Donovan Mitchell Thread #6 - Something might actually happen in this one!!!!!!

[NoDopeOnSundays]

seems more than a little misleading to only use stats in wins, when he prefaces it with RJ Barrett in games he has as least 20 FGA, don't you think? how interesting, i guess that is the only way to make RJ look good with stats tho, i respect it

Only way to make him look good? Damn bro, the hate in your blood is thick


Also, this is why I will continue to say RJ can play within an offense (and Obi as well).

i dont deny that. if/when we get mitchell, he'd be pretty good at playing within an offense sitting in the corner shooting 3s, and getting the occasional opportunity to make a play himself. he can be our little andrew wiggins when he get mitchell.

43 game stretch he was averaging 62 touches per game and scoring 23.3ppg, he can be more than Wiggins. This is also why I want to keep Obi, we're going to need "Get out the way and let Mitchell / Brunson cook" type of players.

[DowNY]

Read on Twitter

?s=20&t=-FeC2ljPx_OfutiqNjZd6g


Conflict of interest there Tony. Met fan like Donovan? Meanwhile we’re waiting for actual Donovan news.

[stuporman]

RJ was taking more shots then last year and Knicks became worse yet ppl will blame this on Randle lol.

Randle was one of the worst starters and worse than most Bench players in the entire **** league. His numbers came from the first half of the season where he dribbled the air out of the ball and bricked every **** shot especially his patented ISO end of the Q bricks like he's even remotely that player.... This is why Thibs is so **** clueless.

Jimmit79 & Chanel Bomber will form a potent all time RJ hate back court, while Ghetto Gospel holds down the 6th man position....I look forward to it

They're undersized and play no defense but both of them are quite offensive...

[Fury]

Any news man wtf

[G_K_F]

They never say anything insightful or meaningful anyway so who cares. It's not like he's going to map out his plan for the world to see. They give bs canned answers so why even bother.

That’s not the point. It’s an insult to the fans and cowardice for not facing the music. It’s typical Dolan garbage. People who support this stuff are short-sighted. He has the same exact mentality as Trump, which is why he supports him. “Media bad, let’s ban them all”.

Chris Herrig is as solid as they come and puts it in much better terms than I can:

Read on Twitter

I hear you and read the article. It makes some sense but I just don't agree. I don't think reporters are the voice of the people. Particularly national media aren't practicing true journalism; they're looking to hammer the Knicks as some joke and I'm not here for it. Rarely do they ask real questions and almost never give pushback on a bs answer. It wasn't a press conference. It was a fan event and it was streamed live for the fans and season ticket holders were in attendance. I know it's a shame reporters couldn't be there to ask Brunson about Donovan Mitchell questions, but that's the breaks. Hell, we make fun of their inability to ask real questions during post game interviews. If the press wants me to feel that they were unjustly excluded, then maybe they should put out a better more consistent product.

I'm not saying you're (or they) are wrong. I just disagree

But here’s the deal dude - the Knicks only exclude the media because they get negative press. And they get negative press because they’ve been a complete joke on and off the court in various ways over the last 21 years. They deserve every bit of ridicule they get. They’re a garbage organization with one of the worst owners in sports.

I understand people here feel some type of way (although I just think it’s the new Knicks fan generation going soft) about their team being clowned but there is a franchise that gets this treatment in literally every sport. The Browns and Cowboys get ridiculed routinely. The Jets have been a joke franchise for years and get rightfully laughed at. In baseball you had the Mets as a joke for many years. The Cubs were trolled for their 100+ year title drought. Etc. The Sacramento Kings, by the way, are also considered a league-wide joke. They just don’t get the coverage the Knicks get because of the market they’re in.

Look man, you can disagree with the article and you can disagree that the press needs to be at certain events but I hope people here acknowledge that the Knicks would not be fighting the press if they were actually a good team in the last 20+ years. If they were good they’d get generally positive press and wouldn’t care. But they’ve been bad for so long. Literally the worst record in the entire NBA in the last 21 years. So Dolan acts like the huge btch he is and tries to control the media instead of actually fixing his own team. It’s like when you’re beating down your friend in 2K and he starts complaining about how his controller ain’t working properly or the game is glitching. Dolan can’t accept responsibility so instead he just lashes out at everyone around him.

