Knicks-Cavs Official PG Thread

[F N 11]

Prozingis was not aggressive enough. He was trying too hard to stay out of foul trouble. Limits his effectiveness on the defensive end.

1 foul
0 blocks
0 steals

I saw Melo and the team chuck him so many times. The dude is a weapon. I really hope the Knicks don't spoil his development. This is two games in a row where he was hot and we never let him see the ball again.

[F N 11]

Fisher is just a clown right now. Guys don't know when to be ready to perform. It's just crazy lineups left and right.

[F N 11]

Fisher foo concerned with making everyone on the team happy instead of having solid balanced rotation.

[tapshotta]

LMAO @ people wanting to replace Fisher with Luke Walton, who gets to coach Steph Curry and the reigning NBA champions this year. I guess GS is undefeated because Walton's rotations are great and the timing of his timeouts are impeccable.

You people are dumb as dirt. I can see why people make fun of Knicks fans and root against us.

A lot of the same posters who constantly find something to be unhappy about, or who are constantly looking for someone the Knicks should fire or cut ties with... there will come a day when those people turn on Porzingis, too. After he gets paid, he will not be allowed to win less than 60 games a year, and he will not be allowed to fall short of an NBA title in any year. And in any season that does not continue the Knicks' tradition of dominating the NBA, heads will roll and star players will be boo'd and ridiculed until their spirit breaks and they no longer have respect for the city they play for. Because we, here in NY, have very high standards. And clearly, holding "our" team to these high standards has yielded great results for nearly 15 years. Why stop now?

Fire Derek Fisher 10 games in. Let's start chanting it at the Garden and posting it all over the internet so the players get the message, too. I'm sure they hate Fisher anyway. The fact that the team is playing so hard, especially on the defensive end, is one of the first signs of frustration. The comradery between the players shows Fisher is on the outside looking in. Let's help the players and the franchise by driving this guy out of town and forcing Rambis to step in, or by forcing Phil to search for an NBA coach elsewhere. Most importantly, let's help our rookie, Porzingis. Let's show him that we're ready to go to bat for him and drive his coach out of town if the team isn't winning. He's been playing professionally for a couple of years now. He should know- if you lose a few games in a row, all you have to do is fire the team's coach and the wins will start pouring in. Hopefully, all the good things KP has been doing has nothing at all to do with the way he's been coached thus far. This way, he doesn't lose a step with a new leader and a new voice in his ear this sudden and this early in the season.

Really though, with only 8 new players, this should have been easy. After a long stretch of 10 games and the toughest schedule in the league, I expected them to be battle-tested. 4-6 is unacceptable from this lying, cheating, homewrecking, fake-ass coach. They should have gotten things together by now. There's no time for experimentation because the time to win a title is NOW. He has no right to test his players, he has no right to hold his players to a certain standard, and he has no right to make decisions based on personal preferences about defense and matchups. He also has no right to go with his own gut and decide in-game who he trusts in what situation based on what he's seen having been with the team every single day since September. Fisher should know exactly who to play and when he should play them and also for how long, and it has to jive with what the fans want and expect exactly. Because we pay his salary. And because we know best, and there's no room for error on his or the players' part. So when the players he signed and traded for step in the game, they should be ready to close out any team in any situation because..... because..... MOM!!!! ARE MY HOTPOCKETS READY YET!!!!!!!!!!!!

Melo needs a move going towards the bucket from within 12 ft. A runner, a bankshot, A babay Hook..

Everybody knows its either faceup, back down and fade away shimmy left or fade away shimmy right, yay. The defender can take it away. Makes the shot difficult and the you lose the advantage of being close to the basket, bon voyage.

This squad stops and watches when Mel has the ball. If that doesnt stop then this place is really gonna become a zoo.

Somebody else needs to step up to the challange and accept being an older Melo's number two. I'd like to see up let it be KP. If he does this team could be dirty.

[tapshotta]

also; 2 pts the last 2:49 of a game is atrociious. That doesnt fall on one man. There are 16 other limbs out there not connected to Melo. WTF.

[kane2021]

Derek Fisher put the onus on himself.

"I have to do a better job of putting guys in position to be successful out there," the coach said. "They're doing what we're asking them to do."

