Russia-Ukraine War Part 2

[thebuzzardman]

The Russians are very good people who aren't imperialists like the USA. Russia and China should have free reign to do whatever they want in Africa north, central or south, because anything and everything they do will be out of the goodness of their hearts and with only the best interests of the various African governments and especially the many different African people.

Unlike the evil USA, the avatar of all that is bad.

Let them have at it. Them and China. Will work out great.

Buzz, I agree with a lot of this. Since you seem to have a lot of knowledge and experience here, let me ask you something though.

Do you think USA would have a decent success rate in a place like mid/central Africa? And what would the goal here be? Just killing Russia and China influence? Or would we actually be aiming to kill corruption?

In recent memory, it looks like our success rate is pretty low. The only success story I can think of is Kosovo. Which was a pretty small region/country with a weak opposition.

To me, we might have the capital to help Africa. But I don't think we have the manpower. Sounds like more "forever wars".

I can't speak with real expertise here, but I know the US has a LOT of Special Operations soldiers throughout Africa, where I assume we are doing similar, but not the same, kind of proxy war stuff that China and the USSR are doing.

Africa has a history of corruption. Probably a legacy of colonialism, probably other factors. It will be interesting to see what plays out where corrupt regimes engage with the corrupt regimes of China & Russia. Is the USA free of corruption (beside our obvious domestic corruption)? No. But for now, my understanding is that USA businesses are seen as more reliable partners. I'm not apologizing for any and all of them - there are bad actors. It's just seen as "more" reliable.

Not sure how this will play out. We spend a sh*t ton of money on the military and care about foreign policy, such as whatever you want to call what will happen in Africa to be, but the Chinese are VERY motivated to spread their influence as well and have LOTS of troops there doing the same kind of "engineering" and "civil affairs" etc. I mean, they'll need a supply of cheap labor and another market for their goods, no less all the raw materials.

Lastly, and this is very small sample size, so who knows, but speaking to some Africans recently from the continent, many of them seem pretty resentful of the way the Chinese operate there.

Apparently the USA or the west aren't the lone imperial actors. As if that isn't obvious to anyone who has cracked open a world history book that goes back any further than 1900.

[Stannis]

Spoiler:

I can't speak with real expertise here, but I know the US has a LOT of Special Operations soldiers throughout Africa, where I assume we are doing similar, but not the same, kind of proxy war stuff that China and the USSR are doing.

Africa has a history of corruption. Probably a legacy of colonialism, probably other factors. It will be interesting to see what plays out where corrupt regimes engage with the corrupt regimes of China & Russia. Is the USA free of corruption (beside our obvious domestic corruption)? No. But for now, my understanding is that USA businesses are seen as more reliable partners. I'm not apologizing for any and all of them - there are bad actors. It's just seen as "more" reliable.

Not sure how this will play out. We spend a sh*t ton of money on the military and care about foreign policy, such as whatever you want to call what will happen in Africa to be, but the Chinese are VERY motivated to spread their influence as well and have LOTS of troops there doing the same kind of "engineering" and "civil affairs" etc. I mean, they'll need a supply of cheap labor and another market for their goods, no less all the raw materials.

Lastly, and this is very small sample size, so who knows, but speaking to some Africans recently from the continent, many of them seem pretty resentful of the way the Chinese operate there.

Apparently the USA or the west aren't the lone imperial actors. As if that isn't obvious to anyone who has cracked open a world history book that goes back any further than 1900.

Thanks Buzz.

I've been reading about China's "Belt and Road Initiative" for a while. The criticism of US is we spread our influence through drones and bombs (I know that's not 100% the case, but enough people believe it). While China does it by building these countries new roads and stadiums. So I feel they get a better reputation for their imperialist actions, even though their long-term intentions are most likely worse than the USA's.

North and Central Africa is resource heavy, which is the only reason China and Russia have their eyes on them imo. That's what really fueled the Nazis in WW2, and I think that's what China and Russia want.

I still don't know how the US can stop all this. I feel it's pretty hopeless here tbh.

