Time to be honest about Iman Shumpert

[seren]

We are a better team without JR getting a single minute and that is a fact.

He has been brutal so far and I've always been a JR supporter.

I know he had the knee injury but the suspension is all on him and he doesn't appear to be close to the shape he was in last year. We could be seeing a classic case of a guy being on his best behavior in a contract year. Plus it's easy to believe that many players resent JR over the Chris Smith situation and he's not the easiest guy to play with.

What is weird was last year -- everyone seemed to really like JR and he seemed to be a good teammate. Things seem different this year in terms of play and vibe.

I agree about the injury issue as well as the Chris Smith situation.

The other issue is he has been more of a playmaker which should be a no no. We are hurting big time due to lack of PG play.

[NOOB77]

Plain and simple it looks like Shump just stopped working on his game. He usually put in work on the floor during the game but his lack of developed skills points to a lack of work ethic off the court. Shump wants to be a star but isn't putting in the work to be a star.....He hasn't gotten better at anything in fact he is actually getting worse on the defensive side of the ball. If "trade rumors" can break him down then he doesn't have it mentally.

The Knicks had a plan to work Shump in as a point guard which we could use but he refused to do that. Look at his ball handling skills? It was a factor in the playoffs that our SG couldn't take advantage of David West guarding him and blow by him every time. Instead of working on his handles he went to play around in China.

Now because he is getting worse as a player he is blaming ball movement. He went to the Amare school of deflecting.....

[J0rdan4life42o]

Time to be honest?

Shump was way overhyped as a rookie, failed to live up to the superstar expectations right away and now people are disappointed.

He can still be a solid player and the kind of player you want on your team, but everyone looks bad in a poorly coached trade rumor filled toxic environment like this. He's being put in a position to fail.

Its the typical cycle of a young player on the Knicks. Next step is that he will be traded for scraps, he will find a role somewhere else, and people will regret that we gave him away. The same damn things happen with this team over and over and over and over.

I agree with this for the most part.

I thought Shump had been playing fairly well this season. He had been hitting the boards really well and had some energy that was missing.

If we had this Shump last year, to go with the stability and shooting, we would have been a much better team.

Shump is not a player who is good enough to pull us out of this funk, so people are turning on him. He will be a good role player in this league.

I think people are turning on him because of his lame excuse last night for his horrible play as of late. The ball is sticking? The ball isn't moving? First of all, it's absurd and semi-idiotic to blame his and the team's struggles on ball movement when the Knicks actually moved the ball decently last night and assisted on 60%+ of their made shots. But what in the hell does ball movement have to do with defending and rebounding the ball? If he's the type of player that lets those areas of his game suffer because he's not happy with the offense, well then people have every right to turn on him. Just once I'd like to hear these players take accountability for the pathetic defense they've been playing.

[GONYK]

Time to be honest?

Shump was way overhyped as a rookie, failed to live up to the superstar expectations right away and now people are disappointed.

He can still be a solid player and the kind of player you want on your team, but everyone looks bad in a poorly coached trade rumor filled toxic environment like this. He's being put in a position to fail.

Its the typical cycle of a young player on the Knicks. Next step is that he will be traded for scraps, he will find a role somewhere else, and people will regret that we gave him away. The same damn things happen with this team over and over and over and over.

I agree with this for the most part.

I thought Shump had been playing fairly well this season. He had been hitting the boards really well and had some energy that was missing.

If we had this Shump last year, to go with the stability and shooting, we would have been a much better team.

Shump is not a player who is good enough to pull us out of this funk, so people are turning on him. He will be a good role player in this league.

I think people are turning on him because of his lame excuse last night for his horrible play as of late. The ball is sticking? The ball isn't moving? First of all, it's absurd and semi-idiotic to blame his and the team's struggles on ball movement when the Knicks actually moved the ball decently last night and assisted on 60%+ of their made shots. But what in the hell does ball movement have to do with defending and rebounding the ball? If he's the type of player that lets those areas of his game suffer because he's not happy with the offense, well then people have every right to turn on him. Just once I'd like to hear these players take accountability for the pathetic defense they've been playing.

I hadn't heard about Shump's comments until just now. If you couldn't tell from the title of my PG thread, I passed the hell out after the game

[nykballa2k4]

Iman is great but he plays with heart. Hard to play with heart when you see your jersey being taken from you soon.

[GONYK]

Iman is great but he plays with heart. Hard to play with heart when you see your jersey being taken from you soon.

It's hard to play with heart once you face adversity?

[J0rdan4life42o]

I hadn't heard about Shump's comments until just now. If you couldn't tell from the title of my PG thread, I passed the hell out after the game

Ah lol, makes sense now.

[Workforce250]

Expecting the World out of a 3rd year player, while a 10 year vet plays like a rookie and can do no wrong.

Thank you...and one that has only played 1 full season and a half. Yet he's the one to be traded. Some here even want to trade THJ right now without seeing what he can do. To me this fan base is maddening, almost schizophrenic.

[Fat]

Shump would excel in POPS system

[Workforce250]

Plain and simple it looks like Shump just stopped working on his game. He usually put in work on the floor during the game but his lack of developed skills points to a lack of work ethic off the court. Shump wants to be a star but isn't putting in the work to be a star.....He hasn't gotten better at anything in fact he is actually getting worse on the defensive side of the ball. If "trade rumors" can break him down then he doesn't have it mentally.

The Knicks had a plan to work Shump in as a point guard which we could use but he refused to do that. Look at his ball handling skills? It was a factor in the playoffs that our SG couldn't take advantage of David West guarding him and blow by him every time. Instead of working on his handles he went to play around in China.