Fisher himself said the players are doing what they need to do. That he's not putting them in a position to win.

It's unfair to point solely at Amundson and Thomas for the Knicks' late-game failure. But given the talent left on the bench at the time, Fisher certainly left himself open to second-guessing.

"It's my job to help the situation get better down the stretch," he said.

Fisher himself admits he could handle late game situations better.

So its not just fans putting it on the coach. Or the media. Its the coach himself too.

[j4remi]

Short version: I know the lost was frustrating but I actually found this one really promising in all places but coaching. When Calderon checked the Cleveland SG's and became secondary in playmaking (second quarter run), he was as useful as I think he's been all year. When KP was keyed in match-ups with Love, he seemed completely confident and showed his versatility. Melo didn't have the gas tank to both guard Lebron and be our entire offense, but he didn't force very much in the fourth in fact he actually started trying to create for others again (ball denial from Lebron really did him in, more on that below). This team is gonna get better imo and it's already proving good enough to battle with high quality opposition.

Carmelo: Honestly, I know a lot of people will turn on his performance but he was 26 pts, 4 assists, 5 boards, and a highlight reel block while sinking 9 of 20. It's unfortunate that he couldn't keep up the torrid pace he'd set in the first half, but honestly he was guarding the best player on the planet all night and STILL carried the scoring load in the first half (and passing well out of doubles btw). In the second half Lebron's ball denial really hurt him, mainly because Calderon is such a risk averse PG. The Knicks inexplicably went away from him in the third (ball denial played a big role) and his legs weren't there late, but he made a few a nice passes...the good news though is that Afflalo looked like he could legitimately take some of the scoring load off of Melo and if we utilize KP and AA right, I think Melo can have his legs about him late (it would really help if we had a shut down wing defender to take the weight off Melo doing both the big time defense and the offense though).

KP: He seemed kinda brilliant whenever we gave him opportunities to attack. His jumper from midrange has become damn near automatic, he's not afraid to attack a one on one match-up when he's feeling it, his rebounding was still really solid as well. My biggest gripe with him is that if he's fouled, he's either selling it over going strong or just not strong enough to get up a good look...so when he grabs a monster offensive board, Kevin love can throw him off balance with a foot nudge and spark a fast break thanks to poor reffing. He had a really clutch basket in the fourth, posting up Love and going over him like it was nothing with a little hook. He needs his three pointer legs, but everything else is already there. 11 and 7 with 1 assist 5 of 11 from the field...I wish we'd have tried getting him open more often in the fourth.

AA: 14 points, 4 assists and 3 boards with 0 TO's in 30 minutes. He looked like a legitimate second option, knocking down midrange jumpers whenever he got space and making timely plays. He can post up a guy like Dellevadova and get in a position to get a whistle or make a jumper. He's another one who just doesn't have his legs there for the three point range yet and by the fourth he was short on a lot of his takes but he made a clutch J late when we needed one (and I think he deserved FT's on the second post up of Delly). Melo visibly trusts AA and will let him isolate when he's feeling a match up or look to feed AA when the defense it too unbalanced on his side. This meant less forces than when he shared space with Sasha. AA also moves REALLY well off the ball. His defense is a work in progress but wasn't really bad either. Good game and probably the most exciting part of the thing for. We've seen KP's potential and know Melo can take over but having a second player who can create offense for himself is pretty big.

Calderon: Tale of two games for this guy. When he was the off ball guard, he was able to feast off receiving the ball on the weakside wing and dribbling through a screen. He made kickouts count in a way nobody else was able to last night. He played solid defense on SG's, not really good or anything but he wasn't so visibly bad. 10, 2 and 2 making 4 of 5 with 3 steals on the board as well (but one of those steals was really a block by Melo to be fair). That's really nice in 20 minutes. The bad has to be called out though, as the primary ball handler he just couldn't create anything. It showed in the first quarter (where Melo and KP became primary ball handlers for a chunk of time where we made a come back) and in the fourth quarter where he couldn't get Melo the ball early in shot clocks (probably wouldn't have helped if Melo was gonna shoot it to be fair but would have if he passed). It resulted in a LOT of ugly possessions and again, being fair as I can be, the whole offense was in disarray with Melo bottled up...but when you're the ball handler, it's YOUR job to make something happen and dribbling around the perimeter through a bunch of screens but being completely unable to break the defensive balance will never ever cut it.

