Lonzo Ball - What's your opinion of him?

[HarthorneWingo]

for 1 year id rather take 35 yr old kyle lowry

In a vacuum but what would we have to give up?

[robillionaire]

Yeah I think I'd still take him as he is shooting 38.5% from 3 on 7.8 attempts per game which is even an improvement from last season on higher volume, plus also has improved overall FG% and FT% and has dropped his turnovers from 3.1 to 2.0. Only downside is his assists have gone down from 7.0 to 5.1 per game which is still not bad. Would definitely be better than elfraud. He shoots 12.4 shots per game and 7.8 of them are 3s so at least he's playing modern basketball. Compare that to Elfraud who shoots 12 times a game and 10.1 of them are 2 point attempts

[Knicksfan1992]

You ready to play Lonzo $15-18M/yr?

I'd be ecstatic if that's all we had to pay him tbh. With the way the market is shaping up he's slowly becoming the premier attainable FA given his age and production this season and the amount of teams that project to have cap space this summer. I wouldn't expect him to stay under 20 million a year.

Anyway I've been super high on Lonzo way back since the draft thread days and I've been pushing him in every thread here. I had him ahead of Fultz actually but behind Josh Jackson This year we're finally starting to see why actual smart draft people were excited for him. He's a super glue guy. He does a little bit of everything while being an extremely high IQ player. Guys like that at his age are really hard to come by. But the people who thought he was going to be this top 15-20 stud in the league were unrealistic and that's where I think the disconnect begins between Lonzo haters and the Ball family fanboys...If you remove the name Ball from his last name I'd think a lot more people here would be excited about getting him given what his actual skillset is and given who it would replace (Elf). Lonzo is a low usage unselfish guy who would help unlock our transition offense and make our already good defense even better. He also currently would be one of our better shooters. All those RJ kick outs to Elf would now go to Lonzo who is shooting 39% on high volume.

The downside is it's a tough path to seeing how he gets much better than this because he's still not really an off the dribble shooter, he's not great finishing at the rim and isn't all that comfortable in the pick and roll. So 3 staples of halfcourt offense he's below average at and it's really hard to go from bad to good in those areas. Also he takes up a spot in the startng lineup that usually goes to a more dynamic player So it's kind of what you see is what you get with Lonzo, but I don't think it's absurd to pay him when you have the salary structure the Knicks do but acquiring him doesn't vault us into contention right away. He more helps our baseline performance on a night in night out basis. You still would need to make another move while somewhat depleting your asset base for this one.

Ultimately, i'd take the risk. 23 year old guys with the all around production he has don't become realistically attainable that often. I think given his 2 way ability it's hard to see a scenario where he isn't at the very least a useful player for you even if he ends up overpaid. And there's always the chance that with a change of scenery and new coaching staff that skills that may have been hidden before become somewhat unlocked.

[GONYK]

You ready to play Lonzo $15-18M/yr?

I'd be ecstatic if that's all we had to pay him tbh. With the way the market is shaping up he's slowly becoming the premier attainable FA given his age and production this season and the amount of teams that project to have cap space this summer. I wouldn't expect him to stay under 20 million a year.

Anyway I've been super high on Lonzo way back since the draft thread days and I've been pushing him in every thread here. I had him ahead of Fultz actually but behind Josh Jackson This year we're finally starting to see why actual smart draft people were excited for him. He's a super glue guy. He does a little bit of everything while being an extremely high IQ player. Guys like that at his age are really hard to come by. But the people who thought he was going to be this top 15-20 stud in the league were unrealistic and that's where I think the disconnect begins between Lonzo haters and the Ball family fanboys...If you remove the name Ball from his last name I'd think a lot more people here would be excited about getting him given what his actual skillset is and given who it would replace (Elf). Lonzo is a low usage unselfish guy who would help unlock our transition offense and make our already good defense even better. He also currently would be one of our better shooters. All those RJ kick outs to Elf would now go to Lonzo who is shooting 39% on high volume.

The downside is it's a tough path to seeing how he gets much better than this because he's still not really an off the dribble shooter, he's not great finishing at the rim and isn't all that comfortable in the pick and roll. So 3 staples of halfcourt offense he's below average at and it's really hard to go from bad to good in those areas. Also he takes up a spot in the startng lineup that usually goes to a more dynamic player So it's kind of what you see is what you get with Lonzo, but I don't think it's absurd to pay him when you have the salary structure the Knicks do but acquiring him doesn't vault us into contention right away. He more helps our baseline performance on a night in night out basis. You still would need to make another move while somewhat depleting your asset base for this one.

Ultimately, i'd take the risk. 23 year old guys with the all around production he has don't become realistically attainable that often. I think given his 2 way ability it's hard to see a scenario where he isn't at the very least a useful player for you even if he ends up overpaid. And there's always the chance that with a change of scenery and new coaching staff that skills that may have been hidden before become somewhat unlocked.

I agree with everything you laid out above. I like Lonzo as a player, even with his limitations.

I am a little unsure if he's the right use of the assets, but I do think if the organization thinks he is someone they want to build with going forward, we should be trading for him now.

