JUST STOP IT!!

[GONYK]

I'm not saying Mike is above criticism. He's not perfect. Everyone knows that.

What I'm saying is that go to Dallas' board, they hate Carlise. Go to OKC's board, they hate Brooks. Laker fans were bashing Phil Jax last year. Celtic fans b*tch that Doc doesn't know what he's doing anymore. Spurs fans call Pop an idiot. Heat fans want Spo gone after every game that doesn't end in a 15 pt blowout. Basically, Chicago is the only team happy with their coach, but the rest of the league knows he can't coach offense for his life.

I don't know what this paragon of a coach you keep judging Mike against. You give him the players he needs, his team produces. His players stick up for him, and praise him years after playing for him. I'm not saying the dude is Red Auerbach, but seriously, you guys make it seem like he can't walk and chew gum at the same time. People make sh*t up to criticize him over.

Corey f*cking Brewer...

[Thugger HBC]

I can't stand D'antoni, but the players are rallying behind him, and with a complete roster they are playing much better.

Gotta credit the coach for that, and how far the team goes will be squarely on him.

[Deeeez Knicks]

D'Antoni did deserve a lot of the critiscm he got. A lot of us were screaming at him to play Novak and/or Lin. It wasn't rocket science. We just needed shooting and any pg better then Toney Douglas. He stuck with Bill Walker and Toney Douglas for what seemed like forever. There's a long history of that too. It was very frustrating as a fan how stubborn D'Antoni is sometimes.

Where I think he deserved a lot of critiscm, right now we look great and D'Antoni deserves a lot of credit. He has already proven he can win a lot of games. I still question whether he's the guy that can take us to the next level. Its little things like not knowing we have a foul to give that that can make the difference in the playoffs.

We have so many leaders on the court like Tyson, Lin, Jeffries, Melo and Amare that I think they help make up for some of D'Antoni's weakness's though as a players coach.

At the end of the day we are a pretty good team right now and anything can happen. Coaches can learn from there mistakes and become better coaches (like Doc, Carlise, etc). Lets see how it turns out.

[seren]

I heard on the radio that he will DNP some players to give more time to others. Did anyone catch that? Is this guy stupid or what? Why mess up with something good? The only guy I would DNP is Amare TBH.

[TKF]

I'm not saying Mike is above criticism. He's not perfect. Everyone knows that.

What I'm saying is that go to Dallas' board, they hate Carlise. Go to OKC's board, they hate Brooks. Laker fans were bashing Phil Jax last year. Celtic fans b*tch that Doc doesn't know what he's doing anymore. Spurs fans call Pop an idiot. Heat fans want Spo gone after every game that doesn't end in a 15 pt blowout. Basically, Chicago is the only team happy with their coach, but the rest of the league knows he can't coach offense for his life.

I don't know what this paragon of a coach you keep judging Mike against. You give him the players he needs, his team produces. His players stick up for him, and praise him years after playing for him. I'm not saying the dude is Red Auerbach, but seriously, you guys make it seem like he can't walk and chew gum at the same time. People make sh*t up to criticize him over.

Corey f*cking Brewer...

VERY GOOD POINT... I supported Dantoni from the standpoint that I never thought he was the main reason why we were losing. I hated the Dantoni scapegoating. Players play, and honestly, our players were underachieving... Dantoni has flaws, but he has proven with the talent, the right talent he can win a lot of games... Even with talent, a lot of coaches can't say that...

[GONYK]

I heard on the radio that he will DNP some players to give more time to others. Did anyone catch that? Is this guy stupid or what? Why mess up with something good? The only guy I would DNP is Amare TBH.

What he said is that he's going to play 10 guys, and they might not be the same 10 every night. Someone who logged minutes in one game may not get in the next, and vice versa.

i.e. Jeffries might get his minutes cut if he's fatigued, but Jorts will play.

What's wrong with that?

[Thugger HBC]

I heard on the radio that he will DNP some players to give more time to others. Did anyone catch that? Is this guy stupid or what? Why mess up with something good? The only guy I would DNP is Amare TBH.

He was saying that at the start of the season as well primarily to give guys rest.

It's a great idea to me, now that we have depth that is playing well, as other teams have been doing and haven't missed a beat.

