What's the deal with Stephon Marbury?

[KingzAndQueenz]

I only started watching the NBA in 2010 so I wasn't really around during his time with the Knicks. Can someone explain what happened and why the fan base hated him so much?

[Sky_Knicks]

Knicks fans hate him because his team never won anything. He, curry, and Isaiah represent some terrible years of New York basketball. He never really did anything wrong though. I doubt anybody is mad that he banged that assistant in the parking lot.

I have no problem with him. And I appreciate what he was trying to do by putting out those low cost sneakers for the kids from low income families. Good dude, lots of heart.

[RC3isback]

He wasn't a good leader. He had a lot of talent though. I remember everything went downhill when Marburg said he was the best point guard in the NBA. And then after that knicks got blown out by Jason Kidd and the nets and missed the playoffs even though they had a 17-14 record at the start.just like Allen iverson and Steve Francis, these point guards had talent but they were losing players that didn't take the game as seriously as they should.

[moocow007]

I only started watching the NBA in 2010 so I wasn't really around during his time with the Knicks. Can someone explain what happened and why the fan base hated him so much?

You know how fans get on Carmelo Anthony for passing too much if he shoots and not shooting enough if he passes? How they expect him to be Lebron James? How if the Knicks can't win it all then it's his fault and he should be (pick one...or more...of the following: a) deballed, b) flogged, c) hung, d) traded for "whatever")?

Well take that expectation and hate, blow it up by about 5 or 6 times and that's what happened to Marbury.

Seriously though. Why?

Because Marbury was supposed to be the savior of a franchise that had be without a title since 1973 and had been crap since they traded Ewing back in 2000 for...well...crap. He was supposed to be the hometown kid coming back do lead the Knicks to the promised land. The kid for Brooklyn who was going to set the city on fire and carry them back to the promised land where the Knicks have deserved to be but had been robbed of.

It didn't matter if Marbury never had a history of making crap players better than they are because he didn't have the desire or patience for lesser players around him (true back to his HS days). It didn't matter if the Knicks roster was like the cast of the "Fat" or "Old" Land of Misfit Toys. It didn't matter if the front office was run by idiots. They expected...DEMANDED...that he do the impossible. And when he naturally did not, they blamed him for it. In fact they crucified him for it.

And Marbury's surly and aloof personality (symbolized by the "towel" he'd wear over his head when his teammates couldn't perform or the eye rolling when they made mistakes) and confident/egotistical (depending on your POV) statements about his own skills didn't help endear him to many fans where were lining up with pitchforks in hand looking for an "escapegoat" to burn.

That's what happened.

Marbury was a terrific talent. He never gave up when he was on the floor and often would try to win games by himself. (in true NY fasion) He didn't back down from nobody and didn't take **** from anyone. He'd sacrafice his body to try to win. By itself, each of these qualities would make you think were positives but it often just became 1-on-5 (Starbury mode) and Marbury just was not willing/able to make his teammates better in the end. Was it his fault? Some. But IMO (and I said this in the other thread), he was basically placed in a no win situation. There was no talent (that fit as a team or were condusive to winning anything) around him. He was portrayed by the media as this larger than life savior. The Knick fans bought into it and was absolutely livid when he couldn't deliver what the media promised them.

By the end, Marbury (at least on this board) was this Anti-Christ figure that was the reason for everything that was bad in the world (not just the Knicks and not just the NBA). Folks didn't want to hear **** about **** and it was his fault for everything. Honestly, by the end, it was just plain ugly. He was getting death threats for not just him but his family.

For Marbury to have been able to win with the teammates he had he'd have to have been the Lebron James of point guards (same way fans are getting on Carmelo Anthony for basically not being Lebron James...notice how it starts?). Marbury wasn't. So of course, the only reason must be because he sucks, he's a cancer and is the Anti-Christ.

[Grinditout]

Lofty expectations and some scandals/rumors did him in. I never really hated him, the guy played hard and you knew he loved NY. Sure he was a bit loose in the head but I don't believe he was the cancer as some media/fans would have you believe.

[moocow007]

Lofty expectations and some scandals/rumors did him in. I never really hated him, the guy played hard and you knew he loved NY. Sure he was a bit loose in the head but I don't believe he was the cancer as some media/fans would have you believe.

Yeah that was the thing. I can understand if he just mopped around doing nothing but collecting his paycheck (like Stevie Franchise basically did his short stint here) but Marbury tried. He fought. He played hard. He didn't back down from anyone...unlike most of the rest of his teammates did...when things were bad. That's why I never got into the crazed nonsense that some others were in. He tried...and you can't blame anyone for trying their best.

