Somebody’s got to go.

[dakomish23]

What's the problem here?
If we can't trade Lee we can just cut Baker or Kornet. Even Trey if we have to.

Our core future is KP, Dotson, Mitch, Trier, Knox, Frank and Vonleh (if we can sign him). Possibly Mudiay if he keeps playing like this and he agrees to a team-friendly contract.

All the rest can go.

Change of heart?

[dakomish23]

Hard to see Vonleh not getting a good offer if he's at this level in the summer. He's tough, smart, plays D, and is rounding out a pretty complete, if somewhat rough-edged, offensive attack.

What we needed was to have them all on options for next season, as Dot is.

He’s a bench big. I can’t even see him getting a 1 year MLE.

He’s been great, but last year ppl thought KOQ would get 10 per.

Bigs just are not going to get paid unless you’re a stud. Not after 2016.

[dakomish23]

The only guys worth keeping are the guys on their rookie deals.

Also happen to the the guys who we should keep and focus on b/c we are rebuilding.

We all know that’s not happening. Burke & THJ will be here till 2021 at the minimum.

[NoStatsGuy]

clearly dot over zo. we need 3 and d guys. not iso scorers. we shouldve learned.

waive ron baker or buy him out, then sign Trier and trade him as soon as its allowed. IF theres any value here.. just because he put up some 20 point games, doesnt mean he has value around the league.

Dot is a keeper

[Side beard]

Spoiler:

There’s an obvious log jam at the two guard. Because of the contract we signed Trier to, we're most at risk of losing him this offseason.

Lee is back and him and Tammy are going to eat most of the minutes at the 2/3.

I like Dotson for our team more then ISO ZO.

I don’t see how we couldn’t get a pick in the 15-21 range at this point for ZO.

Questions are
who should go?
Who has more value?
Are politics going to factor into Dot being traded not Zo if one is traded at all?

i'd much rather keep dotson than zo. although, based on this fan base with their love of players the last decade or so, they'd rather have a guy who will put up stats (Zo) than someone who will try to win and play defense (dotson).

this is where i have the knicks backcourt valued, compared to their contract, etc. and the other in which i'd like to keep these guys, as of now.

dotson: best backcourt player the knicks have, overall. although i don't think other teams value him as highly. compared to similar players, he should be a late lottery pick, but i doubt he gets anything better than the 20s, for a pick.
mudiay: i like what he's showing, but he may be looking to get paid. if he continues to play like this, i'd like to see him to something under $10 a year. but i'll wait til the end of the season to see if he can sustain this level of play. he may get a late first rounder, in the 20s.

trier: i'd like to keep him for now, but he doesn't play defense and ISOs way too much. if there's anything we've learned over the last decade, empty stats and ISOing doesn't win basketball, at all. doubt he'd get a lot back, at this point. teams are seeing what GSW is doing - team basketball, and defense - and how that produces wins, versus ISOing all the time, which, as we know, produces losing.

Spoiler:

frank: i'm not giving up on him yet, as i prefer defense over empty stats, unlike most people here. but i think he won't get much more than a later 1st round pick at this point. he just doesn't show any desire to play basketball. maybe he's just not a "rah, rah," in your face type of personality, which is fine. but he needs to show more on the court.
lee: there has to be a contender looking for a guy like him. OKC may be wanting him, with roberson having a pretty big set back in his rehab. just not sure what he looks like after his "injuries."
timmy: compared to others, his contract isn't looking AS bad as originally thought - although, it's still a disgusting signing. maybe there's a team that will take a shot at him, but i highly doubt it. i think the knicks are stuck with him until his contract expires, or on the final year.
burke: maybe, MAYBE a second round pick somewhere from a team without a PG
baker: lol. he's expiring, right?


i like lee better than trier and frank, but he may have less value, with his contract and all. i flip flop between frank and trier on who i'd rather keep, though.

He was undrafted. He has a lot more to prove than any of the other players.

[br7knicks]

Spoiler:

There’s an obvious log jam at the two guard. Because of the contract we signed Trier to, we're most at risk of losing him this offseason.

Lee is back and him and Tammy are going to eat most of the minutes at the 2/3.

I like Dotson for our team more then ISO ZO.

I don’t see how we couldn’t get a pick in the 15-21 range at this point for ZO.