Just like he could have rode with the bench against the Cavs, and gave all of his starters proper rest.

[Capn'O]

Utter nonsense about the Cavs game. What happened at the beginning was that the Cavs were still loose from the previous night's game and then Knicks were still thinking about applying their practice sessions... they hadn't adjusted yet. In the second half the team was loose, comfortable with the playbook, and ran the Cavs out of the gym.

Back to JUST STOP IT - those first two years of Knick teams that MDA had were awful. Just awful. David Lee was our best player and we essentially had 20 year olds and NoSharrington playing behind him. The roster overturned every 3 months as we were clearing out room for 2010.

With all of that, we had Lee playing like an All Star, Duhon playing like a mid-tier point guard, Gallo and Chandler improving and becoming valuable assets, and Harrington dropping 20/game - something he hadn't done before or since. We had our vets playing over their heads and our assets developing. Maybe there is a coach in the league that could have won 35 games with those teams. Maybe. But I saw a team that played hard and as well together as their talent allowed.


So JUST STOP IT with Mike. It's not what the team looks like at the beginning of the year but how we play at the end of the year that matters. Now that we're healthy and actually able to play his game, let's get this team humming and running on all cylinders and see how he calls it with a real team in the playoffs.

[Capn'O]

D'Antoni did deserve a lot of the critiscm he got. A lot of us were screaming at him to play Novak and/or Lin. It wasn't rocket science. We just needed shooting and any pg better then Toney Douglas. He stuck with Bill Walker and Toney Douglas for what seemed like forever. There's a long history of that too. It was very frustrating as a fan how stubborn D'Antoni is sometimes.

Where I think he deserved a lot of critiscm, right now we look great and D'Antoni deserves a lot of credit. He has already proven he can win a lot of games. I still question whether he's the guy that can take us to the next level. Its little things like not knowing we have a foul to give that that can make the difference in the playoffs.

We have so many leaders on the court like Tyson, Lin, Jeffries, Melo and Amare that I think they help make up for some of D'Antoni's weakness's though as a players coach.

At the end of the day we are a pretty good team right now and anything can happen. Coaches can learn from there mistakes and become better coaches (like Doc, Carlise, etc). Lets see how it turns out.

The flipside of that argument is that when these players finally do get the opportunity they are hungry and prepared. Maybe MDA waited too long on getting Lin into the lineup but by what? A week? The coaching staff built him up from a player with no confidence to a player comfortable going out their and executing the MDA offense.

Coaches that just throw their young players out there often times win more games immediately but it is fools gold in the long run. Like I said, MDA probably made a mistake of not playing Lin about a week earlier but the vast majority of the time it is ultimately in the player and team's interest to wait until they are ready.

[seren]

I see on ESPN twitter that someone presented a paper on keeping teams intact at Sloan Conference. Apparently, trading your roster every three months do not bring playoff success. Can't argue with that. Dallas finally figured that out last year.

[JohnStarksTheDunk]

Celtic fans b*tch that Doc doesn't know what he's doing anymore.

When I moved to Boston in 2006, fans here were complaining that Doc shouldn't be an NBA head coach. They made the playoffs his first year and then missed them the following season, and after winning only 24 games in 2006-2007, they wanted him fired, even though Pierce missed half of the season due to injury. Even after the Allen and KG trades, a lot of people thought he wasn't the right coach for that team. We all know what happened in 2007-2008, and after that Doc has been considered one of the best coaches in the league (though some C's fans are starting to turn on him again).

So did KG and Ray save Doc's job? Or was it Tom Thibodeau who "made" Rivers?

Or maybe it was the right mix of players and coaching staff.

[Capn'O]

This thread goes 4 pages?

Anyway, Mike Breen needs to "STOP IT!!" Carmelo had like one wing isolation last game, and Breen was talking about hearing groans from the crowd because he isolated. It was one freaking isolation play. He needs to do that in order to make the Knicks more versatile and therefore harder to defend. The crowd probably groaned because he missed the shot, or because maybe they felt he could have gotten to the basket if he decided to drive.