[Zenzibar]

Spoiler:

I can't speak with real expertise here, but I know the US has a LOT of Special Operations soldiers throughout Africa, where I assume we are doing similar, but not the same, kind of proxy war stuff that China and the USSR are doing.

Africa has a history of corruption. Probably a legacy of colonialism, probably other factors. It will be interesting to see what plays out where corrupt regimes engage with the corrupt regimes of China & Russia. Is the USA free of corruption (beside our obvious domestic corruption)? No. But for now, my understanding is that USA businesses are seen as more reliable partners. I'm not apologizing for any and all of them - there are bad actors. It's just seen as "more" reliable.

Not sure how this will play out. We spend a sh*t ton of money on the military and care about foreign policy, such as whatever you want to call what will happen in Africa to be, but the Chinese are VERY motivated to spread their influence as well and have LOTS of troops there doing the same kind of "engineering" and "civil affairs" etc. I mean, they'll need a supply of cheap labor and another market for their goods, no less all the raw materials.

Lastly, and this is very small sample size, so who knows, but speaking to some Africans recently from the continent, many of them seem pretty resentful of the way the Chinese operate there.

Apparently the USA or the west aren't the lone imperial actors. As if that isn't obvious to anyone who has cracked open a world history book that goes back any further than 1900.

Thanks Buzz.

I've been reading about China's "Belt and Road Initiative" for a while. The criticism of US is we spread our influence through drones and bombs (I know that's not 100% the case, but enough people believe it). While China does it by building these countries new roads and stadiums. So I feel they get a better reputation for their imperialist actions, even though their long-term intentions are most likely worse than the USA's.

North and Central Africa is resource heavy, which is the only reason China and Russia have their eyes on them imo. That's what really fueled the Nazis in WW2, and I think that's what China and Russia want.

I still don't know how the US can stop all this. I feel it's pretty hopeless here tbh.

Maybe we can stop it by "protecting" it for PhillipsConoco?

[HarthorneWingo]

Spoiler:

I can't speak with real expertise here, but I know the US has a LOT of Special Operations soldiers throughout Africa, where I assume we are doing similar, but not the same, kind of proxy war stuff that China and the USSR are doing.

Africa has a history of corruption. Probably a legacy of colonialism, probably other factors. It will be interesting to see what plays out where corrupt regimes engage with the corrupt regimes of China & Russia. Is the USA free of corruption (beside our obvious domestic corruption)? No. But for now, my understanding is that USA businesses are seen as more reliable partners. I'm not apologizing for any and all of them - there are bad actors. It's just seen as "more" reliable.

Not sure how this will play out. We spend a sh*t ton of money on the military and care about foreign policy, such as whatever you want to call what will happen in Africa to be, but the Chinese are VERY motivated to spread their influence as well and have LOTS of troops there doing the same kind of "engineering" and "civil affairs" etc. I mean, they'll need a supply of cheap labor and another market for their goods, no less all the raw materials.

Lastly, and this is very small sample size, so who knows, but speaking to some Africans recently from the continent, many of them seem pretty resentful of the way the Chinese operate there.

Apparently the USA or the west aren't the lone imperial actors. As if that isn't obvious to anyone who has cracked open a world history book that goes back any further than 1900.

Thanks Buzz.

I've been reading about China's "Belt and Road Initiative" for a while. The criticism of US is we spread our influence through drones and bombs (I know that's not 100% the case, but enough people believe it). While China does it by building these countries new roads and stadiums. So I feel they get a better reputation for their imperialist actions, even though their long-term intentions are most likely worse than the USA's.

North and Central Africa is resource heavy, which is the only reason China and Russia have their eyes on them imo. That's what really fueled the Nazis in WW2, and I think that's what China and Russia want.

I still don't know how the US can stop all this. I feel it's pretty hopeless here tbh.

Maybe we can stop it by "protecting" it for PhillipsConoco?

My thought is that this is exactly what will happen. Apparently, there are some important mineral resources there (I read something about this specifically with respect to Niger, recently). Somehow, I don't expect us to just walk away from this. You know, "American interests" and all that.

[Zenzibar]

Thanks Buzz.

