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[2018] - DRAFT NIGHT THREAD! Currently #9, #36

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Re: [2018] - DRAFT NIGHT THREAD! Currently #9, #36 

Post#901 » by DOT » Thu Jun 21, 2018 7:15 pm

mpharris36 wrote:
Mecca wrote:
mpharris36 wrote:
i did. I get where your coming from but Mikal just the better prospect and player IMO. So is Knox a horrible selection...no. But I don't see how you could watch both guys and come away that Knox should be the pick...personally.


Do you see me saying he’s better than Mikal? Or that I prefer him to Mikal? It’s more that I’d be happy with either one.


I never said you said that. I just don't have that personality. If I think Mikal is the better player/prospect (which I do). Then I will not be pleased if we pick a player I clearly think is better in pretty much every facet of there games. So I don't get being happy if your main target is on the board and you pass him up.

Like women you think one girl is the best, she is the girl you want to be with. There is this other girl that aiight, you settling for the second girl or you shooting your shot at your favorite?

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Re: [2018] - DRAFT NIGHT THREAD! Currently #9, #36 

Post#902 » by Handledatruth » Thu Jun 21, 2018 7:15 pm

FrontOfficeEye wrote:
fatalogic wrote:DraftExpress is releasing all their videos on youtube right now
Here is Knox:




Not sure if anyone remembers watching Antoine Jamison play, but they have an eerily similar game. Same defense issues as well. Not to call it his ceiling, just noting Knox's playing style.
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Re: [2018] - DRAFT NIGHT THREAD! Currently #9, #36 

Post#903 » by SARGO127 » Thu Jun 21, 2018 7:15 pm

Please trade up for Doncic.

#9, Lee, LFT, Baker, Burke, 2020 1st (top 5 protected) for Parsons, #4

Yep - I'd give that much.
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Re: [2018] - DRAFT NIGHT THREAD! Currently #9, #36 

Post#904 » by NBA Fan 1234 » Thu Jun 21, 2018 7:16 pm

KnickLeDime wrote:
FrontOfficeEye wrote:
CoolKids wrote:49th percentile meaning what? Serious question

In Synergy's database, he ranked in the 49th percentile in transition (which is considered "average"), but that's bad for a high level prospect. The 19% turnover rate is his turnover rate in transition. What's scarier than his turnover rate in general, is the fact that he had a 26% turnover rate RUNNING THE WING! He'd fumble the ball, make a bad pass, drive into traffic, etc so often.


What are Mikals stats...again, this is an 18 year old kid...


Last year, soph year, or freshman. He barely played as a freshman, but I can pull whatever.

Nyk_Fatboy wrote:
FrontOfficeEye wrote:
Nyk_Fatboy wrote:
he shot 34% from 3 and has the physical tools to be solid on defense him becoming a 3D is very likely :lol: his defense issues come alot from lack of focus and assertiveness not a problem at all fixing.

Everyone wants to trade up for bamba talking about how he can defend and stretch out. he shot 27% from 3

these dudes played one year and are 18 and 19 years old i dont see how its unlikely when your already on the right track but need more grooming.



57th percentile in unguarded situations...meaning, where defense isn't near him. That's not a great sign going forward. It could be him getting more reps, yeah, but it doesn't mean he'll become a knock down three point shooter.

Physical tools mean nothing if the IQ is there. He did not show BBIQ on defense at all last year.

Knox came into college as this versatile scorer with a smooth looking jumper...he did not display that. Bamba came in as a defensive/rebounding force with a limited offensive game. Knox looked subpar relative to where he was expected to be, whereas Bamba showed he was MORE than he was expected to be. Bamba's game improved much more than Knox's did from senior year of HS through the freshman year in college. You're right...people expecting Bamba to come in and knock down threes are probably going to be let down...but...he's on the right trajectory for that with the huge steps he's taken in the last year +.


Ayton is going #1 physical tools and not great IQ

I just feel yall looking at Knox like he's some kind of finished project. If mikal entered the draft as a freshman he wouldnt even be considered a top 10 pick period. He grew and got better over time and yall refuse to look at that picture. yall comparing 3 years of experience to a freshman thrown into the fire of being a star on a team of starters who were dam near the same age as him and didnt have experience themselves.

idk man mikal is a EASY pick to like and take but i dont feel his upside is greater but hes still in my top 3 on draft night either way.