Carmelo Anthony was efficient shooting the ball last night, so the offense looked explosive. What hindered the offensive before was Melo's inefficient shooting (FG @ 39% on the season), not the fact that he isolated too much. Also, The Knicks offense was hindered by D'Antoni bad coaching decision of making Anthony a point forward. Anthony is not capable of running this team the way Lin and Davis can, and putting him in the role of facilitator hurt his offensive aggressiveness. The offense had a lot of 'Melo isolations' due to the fact that Douglas only knew two plays, throw it in the post to Carmelo and pass it back to the perimeter if I don't shoot it. Shumpert was the same way. Neither of the previous "PGs" ran the pick-and-roll with any type of frequency/consistency.

+1. Melo was fine.

[hanakuza]

more hating from Berman?

"Knicks' Davis Could Take Lin's Starting Spot"

http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/knicks/k ... Aon2WFSXuI

Although Baron might be playing better(for just one game) he is getting old, and doesn't seem to be a good option to build around unlike a young PG like Lin. Good for a veteran boost for 1 to 2 years but he should be passing the torch or guiding Lin somewhat.

[Deeeez Knicks]

D'Antoni did deserve a lot of the critiscm he got. A lot of us were screaming at him to play Novak and/or Lin. It wasn't rocket science. We just needed shooting and any pg better then Toney Douglas. He stuck with Bill Walker and Toney Douglas for what seemed like forever. There's a long history of that too. It was very frustrating as a fan how stubborn D'Antoni is sometimes.

Where I think he deserved a lot of critiscm, right now we look great and D'Antoni deserves a lot of credit. He has already proven he can win a lot of games. I still question whether he's the guy that can take us to the next level. Its little things like not knowing we have a foul to give that that can make the difference in the playoffs.

We have so many leaders on the court like Tyson, Lin, Jeffries, Melo and Amare that I think they help make up for some of D'Antoni's weakness's though as a players coach.

At the end of the day we are a pretty good team right now and anything can happen. Coaches can learn from there mistakes and become better coaches (like Doc, Carlise, etc). Lets see how it turns out.

The flipside of that argument is that when these players finally do get the opportunity they are hungry and prepared. Maybe MDA waited too long on getting Lin into the lineup but by what? A week? The coaching staff built him up from a player with no confidence to a player comfortable going out their and executing the MDA offense.

Coaches that just throw their young players out there often times win more games immediately but it is fools gold in the long run. Like I said, MDA probably made a mistake of not playing Lin about a week earlier but the vast majority of the time it is ultimately in the player and team's interest to wait until they are ready.

True, but he also flat out stated he had no plan to play Lin. We also had Novak sitting on the bench for awhile. It didn't really make sense. Its not an isolated incident as D'Antoni has a history of burying players on the bench who go on to help other teams. Its scary how close Lin was to being the next one. He likes to stick with his favs and can be stubborn to a fault. He definitely deserved criticism for that at the time.

Its all good now though. He deserves credit for the turn around just like he deserved some blame for the slow start. I'm just glad we are playing really well right now. D'Antoni def gets some credit for that.

[AllanHoustonFan]

Best post/topic you've made all season, TKF. Kudos, brother.

[blackbishop]

D'Antoni did deserve a lot of the critiscm he got. A lot of us were screaming at him to play Novak and/or Lin. It wasn't rocket science. We just needed shooting and any pg better then Toney Douglas. He stuck with Bill Walker and Toney Douglas for what seemed like forever. There's a long history of that too. It was very frustrating as a fan how stubborn D'Antoni is sometimes.

Where I think he deserved a lot of critiscm, right now we look great and D'Antoni deserves a lot of credit. He has already proven he can win a lot of games. I still question whether he's the guy that can take us to the next level. Its little things like not knowing we have a foul to give that that can make the difference in the playoffs.

We have so many leaders on the court like Tyson, Lin, Jeffries, Melo and Amare that I think they help make up for some of D'Antoni's weakness's though as a players coach.

At the end of the day we are a pretty good team right now and anything can happen. Coaches can learn from there mistakes and become better coaches (like Doc, Carlise, etc). Lets see how it turns out.

The flipside of that argument is that when these players finally do get the opportunity they are hungry and prepared. Maybe MDA waited too long on getting Lin into the lineup but by what? A week? The coaching staff built him up from a player with no confidence to a player comfortable going out their and executing the MDA offense.