R-Lo: Same as usual...his stat line ain't pretty but he did a lot more than the numbers allow for. I felt that going to Amundson late was the wrong decision for Fish (but it's a decision I completely understand and won't hate on him for, Lou had done well).

Grant: When I went to check the box score after the game I was pretty shocked at this guy's stat line because he played really well imo even without the jumper. He was our only penetrating guard last night and got to the free throw line for it (after a few games where we were allergic to the line). He was orchestrating well despite only 1 assist on his line. He only got 15 minutes, but I felt they were quality minutes damn near all night. He passed up some really open looks that he HAS to take even if he's struggling because the spacing was bad but every time he got into the paint something good happened. I'm praying his jumper comes around soon too, because Fisher ain't having a PG out there that doesn't hit jumpers apparently. Fun fact, Grant had the highest plus/minus on the team...I needed some kinda stat to support what I was seeing.

D-Will: Welcome back D-Will. No he didn't shoot well and yes he left points at the line, but his mentality of a scorer was on full display. He attacked his match ups and drew fouls, he beasted on boards and took off as soon as his feet hit the ground and even though he was missing, I felt that most of the shots he took were good choices. More importantly, his athleticism becomes a great trait defensively when he plays guys whose offensive moves are reliant on power or speed because he can usually match it. He honestly gave Love hell in post up defense, better than KP or Lance or anybody else. He seems to have a knack lately for stealing the ball too. 5 points, 7 boards, 1 assist, 2 steals and a nice block (I believe it shoulda been 2 but not sure)...he's gotta get his shooting stroke back in order, but this was really promising. Get this guy more minutes and let him break the funk.

KOQ: Played really poorly in 3 short minutes out there and Lou was too good for the most part to complain about his minutes getting cut. But I still love his game and hope we get back to using him right (as a C, setting screens and in passing positions from the top of the key).

Sweet Lou: 20 minutes of pretty good ball. He really saw the benefit of the Cavs going small though (gotta add the caveat) which made him all the more effective. Dude is all hustle and made some really nice defensive stands that sparked momentum for us. He was a workhorse on the boards as well. He didn't do much for us offensively, but he didn't force anything and did grab 2 offensive boards. 1 points 6 boards and 2 blocks...not bad.

Lance Thomas: Hey let's talk about Lance Thomas again. 0,0,1 with 1 steal and 3 TO's over 16 minutes. He had a really nice run of man to man defensive plays in the first half but my God...dude does NOTHING else well. He has a one hot game every 5 games average and the rest of that verse pretty much works for this player review too. Bring Lance in for spot minutes to frustrate a wing that's going off and banish him to the bench under all other circumstances.

Galloway: He was kinda bad last night, which pains me to say for probably our most reliable player so far. Dude's shot was all out wack, we're talking ugly bricks and he actually forced a couple of shots for a change, probably because he was pressing to get his rhythm. He also picked up a lot of fouls, albeit a couple were questionable as hell. His defense was pretty good but Mo Williams tooled him in two key possessions. On the first, Galloway went under a screen which gave Mo just enough space to knock down a three; not bad defense but just not good enough. On the second, I'm not sure you could defend it any better tbh. It was just a crappy night to be off with his jumper which probably makes me harsher than I should be. 7 points, 6 boards, 2 assists with 1 steal and 1 TO...by no means was he terrible. He just wasn't as good as he typically has been.

Fisher: So some of his decisions were promising and some are still frustrating. He only played R-Lo for 25 minutes which was probably a response to small ball from the Cavs and Lou playing pretty well, but I'd have liked to see R-Lo get a bit more time. He did that weird "Lance must close" thing and tried to make Calderon work at PG late when he had done nothing but turn it over in that role earlier in the night. He did make some good decisions too though. Going to Afflalo late was a really good idea and seemed to catch the Cavs off guard. The alley-oop play he drew up for KP was a stroke of genius, but then again he really should have had his best passing big man make the pass which would have been KOQ because that pass is a pretty difficult one. I'd like to see him let Grant and KP work together more often, use Afflalo with the second unit more often (calming presence) and stop making Calderon the primary ball handler since he never has to be any more.

