What do you expect from Ron Baker , Frank Ntilikina, Ramon Sessions and the point guard position as a whole in 2017-18?

[Iron Mantis]

I expect sessions to start, Out of respect for his seniority
I don't expect he will play more than 15 minutes a night or so

Baker will probably be the number one option for us to get a look at
His defense and willingness to pass have earned him playing time
Especially when we're not that concerned with putting up a lot of points

And I think Frank will be brought along slowly
He'll get time at shooting guard and point guard

This crap again? Might as well go get Jose back.

[NoLayupRule]

I expect sessions to start, Out of respect for his seniority
I don't expect he will play more than 15 minutes a night or so

Baker will probably be the number one option for us to get a look at
His defense and willingness to pass have earned him playing time
Especially when we're not that concerned with putting up a lot of points

And I think Frank will be brought along slowly
He'll get time at shooting guard and point guard

This crap again? Might as well go get Jose back.

Cry all you want but this is what I expect to happen based on decades of watching the NBA

[DOT]

I expect sessions to start, Out of respect for his seniority
I don't expect he will play more than 15 minutes a night or so

Baker will probably be the number one option for us to get a look at
His defense and willingness to pass have earned him playing time
Especially when we're not that concerned with putting up a lot of points

And I think Frank will be brought along slowly
He'll get time at shooting guard and point guard

This crap again? Might as well go get Jose back.

Cry all you want but this is what I expect to happen based on decades of watching the NBA

I think they're waiting to see what happens in camp and preseason, but I'd say Baker has a good shot to start seeing as how much Jeff likes him, and that he's the highest paid of the three

[dakomish23]

I just hope that these guys are efficient. They don't have to score a lot, just do what the situations call for: run the offense, hit the open shots, make the extra pass, limit turnovers/mental errors and play defense. Just don't try and do too much. We have plenty of other players/vets to take shots.

I'm with you on Sessions and Baker. But you don't want Frank to be aggressive, even by the end of next season? I'm not asking him to pull a DRose and go for buckets only non stop. Just hope he doesn't defer too much.

[HarthorneWingo]

I just hope that these guys are efficient. They don't have to score a lot, just do what the situations call for: run the offense, hit the open shots, make the extra pass, limit turnovers/mental errors and play defense. Just don't try and do too much. We have plenty of other players/vets to take shots.

I'm with you on Sessions and Baker. But you don't want Frank to be aggressive, even by the end of next season? I'm not asking him to pull a DRose and go for buckets only non stop. Just hope he doesn't defer too much.

Oh sure if it's in the natural order of his progression this year. As he finds his confidence I'd love to see him spreading his wings. That would be exciting. Now see what you just did? LOL. I refuse to put high expectations on this kid so early especially given all the BS that's going on with Melo and KP.

He'll probably be hitting that rookie wall sometime in March.

[Basketball1981]

I personally view Ron Baker as a fringe NBA player. I don't know if he makes a good team's roster. His talent is very limited IMO. I think after the two year deal he'll be likely out of the league.

Sessions will provide a veteran presence. I think 8points/4assists in 20minutes is kinda realistic.

Ntilikina I'm not sure what to expect. I actually thought that his body has yet to grow into NBA readiness but watching that practice clip with THjr made me correct my stance there. He actually looks very mature and strong for a 19 year old. I think 20 minutes along with good defense, a couple assists and 5-8 points on offense is realistic. I think anything exceeding that would be absolutely great. Realistically, I wouldn't expect more than 7 points/ 3assists on solid shooting. I will actually be more eager to see what his shooting is like. IMO, that's the most crucial point. Going by his mentality and physical tools , we all know hes gonna be a good defender, team player and likely solid passer. His ability to knock down open shots on a high clip is what is gonna determine whether he'll "only" be a good bench player/solid starter or eventually develop into a star player (not talking all-star or superstar but just star player, like Jeff Teague level).

[thebuzzardman]

20 mpg is sort of the standard "How many minutes do you think a rookie who is young and needs to develop gets"

If Frank averages more, even a couple more, he's head of the curve. Being around 28 mpg, he'd be WAY ahead of the curve.

Less, and it could be a concern, but really, how much less. If they are having trouble finding more than 10 mpg on a bad team, bit of an issue, maybe.

[xNewYorkMadex]

It'll be dumb if we start Sessions.

Sessions has been a backup as soon as he entered the NBA. Hes been a spot starter his entire career, 143 starts out of 663 games played. Even if Frank plays incredibly bad during training camp and preseason, I'd rather start Baker over Sessions.