Coaches that just throw their young players out there often times win more games immediately but it is fools gold in the long run. Like I said, MDA probably made a mistake of not playing Lin about a week earlier but the vast majority of the time it is ultimately in the player and team's interest to wait until they are ready.

True, but he also flat out stated he had no plan to play Lin. We also had Novak sitting on the bench for awhile. It didn't really make sense. Its not an isolated incident as D'Antoni has a history of burying players on the bench who go on to help other teams. Its scary how close Lin was to being the next one. He likes to stick with his favs and can be stubborn to a fault. He definitely deserved criticism for that at the time.

Its all good now though. He deserves credit for the turn around just like he deserved some blame for the slow start. I'm just glad we are playing really well right now. D'Antoni def gets some credit for that.

Dantoni was correct in saying he had no plan for jordan or lin. Remember shortened season. Douglas, bibby, shumpert, and (injured davis) were ahead of lin on the depth chart. Lin probably was not even seeing the floor during what few practices the team had. In addition, do you even remember the first few times, lin hit the court this year, when isiah thomas got in his a$$ and was making him into a turnover machine. Lin did not exactly warrant a look from those early auditions. But when Lin started to show something in practice (against davis), he got a chance during the celtic game, played well enough to replace douglas in the rotation and the nets game is now history.

Novak without a point guard is/was useless. When we had douglas passing the ball around the perimeter, there was no room for novak to shoot and thus, not very useful in the offense at that time. Now he is getting good looks cause he is open from penetration.

Dantoni its not about favorites as it is about allowing players to play through slumps once they have proven they can play. He has a system that requires certain types of players. He found the most important piece and now his team is playing much better. Remember:

Douglas
Bibby
shumpert (PG version)
Melo (point forward version)

They could not run the offense as dantoni envisioned it and it showed. Lin and Davis can run the offense as dantoni envisioned it and it shows.

[Capn'O]

D'Antoni did deserve a lot of the critiscm he got. A lot of us were screaming at him to play Novak and/or Lin. It wasn't rocket science. We just needed shooting and any pg better then Toney Douglas. He stuck with Bill Walker and Toney Douglas for what seemed like forever. There's a long history of that too. It was very frustrating as a fan how stubborn D'Antoni is sometimes.

Where I think he deserved a lot of critiscm, right now we look great and D'Antoni deserves a lot of credit. He has already proven he can win a lot of games. I still question whether he's the guy that can take us to the next level. Its little things like not knowing we have a foul to give that that can make the difference in the playoffs.

We have so many leaders on the court like Tyson, Lin, Jeffries, Melo and Amare that I think they help make up for some of D'Antoni's weakness's though as a players coach.

At the end of the day we are a pretty good team right now and anything can happen. Coaches can learn from there mistakes and become better coaches (like Doc, Carlise, etc). Lets see how it turns out.

The flipside of that argument is that when these players finally do get the opportunity they are hungry and prepared. Maybe MDA waited too long on getting Lin into the lineup but by what? A week? The coaching staff built him up from a player with no confidence to a player comfortable going out their and executing the MDA offense.

Coaches that just throw their young players out there often times win more games immediately but it is fools gold in the long run. Like I said, MDA probably made a mistake of not playing Lin about a week earlier but the vast majority of the time it is ultimately in the player and team's interest to wait until they are ready.

True, but he also flat out stated he had no plan to play Lin. We also had Novak sitting on the bench for awhile. It didn't really make sense. Its not an isolated incident as D'Antoni has a history of burying players on the bench who go on to help other teams. Its scary how close Lin was to being the next one. He likes to stick with his favs and can be stubborn to a fault. He definitely deserved criticism for that at the time.

Its all good now though. He deserves credit for the turn around just like he deserved some blame for the slow start. I'm just glad we are playing really well right now. D'Antoni def gets some credit for that.

WIth Novak, it makes a lot of sense. He's a guy that does not make his own shot. He needs to be set up.

There's a guy in one of the fantasy leagues that I play in who calls Gallo "the Italian Steve Novak". Gives me fits because Gallo can put the ball on the floor and is also an excellent passer. Ultimately, I think he'll develop a nice game with his back to the basket as well. A lot of tools in his belt that got overlooked because of his role here.