I've been reading about China's "Belt and Road Initiative" for a while. The criticism of US is we spread our influence through drones and bombs (I know that's not 100% the case, but enough people believe it). While China does it by building these countries new roads and stadiums. So I feel they get a better reputation for their imperialist actions, even though their long-term intentions are most likely worse than the USA's.

North and Central Africa is resource heavy, which is the only reason China and Russia have their eyes on them imo. That's what really fueled the Nazis in WW2, and I think that's what China and Russia want.

I still don't know how the US can stop all this. I feel it's pretty hopeless here tbh.

Maybe we can stop it by "protecting" it for PhillipsConoco?

My thought is that this is exactly what will happen. Apparently, there are some important mineral resources there (I read something about this specifically with respect to Niger, recently). Somehow, I don't expect us to just walk away from this. You know, "American interests" and all that.

For sure.

I don't know what's worse for these wealthy African countries. One wannabe master or 3 wannabe masters? All that is done is keep Africa from uniting under one Flag and one government through proxy wars.

Just saying, 3-4 unified countries within the continent of Africa, would be a nightmare for the big 3.

[HarthorneWingo]

Maybe we can stop it by "protecting" it for PhillipsConoco?

My thought is that this is exactly what will happen. Apparently, there are some important mineral resources there (I read something about this specifically with respect to Niger, recently). Somehow, I don't expect us to just walk away from this. You know, "American interests" and all that.

For sure.

I don't know what's worse for these wealthy African countries. One wannabe master or 3 wannabe masters? All that is done is keep Africa from uniting under one Flag and one government through proxy wars.

Just saying, 3-4 unified countries within the continent of Africa, would be a nightmare for the big 3.

Greed and corruption. Why can't these African countries just come up with a mandatory bidding process to ensure that they get the best deals? Oh wait ... but then the top officials can't get their bribe money. Got it.

[Zenzibar]

My thought is that this is exactly what will happen. Apparently, there are some important mineral resources there (I read something about this specifically with respect to Niger, recently). Somehow, I don't expect us to just walk away from this. You know, "American interests" and all that.

For sure.

I don't know what's worse for these wealthy African countries. One wannabe master or 3 wannabe masters? All that is done is keep Africa from uniting under one Flag and one government through proxy wars.

Just saying, 3-4 unified countries within the continent of Africa, would be a nightmare for the big 3.

Greed and corruption. Why can't these African countries just come up with a mandatory bidding process to ensure that they get the best deals? Oh wait ... but then the top officials can't get their bribe money. Got it.

[drekwins]

The Russians are very good people who aren't imperialists like the USA. Russia and China should have free reign to do whatever they want in Africa north, central or south, because anything and everything they do will be out of the goodness of their hearts and with only the best interests of the various African governments and especially the many different African people.

Unlike the evil USA, the avatar of all that is bad.

Let them have at it. Them and China. Will work out great.

Buzz, I agree with a lot of this. Since you seem to have a lot of knowledge and experience here, let me ask you something though.

Do you think USA would have a decent success rate in a place like mid/central Africa? And what would the goal here be? Just killing Russia and China influence? Or would we actually be aiming to kill corruption?

In recent memory, it looks like our success rate is pretty low. The only success story I can think of is Kosovo. Which was a pretty small region/country with a weak opposition.

To me, we might have the capital to help Africa. But I don't think we have the manpower. Sounds like more "forever wars".

I think the first step is to understand what is happening in Africa (and elsewhere). A lot of people hear "coup" and they assume that it was performed by people within that country. That is not always the case. There is an islamist revolution happening that is being funded by larger islamic states, China and Russia. There is a proxy imperialist coup taking place all over Africa, sponsored by Russia, China and Islamic states. They are overthrowing democratically elected presidents. This is a real problem that America has to figure out a response to. These are not simply civil wars.

At the same time, China is building islands, etc. There is a very aggressive attempt to re-shape the world... and a lot of the Western World is slow to process what that means or what is truly at stake.

The problem is that the citizens of many Western countries are naive. They've been removed from the personal effects of war for so many years/generations, that it's difficult for them to fathom other powers that want to take over the world. They simple have not experienced what that means.