Ayton is going #1 because he is skilled offensively and the body and athleticism to match. I think he's a terrible defender, but part of me thinks it is because he was playing the 4 instead of the 5 last year.

I don't think Knox is finished at all. I just don't think he's this great well rounded prospect many people think he is.

K P 6 wrote:Yall can go into your stats all you want. From the highlights I have seen he gets it on the run and attacks. He's young, I think he can build off of it.


It's player tracking numbers, not any advanced metric. Highlights can make anyone look good.
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Re: [2018] - DRAFT NIGHT THREAD! Currently #9, #36 

Post#905 » by F N 11 » Thu Jun 21, 2018 7:16 pm

mpharris36 wrote:
delvec19 wrote:You can't crush a GM for wanting to take a player that basically every big college program was frothing over.


u mean like jahlil okafor?

Everybody knew big who dont play D was going out of style except the sixers.
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Re: [2018] - DRAFT NIGHT THREAD! Currently #9, #36 

Post#906 » by Jeff Van Gully » Thu Jun 21, 2018 7:16 pm

Jstock12 wrote:
dakomish23 wrote:
Jstock12 wrote:
Musa was an equal rival to Doncic when they were 15.


Really? Damn. How much hype does he have overseas?


At that time, it really wasn't clear who's gonna be the better player. Both looked like rare prodigies. But since then, Doncic has put a lot of separation between him and Musa, while Musa's progression has slowed down.


contender for understatement of the year
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Re: [2018] - DRAFT NIGHT THREAD! Currently #9, #36 

Post#907 » by Jeff Van Gully » Thu Jun 21, 2018 7:17 pm

K P 6 wrote:
mpharris36 wrote:
delvec19 wrote:You can't crush a GM for wanting to take a player that basically every big college program was frothing over.


u mean like jahlil okafor?

Everybody knew big who dont play D was going out of style except the sixers.


he still looked like a star in the making, if only for offensive skillset.

turns out his conditioning, motor, and maturity issues were all 100% real. that duke character tho.
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Re: [2018] - DRAFT NIGHT THREAD! Currently #9, #36 

Post#908 » by SmoothLefty21 » Thu Jun 21, 2018 7:18 pm

KnickLeDime wrote:
Again, no ****...one guy has 3 years experience with two NCAA championships and the other is an 18 year old prodigy...who do people think will make better basketball decisions? It's not apples to apples.


You can still project/estimate. You'd like to see a certain baseline even at 18. I am still in favor of taking Knox FTR.

Not every young player overcomes those IQ issues; it's simply not a guarantee. JaVale McGee didn't develop KG's defensive IQ. It's not fair to assume that in three years Knox will be as smart a player as Bridges is. That's why he's a risk. Yes, he will improve, but you don't know if it'll remain a weakness or if he'll improve it enough to the point where it's acceptable.
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Re: [2018] - DRAFT NIGHT THREAD! Currently #9, #36 

Post#909 » by Jeff Van Gully » Thu Jun 21, 2018 7:18 pm

K P 6 wrote:
FrontOfficeEye wrote:
K P 6 wrote:Cant believe people dont see the upside in Knox. Smh. Dude is a demon in transition too. Not shy to put it on the floor.

49th percentile in transition with a 19% turnover rate is a real demon.

Yall can go into your stats all you want. From the highlights I have seen he gets it on the run and attacks. He's young, I think he can build off of it.


this conversation is why i have flashes of anthony randolph
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Re: [2018] - DRAFT NIGHT THREAD! Currently #9, #36 

Post#910 » by KnickLeDime » Thu Jun 21, 2018 7:18 pm

FrontOfficeEye wrote:
KnickLeDime wrote:
FrontOfficeEye wrote:In Synergy's database, he ranked in the 49th percentile in transition (which is considered "average"), but that's bad for a high level prospect. The 19% turnover rate is his turnover rate in transition. What's scarier than his turnover rate in general, is the fact that he had a 26% turnover rate RUNNING THE WING! He'd fumble the ball, make a bad pass, drive into traffic, etc so often.