We aren't going to want to deal with pursuing him on the open market.

[3toheadmelo]

Lonzo
Powell
RJ
Randle
Mitch

[NoDopeOnSundays]

Lonzo
Powell
RJ
Randle
Mitch

I like Norm, but wouldn't it be better to see if IQ can assume a similar role in his 2nd year? You'd have no issues with Lonzo/IQ defensively as far as size goes, that's part of the problem I see with IQ long term, he's too small to guard SGs, but offensively he's a SG. Lonzo solves that problem, he can guard the 2s, and IQ takes the 1s.


Starting IQ year 2 will also raise his profile in case there's a star player that we can trade for too.

[3toheadmelo]

Lonzo
Powell
RJ
Randle
Mitch

I like Norm, but wouldn't it be better to see if IQ can assume a similar role in his 2nd year? You'd have no issues with Lonzo/IQ defensively as far as size goes, that's part of the problem I see with IQ long term, he's too small to guard SGs, but offensively he's a SG. Lonzo solves that problem, he can guard the 2s, and IQ takes the 1s.


Starting IQ year 2 will also raise his profile in case there's a star player that we can trade for too.

You can do that as well and make Powell the 6th man.

I thought you wanted Trent over starting IQ though

[Clyde_Style]

You ready to play Lonzo $15-18M/yr?

I'd be ecstatic if that's all we had to pay him tbh. With the way the market is shaping up he's slowly becoming the premier attainable FA given his age and production this season and the amount of teams that project to have cap space this summer. I wouldn't expect him to stay under 20 million a year.

Anyway I've been super high on Lonzo way back since the draft thread days and I've been pushing him in every thread here. I had him ahead of Fultz actually but behind Josh Jackson This year we're finally starting to see why actual smart draft people were excited for him. He's a super glue guy. He does a little bit of everything while being an extremely high IQ player. Guys like that at his age are really hard to come by. But the people who thought he was going to be this top 15-20 stud in the league were unrealistic and that's where I think the disconnect begins between Lonzo haters and the Ball family fanboys...If you remove the name Ball from his last name I'd think a lot more people here would be excited about getting him given what his actual skillset is and given who it would replace (Elf). Lonzo is a low usage unselfish guy who would help unlock our transition offense and make our already good defense even better. He also currently would be one of our better shooters. All those RJ kick outs to Elf would now go to Lonzo who is shooting 39% on high volume.

The downside is it's a tough path to seeing how he gets much better than this because he's still not really an off the dribble shooter, he's not great finishing at the rim and isn't all that comfortable in the pick and roll. So 3 staples of halfcourt offense he's below average at and it's really hard to go from bad to good in those areas. Also he takes up a spot in the startng lineup that usually goes to a more dynamic player So it's kind of what you see is what you get with Lonzo, but I don't think it's absurd to pay him when you have the salary structure the Knicks do but acquiring him doesn't vault us into contention right away. He more helps our baseline performance on a night in night out basis. You still would need to make another move while somewhat depleting your asset base for this one.

Ultimately, i'd take the risk. 23 year old guys with the all around production he has don't become realistically attainable that often. I think given his 2 way ability it's hard to see a scenario where he isn't at the very least a useful player for you even if he ends up overpaid. And there's always the chance that with a change of scenery and new coaching staff that skills that may have been hidden before become somewhat unlocked.

If Lonzo can't become proficient in PnR then I'd have concerns. What is clearly lacking from our offense now is consistent screens that lead to the roll man scoring. Elfrid does it on occasion at best. Without Mitch as the obvious target this void in our offense is glaring. With players like Randle, RJ and Mitch, you need to run the PnR way more than we do. And we need someone who will set that up effectively. Thibs is ahead of the curve on defense, but still lagging on utilizing the talent we have on offense.

I couldn't help but notice last night during the first minutes of the game when we were competing before we fell apart, multiple plays had Elfrid quickly dump the ball to RJ who then initiated the action. And we looked so much better to the extent I think RJ is a better PG option right now than Elfrid.

[Capn'O]

I like Lonzo. Floor general that can shoot and defend. He's a good piece for the right price.

I wouldn't write off IQ entirely as he is very young but he doesn't have that toolset at this time.

[Capn'O]

I don't think anyone has pushed for him to be acquired by the Knicks harder than me.

wait for my call in tonight...its part of my question

I don't think he is a thibs PG at all and I'm bringing the stats

Lookin' forward to your take!

I have got to tune into this show.

[NoDopeOnSundays]

Lonzo
Powell
RJ
Randle
Mitch

I like Norm, but wouldn't it be better to see if IQ can assume a similar role in his 2nd year? You'd have no issues with Lonzo/IQ defensively as far as size goes, that's part of the problem I see with IQ long term, he's too small to guard SGs, but offensively he's a SG. Lonzo solves that problem, he can guard the 2s, and IQ takes the 1s.


Starting IQ year 2 will also raise his profile in case there's a star player that we can trade for too.

You can do that as well and make Powell the 6th man.

I thought you wanted Trent over starting IQ though

I want Lonzo over Trent, can't get them both IMO, would prefer the big PG in that case.