Random: I really can't stand when the refs call a tight game for 45 minutes and then swallow their whistles late, but that's no excuse because they at least tried to call it both ways. They let Lebron play really physical late and then Melo got away with some stuff too. So I don't want that to come off as making excuses, we just lost a really good team that has the best player in basketball. Just not a fan of the refs switching it up.

[thebuzzardman]

Well, Fisher is still basically a neophyte coach. That said, I've seen enough written that the vast majority of coaches don't really move the needle that much either way in the NBA. A small few gain a team wins and a small few cause a team losses. Unfortunately, right now, at the least, Fisher is in the 2nd group.

[thebuzzardman]

I really wish the team would go Grant/Aflalo and Galloway/Calderon as the guard pairings.

[Signature NYK]

Galloway
Afflalo
Melo
KP
Lopez

to end the game. And that ENITRE Lineup should be in the game already at around the 7-5 minute mark. Now depending on fouls and you can switch guys.

Calderon shouldn't be in unless he's playing with with a defensive minded guard (Gallo, Grant, Afflalo)


We need to use the bench squad we used in preseason together more. Grant and DWill can run the floor well and get transition buckets or at least get to the line. Thomas has been ok but he shouldn't be playing crunch time minutes.

[HarthorneWingo]

Fisher scammed Phil.

He's going to get fired and collect $25M for 18 months of work.

He's a genius

Fisher graduated cum laude from the Larry Brown School for Contract Negotiation and Subsequent Buy-Out

[TruthBeTold]

The Cure For The KNICKS!!!

Fire Fisher!!! Towns probably could have saved your job, Fish. Your dumb ass should have think long term. Talent is what wins in the NBA above anything else. I just hope it's not a lottery pick in June.

Hire Tom Thibodeau: I've had him rated as the second best coach in the NBA for years. Let Tom run his system and get this team to playing defense. NO more hiring unproven coaches and then crossing fingers. I believe Tom would give the Knicks consideration.

Phil, put together a trade package to try to acquire an All-Star caliber player. Trade anyone except Melo and KP. Or, try to get a star player during the off season. KD is not coming to the Knicks and the Knicks won't be able to trade for him. Knicks have to go after the next best option. The Knicks need at least a big 2. I know it's easier said than done, but this would change the Knicks tremendously for the better in my opinion.

A proven coach and a second scoring option will help take some load off Melo when he is having bad games.

[Clyde_Style]

Fisher scammed Phil.

He's going to get fired and collect $25M for 18 months of work.

He's a genius

Fisher graduated cum laude from the Larry Brown School for Contract Negotiation and Subsequent Buy-Out

I feel an acid reflux collapse brewing

[Clyde_Style]

Well, Fisher is still basically a neophyte coach. That said, I've seen enough written that the vast majority of coaches don't really move the needle that much either way in the NBA. A small few gain a team wins and a small few cause a team losses. Unfortunately, right now, at the least, Fisher is in the 2nd group.

Oi vey. The impact of a coach on a player's development and career can be immense. Don't minimize it that much

[earthmansurfer]

Well, Fisher is still basically a neophyte coach. That said, I've seen enough written that the vast majority of coaches don't really move the needle that much either way in the NBA. A small few gain a team wins and a small few cause a team losses. Unfortunately, right now, at the least, Fisher is in the 2nd group.

Oi vey. The impact of a coach on a player's development and career can be immense. Don't minimize it that much

Good insight Clyde. I think as far as W&L now are concerned, Fisher is behind the curve a bit. Some bad coaching but he is showing some promise too (maybe earlier in games unfortunately.)

As far as Fisher's affect on Grant and KP, now we have to tread carefully. When you have someone from mid range who is automatic, someone who can defend splendidly, and overall shoot really well, have them in there when it counts. Build that confidence. That is where Fisher is walking on thin ice. The cake is gonna be in the oven for 20 minutes or so, but we are still deciding on the ingredients and no matter if you bake it perfectly, you got to get the ingredients right and that is a bit of a problem now (Sorry, this analogy just came to mind). Luckily KP seems like a very solid player/person, as does Grant, so hopefully they don't let the bad development (to a point), derail their progress.

[Greenie]

Fair weather fans not giving Fisher a fair chance. Come on.

