fortunes changed in the draft than us building around an inefficient player in Randle hoping that we make make the playoffs just to say we did.

And how good will they be? Is the goal to be the Celtics? Cause they ain’t winning any chips.

People get so caught up on the draft it’s crazy.. even acquiring a star talent in the draft.. if you’re in that position to begin with your team will take a while before it’s good enough to even think about championships. That player you draft likely will be off their rookie contract by the time you can entertain that thought

I would pull a Lakers/LeBron any day.

Get a star player and trade the assets to build a big 3, that should be the ideal way. Not constantly tanking and stacking up assets that become useless.

[Clyde_Style]

I think Orlando has a better chance at acquiring a superstar in the draft than we do. I’d rather be in a position like them where they’re bad enough to have their fortunes changed in the draft than us building around an inefficient player in Randle hoping that we make make the playoffs just to say we did.

And how good will they be? Is the goal to be the Celtics? Cause they ain’t winning any chips.

People get so caught up on the draft it’s crazy.. even acquiring a star talent in the draft.. if you’re in that position to begin with your team will take a while before it’s good enough to even think about championships. That player you draft likely will be off their rookie contract by the time you can entertain that thought

Then better get cracking

[Zenzibar]

One can ask "what the fk is Thibs doing burying Frank when he has the size to guard Luka"? But Frank gives you -ZERO offense and it's been the story of his Knicks career. SMDFH.

[GEOLINK]

One can ask "what the fk is Thibs doing burying Frank when he has the size to guard Luka"? But Frank gives you -ZERO offense and it's been the story of his Knicks career. SMDFH.

They built a team with 0 offense.

[Zenzibar]

One can ask "what the fk is Thibs doing burying Frank when he has the size to guard Luka"? But Frank gives you -ZERO offense and it's been the story of his Knicks career. SMDFH.

They built a team with 0 offense.

Like IQ's floater floating away

[NewKnicks]

The Rockets traded away picks and Chris Paul for Westbrook.

They then traded both Westbrook and Harden for picks to recoup some draft assets.

Lavine's perception might change if the Bulls fail to make the playoffs this year and next. Vuc is an awful fit next to Lavine, and at 30 he's only gonna get less mobile with time. If the Knicks end up with a better record than the Bulls, then it would be safe to assume from his perspective that he could get farther with the Knicks than with the Bulls.

And I still disagree with you here.

That's cool.

But there's certainly a precedent for an organization trading picks for players, only to trade the guy they traded picks for (to bring in established players) for more picks to recoup.

Houston did it. Chicago could do it as well if things don't work out.

True, but it's been what, 2 weeks? I don't think anyone in that franchise is looking to blow anything up any time soon.

[NewKnicks]

The Rockets traded away picks and Chris Paul for Westbrook.

They then traded both Westbrook and Harden for picks to recoup some draft assets.

Lavine's perception might change if the Bulls fail to make the playoffs this year and next. Vuc is an awful fit next to Lavine, and at 30 he's only gonna get less mobile with time. If the Knicks end up with a better record than the Bulls, then it would be safe to assume from his perspective that he could get farther with the Knicks than with the Bulls.

Chanel: Do you know the process of who decides who makes the pre/post and gamethreads? And what time the pre-game thread usually goes up?

Since I'm NEW ( ) around here, I don't know the process.

Try it.

I dare you.

[NewKnicks]

Knicks stay a joke as usual.

Didn't watch one second of the game by this buttf*ck franchise, but box score watching it looks like the Knicks guards/wings had yet another scintillating effort.
Other than the aged Alec Burks

Oh, and the 2nd game in a row where the Knicks are fighting for their playoff lives and RJ Barrett laid an egg.

Barret's new knickname is RJ3, because he's clearly just a 3rd option, he of the slow robot mechanical moves.

Also, yet again, I fell for the Knicks bullsh*t.

I thought they were doing a better job with a new FO, but it's really the same exact thing as the last 3 years.

