WOJ: Knicks president [Mills] angling for David Fizdale firing

[Synciere]

The fact that all of this is going on isn’t evidence that we shouldn’t be burning it down. What Coach worthnhis salt is going to want to come here after the way Fizdale has been treated? It’s like constantly turning over your roster and/or tanking. By the time you have money for free agents they’re going to look at your organization and say hell no.

What possible reason does Masai have for leaving a good Toronto organization to come here?

All of you begging for a coaching change, whos out there that’s clearly better who would actually come? Look at how we ended with KP... Melo.. as fans you may not care but it’s clear that players are watching all of this and taking note.

At some point we need some consistency that isn’t consistently tanking. Y’all don’t hear me though.

We haven't had consistent tanking. It's time we did that. And it's time for that stinking rotting fish Mills to be discarded. If you get rid of Mills the incoming executive will want to pick his own team so you are getting rid of both Perry and Fizdale by default.

It’s never time to tank/consistently lose. Fans like the idea because it’s easier than trying to win and appeases them for a few years by creating this notion that it’ll pay off in the end.

When philly started their tank the word was you don’t want to end up as a perennial second round team like the Hawks of the 2000s. Hinkie has been gone for more than three years. He tanked for four years. Guess the furthest the Sixers have been in the playoffs in that time? Seven, eight years and all they have to show for it is the second round. Now with smoother lottery odds and people still think tanking is the answer. It’s not. Not a single team has tanked to a chip.

I agree a new exec should have the chance to hire/fire staff, but at least give the GM and coach an interview and try to create some continuity.

[BallSacBounce]

The fact that all of this is going on isn’t evidence that we shouldn’t be burning it down. What Coach worthnhis salt is going to want to come here after the way Fizdale has been treated? It’s like constantly turning over your roster and/or tanking. By the time you have money for free agents they’re going to look at your organization and say hell no.

What possible reason does Masai have for leaving a good Toronto organization to come here?

All of you begging for a coaching change, whos out there that’s clearly better who would actually come? Look at how we ended with KP... Melo.. as fans you may not care but it’s clear that players are watching all of this and taking note.

At some point we need some consistency that isn’t consistently tanking. Y’all don’t hear me though.

We haven't had consistent tanking. It's time we did that. And it's time for that stinking rotting fish Mills to be discarded. If you get rid of Mills the incoming executive will want to pick his own team so you are getting rid of both Perry and Fizdale by default.

It’s never time to tank/consistently lose. Fans like the idea because it’s easier than trying to win and appeases them for a few years by creating this notion that it’ll pay off in the end.

When philly started their tank the word was you don’t want to end up as a perennial second round team like the Hawks of the 2000s. Hinkie has been gone for more than three years. He tanked for four years. Guess the furthest the Sixers have been in the playoffs in that time? Seven, eight years and all they have to show for it is the second round. Now with smoother lottery odds and people still think tanking is the answer. It’s not. Not a single team has tanked to a chip.

I agree a new exec should have the chance to hire/fire staff, but at least give the GM and coach an interview and try to create some continuity.

Tanking is no lock and has plenty of risk but there still isn't a better option. Get a couple three good young cheap players and then you're off and running for a build. Do it too early and you run into cap space problems trying to build a team. If you can sign a couple of great free agents and build around them that's another option. In the meantime you keep the cap flexible and tank. Apparently we tried to become competitive this year which was stupid. Thankfully it's not working, so far at least.

The right free agents have to be available and want to sign. The right trades which can make a difference have to be offered. There are no guarantees or locks with any of this. Whichever path is chosen luck is a huge factor. At least we remain in control of our cap and are likely to pick high again. I'll take it for now.

[Synciere]

We haven't had consistent tanking. It's time we did that. And it's time for that stinking rotting fish Mills to be discarded. If you get rid of Mills the incoming executive will want to pick his own team so you are getting rid of both Perry and Fizdale by default.

It’s never time to tank/consistently lose. Fans like the idea because it’s easier than trying to win and appeases them for a few years by creating this notion that it’ll pay off in the end.