What are Mikals stats...again, this is an 18 year old kid...


Last year, soph year, or freshman. He barely played as a freshman, but I can pull whatever.

Nyk_Fatboy wrote:
FrontOfficeEye wrote:

57th percentile in unguarded situations...meaning, where defense isn't near him. That's not a great sign going forward. It could be him getting more reps, yeah, but it doesn't mean he'll become a knock down three point shooter.

Physical tools mean nothing if the IQ is there. He did not show BBIQ on defense at all last year.

Knox came into college as this versatile scorer with a smooth looking jumper...he did not display that. Bamba came in as a defensive/rebounding force with a limited offensive game. Knox looked subpar relative to where he was expected to be, whereas Bamba showed he was MORE than he was expected to be. Bamba's game improved much more than Knox's did from senior year of HS through the freshman year in college. You're right...people expecting Bamba to come in and knock down threes are probably going to be let down...but...he's on the right trajectory for that with the huge steps he's taken in the last year +.


Ayton is going #1 physical tools and not great IQ

I just feel yall looking at Knox like he's some kind of finished project. If mikal entered the draft as a freshman he wouldnt even be considered a top 10 pick period. He grew and got better over time and yall refuse to look at that picture. yall comparing 3 years of experience to a freshman thrown into the fire of being a star on a team of starters who were dam near the same age as him and didnt have experience themselves.

idk man mikal is a EASY pick to like and take but i dont feel his upside is greater but hes still in my top 3 on draft night either way.


Ayton is going #1 because he is skilled offensively and the body and athleticism to match. I think he's a terrible defender, but part of me thinks it is because he was playing the 4 instead of the 5 last year.

I don't think Knox is finished at all. I just don't think he's this great well rounded prospect many people think he is.

K P 6 wrote:Yall can go into your stats all you want. From the highlights I have seen he gets it on the run and attacks. He's young, I think he can build off of it.


It's player tracking numbers, not any advanced metric. Highlights can make anyone look good.


I was looking for advanced metrics, comparison of freshman Mikal vs freshman Knox. I know there may be a significant disperity between time played. Just wanted to see how they stacked up freshman on freshman/apples to apples.
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Re: [2018] - DRAFT NIGHT THREAD! Currently #9, #36 

Post#911 » by Oscirus » Thu Jun 21, 2018 7:19 pm

mpharris36 wrote:
delvec19 wrote:You can't crush a GM for wanting to take a player that basically every big college program was frothing over.


u mean like jahlil okafor?

Jahill is what you get when you make the safe pick. It just looks worse with him because he really didn't pan out.
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Re: [2018] - DRAFT NIGHT THREAD! Currently #9, #36 

Post#912 » by Jstock12 » Thu Jun 21, 2018 7:19 pm

Jeff Van Gully wrote:
Jstock12 wrote:
dakomish23 wrote:
Really? Damn. How much hype does he have overseas?


At that time, it really wasn't clear who's gonna be the better player. Both looked like rare prodigies. But since then, Doncic has put a lot of separation between him and Musa, while Musa's progression has slowed down.


contender for understatement of the year

ok
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Re: [2018] - DRAFT NIGHT THREAD! Currently #9, #36 

Post#913 » by Jeff Van Gully » Thu Jun 21, 2018 7:19 pm

KnickLeDime wrote:
FrontOfficeEye wrote:
KnickLeDime wrote:
What are Mikals stats...again, this is an 18 year old kid...


Last year, soph year, or freshman. He barely played as a freshman, but I can pull whatever.

Nyk_Fatboy wrote:
Ayton is going #1 physical tools and not great IQ

I just feel yall looking at Knox like he's some kind of finished project. If mikal entered the draft as a freshman he wouldnt even be considered a top 10 pick period. He grew and got better over time and yall refuse to look at that picture. yall comparing 3 years of experience to a freshman thrown into the fire of being a star on a team of starters who were dam near the same age as him and didnt have experience themselves.

idk man mikal is a EASY pick to like and take but i dont feel his upside is greater but hes still in my top 3 on draft night either way.


Ayton is going #1 because he is skilled offensively and the body and athleticism to match. I think he's a terrible defender, but part of me thinks it is because he was playing the 4 instead of the 5 last year.