Lonzo is my top target this summer, we'd still have a hole at PG if we get Trent. I want Trent if we can't get Lonzo and we have to go into next season with Rose as our starting PG.

[nedleeds]

Rich man's Elfrid Payton. He's a point guard that will never, ever get fouled and get to the line. If he is a PnR initiator nobody respects his off the dribble 3 enough to care and they just sag and go under. Good $6 million a year bench guard who can defend and maybe get out on the break with a unit that can run. His spot up 3 ball is at least league average now and so I think he can cancel his flight to China.

[DOT]

Rich man's Elfrid Payton. He's a point guard that will never, ever get fouled and get to the line. If he is a PnR initiator nobody respects his off the dribble 3 enough to care and they just sag and go under. Good $6 million a year bench guard who can defend and maybe get out on the break with a unit that can run. His spot up 3 ball is at least league average now and so I think he can cancel his flight to China.

I can tell by this you've never actually seen Lonzo play, cause this is all incredibly incorrect

[DOT]

I like Lonzo. Floor general that can shoot and defend. He's a good piece for the right price.

Reminds me a bit of Brogdon coming out of Milwaukee a couple years ago

I thought it was an overpay and we shouldn't go after him at the time, and we'll probably have to pay more for Lonzo than I want to, but it's a gamble that could pay off, cause his playstyle is perfect to play off of RJ and Randle

[thebuzzardman]

If only there was guard in the last draft who was a plus passer, shot the 3 well, had size, and could space the floor with IQ for RJ, Randle and Mitch.

Oh well. Always a good idea to go get one who costs $14 million more dollars a year for the next 3 years.

That's what the good FO's do.

[2010]

wait for my call in tonight...its part of my question

I don't think he is a thibs PG at all and I'm bringing the stats

Lookin' forward to your take!

I have got to tune into this show.

Would love to have you on.

[nedleeds]

Rich man's Elfrid Payton. He's a point guard that will never, ever get fouled and get to the line. If he is a PnR initiator nobody respects his off the dribble 3 enough to care and they just sag and go under. Good $6 million a year bench guard who can defend and maybe get out on the break with a unit that can run. His spot up 3 ball is at least league average now and so I think he can cancel his flight to China.

I can tell by this you've never actually seen Lonzo play, cause this is all incredibly incorrect

Watched him plenty because I watch the Pels to see Zion. Everything I say is accurate. He doesn't ever get fouled, and never gets to the line. Maybe you're watching LeMelo.

Not that you care but here are some facts. How is my assertion that "never, ever get fouled and get to the line" ... "incredibly incorrect".



Dude never gets to the rim. If you filter on fastbreaks it's even more hilarious.



Up there with walking corpses like Nik Batum. Players with 1/2 the minutes as him like Bev and Herro have the same number of attempts.

[DOT]

Spoiler:

Rich man's Elfrid Payton. He's a point guard that will never, ever get fouled and get to the line. If he is a PnR initiator nobody respects his off the dribble 3 enough to care and they just sag and go under. Good $6 million a year bench guard who can defend and maybe get out on the break with a unit that can run. His spot up 3 ball is at least league average now and so I think he can cancel his flight to China.

I can tell by this you've never actually seen Lonzo play, cause this is all incredibly incorrect

Watched him plenty because I watch the Pels to see Zion. Everything I say is accurate. He doesn't ever get fouled, and never gets to the line. Maybe you're watching LeMelo.

Not that you care but here are some facts. How is my assertion that "never, ever get fouled and get to the line" ... "incredibly incorrect".



Dude never gets to the rim. If you filter on fastbreaks it's even more hilarious.



Up there with walking corpses like Nik Batum. Players with 1/2 the minutes as him like Bev and Herro have the same number of attempts.

Yeah, that's the point

You called him a rich man's Payton, when his playstyle is literally the complete opposite, then drew a bunch of circles and arrows and wrote "lol" on some stats which prove my point, but you somehow think they prove yours

Lonzo takes 25% of his shots within 10 feet of the rim and shoots 64% within 3 feet

Payton takes 68% of his shots within 10 feet of the rim and shoots 56% within 3 feet

The fact that you compared his playstyle to Elfrid's is what's completely incorrect, cause they play nothing alike. And you claimed people don't respect his shooting off the dribble and he isn't a good scorer out of the PnR because of that, but he's in the 82nd percentile for PnR scoring too

The only thing you were right about is he doesn't drive, which is inconsequential to me because that's not the playstyle we'll need if we're going forward with RJ and Randle. So thank you for proving my point.

[NowWHYcee7]

I'm a big fan of his game and I believe in him. I would love for him to come here.

[WargamesX]

Watch on YouTube

Lonzo at his best

On a bad night it’s the same kind of production but he’ll take only 1-3 threes the whole game. He is a bit injury prone, but young and they aren’t season ending surgery type injuries. Also he holds his own with most PG except Fox who lights him up something serious.

Keep in mind RJ/Randle/Rose and Quickly can draw their shares of fouls. We need someone to spread defenders.