I wouldnt look to baby Frank. They already babied him by coming off the bench in the French league. KP wasnt supposed to look good at all in his rookie year but we still started him. I dont think Frank is a raw prospect that needs to come off the bench. Lets see what hes got. We are a rebuilding team, play the young guys and lets get to work.

Hernangomez/KP/Melo/Hardaway/Frank should be our opening lineup.

I wont be surprised if Noah gets the starting C spot though. Like NLR was saying earlier, hes the candidate that gets the start out of seniority and respect. Dont see it with Sessions. Noah has been a steady starter throughout his career and has actually accomplished things in the league unlike Sessions.

[Adelheid]

It'll be dumb if we start Sessions.

Sessions has been a backup as soon as he entered the NBA. Hes been a spot starter his entire career, 143 starts out of 663 games played. Even if Frank plays incredibly bad during training camp and preseason, I'd rather start Baker over Sessions.

I wouldnt look to baby Frank. They already babied him by coming off the bench in the French league. KP wasnt supposed to look good at all in his rookie year but we still started him. I dont think Frank is a raw prospect that needs to come off the bench. Lets see what hes got. We are a rebuilding team, play the young guys and lets get to work.

Hernangomez/KP/Melo/Hardaway/Frank should be our opening lineup.

I wont be surprised if Noah gets the starting C spot though. Like NLR was saying earlier, hes the candidate that gets the start out of seniority and respect. Dont see it with Sessions. Noah has been a steady starter throughout his career and has actually accomplished things in the league unlike Sessions.

If Noah starts then that sounds good for the tank since he really cant contribute anything worthwhile at this point.

[dakomish23]

I just hope that these guys are efficient. They don't have to score a lot, just do what the situations call for: run the offense, hit the open shots, make the extra pass, limit turnovers/mental errors and play defense. Just don't try and do too much. We have plenty of other players/vets to take shots.

I'm with you on Sessions and Baker. But you don't want Frank to be aggressive, even by the end of next season? I'm not asking him to pull a DRose and go for buckets only non stop. Just hope he doesn't defer too much.

Oh sure if it's in the natural order of his progression this year. As he finds his confidence I'd love to see him spreading his wings. That would be exciting. Now see what you just did? LOL. I refuse to put high expectations on this kid so early especially given all the BS that's going on with Melo and KP.

He'll probably be hitting that rookie wall sometime in March.

That's a smart policy. I'm all for the steady progression. I just don't want to see him defer too much. I want this to be a growth and development year from the organization. Let's hope they feel that way.

[dakomish23]

20 mpg is sort of the standard "How many minutes do you think a rookie who is young and needs to develop gets"

If Frank averages more, even a couple more, he's head of the curve. Being around 28 mpg, he'd be WAY ahead of the curve.

Less, and it could be a concern, but really, how much less. If they are having trouble finding more than 10 mpg on a bad team, bit of an issue, maybe.

KP was at 28.4 so that fits the theory.

[Jeff Van Gully]

I expect sessions to start, Out of respect for his seniority
I don't expect he will play more than 15 minutes a night or so

Baker will probably be the number one option for us to get a look at
His defense and willingness to pass have earned him playing time
Especially when we're not that concerned with putting up a lot of points

And I think Frank will be brought along slowly
He'll get time at shooting guard and point guard

This crap again? Might as well go get Jose back.

Cry all you want but this is what I expect to happen based on decades of watching the NBA

sessions is soooooo the starter, at least at the beginning of the season. he may take a backseat, but they're not throwing frank right into the fire.

the whole point of signing sessions was to show frank how to handle all of this. he won't need much, but you at least get this out of sessions.

this is all for frank. all for his own good.

[Jeff Van Gully]

20 mpg is sort of the standard "How many minutes do you think a rookie who is young and needs to develop gets"

If Frank averages more, even a couple more, he's head of the curve. Being around 28 mpg, he'd be WAY ahead of the curve.

Less, and it could be a concern, but really, how much less. If they are having trouble finding more than 10 mpg on a bad team, bit of an issue, maybe.

KP was at 28.4 so that fits the theory.

i think frank finds 24 mpg out of the gate. at least 12 of them spelling sessions at the 1. he'll play off the ball some too.

[NoLayupRule]

This crap again? Might as well go get Jose back.

Cry all you want but this is what I expect to happen based on decades of watching the NBA

sessions is soooooo the starter, at least at the beginning of the season. he may take a backseat, but they're not throwing frank right into the fire.

the whole point of signing sessions was to show frank how to handle all of this. he won't need much, but you at least get this out of sessions.

this is all for frank. all for his own good.

Right?