The flipside of this is that Gallo's ideal role is NOT as a spot up shooter, which is how he was played here a lot of the time. Novak is that guy who can curl off of screens, catch, and shoot with Reggie-like quickness or cut to the corner as the defense collapses on the play. He makes you pay but look at his stat line and you see what he can do... shoot when open.

Melo and Shump are good passers but when Toney was running the offense we needed more plays run where coverage was tight on our guys. We needed more creaters. Not Steve's best role.

This is all a way of saying that Linsanity (and now Baron) were necessary to really make Novak what he is now for us.

[GONYK]

There is no Novak without Lin and Davis.

He's not a player who deserves time on his own merit.

[Capn'O]

There is no Novak without Lin and Davis.

He's not a player who deserves time on his own merit.

To be fair, Novak has actually been quite a bit better on D than I expected. He doesn't give up his position easily and is long enough to cause problems. But yeah - without a point guard on offense it would be like taking a sniper and asking him why he can't take out Mike Tyson from point blank range.

[Deeeez Knicks]

The flipside of that argument is that when these players finally do get the opportunity they are hungry and prepared. Maybe MDA waited too long on getting Lin into the lineup but by what? A week? The coaching staff built him up from a player with no confidence to a player comfortable going out their and executing the MDA offense.

Coaches that just throw their young players out there often times win more games immediately but it is fools gold in the long run. Like I said, MDA probably made a mistake of not playing Lin about a week earlier but the vast majority of the time it is ultimately in the player and team's interest to wait until they are ready.

True, but he also flat out stated he had no plan to play Lin. We also had Novak sitting on the bench for awhile. It didn't really make sense. Its not an isolated incident as D'Antoni has a history of burying players on the bench who go on to help other teams. Its scary how close Lin was to being the next one. He likes to stick with his favs and can be stubborn to a fault. He definitely deserved criticism for that at the time.

Its all good now though. He deserves credit for the turn around just like he deserved some blame for the slow start. I'm just glad we are playing really well right now. D'Antoni def gets some credit for that.

Dantoni was correct in saying he had no plan for jordan or lin. Remember shortened season. Douglas, bibby, shumpert, and (injured davis) were ahead of lin on the depth chart. Lin probably was not even seeing the floor during what few practices the team had. In addition, do you even remember the first few times, lin hit the court this year, when isiah thomas got in his a$$ and was making him into a turnover machine. Lin did not exactly warrant a look from those early auditions. But when Lin started to show something in practice (against davis), he got a chance during the celtic game, played well enough to replace douglas in the rotation and the nets game is now history.

Novak without a point guard is/was useless. When we had douglas passing the ball around the perimeter, there was no room for novak to shoot and thus, not very useful in the offense at that time. Now he is getting good looks cause he is open from penetration.

Dantoni its not about favorites as it is about allowing players to play through slumps once they have proven they can play. He has a system that requires certain types of players. He found the most important piece and now his team is playing much better. Remember:

Douglas
Bibby
shumpert (PG version)
Melo (point forward version)

They could not run the offense as dantoni envisioned it and it showed. Lin and Davis can run the offense as dantoni envisioned it and it shows.

Its kinda pointless to argue about this now, but you said it yourself that those guys could not run the offense. Not only that, but they looked atrocious doing it. They were so bad that almost anyone could be better. It made sense to play the only healthy pg on the roster. Its not like Lin is a rookie that has never played before. He had some solid games as a backup. He played well at the end of last year. He had some great summer league games. At least don't rule him out like that.

I disagree about Novak being useless without a pg. Of course a pg helps, but he could have helped even without Lin. Teams had 5 guys in the paint against us. Walker and TD had open shots but couldn't hit anything. We had plenty of open 3's before LIn, but not shooters to knock them down. Shooting was killing us. Novak def could have helped with spacing the floor. He only got a chance because Melo got hurt.

Even when Lins out, Novaks still very effective. He doesn't need much space.

No doubt Lin helps a lot though.

Again, D'Antoni deserves credit for our win streak just like deserves blame for our slow start. I think thats fair.