[vallen]

People crying about the media not allowed in the JB welcome need to chill. It was his day and he shouldnt have to be bombarded by Donovon questions, and what if scenario's. Finally a good look from the Knicks media team to keep him protected, comfortable, and welcomed by fans with no agendas, then by rapid reporters with financial agendas. That bitter dude can EAD.

[Ghetto Gospel]

Only way to make him look good? Damn bro, the hate in your blood is thick


Also, this is why I will continue to say RJ can play within an offense (and Obi as well).

i dont deny that. if/when we get mitchell, he'd be pretty good at playing within an offense sitting in the corner shooting 3s, and getting the occasional opportunity to make a play himself. he can be our little andrew wiggins when he get mitchell.

43 game stretch he was averaging 62 touches per game and scoring 23.3ppg, he can be more than Wiggins. This is also why I want to keep Obi, we're going to need "Get out the way and let Mitchell / Brunson cook" type of players.

wiggins is currently a much better overall defender and shooter than rj which is probably the most important to being a role player in today's nba. i think he also has a bit more positional versatility, because he can much better play the 4 over RJ. he really stepped up in the playoffs and especially the finals where his rebounding in traffic was much needed and he offered some level of paint resistance that i'm not sure rj can get to

i'm also not sure obi is really THAT guy unless he also proves his shooting and defense which are still question marks. it's why i like grimes, cause i know he can at least do that on a cheap deal

[KnixtapeH20]

RJ was taking more shots then last year and Knicks became worse yet ppl will blame this on Randle lol.

Randle was one of the worst starters and worse than most Bench players in the entire **** league. His numbers came from the first half of the season where he dribbled the air out of the ball and bricked every **** shot especially his patented ISO end of the Q bricks like he's even remotely that player.... This is why Thibs is so **** clueless.

Jimmit79 & Chanel Bomber will form a potent all time RJ hate back court, while Ghetto Gospel holds down the 6th man position....I look forward to it

OH damn I gotta be running point on the Randle hate roster. Like Brunson I'm 6'1 lmao. Who else we got?

Something tells me. We'd have to expand the rosters to like 2,000+

[Ghetto Gospel]

RJ was taking more shots then last year and Knicks became worse yet ppl will blame this on Randle lol.

Randle was one of the worst starters and worse than most Bench players in the entire **** league. His numbers came from the first half of the season where he dribbled the air out of the ball and bricked every **** shot especially his patented ISO end of the Q bricks like he's even remotely that player.... This is why Thibs is so **** clueless.

Jimmit79 & Chanel Bomber will form a potent all time RJ hate back court, while Ghetto Gospel holds down the 6th man position....I look forward to it

wouldn't have said anything if the stats weren't fake

[NoDopeOnSundays]

i dont deny that. if/when we get mitchell, he'd be pretty good at playing within an offense sitting in the corner shooting 3s, and getting the occasional opportunity to make a play himself. he can be our little andrew wiggins when he get mitchell.

43 game stretch he was averaging 62 touches per game and scoring 23.3ppg, he can be more than Wiggins. This is also why I want to keep Obi, we're going to need "Get out the way and let Mitchell / Brunson cook" type of players.

wiggins is currently a much better overall defender and shooter than rj which is probably the most important to being a role player in today's nba. i think he also has a bit more positional versatility, because he can much better play the 4 over RJ. he really stepped up in the playoffs and especially the finals where his rebounding in traffic was much needed and he offered some level of paint resistance that i'm not sure rj can get to

i'm also not sure obi is really THAT guy unless he also proves his shooting and defense which are still question marks. it's why i like grimes, cause i know he can at least do that on a cheap deal

It took Wiggins 8 seasons to become that, most of you would have gotten rid of him just like the Wolves did, because yall are even more harsh with RJ, who actually looks like he cares.