I don't think Knox is finished at all. I just don't think he's this great well rounded prospect many people think he is.

K P 6 wrote:Yall can go into your stats all you want. From the highlights I have seen he gets it on the run and attacks. He's young, I think he can build off of it.


It's player tracking numbers, not any advanced metric. Highlights can make anyone look good.


I was looking for advanced metrics, comparison of freshman Mikal vs freshman Knox. I know there may be a significant disperity between time played. Just wanted to see how they stacked up freshman on freshman/apples to apples.


as i got to the end i was thinking just how NOT apples to apples that comparison would be. different teams. different systems. different roles.
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Re: [2018] - DRAFT NIGHT THREAD! Currently #9, #36 

Post#914 » by delvec19 » Thu Jun 21, 2018 7:20 pm

mpharris36 wrote:
delvec19 wrote:You can't crush a GM for wanting to take a player that basically every big college program was frothing over.


u mean like jahlil okafor?


Right but who out there thought he'd be a complete bust? You never know what could happen, but I like that the Knicks are taking chances. Only way we're going to have a chance at a great player is either by tanking correctly which we can never seem to do or taking chances on players with big potential.
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Re: [2018] - DRAFT NIGHT THREAD! Currently #9, #36 

Post#915 » by BowlRips » Thu Jun 21, 2018 7:20 pm

Source: Knox met with NYK 3 times. All indications he’s been given have been that he’s the selection


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Re: [2018] - DRAFT NIGHT THREAD! Currently #9, #36 

Post#916 » by Infinitimind » Thu Jun 21, 2018 7:20 pm

SARGO127 wrote:Please trade up for Doncic.

#9, Lee, LFT, Baker, Burke, 2020 1st (top 5 protected) for Parsons, #4

Yep - I'd give that much.


Agreed. Please get him. But again no rumors we are even trying
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Re: [2018] - DRAFT NIGHT THREAD! Currently #9, #36 

Post#917 » by KnickLeDime » Thu Jun 21, 2018 7:20 pm

SmoothLefty21 wrote:
KnickLeDime wrote:
Again, no ****...one guy has 3 years experience with two NCAA championships and the other is an 18 year old prodigy...who do people think will make better basketball decisions? It's not apples to apples.


You can still project/estimate. You'd like to see a certain baseline even at 18. I am still in favor of taking Knox FTR.

Not every young player overcomes those IQ issues; it's simply not a guarantee. JaVale McGee didn't develop KG's defensive IQ. It's not fair to assume that in three years Knox will be as smart a player as Bridges is. That's why he's a risk. Yes, he will improve, but you don't know if it'll remain a weakness or if he'll improve it enough to the point where it's acceptable.


Exactly right in that we have no idea if he'll ever get the BBIQ of Bridges....hence the risk in drafting an 18 year old kid. You weigh the potential vs the now or ceiling if comparing to Bridges and assess if you can tolerate the risk.
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Re: [2018] - DRAFT NIGHT THREAD! Currently #9, #36 

Post#918 » by Jeff Van Gully » Thu Jun 21, 2018 7:20 pm

Oscirus wrote:
mpharris36 wrote:
delvec19 wrote:You can't crush a GM for wanting to take a player that basically every big college program was frothing over.


u mean like jahlil okafor?

Jahill is what you get when you make the safe pick. It just looks worse with him because he really didn't pan out.


so is KAT? i mean... what a strange generalization.
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Re: [2018] - DRAFT NIGHT THREAD! Currently #9, #36 

Post#919 » by SmoothLefty21 » Thu Jun 21, 2018 7:21 pm

KnickLeDime wrote:I have no idea if these things are available but I wonder how Mikal looks after his freshman year vs Knox...on advanced analytics.


It'd be a smaller sample size but I'm sure it wouldn't blow anyone away. He played 20 MPG, averaged 6/3/1 and shot 30% from deep.
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Re: [2018] - DRAFT NIGHT THREAD! Currently #9, #36 

Post#920 » by Oscirus » Thu Jun 21, 2018 7:21 pm

If I'm being honest, not a fan of all these centers being picked in the top ten. The game is moving away from those type of players.
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