When philly started their tank the word was you don’t want to end up as a perennial second round team like the Hawks of the 2000s. Hinkie has been gone for more than three years. He tanked for four years. Guess the furthest the Sixers have been in the playoffs in that time? Seven, eight years and all they have to show for it is the second round. Now with smoother lottery odds and people still think tanking is the answer. It’s not. Not a single team has tanked to a chip.

I agree a new exec should have the chance to hire/fire staff, but at least give the GM and coach an interview and try to create some continuity.

Tanking is no lock and has plenty of risk but there still isn't a better option. Get a couple three good young cheap players and then you're off and running for a build. Do it too early and you run into cap space problems trying to build a team. If you can sign a couple of great free agents and build around them that's another option. In the meantime you keep the cap flexible and tank. Apparently we tried to become competitive this year which was stupid. Thankfully it's not working, so far at least.

Tanking has legitimately never worked. By definition that means it’s the worst possible option. Tanking will taint all free agents from coming to your team because you’ll always suck. Your youth won’t ever learn how to win. You lose and executives and coaches end up getting fired and you build no continuity in players or staff. Trying to become competitive this year was perfectly fine, because we signed a bunch of defacto one year deals and drafted third. We’re fine. Now if based on history people say get rid of Mills, I’m okay with that, because he’s had a long history with the team. But the fire Perry or Fizdale rhetoric to me is remarkably shortsighted, especially considering how obviously we were tanking last year.

[BallSacBounce]

It’s never time to tank/consistently lose. Fans like the idea because it’s easier than trying to win and appeases them for a few years by creating this notion that it’ll pay off in the end.

When philly started their tank the word was you don’t want to end up as a perennial second round team like the Hawks of the 2000s. Hinkie has been gone for more than three years. He tanked for four years. Guess the furthest the Sixers have been in the playoffs in that time? Seven, eight years and all they have to show for it is the second round. Now with smoother lottery odds and people still think tanking is the answer. It’s not. Not a single team has tanked to a chip.

I agree a new exec should have the chance to hire/fire staff, but at least give the GM and coach an interview and try to create some continuity.

Tanking is no lock and has plenty of risk but there still isn't a better option. Get a couple three good young cheap players and then you're off and running for a build. Do it too early and you run into cap space problems trying to build a team. If you can sign a couple of great free agents and build around them that's another option. In the meantime you keep the cap flexible and tank. Apparently we tried to become competitive this year which was stupid. Thankfully it's not working, so far at least.

Tanking has legitimately never worked. By definition that means it’s the worst possible option. Tanking will taint all free agents from coming to your team because you’ll always suck. Your youth won’t ever learn how to win. You lose and executives and coaches end up getting fired and you build no continuity in players or staff. Trying to become competitive this year was perfectly fine, because we signed a bunch of defacto one year deals and drafted third. We’re fine. Now if based on history people say get rid of Mills, I’m okay with that, because he’s had a long history with the team. But the fire Perry or Fizdale rhetoric to me is remarkably shortsighted, especially considering how obviously we were tanking last year.

Go tell that to the Spurs, c'mon.

[Synciere]

Tanking is no lock and has plenty of risk but there still isn't a better option. Get a couple three good young cheap players and then you're off and running for a build. Do it too early and you run into cap space problems trying to build a team. If you can sign a couple of great free agents and build around them that's another option. In the meantime you keep the cap flexible and tank. Apparently we tried to become competitive this year which was stupid. Thankfully it's not working, so far at least.

Tanking has legitimately never worked. By definition that means it’s the worst possible option. Tanking will taint all free agents from coming to your team because you’ll always suck. Your youth won’t ever learn how to win. You lose and executives and coaches end up getting fired and you build no continuity in players or staff. Trying to become competitive this year was perfectly fine, because we signed a bunch of defacto one year deals and drafted third. We’re fine. Now if based on history people say get rid of Mills, I’m okay with that, because he’s had a long history with the team. But the fire Perry or Fizdale rhetoric to me is remarkably shortsighted, especially considering how obviously we were tanking last year.

Go tell that to the Spurs, c'mon.