For some reason people can't handle simple reality around here at times

[moocow007]

Considering that it looks like the Knicks can wiggle another roster spot up to sign another PG (you can argue Baker is just a guard and can be plugged in at either SG or PG), here's a short list of some of the remaining free agent "point guards" (or guys that can play the point) that may be worth adding to the team in lieu of someone like Chasson Randle (there's only so many "raw young point guard" types you can have on a team at one time):

Deron Williams
Monta Ellis
Randy Foye
CJ Watson
Leandro Barbosa
Aaron Brooks
Trey Burke
Rodney Stuckey
Jason Terry
Beno Udrih

There are a handful of other guys but they have already signed overseas so I didn't include them. Trey Burke I have on the list but he's hardly a "seasoned" player and has been a flub of sorts considering where he was drafted. Also if the goal is Ntilikina is your man not sure why Burke would be brought in as he doesn't offer much in the way of proven production or NBA leadership.

If the Knicks aren't interested in the potential drama that can come with guys like Deron Williams, Monta Ellis, etc., and instead is looking for someone that is considered a great vet, that has shown a long NBA track record as a reserve guard and who can shoot a little maybe CJ Watson would be a good "other mentor" type that could provide some coverage minutes wise.

[Iron Mantis]

Cry all you want but this is what I expect to happen based on decades of watching the NBA

sessions is soooooo the starter, at least at the beginning of the season. he may take a backseat, but they're not throwing frank right into the fire.

the whole point of signing sessions was to show frank how to handle all of this. he won't need much, but you at least get this out of sessions.

this is all for frank. all for his own good.

Right?

For some reason people can't handle simple reality around here at times

It's true that they probably will not start Frank, but I am interested in your thoughts as to why is it better for his development to come off of the bench on this team as opposed to playing most of his minutes with KP.

From the small sample I've seen, the kid has a legit NBA-ready body and skill-set. His defense will have an immediate impact. He's been playing pro ball with adults. The offense will supposedly be heavy on player and ball movement so Frank will not have to dominate the ball.

There's no pressure on him at all as the Knicks are in full-rebuild mode. KP was thrown into the fire in a season where the guys actually had playoff aspirations and he turned out fine.

[Jeff Van Gully]

sessions is soooooo the starter, at least at the beginning of the season. he may take a backseat, but they're not throwing frank right into the fire.

the whole point of signing sessions was to show frank how to handle all of this. he won't need much, but you at least get this out of sessions.

this is all for frank. all for his own good.

Right?

For some reason people can't handle simple reality around here at times

It's true that they probably will not start Frank, but I am interested in your thoughts as to why is it better for his development to come off of the bench on this team as opposed to playing most of his minutes with KP.

From the small sample I've seen, the kid has a legit NBA-ready body and skill-set. His defense will have an immediate impact. He's been playing pro ball with adults. The offense will supposedly be heavy on player and ball movement so Frank will not have to dominate the ball.

There's no pressure on him at all as the Knicks are in full-rebuild mode. KP was thrown into the fire in a season where the guys actually had playoff aspirations and he turned out fine.

preseason will probably tell us what we need to know. but chances are a PG this young coming from a world away would benefit from a little bit of kid gloves and leadership by example at first.

on the other hand, not sure what the rush is to have him square up against the chris pauls and russell westbrooks of the world when you have access to a buffer who is clearly amenable to the concept.

[NoLayupRule]

sessions is soooooo the starter, at least at the beginning of the season. he may take a backseat, but they're not throwing frank right into the fire.

the whole point of signing sessions was to show frank how to handle all of this. he won't need much, but you at least get this out of sessions.

this is all for frank. all for his own good.

Right?

For some reason people can't handle simple reality around here at times

It's true that they probably will not start Frank, but I am interested in your thoughts as to why is it better for his development to come off of the bench on this team as opposed to playing most of his minutes with KP.

From the small sample I've seen, the kid has a legit NBA-ready body and skill-set. His defense will have an immediate impact. He's been playing pro ball with adults. The offense will supposedly be heavy on player and ball movement so Frank will not have to dominate the ball.

There's no pressure on him at all as the Knicks are in full-rebuild mode. KP was thrown into the fire in a season where the guys actually had playoff aspirations and he turned out fine.