Russia/China is attempting a global revolution in any area that they see possible. Putin wants to re-create the world with as much Russian territory, and Russian friendly territory as possible, and he will attack the weakest areas to do so. China has adopted the same exact mindset.

[Stannis]

**** is about to go down

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Read on Twitter

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[Stannis]

Watch on YouTube

[Zenzibar]

Watch on YouTube

The French fighting Africans now?

[Stannis]

Watch on YouTube

The French fighting Africans now?

Maybe. At least the ones Russia is supporting.

France has been taking a more lenient stance on the Russia-Ukraine war. So it looks like they will be forced to go all in now.

But it's also France. So maybe they go ahead and surrender.

[HarthorneWingo]

Watch on YouTube

The French fighting Africans now?

Maybe. At least the ones Russia is supporting.

France has been taking a more lenient stance on the Russia-Ukraine war. So it looks like they will be forced to go all in now.

But it's also France. So maybe they go ahead and surrender.

Hey, c'mon now. Let's not forget that we'd probably still be a British colony if it wasn't for the French. That's a debt that's almost never paid off on the street.

[Stannis]

Hey, c'mon now. Let's not forget that we'd probably still be a British colony if it wasn't for the French. That's a debt that's almost never paid off on the street.

That was a long time ago. Completely different country now.

They've been closet Russian sympathizers (Serbia sympathizers too when it came to the Bosnia and Kosovo genocides). While also being Anti-Islam. Which is why I wouldn't be surprised if they just said eff it and gave up on Niger.

I believe Niger has been supplying France with Uranium, but that's a pretty abundant resource and not enough to keep France sticking around.

[HarthorneWingo]

Hey, c'mon now. Let's not forget that we'd probably still be a British colony if it wasn't for the French. That's a debt that's almost never paid off on the street.

That was a long time ago. Completely different country now.

They've been closet Russian sympathizers (Serbia sympathizers too when it came to the Bosnia and Kosovo genocides). While also being Anti-Islam as well. Which is why I wouldn't be surprised if they just said eff it and gave up on Niger.

I believe Niger has been supplying France with Uranium, but that's a pretty abundant resource and not enough to keep France sticking around.

Sacreblue!

I thought that there was another precious mineral there that have Russia and the Chinese there.

[Stannis]

Hey, c'mon now. Let's not forget that we'd probably still be a British colony if it wasn't for the French. That's a debt that's almost never paid off on the street.

That was a long time ago. Completely different country now.

They've been closet Russian sympathizers (Serbia sympathizers too when it came to the Bosnia and Kosovo genocides). While also being Anti-Islam as well. Which is why I wouldn't be surprised if they just said eff it and gave up on Niger.

I believe Niger has been supplying France with Uranium, but that's a pretty abundant resource and not enough to keep France sticking around.

Sacreblue!

I thought that there was another precious mineral there that have Russia and the Chinese there.

I'm not sure what else there could be there. Talking to my stock/commodity buddies, they don't think this conflict will affect much (if any) commodity prices.

Congo is really big when it comes to cobalt. This is a big requirement for EVs. And they are responsible for 70% of the world's supply. Not sure if you were thinking of this one?

China is big on nickel and iron ore which is all over Africa.

[HarthorneWingo]

That was a long time ago. Completely different country now.

They've been closet Russian sympathizers (Serbia sympathizers too when it came to the Bosnia and Kosovo genocides). While also being Anti-Islam as well. Which is why I wouldn't be surprised if they just said eff it and gave up on Niger.

I believe Niger has been supplying France with Uranium, but that's a pretty abundant resource and not enough to keep France sticking around.

Sacreblue!

I thought that there was another precious mineral there that have Russia and the Chinese there.

I'm not sure what else there could be there. Talking to my stock/commodity buddies, they don't think this conflict will affect much (if any) commodity prices.

Congo is really big when it comes to cobalt. This is a big requirement for EVs. And they are responsible for 70% of the world's supply. Not sure if you were thinking of this one?

China is big on nickel and iron ore which is all over Africa.

Probably cobalt. Thanks.