Questions are
who should go?
Who has more value?
Are politics going to factor into Dot being traded not Zo if one is traded at all?

i'd much rather keep dotson than zo. although, based on this fan base with their love of players the last decade or so, they'd rather have a guy who will put up stats (Zo) than someone who will try to win and play defense (dotson).

this is where i have the knicks backcourt valued, compared to their contract, etc. and the other in which i'd like to keep these guys, as of now.

dotson: best backcourt player the knicks have, overall. although i don't think other teams value him as highly. compared to similar players, he should be a late lottery pick, but i doubt he gets anything better than the 20s, for a pick.
mudiay: i like what he's showing, but he may be looking to get paid. if he continues to play like this, i'd like to see him to something under $10 a year. but i'll wait til the end of the season to see if he can sustain this level of play. he may get a late first rounder, in the 20s.

trier: i'd like to keep him for now, but he doesn't play defense and ISOs way too much. if there's anything we've learned over the last decade, empty stats and ISOing doesn't win basketball, at all. doubt he'd get a lot back, at this point. teams are seeing what GSW is doing - team basketball, and defense - and how that produces wins, versus ISOing all the time, which, as we know, produces losing.

Spoiler:

frank: i'm not giving up on him yet, as i prefer defense over empty stats, unlike most people here. but i think he won't get much more than a later 1st round pick at this point. he just doesn't show any desire to play basketball. maybe he's just not a "rah, rah," in your face type of personality, which is fine. but he needs to show more on the court.
lee: there has to be a contender looking for a guy like him. OKC may be wanting him, with roberson having a pretty big set back in his rehab. just not sure what he looks like after his "injuries."
timmy: compared to others, his contract isn't looking AS bad as originally thought - although, it's still a disgusting signing. maybe there's a team that will take a shot at him, but i highly doubt it. i think the knicks are stuck with him until his contract expires, or on the final year.
burke: maybe, MAYBE a second round pick somewhere from a team without a PG
baker: lol. he's expiring, right?


i like lee better than trier and frank, but he may have less value, with his contract and all. i flip flop between frank and trier on who i'd rather keep, though.

He was undrafted. He has a lot more to prove than any of the other players.

you're right. but part of proving you belong is not taking the ball and guaranteeing you will be shooting it every time you get it, while freezing out open teammates.

trier isn't as bad as some guys that have put on a knicks uniform the last decade (starting with al harrington). but it'd also be nice if he could try to play some resemblance of defense as well. i'd keep guys like that.

[br7knicks]

clearly dot over zo. we need 3 and d guys. not iso scorers. we shouldve learned.

waive ron baker or buy him out, then sign Trier and trade him as soon as its allowed. IF theres any value here.. just because he put up some 20 point games, doesnt mean he has value around the league.

Dot is a keeper

definitely dot over trier. i don't know if i'd trade him just yet, unless the knicks are getting a CLEAR upgrade and steal over it. like, if atlanta offers their first round pick, then i'll drive trier myself.

but i don't want to give up on trier. while his strength is ISOing, he does have some moments where he passes the ball, and he plays with a lot of desire and fire, which i think should be a part of the new culture/environment of the knicks.

so unless it's a CLEAR upgrade, i don't know if i'd trade him just yet.

[br7knicks]

I hope you’re right but unless we can get expirings for Lee and the others even a few 2nd rd picks It’s not even worth trading them

don't lee and thomas become appealing expiring contracts next year? this is a throw away year, so why not keep and use them as an expiring next year?

i just feel bad because lee deserves to go to a contender. i like the way lance plays, but he's not worth that ~$7 million he's making

timmy has a player option, though, doesn't he? which sucks, because it'd be nice if he was expiring too. i don't think anyone will offer him anything remotely close to that after his current contract is up.

but, honestly, timmy's contract doesn't look too bad, when compared to others making more than him right now (especially significantly more). at this point, with recent reports, wall and timmy may have similar trade value - obviously not talent wise. but with wall making $40+ million per year, and timmy making $17 million, not sure how many are jumping on either guy.

If it were not for character issues, I would be ALL SORTS of about Timmy+Burke+Lee+Thomas for Wall. The problem is that he isn't being paid the 40M now so without a 17M EC to tie to him no way of making a salary neutral deal.

KP/Mitch
Zion
Durant/Knox
Dots/Frank
Wall/Trier
I think that juuuuuust fits no?

i don't think wall fits the time table, either. the only positive is that it unloads timmy, gets something for burke, allows lee to go to a different team (where i don't think he'd play, unless they move beal to the primary ball handler). losing lance would be, i feel, a negative, because i like his leadership and presence. just not his contract.

[Reign23]

the absolut best case would be trading timmy for an expiring. but there is not one team dumb enough to do this.

just a few weeks ago it might have been possible, but now no chance. And the worst of this situation is that not only does he make the most money, but he steals playing time from Dot, Trier and even Frank. he just sucks...

we might end up trading no one because the front office "likes" or even "loves" every player.