The Spurs?! The same Spurs that a Hall of Famer (David Robinson) and All Star (Sean Elliot) got hurt on within the first month of that season?? I’m assuming you’re referencing the Duncan draft.. That’s what you call tanking?

[ezmoney707]

Tanking is no lock and has plenty of risk but there still isn't a better option. Get a couple three good young cheap players and then you're off and running for a build. Do it too early and you run into cap space problems trying to build a team. If you can sign a couple of great free agents and build around them that's another option. In the meantime you keep the cap flexible and tank. Apparently we tried to become competitive this year which was stupid. Thankfully it's not working, so far at least.

Tanking has legitimately never worked. By definition that means it’s the worst possible option. Tanking will taint all free agents from coming to your team because you’ll always suck. Your youth won’t ever learn how to win. You lose and executives and coaches end up getting fired and you build no continuity in players or staff. Trying to become competitive this year was perfectly fine, because we signed a bunch of defacto one year deals and drafted third. We’re fine. Now if based on history people say get rid of Mills, I’m okay with that, because he’s had a long history with the team. But the fire Perry or Fizdale rhetoric to me is remarkably shortsighted, especially considering how obviously we were tanking last year.

Go tell that to the Spurs, c'mon.

This isn't 1996 though

[DOT]

It just feels like an eternity when players like Randle are in the game, running point and spinning their way down the floor into triple teams. Feels like everybody is on the bench when that happens.

Kinda the same with Timmy, Burke, Mudiay, Kanter last year

That’s what happens when you have a coach that won’t hold him accountable and play him to his strengths. Randle is a good player but Fiz is making him look bad in every way possible.

Hell it was Randle himself who said after the Chicago game that he should pass more instead of forcing it. Doesn’t sound like Fiz suggested it.

Yeah, you're right, but at the same time, if Randle understands where his faults lie, then it's also on him to fix them

He pretty much has a blank check to do whatever he wants on the court. If he knows he should be passing more instead of forcing, Fiz isn't gonna bench him for that, same thing with defense

I think a big problem too is that, he's not consistent about it. Like, even last game, he was instrumental in that huge run we went on, but right afterwards reverted back into his old habits. And there are already too many games where he's cost us late with bad turnovers

It's still a lot on Fiz, but if you know your faults, you're responsible for fixing them

[Clyde Frazier]

WE WANT MIKE MILLER

GIVE US MIKE MILLER

[whocares1]

WE WANT MIKE MILLER

GIVE US MIKE MILLER

So in 5 months we can blame him too.

[Clyde Frazier]

WE WANT MIKE MILLER

GIVE US MIKE MILLER

So in 5 months we can blame him too.

Maybe? Seeing what he can do with the roster for the remainder of the season from a development standpoint would make it a lot more interesting, though.

[Vampirate]

Pursuing Masai

What are they going to do with Mills? Masai aint leaving Toronto to be Mills' lap dog

the trouble with Masai, and really the only trouble, is that it'll cost us like a player trade

were gonna have to send at least a pick

and not a 2nd rounder

it might cost us two picks


still, Id be happy to have a real executive here again

No no no no, the problem with Masai is the same problem as it was with Phil Jackson or even Larry Brown—there simply isn’t a dollar amount Dolan can overpay to fix the institutional dysfunction he’s created.

Paying for a high priced name brand is predictable and continues the same cycle of entitled trustfund baby madness. You cannot simply BUY your way into instant greatness. Sorry.

Masai, like his predecessors, would not have autonomy from Dolan’s wishes. In all likelihood he would still have Mills or whatever corporate shill Dolan runs out to replace him.

Like Phil or Larry, Masai would be getting overpaid NOT for his basketball acumen but rather his brand recognition to provide media cover (and inevitable scapegoat fallguy) for Dolan’s never ending ineptitude.

Instead of developing the next Masai Ujiri or Kevin Durant, Dolan thinks he can just buy one off the shelf. This kind of delusional hubris has never and will never work. It’s just more failure waiting to happen.