These fair weather fans(causal) irk me the most and they were nowhere around last year. Before the season started people understood the beginning of our season was brutal. Why the change of heart? Because we're not being blown out? Is that what people want? To be blown out? Will that make it better? They saw a few highlight plays of KP and came running expecting miracles but don't know sh*t else about this roster. These are the EXACT same clowns that hopped on the Met bandwagon and then called for the managers head in the damn WS

News flash to all of our new bandwagon (KP) fans: We are supposed to have a losing record right now. Last year we only won 17 games(just in case you didn't know). 8 of the 10 games we have played were against PLAYOFF TEAMS. Each team we have played this year had a better record than us last year(LA too). We are 4-6, not 2-8 or even 0-10 and we really could be. We have a rookie and Jose in our starting lineup. We will struggle until KP becomes consistent and Jose gets the hell on. Our bench is filled with young guys trying to establish themselves in the league. They will struggle and be inconsistent at various time THROUGHOUT the ENTIRE year.

You guys set yourselves up to be disappointed coming in here with those playoff hopes and dreams THIS YEAR. You should have watched the team last year so you wouldn't look so stupid now in here predicting a .500 team. Fisher ain't great, but there are only about 5 great head coaches in the NBA all together(and that's being nice). Our roster is a work in progress. Stop coming in here with nonsense and casual fan views. We are way ahead of schedule for wins this year. 28-35 wins is where our ceiling is THIS year. It always was. Saying it ain't don't make it true. That crap belongs on ESPN.com or Yahoo.

[Clyde_Style]

LMAO @ people wanting to replace Fisher with Luke Walton, who gets to coach Steph Curry and the reigning NBA champions this year. I guess GS is undefeated because Walton's rotations are great and the timing of his timeouts are impeccable.

You people are dumb as dirt. I can see why people make fun of Knicks fans and root against us.

[NYKat]

Just finished watching the replay. Lemme see if I got this straight...

The Knicks, who have played about 10 games together and only 2 with the current lineup, lost a game that came down to the last 2 minutes against the reigning ECF champs, most of whom have played at least a half season together, and have the highest payroll in the league, including the best player in the league.

And y'all wanna fire the coach.

Makes sense...

Watch out now...
Signs of reasonable intelligent thought do still exist on this board, who knew?

[Phish Tank]

Fair weather fans not giving Fisher a fair chance. Come on.

These fair weather fans(causal) irk me the most and they were nowhere around last year. Before the season started people understood the beginning of our season was brutal. Why the change of heart? Because we're not being blown out? Is that what people want? To be blown out? Will that make it better? They saw a few highlight plays of KP and came running expecting miracles but don't know sh*t else about this roster. These are the EXACT same clowns that hopped on the Met bandwagon and then called for the managers head in the damn WS

News flash to all of our new bandwagon (KP) fans: We are supposed to have a losing record right now. Last year we only won 17 games(just in case you didn't know). 8 of the 10 games we have played were against PLAYOFF TEAMS. Each team we have played this year had a better record than us last year(LA too). We are 4-6, not 2-8 or even 0-10 and we really could be. We have a rookie and Jose in our starting lineup. We will struggle until KP becomes consistent and Jose gets the hell on. Our bench is filled with young guys trying to establish themselves in the league. They will struggle and be inconsistent at various time THROUGHOUT the ENTIRE year.

You guys set yourselves up to be disappointed coming in here with those playoff hopes and dreams THIS YEAR. You should have watched the team last year so you wouldn't look so stupid now in here predicting a .500 team. Fisher ain't great, but there are only about 5 great head coaches in the NBA all together(and that's being nice). Our roster is a work in progress. Stop coming in here with nonsense and casual fan views. We are way ahead of schedule for wins this year. 28-35 wins is where our ceiling is THIS year. It always was. Saying it ain't don't make it true. That crap belongs on ESPN.com or Yahoo.

preach Greenie preach.

[Mr_Perfect]

What we're projected to win and how Fisher coaches are 2 different variables. Stop relating one with the other.

If you have eyes you can see that Fisher is a terrible coach. I supported him through this year and gave him the benefit of the doubt as a rookie roach with a terrible roster last year but he is absolutely atrocious and clueless as a head coach. He is not good, regardless of what we were or ojected to win as a team.