[HarthorneWingo]

Read on Twitter

?s=46

[MrDollarBills]

Spoiler:

I can't speak with real expertise here, but I know the US has a LOT of Special Operations soldiers throughout Africa, where I assume we are doing similar, but not the same, kind of proxy war stuff that China and the USSR are doing.

Africa has a history of corruption. Probably a legacy of colonialism, probably other factors. It will be interesting to see what plays out where corrupt regimes engage with the corrupt regimes of China & Russia. Is the USA free of corruption (beside our obvious domestic corruption)? No. But for now, my understanding is that USA businesses are seen as more reliable partners. I'm not apologizing for any and all of them - there are bad actors. It's just seen as "more" reliable.

Not sure how this will play out. We spend a sh*t ton of money on the military and care about foreign policy, such as whatever you want to call what will happen in Africa to be, but the Chinese are VERY motivated to spread their influence as well and have LOTS of troops there doing the same kind of "engineering" and "civil affairs" etc. I mean, they'll need a supply of cheap labor and another market for their goods, no less all the raw materials.

Lastly, and this is very small sample size, so who knows, but speaking to some Africans recently from the continent, many of them seem pretty resentful of the way the Chinese operate there.

Apparently the USA or the west aren't the lone imperial actors. As if that isn't obvious to anyone who has cracked open a world history book that goes back any further than 1900.

Thanks Buzz.

I've been reading about China's "Belt and Road Initiative" for a while. The criticism of US is we spread our influence through drones and bombs (I know that's not 100% the case, but enough people believe it). While China does it by building these countries new roads and stadiums. So I feel they get a better reputation for their imperialist actions, even though their long-term intentions are most likely worse than the USA's.

North and Central Africa is resource heavy, which is the only reason China and Russia have their eyes on them imo. That's what really fueled the Nazis in WW2, and I think that's what China and Russia want.

I still don't know how the US can stop all this. I feel it's pretty hopeless here tbh.

China offers to build infrastructure to 3rd world countries in exchange for debt enslavement. They're doing this right now in The Caribbean and South America.

[thebuzzardman]

Spoiler:

I can't speak with real expertise here, but I know the US has a LOT of Special Operations soldiers throughout Africa, where I assume we are doing similar, but not the same, kind of proxy war stuff that China and the USSR are doing.

Africa has a history of corruption. Probably a legacy of colonialism, probably other factors. It will be interesting to see what plays out where corrupt regimes engage with the corrupt regimes of China & Russia. Is the USA free of corruption (beside our obvious domestic corruption)? No. But for now, my understanding is that USA businesses are seen as more reliable partners. I'm not apologizing for any and all of them - there are bad actors. It's just seen as "more" reliable.

Not sure how this will play out. We spend a sh*t ton of money on the military and care about foreign policy, such as whatever you want to call what will happen in Africa to be, but the Chinese are VERY motivated to spread their influence as well and have LOTS of troops there doing the same kind of "engineering" and "civil affairs" etc. I mean, they'll need a supply of cheap labor and another market for their goods, no less all the raw materials.

Lastly, and this is very small sample size, so who knows, but speaking to some Africans recently from the continent, many of them seem pretty resentful of the way the Chinese operate there.

Apparently the USA or the west aren't the lone imperial actors. As if that isn't obvious to anyone who has cracked open a world history book that goes back any further than 1900.

Thanks Buzz.

I've been reading about China's "Belt and Road Initiative" for a while. The criticism of US is we spread our influence through drones and bombs (I know that's not 100% the case, but enough people believe it). While China does it by building these countries new roads and stadiums. So I feel they get a better reputation for their imperialist actions, even though their long-term intentions are most likely worse than the USA's.

North and Central Africa is resource heavy, which is the only reason China and Russia have their eyes on them imo. That's what really fueled the Nazis in WW2, and I think that's what China and Russia want.

I still don't know how the US can stop all this. I feel it's pretty hopeless here tbh.

China offers to build infrastructure to 3rd world countries in exchange for debt enslavement. They're doing this right now in The Caribbean and South America.

It's a hilariously old imperialistic trick, one the US of A etc has done via the World Bank.

Yet somehow when China does it, it's fine.
Either it's fine or it's not.