I would like us to see what we actually have with Obi before we decide whether or not he's the guy, we're not going to be in a position to contend for a title, so him being able to play defense or shoot next season aren't that important. Finding out if he can do those things should be the goal, what we know is he's exactly the type of low usage player you want with ball dominant guards. Grimes has no place if Mitchell and Brunson are on the team, unlike with Obi there's a lot of uncertainty about the guy in front of him.

[evevale]

i’m ready to serve my ban

i'll let you out when donovan gets traded to miami

[NoDopeOnSundays]

Randle was one of the worst starters and worse than most Bench players in the entire **** league. His numbers came from the first half of the season where he dribbled the air out of the ball and bricked every **** shot especially his patented ISO end of the Q bricks like he's even remotely that player.... This is why Thibs is so **** clueless.

Jimmit79 & Chanel Bomber will form a potent all time RJ hate back court, while Ghetto Gospel holds down the 6th man position....I look forward to it

wouldn't have said anything if the stats weren't fake

Your counter stats were fake

[Ghetto Gospel]

43 game stretch he was averaging 62 touches per game and scoring 23.3ppg, he can be more than Wiggins. This is also why I want to keep Obi, we're going to need "Get out the way and let Mitchell / Brunson cook" type of players.

wiggins is currently a much better overall defender and shooter than rj which is probably the most important to being a role player in today's nba. i think he also has a bit more positional versatility, because he can much better play the 4 over RJ. he really stepped up in the playoffs and especially the finals where his rebounding in traffic was much needed and he offered some level of paint resistance that i'm not sure rj can get to

i'm also not sure obi is really THAT guy unless he also proves his shooting and defense which are still question marks. it's why i like grimes, cause i know he can at least do that on a cheap deal

It took Wiggins 8 seasons to become that, most of you would have gotten rid of him just like the Wolves did, because yall are even more harsh with RJ, who actually looks like he cares.

I would like us to see what we actually have with Obi before we decide whether or not he's the guy, we're not going to be in a position to contend for a title, so him being able to play defense or shoot next season aren't that important. Finding out if he can do those things should be the goal, what we know is he's exactly the type of low usage player you want with ball dominant guards. Grimes has no place if Mitchell and Brunson are on the team, unlike with Obi there's a lot of uncertainty about the guy in front of him.

it's true that it took wiggins 8 seasons to become that, yet he is still underperforming his contract and what he provides a team for $30m/year is really poor value, you must admit. yes, the wolves got rid of him, but at this point in time, the future looks brighter now than at any point with him outside of maybe that 1 jimmy butler year, but jimmy couldn't handle him or kat, so it never would have lasted. i'm glad he cares, but unfortunately.. caring doesn't win games

if it turns out next season, he's a pretty average shooter and defender, great his value goes up. every year it turns out that he isn't, his value goes down. maybe the FO just doesn't want to risk it, to which i understand

in theory, if we keep grimes, i would think we probably lose quickley and fournier. there should be ample minutes for him to play at the 2/3 because i'm honestly not sure how playable cam reddish is if we keep him. he also suffers from the can't shoot and can't play defense syndrome

[Ghetto Gospel]

Jimmit79 & Chanel Bomber will form a potent all time RJ hate back court, while Ghetto Gospel holds down the 6th man position....I look forward to it

wouldn't have said anything if the stats weren't fake

Your counter stats were fake

they were closer to reality than the original stats

[DaGawd]

Any news man wtf

they’re gonna cock tease us for the next 6 weeks

[DaGawd]

i’m ready to serve my ban

i'll let you out when donovan gets traded to miami

yes

[aggo]

21-22:
https://www.nba.com/stats/players/traditional/?sort=PLUS_MINUS&dir=-1&Season=2021-22&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&TeamID=1610612752&PerMode=Per100Possessions

20-21:
https://www.nba.com/stats/players/traditional/?sort=PLUS_MINUS&dir=-1&Season=2020-21&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&TeamID=1610612752&PerMode=Per100Possessions



IQ/Rose/Burks

only players with positive +/- both years.


IQ should kept in any trade with Utah.