[TheGreenArrow]

clearly dot over zo. we need 3 and d guys. not iso scorers. we shouldve learned.

waive ron baker or buy him out, then sign Trier and trade him as soon as its allowed. IF theres any value here.. just because he put up some 20 point games, doesnt mean he has value around the league.

Dot is a keeper

definitely dot over trier. i don't know if i'd trade him just yet, unless the knicks are getting a CLEAR upgrade and steal over it. like, if atlanta offers their first round pick, then i'll drive trier myself.

but i don't want to give up on trier. while his strength is ISOing, he does have some moments where he passes the ball, and he plays with a lot of desire and fire, which i think should be a part of the new culture/environment of the knicks.

so unless it's a CLEAR upgrade, i don't know if i'd trade him just yet.

Yeah i agree. I believe zo can fit into a team oriented system seamlessly if given the opportunity.

We really dont run any type of sets offensively its more freelance so i wont judge trier as of yet in that aspect.

[Deeeez Knicks]

Keep Dot, Trier, Frank and Vonleh.

Move or let go Burke, Lee, Mario, Hardaway (although not happening).

Mudiay I don’t mind keeping for now, but I don’t think I’d resign him.

[Jeff Van Gully]

this thread title keeps making me think of

Spoiler:

Watch on YouTube

[JXL]

Burke to PHX for Suns 1st rounder via Milwaukee.

[Jeff Van Gully]

Burke to PHX for Suns 1st rounder via Milwaukee.

who says no?

Spoiler:

[Fat Kat]

Burke to PHX for Suns 1st rounder via Milwaukee.

Done

[Jeff Van Gully]

don't lee and thomas become appealing expiring contracts next year? this is a throw away year, so why not keep and use them as an expiring next year?

i just feel bad because lee deserves to go to a contender. i like the way lance plays, but he's not worth that ~$7 million he's making

timmy has a player option, though, doesn't he? which sucks, because it'd be nice if he was expiring too. i don't think anyone will offer him anything remotely close to that after his current contract is up.

but, honestly, timmy's contract doesn't look too bad, when compared to others making more than him right now (especially significantly more). at this point, with recent reports, wall and timmy may have similar trade value - obviously not talent wise. but with wall making $40+ million per year, and timmy making $17 million, not sure how many are jumping on either guy.

If it were not for character issues, I would be ALL SORTS of about Timmy+Burke+Lee+Thomas for Wall. The problem is that he isn't being paid the 40M now so without a 17M EC to tie to him no way of making a salary neutral deal.

KP/Mitch
Zion
Durant/Knox
Dots/Frank
Wall/Trier
I think that juuuuuust fits no?

i don't think wall fits the time table, either. the only positive is that it unloads timmy, gets something for burke, allows lee to go to a different team (where i don't think he'd play, unless they move beal to the primary ball handler). losing lance would be, i feel, a negative, because i like his leadership and presence. just not his contract.

john wall is not the second star you need. he's not even the second star washington needs. he's about to have the worst contract in the NBA for an immature locker room cancer.

love his skill set. but you might as well max out kemba.

[cuyankees]

Burke to PHX for Suns 1st rounder via Milwaukee.

1 can dream!

[cgf]

Signing Mudiay long term would be such a knicks thing to do.

Word. Do not want Bootiay

Agreed. If I was running this team I’d be calling Phoenix with a Mudiay + CHA SRP for Bender + MIL FRP (top 8 protected in 2020 & unprotected in 2021) offer every day until Sarver accepted or Mudiay’s hot streak ended.

I’m rooting for him to turn his career around, but I don’t want the Knicks gambling any of their capspace on that having happened.

[cgf]

Hard to see Vonleh not getting a good offer if he's at this level in the summer. He's tough, smart, plays D, and is rounding out a pretty complete, if somewhat rough-edged, offensive attack.

What we needed was to have them all on options for next season, as Dot is.

He’s a bench big. I can’t even see him getting a 1 year MLE.

He’s been great, but last year ppl thought KOQ would get 10 per.

Bigs just are not going to get paid unless you’re a stud. Not after 2016.

Though I agree that Vonleh is unlikely to get the full non-tax MLE from anyone, if he keeps this up he should have more interest than KOQ because of his versatility to guard giant wings like Giannis & LeBron on the perimeter, as well as protect the rim as a small ball 5. Add his newfound 3ball and he’s an ideal 7th or 8th man for the modern NBA if he keeps this up.

I’m becoming more & more convinced he’ll get the room exception that KOQ did.

[JXL]

I would give Vonleh a 3 yr deal on the mid-level exception, and Mudiay on a 2 yr on 1/2 the taxpayer exception.