If you've ever done any sports or athletics you probably know how important confidences and knowledge is in your performance

We see it every year
There are a couple exceptions. Usually very high draft picks. Or sometimes 4 year players.
But for the most part it takes young players literally years before they find their role in the NBA
That's why almost without exception you don't see young teams winning very many games and certainly not championships

For Frank's development I honestly believe he will be best suited playing in minutes where he can thrive and prove his value in front of the garden crowd not playing minutes set up for him to fail and possibly grow through that failure

[dakomish23]

Considering that it looks like the Knicks can wiggle another roster spot up to sign another PG (you can argue Baker is just a guard and can be plugged in at either SG or PG), here's a short list of some of the remaining free agent "point guards" (or guys that can play the point) that may be worth adding to the team in lieu of someone like Chasson Randle (there's only so many "raw young point guard" types you can have on a team at one time):

Deron Williams
Monta Ellis
Randy Foye
CJ Watson
Leandro Barbosa
Aaron Brooks
Trey Burke
Rodney Stuckey
Jason Terry
Beno Udrih

There are a handful of other guys but they have already signed overseas so I didn't include them. Trey Burke I have on the list but he's hardly a "seasoned" player and has been a flub of sorts considering where he was drafted. Also if the goal is Ntilikina is your man not sure why Burke would be brought in as he doesn't offer much in the way of proven production or NBA leadership.

If the Knicks aren't interested in the potential drama that can come with guys like Deron Williams, Monta Ellis, etc., and instead is looking for someone that is considered a great vet, that has shown a long NBA track record as a reserve guard and who can shoot a little maybe CJ Watson would be a good "other mentor" type that could provide some coverage minutes wise.

An article of Vogel's trust in Watson.

C.J. Watson’s subtle impact helping Orlando Magic

by Philip Rossman-Reich8 months agoFollow @philiprr_omd
C.J. Watson, Orlando Magic, P.J. Tucker, Phoenix Suns
C.J. Watson‘s statistics look poor this season. Yet Frank Vogel has continually turned to the veteran guard for his subtle impact on the floor.

C.J. Watson’s play is very much like his public personality.

Watson is relatively unassuming. He generally keeps quiet. His responses to the media — when they do ask for him — tend to be short and to the point. Watson stays on message and speaks somewhat in cliche and generalities. It is easy to forget Watson is around.

Watson’s seeming absence has characterized his two years in Orlando so far. He missed most of last season with a mysterious calf strain, keeping the veteran on the sidelines as the team’s season blossomed and unraveled. The Orlando Magic never got to see what he might provide the team as a steadying force and shooter.

This season, Watson got buried a bit in the rotation crunch. The Magic added Jodie Meeks at shooting guard and D.J. Augustin at point guard to push him out of the rotation. But with Evan Fournier injured, the Magic have turned to Watson somewhat controversially to fill those backup shooting guard minutes.

Watson is averaging 2.7 points per game and shooting a 36.2 percent effective field goal percentage. In his latest stint in the rotation the past six games, he is averaging 4.2 points per game and shooting 31.3 percent from the floor and an icy 17.6 percent from beyond the arc.

It is admittedly hard to justify his play by his individual statistics. He does not do a lot that impacts the box score. Eventually, his struggles hitting shots are going to push him out of the rotation. Almost certainly when Evan Fournier returns, his minutes will dry up. Yet Watson still plays a major role for the Magic.

The reason Watson plays is something different. It is not necessarily what he provides on a box score, but perhaps the versatility and knowledge he brings. Watson is rarely in the wrong spot on either end of the floor. He is not a player who is going to make a ton of mistakes.

His role is to settle things down and do something much more subtle.

“[C.J. and Damjan Rudez are] guys who know what they are doing,” coach Frank Vogel said last week. “On both ends of the court, they have great IQs. I told C.J. the other day that was most productive 0-for 4 performance [against Memphis] maybe I have ever seen. He played really well and didn’t make a shot.”

Watson concurred. He said his role is to come off the bench and bring energy, trying to change the pace of the game. His job is to “make shots, play hard on defense and try to keep everyone settled.”

Fans can certainly debate whether he does that successfully.

[Knicksfan1992]

Cry all you want but this is what I expect to happen based on decades of watching the NBA

sessions is soooooo the starter, at least at the beginning of the season. he may take a backseat, but they're not throwing frank right into the fire.

the whole point of signing sessions was to show frank how to handle all of this. he won't need much, but you at least get this out of sessions.

this is all for frank. all for his own good.

Right?

For some reason people can't handle simple reality around here at times

The Sixers doing what they did really warped a lot of people into thinking Rookies are supposed to start and play 30 minutes a game. Some are built for it, but most are not. There are so many factors that people behind a computer screen don't even realize go into a young player's development. Travel (France is the size of just Texas) , style of play, language barrier (for some), playing in big arenas vs. small stadiums in France, time zones etc. I'd be cool if Frank didn't start this whole year tbh. As the youngest kid in the draft we can afford to take our time with him. He won't be 21 until his 3rd year in the league...