Sign 1 year bums.
Win enough games to destroy draft position
Go into the draft and f*ck it up or have luck f*ck it up (hi RJ!)
Save $ for "the big FA's"
Don't sign any FA's worth a f*ck
Repeat

Only difference this year is the coach can actually coach defense very well but he's still a maniacal penquin whose rotations suck, but then again, 3/4's of the players suck, so maybe it's not his fault. Would have to wait until how Thibs looks with a good roster but the chance to conduct that half of the experiment will never come.

Oh, and IQ hasn't looked that impressive since the AS break.
He's "ok". Another overhyped Knicks rookie by the fans.
Which is understandable, since he's actually an NBA player, unlike Frank, Knox or Obi.

They sucked me in and fooled me again too. For some dumb reason, I thought this year was different, and they 'turned the corner'. But no, nothing has changed. They put up the smoke and mirrors signing the one year rentals (AGAIN), and Thibs brought in that defensive mentality that allowed us to compete more than we should have.

They got me again.

Us:

I think of myself as being pretty logical most of the time, but somehow I allowed them to get me again dammit.

If they pull out the one year vet strategy again next year, I swear I won't buy into it. But I probably will, because I let my emotions of wanting this franchise to get it together and win. But I don't know how much more I can take it.

[NewKnicks]

he expires after next year. if he says he won't re-sign they have no choice but to trade him.

Sorry, but you're dreaming sham. No way Lavine wants to come to our losing franchise.

i actually said i don't know that he would choose us if you go back and read it. but no, i don't think they've gonna be a winning team now that they got vuc. they're horrible on defense and now they got even worse by making him their center.

It's been 4 games I think. I'll give them more time than that to figure out how they're going to work together.

[NewKnicks]

their schedule since vuc is in the lineup
@spurs
@gsw (with curry back)
@suns
@jazz

I don't know how many games are you supposed to win there. even with vuc&lavine

Hey, don't bring up facts around here. Nobody wants to hear it. The Bulls suck, and there is no chance Vuc and Lavine can play together. I know this because they didn't sweep that schedule.

Conversely I thought the point of making a trade like that was so that you could compete and win a game here and there against teams of those caliber? They couldn’t even beat the likes of the Spurs and Warriors who aren’t exactly powerhouses so what’s the point??

While I agree with the premise of your post, it's literally been 4 games and everyone thinks they know exactly how the trade is going to work out for years to come.

[NewKnicks]

Hey, don't bring up facts around here. Nobody wants to hear it. The Bulls suck, and there is no chance Vuc and Lavine can play together. I know this because they didn't sweep that schedule.

Conversely I thought the point of making a trade like that was so that you could compete and win a game here and there against teams of those caliber? They couldn’t even beat the likes of the Spurs and Warriors who aren’t exactly powerhouses so what’s the point??

here comes 30 more posts in response

Damn right! And you're going to love it.

That's why I laugh to myself when people question my love for the Knicks. I post here more than any other poster. But I also don't live in fairy land and pretend we're better than we are (I know you don't, so I'm not talking about you)

[NewKnicks]

Conversely I thought the point of making a trade like that was so that you could compete and win a game here and there against teams of those caliber? They couldn’t even beat the likes of the Spurs and Warriors who aren’t exactly powerhouses so what’s the point??

here comes 30 more posts in response

SCIENTIFIC FACT: If you put NewKnicks on ignore, RealGM disappears

That's why you guys need me around.

[HarthorneWingo]

So is there no game thread because everyone is depressed or am I missing something?

There's a game tonight?

[TwitterFingers]

And how good will they be? Is the goal to be the Celtics? Cause they ain’t winning any chips.

People get so caught up on the draft it’s crazy.. even acquiring a star talent in the draft.. if you’re in that position to begin with your team will take a while before it’s good enough to even think about championships. That player you draft likely will be off their rookie contract by the time you can entertain that thought

I would pull a Lakers/LeBron any day.

Get a star player and trade the assets to build a big 3, that should be the ideal way. Not constantly tanking and stacking up assets that become useless.

I’d rather draft a Tim Duncan type player and build a team around him for the life of his career than sign an aging vet superstar and then trade all of your draft capital for another superstar so you can have a short window of success. Sure you might get lucky and win a championship, but you’re guaranteed to suck for a long time after your run is over with.