[aggo]

also really interesting to see how for instance, on basketball-reference,

Mitchell Robinson has by far the best winshare contribution on the team, but when you look at his +/- data its not great.

how do you reconcile this? when you actually look at how win shares is calculated, you see that it effectively calculates PPP relative to league average. so Mitchell Robinson because all he does is dunk, has a massively inflated offensive Win-share statistic which cant account for the fact that his teammates do all the work for his points.

what's the takeaway? offensive win shares is a bad stat to use because it distills away too much information. Mitchell Robinson should have the highest PPP (which he does), but offensive win shares cannot contextualize that the majority of MRs offensive is due to assisted plays from his teammates.

[Bob Ross]

That’s not the point. It’s an insult to the fans and cowardice for not facing the music. It’s typical Dolan garbage. People who support this stuff are short-sighted. He has the same exact mentality as Trump, which is why he supports him. “Media bad, let’s ban them all”.

Chris Herrig is as solid as they come and puts it in much better terms than I can:

Read on Twitter

I hear you and read the article. It makes some sense but I just don't agree. I don't think reporters are the voice of the people. Particularly national media aren't practicing true journalism; they're looking to hammer the Knicks as some joke and I'm not here for it. Rarely do they ask real questions and almost never give pushback on a bs answer. It wasn't a press conference. It was a fan event and it was streamed live for the fans and season ticket holders were in attendance. I know it's a shame reporters couldn't be there to ask Brunson about Donovan Mitchell questions, but that's the breaks. Hell, we make fun of their inability to ask real questions during post game interviews. If the press wants me to feel that they were unjustly excluded, then maybe they should put out a better more consistent product.

I'm not saying you're (or they) are wrong. I just disagree

But here’s the deal dude - the Knicks only exclude the media because they get negative press. And they get negative press because they’ve been a complete joke on and off the court in various ways over the last 21 years. They deserve every bit of ridicule they get. They’re a garbage organization with one of the worst owners in sports.

I understand people here feel some type of way (although I just think it’s the new Knicks fan generation going soft) about their team being clowned but there is a franchise that gets this treatment in literally every sport. The Browns and Cowboys get ridiculed routinely. The Jets have been a joke franchise for years and get rightfully laughed at. In baseball you had the Mets as a joke for many years. The Cubs were trolled for their 100+ year title drought. Etc. The Sacramento Kings, by the way, are also considered a league-wide joke. They just don’t get the coverage the Knicks get because of the market they’re in.

Look man, you can disagree with the article and you can disagree that the press needs to be at certain events but I hope people here acknowledge that the Knicks would not be fighting the press if they were actually a good team in the last 20+ years. If they were good they’d get generally positive press and wouldn’t care. But they’ve been bad for so long. Literally the worst record in the entire NBA in the last 21 years. So Dolan acts like the huge btch he is and tries to control the media instead of actually fixing his own team. It’s like when you’re beating down your friend in 2K and he starts complaining about how his controller ain’t working properly or the game is glitching. Dolan can’t accept responsibility so instead he just lashes out at everyone around him.

I agree with you about their performance over 20+ years and also that they have been poor with transparency and their treatment of the media. I guess ultimately my beef is that, at least in NY, there is not objectivity I suspect due to the latter. The media has been noticeably softer with the Nets, even as they turned into a total clownshow. The cap circumvention stuff was widely published and it was crickets from virtually every media person. If members of the press want to have a standard and hold teams to that, then be firm with it.

Case in point - Brunson would've been considered as a win for virtually every team except the Knicks. There were media members who said that! I don't find them to be objective generally (there are a few I feel are). If they want access to report the facts, then report the facts without the backhanded compliments or outright vitriol.

That's how I feel right now anyway. I reserve the right to change my mind. You have good points to your argument

[Capn'O]

I feel like everyone misses the boat a bit on RJ. He's wildly inconsistent. He has games where he's hot, making all the right plays, and making an impact on defense. Everyone gets behind him and he looks like a real first option. Then he has games where he's off and plays the team out of the game.

The hope is he can do more of the former because the rest of the young group ain't that. Maybe Cam but Cam is another level of inconsistent. He's not even in the game at times. Especially with a steady leader like Brunson next to him. And maybe a real first option like Mitchell to ease his role.