Now because he is getting worse as a player he is blaming ball movement. He went to the Amare school of deflecting.....

By all means, what 3 year shooting guard (playing SF), who has only played 1 full season, has the point guard skills you are referring to?

[kane]

shump is gone he reached his cap all those who hoped he might be a borderline allstar player time to put you're hopes into THJ

[nykballa2k4]

Iman is great but he plays with heart. Hard to play with heart when you see your jersey being taken from you soon.

It's hard to play with heart once you face adversity?

It is hard to play with a team full of "brothers" when you know you are not part of the family...

[NOOB77]

Plain and simple it looks like Shump just stopped working on his game. He usually put in work on the floor during the game but his lack of developed skills points to a lack of work ethic off the court. Shump wants to be a star but isn't putting in the work to be a star.....He hasn't gotten better at anything in fact he is actually getting worse on the defensive side of the ball. If "trade rumors" can break him down then he doesn't have it mentally.

The Knicks had a plan to work Shump in as a point guard which we could use but he refused to do that. Look at his ball handling skills? It was a factor in the playoffs that our SG couldn't take advantage of David West guarding him and blow by him every time. Instead of working on his handles he went to play around in China.

Now because he is getting worse as a player he is blaming ball movement. He went to the Amare school of deflecting.....

By all means, what 3 year shooting guard (playing SF), who has only played 1 full season, has the point guard skills you are referring to?

PG skills? I wouldn't go that far. But Shump did play some PG in college and was asked to work on his PG skills by the franchise it may not have been for him to play PG but it may have been for him to work on his handles so he can actually dribble pass David West.

Off the top of my head.....These are players that came in and have developed there game further in the first three years or so. Where as Shump seems to be getting worse with his skills.

Hayward
Parsons
Leonard
George
Butler

[GONYK]

Iman is great but he plays with heart. Hard to play with heart when you see your jersey being taken from you soon.

It's hard to play with heart once you face adversity?

It is hard to play with a team full of "brothers" when you know you are not part of the family...

Having heart is doing what needs to be done despite the circumstances against you. That is what heart is.

[prolific96]

Anyone judging Shumpert on this season is pretty cavalier in their opinions. He clearly is rattled by the trade talk and is not playing well. He was better in the playoffs than he is now and I doubt that means he is simply regressing.

His head is not in the game. He is playing in a nuthouse after all. Most of you would be walking around mumbling to yourselves like a crazy person in the same situation.

Did shump bring this on himself? I know a lot of people want to place blame on Dolan or the coaching staff but I think people really need to consider that Shump's head got a little swole. I remember there was a video posted on here around the preseason with Shump discussing why he cut his hair and he seemed to suggest just that.

[prolific96]

Iman is great but he plays with heart. Hard to play with heart when you see your jersey being taken from you soon.

It's hard to play with heart once you face adversity?

It is hard to play with a team full of "brothers" when you know you are not part of the family...

No one was talking trade until he started sucking.

[Workforce250]

It's hard to play with heart once you face adversity?

It is hard to play with a team full of "brothers" when you know you are not part of the family...

No one was talking trade until he started sucking.

Not really,,it was when the TEAM started losing and the typical fan base knee jerk reaction was to find a scrap goat and sacrificial lamb.

[KNIXFAN_83]

I been saying trade this bum but yall don't hear me tho!

[AmazingJason]

Real life professional basketball is not like NBA 2K.

Amare's comments look bad because Melo dominated and Amare was trash. So was Shump.

But in essence, they were right. Shump and Amare just spilled the truth about what's going on. Tyson's alluded to it, too, after the Pacers series. It's not necessarily that Melo is taking a high volume of shots; it's the way that they're playing offense and it's partly Woodson's fault. They - along with others - are sick of it. And I can't blame them.

These guys do not care that Melo is a dominant scorer and that he is grabbing all these rebounds. Even though he is looking good, he is doing it selfishly. Melo is not a leader of men, and that is why he does not have his teammates' respect. It's the same as when we had MDA during the Tyson/Amare/Melo experiment. It's the same when he had Linsanity and he galvanized us to play team ball. It's also the same when Woodson was in ATL and Josh Smith complained about Iso Joe.

Look at the teams that beating us down. The Spurs, the Blazers, the Hawks, the Bobcats, the Bulls, the Wolves. They all move the ball. They may have a leading or volume scorer like Parker, Aldridge, Horford, Henderson, Rose and Love, but they play within an offensive system that promotes ball movement and runs actual plays with multiple options. Watch our offense. There is no rhyme or reason to it. It's ISO Melo. ISO JR. ISO Felton. By the time we start the offense, there's only 10-14 seconds left and it disintegrates into ISO chucking.

Last year, we had Kidd to lead and coach the offense and promote ball movement. We had guys like Sheed and Kurt to stress defense. Even Sheed - as good an offensive player as he was - was an unselfish team player his entire career. The team does not see that from Melo. We don't have leadership or any team chemistry, and it shows. The players do not like one another. Everyone is playing for themselves and waiting their turn when it's not the Melo show. To me, this also speaks to bad coaching from Woodson, but it's tough when you don't have any players that are leaders on the floor.

[prolific96]

It is hard to play with a team full of "brothers" when you know you are not part of the family...

No one was talking trade until he started sucking.

Not really,,it was when the TEAM started losing and the typical fan base knee jerk reaction was to find a scrap goat and sacrificial lamb.

He's the sacrificial lamb because there are no other tradeable pieces on this team.