Besides if we see Randle as a long term piece, which has been reported, we’re probably maxing him after next year. We’re probably paying mitch this summer. Then RJ’s max is coming up. Even if signing a superstar is feasible cap wise I think they’ll probably be better options available than to team up with Randle and RJ.

[knicksNOTslick]

One can ask "what the fk is Thibs doing burying Frank when he has the size to guard Luka"? But Frank gives you -ZERO offense and it's been the story of his Knicks career. SMDFH.

As opposed to Payton's NEGATIVE offense and worse defense. But hey because he holds on to the ball more than Frank, he must be running the offense right.

Not saying Frank is good but the kid has had defensive success guarding Luka. One would think to try him out in this game. Not playing Frank gives you more offense? Like the 86 points the Knicks put up for the whole game?

[Richard4444]

It's a good question.

Probably the most important one.

I see 5 scenarios to be honest:

1. Knicks make the playoffs, Clippers are a mess, and Kawhi signs this summer
2. Zion signs as a free agent in 2025 or 2026 via player option
3. Knicks miss the playoffs, finally get some lottery luck and draft Cade or Suggs (or whomever)
4. Knicks package their assets and trade for Lavine, and he reaches yet another level
5. Knicks trade Randle to the Warriors or Timberwolves for a top 4 pick.

I don't know if there's any other avenue tbh.

Knicks fans have to stop romanticizing about the draft. Players like Doncic and Zion that can impact the game from day one are very rare. We can not choose to lose all every year to try to grab one of them. Besides, we have to rely on ping pong balls and the tanking competition uses to be great.

The majority of the future stars plays like RJ and Randle at their beginning of the career and we need patience with them. They will not change the franchise overnight and if we grab them we would create threads asking if they are as busts.

The majority of tanking teams fail. The process takes years and they keep losing and losing. And the process is excruciating to the fans. And bad for business (attendance, merchandising).

No one will trade a top5 pick for a UFA 2022 Randle. Especially a small market team will not choose a player who they can't control after one year over one player who they have a 7/8-year control.

The knicks are in a really good spot right now. Their core is relatively cheap and we have a lot of picks. We can make smarts signs and trades to improve the team. We probably will not turn into contenders overnight. But if we stay competitive we will attract stars in the FA market or trade market. Every team is complaining that almost every star wants to play in New York and I am sure that is not because of the color of the shirt. If we stay respectable and competitive, we will attract our share of stars.

Which stars though?

There's no All-NBA caliber player on the free agency horizon.

Most superstars are under contract for a few more years, happy where they are or just old.

The obvious path to winning a championship is to acquire a superstar, if not a few. Even that doesn't guarantee you a championship, but it's the road a franchise needs to take. The 2004 Pistons, 2014 Spurs and 2020 Heat are the exception, not the rule. And even though I love RJ, and Randle's a legit All-Star, there simply isn't that superstar talent on the Knicks roster that can score uber-efficiently and have the gravity to make defenses pay with his playmaking.

The Knicks are in an ok spot. Not good, not bad, just ok. Granted, this is an improvement over the last 8 years, but the franchise is kinda trapped right now, hence the Orlando Magic analogy.

First, we cant behave like a drunk cockroach. A year trying to tank and failing. Next year trying to compete, give up and start tanking again. We signed Thibs and improve a lot as a team. We cant reset and start tanking again throwing away all the evolution. It's a lot harder to tank now. If we go that will, we will fail in both strategies.

Second, we have cap space. We have room to improve. Signing young high potential players is a way of capitalizing value. They may evolve into all starts. Or we can put them in a package in a future trade for an all-star.

Third, playing in New York is a factor that moves stars. We have a competitive advantage that small-market teams don't have. They need to tank until getting a Zion or a LaMello. If we create competitive teams, stars will show. It can take time. But building to the draft with high picks also takes time. One thing that this franchise lacks is respectability.

Forth, I am against bold moves in this stage of evolution. Improving slowly, we probably still be a lottery team and could grab a nice prospect. I know he is not a cant-miss player Top3 or Top5, but a Top 10-14 player has almost as much potential as a Top6.