Masai isn't the GM of the Raptors anymore, he's the President. He also has his own thing in Africa as well. If Dolan is going to somehow lure Masai away from the Raptors org, he'd need to be granted greater power than what he already has. This would mean a sizable stake ownership in the Knicks and probably a clause in the contract that only he can fire himself (step down). Basically if he was hired and did something Dolan didn't want, tough ****, he runs the show.

[Traveyknicks23]

WE WANT MIKE MILLER

GIVE US MIKE MILLER

So in 5 months we can blame him too.

Maybe? Seeing what he can do with the roster for the remainder of the season from a development standpoint would make it a lot more interesting, though.

Maybe? What has he done to warrant that?

[Clyde Frazier]

So in 5 months we can blame him too.

Maybe? Seeing what he can do with the roster for the remainder of the season from a development standpoint would make it a lot more interesting, though.

Maybe? What has he done to warrant that?

Blame him or get a shot to coach the team? Get a shot to coach the team because he won coach of the year in the g league and seemed to get the most out of his roster. Blame him because I'm just being cynical. What else do you expect people to do?

[RHODEY]

The fact that all of this is going on isn’t evidence that we shouldn’t be burning it down. What Coach worthnhis salt is going to want to come here after the way Fizdale has been treated? It’s like constantly turning over your roster and/or tanking. By the time you have money for free agents they’re going to look at your organization and say hell no.

What possible reason does Masai have for leaving a good Toronto organization to come here?

All of you begging for a coaching change, whos out there that’s clearly better who would actually come? Look at how we ended with KP... Melo.. as fans you may not care but it’s clear that players are watching all of this and taking note.

At some point we need some consistency that isn’t consistently tanking. Y’all don’t hear me though.

We haven't had consistent tanking. It's time we did that. And it's time for that stinking rotting fish Mills to be discarded. If you get rid of Mills the incoming executive will want to pick his own team so you are getting rid of both Perry and Fizdale by default.

It’s never time to tank/consistently lose. Fans like the idea because it’s easier than trying to win and appeases them for a few years by creating this notion that it’ll pay off in the end.

When philly started their tank the word was you don’t want to end up as a perennial second round team like the Hawks of the 2000s. Hinkie has been gone for more than three years. He tanked for four years. Guess the furthest the Sixers have been in the playoffs in that time? Seven, eight years and all they have to show for it is the second round. Now with smoother lottery odds and people still think tanking is the answer. It’s not. Not a single team has tanked to a chip.

I agree a new exec should have the chance to hire/fire staff, but at least give the GM and coach an interview and try to create some continuity.

Philly has 2 of the best young players in the league and are legit contenders, so for them I would say it was worth it. Not saying we should tank consciously, but I aint mad at a shot for Wiseman or Cole..especially when we know nobody wants to sign here.

[Traveyknicks23]

It’s never time to tank/consistently lose. Fans like the idea because it’s easier than trying to win and appeases them for a few years by creating this notion that it’ll pay off in the end.

When philly started their tank the word was you don’t want to end up as a perennial second round team like the Hawks of the 2000s. Hinkie has been gone for more than three years. He tanked for four years. Guess the furthest the Sixers have been in the playoffs in that time? Seven, eight years and all they have to show for it is the second round. Now with smoother lottery odds and people still think tanking is the answer. It’s not. Not a single team has tanked to a chip.

I agree a new exec should have the chance to hire/fire staff, but at least give the GM and coach an interview and try to create some continuity.

Tanking is no lock and has plenty of risk but there still isn't a better option. Get a couple three good young cheap players and then you're off and running for a build. Do it too early and you run into cap space problems trying to build a team. If you can sign a couple of great free agents and build around them that's another option. In the meantime you keep the cap flexible and tank. Apparently we tried to become competitive this year which was stupid. Thankfully it's not working, so far at least.

Tanking has legitimately never worked. By definition that means it’s the worst possible option. Tanking will taint all free agents from coming to your team because you’ll always suck. Your youth won’t ever learn how to win. You lose and executives and coaches end up getting fired and you build no continuity in players or staff. Trying to become competitive this year was perfectly fine, because we signed a bunch of defacto one year deals and drafted third. We’re fine. Now if based on history people say get rid of Mills, I’m okay with that, because he’s had a long history with the team. But the fire Perry or Fizdale rhetoric to me is remarkably shortsighted, especially considering how obviously we were tanking last year.

People don’t care to hear this cause it doesn’t fit their agendas so once again it’s lets fire everybody

[RHODEY]

Tanking has legitimately never worked. By definition that means it’s the worst possible option. Tanking will taint all free agents from coming to your team because you’ll always suck. Your youth won’t ever learn how to win. You lose and executives and coaches end up getting fired and you build no continuity in players or staff. Trying to become competitive this year was perfectly fine, because we signed a bunch of defacto one year deals and drafted third. We’re fine. Now if based on history people say get rid of Mills, I’m okay with that, because he’s had a long history with the team. But the fire Perry or Fizdale rhetoric to me is remarkably shortsighted, especially considering how obviously we were tanking last year.

Go tell that to the Spurs, c'mon.

The Spurs?! The same Spurs that a Hall of Famer (David Robinson) and All Star (Sean Elliot) got hurt on within the first month of that season?? I’m assuming you’re referencing the Duncan draft.. That’s what you call tanking?

Just because they already had talent doesnt mean they didnt tank,,,they sure as hell did...Goldenstate is doing the same thing.

[Traveyknicks23]

Maybe? Seeing what he can do with the roster for the remainder of the season from a development standpoint would make it a lot more interesting, though.

Maybe? What has he done to warrant that?

Blame him or get a shot to coach the team? Get a shot to coach the team because he won coach of the year in the g league and seemed to get the most out of his roster. Blame him because I'm just being cynical. What else do you expect people to do?

And that some how adequated to him being the right guy for the job?

[Traveyknicks23]

Go tell that to the Spurs, c'mon.

The Spurs?! The same Spurs that a Hall of Famer (David Robinson) and All Star (Sean Elliot) got hurt on within the first month of that season?? I’m assuming you’re referencing the Duncan draft.. That’s what you call tanking?

Just because they already had talent doesnt mean they didnt tank,,,they sure as hell did...Goldenstate is doing the same thing.

The spurs tank was by circumstance had they never gotten injured they never would have done it.the tanking really isn’t the answer anymore especially now with the changes to the draft.

[Clyde Frazier]

Maybe? What has he done to warrant that?

Blame him or get a shot to coach the team? Get a shot to coach the team because he won coach of the year in the g league and seemed to get the most out of his roster. Blame him because I'm just being cynical. What else do you expect people to do?

And that some how adequated to him being the right guy for the job?

As the interim coach for the remainder of the season? Definitely worth a shot to see what he can do at this level. You aren't hiring someone new who isn't already on the bench in the middle of the season. It rarely happens and isn't a smart idea anyway.

If miller actually does a decent job (this doesn't mean a ton of wins, just getting good performances out of the younger players and run a cohesive offense/defense) then it would be a smart internal hire.

I don't know if knicks management has the balls or foresight to do it, but it'd be a pleasant surprise.

[BallSacBounce]

Tanking has legitimately never worked. By definition that means it’s the worst possible option. Tanking will taint all free agents from coming to your team because you’ll always suck. Your youth won’t ever learn how to win. You lose and executives and coaches end up getting fired and you build no continuity in players or staff. Trying to become competitive this year was perfectly fine, because we signed a bunch of defacto one year deals and drafted third. We’re fine. Now if based on history people say get rid of Mills, I’m okay with that, because he’s had a long history with the team. But the fire Perry or Fizdale rhetoric to me is remarkably shortsighted, especially considering how obviously we were tanking last year.

Go tell that to the Spurs, c'mon.

The Spurs?! The same Spurs that a Hall of Famer (David Robinson) and All Star (Sean Elliot) got hurt on within the first month of that season?? I’m assuming you’re referencing the Duncan draft.. That’s what you call tanking?

Yeah, they had 20 wins that year and got the first pick in the draft. Now that's what I call tanking!