[makeitstop]

A basically good human being with exceptional skills. He was here at the wrong time, because there was no one to help him win.

When he gave that press conference donating the money to Katrina victims and broke down and cried in front of the media, he gained my respect. He truly felt for people and tried to do good things. I'm glad he's happy in China, dude deserves to be happy.

[Grinditout]

A basically good human being with exceptional skills. He was here at the wrong time, because there was no one to help him win.

If only H20 had stayed healthy, we would have been treated to a nice one-two punch, even if we were nowhere near contention.

[Quick Kick]

He was ridiculously talented...could have been a Hall Of Famer. But he had a horrible attitude and just never had a winners mentality. Every team he left ended up improving after he was gone. That said, the NY media was unfairly brutal towards him. He was scrutinized and stripped down after every loss. He definitely did deserve some criticism but goddamn, they made it seem like he was the devil incarnate.

I see he's doing well for himself in China and he's at peace with himself. Good to see he's happy finally.

[Mr_Perfect]

Marbury was a cancer to this organization, an embarrassment and the poster boy of the failed Isiah Thomas regime.

[Starksfor3]

[JBreezeNY]

You know how fans get on Carmelo Anthony for passing too much if he shoots and not shooting enough if he passes? How they expect him to be Lebron James? How if the Knicks can't win it all then it's his fault and he should be (pick one...or more...of the following: a) deballed, b) flogged, c) hung, d) traded for "whatever")?

Well take that expectation and hate, blow it up by about 5 or 6 times and that's what happened to Marbury.

Seriously though. Why?

Because Marbury was supposed to be the savior of a franchise that had be without a title since 1973 and had been crap since they traded Ewing back in 2000 for...well...crap. He was supposed to be the hometown kid coming back do lead the Knicks to the promised land. The kid for Brooklyn who was going to set the city on fire and carry them back to the promised land where the Knicks have deserved to be but had been robbed of.

It didn't matter if Marbury never had a history of making crap players better than they are because he didn't have the desire or patience for lesser players around him (true back to his HS days). It didn't matter if the Knicks roster was like the cast of the "Fat" or "Old" Land of Misfit Toys. It didn't matter if the front office was run by idiots. They expected...DEMANDED...that he do the impossible. And when he naturally did not, they blamed him for it. In fact they crucified him for it.

And Marbury's surly and aloof personality (symbolized by the "towel" he'd wear over his head when his teammates couldn't perform or the eye rolling when they made mistakes) and confident/egotistical (depending on your POV) statements about his own skills didn't help endear him to many fans where were lining up with pitchforks in hand looking for an "escapegoat" to burn.

That's what happened.

Marbury was a terrific talent. He never gave up when he was on the floor and often would try to win games by himself. (in true NY fasion) He didn't back down from nobody and didn't take **** from anyone. He'd sacrafice his body to try to win. By itself, each of these qualities would make you think were positives but it often just became 1-on-5 (Starbury mode) and Marbury just was not willing/able to make his teammates better in the end. Was it his fault? Some. But IMO (and I said this in the other thread), he was basically placed in a no win situation. There was no talent (that fit as a team or were condusive to winning anything) around him. He was portrayed by the media as this larger than life savior. The Knick fans bought into it and was absolutely livid when he couldn't deliver what the media promised them.

By the end, Marbury (at least on this board) was this Anti-Christ figure that was the reason for everything that was bad in the world (not just the Knicks and not just the NBA). Folks didn't want to hear **** about **** and it was his fault for everything. Honestly, by the end, it was just plain ugly. He was getting death threats for not just him but his family.

For Marbury to have been able to win with the teammates he had he'd have to have been the Lebron James of point guards (same way fans are getting on Carmelo Anthony for basically not being Lebron James...notice how it starts?). Marbury wasn't. So of course, the only reason must be because he sucks, he's a cancer and is the Anti-Christ.

Lofty expectations and some scandals/rumors did him in. I never really hated him, the guy played hard and you knew he loved NY. Sure he was a bit loose in the head but I don't believe he was the cancer as some media/fans would have you believe.

I remember Bill Simmons wrote a BRILLIANT piece on this a little while back. He brought up the coaching changes from Lenny Wilkins to the players on the team, to the coaching style of Larry Brown & Isiah Thomas.

But of course none of that matters, Steph had a horrible record here, he's a cancer, he didn't make the coaches look better, he didn't make all his teammates look better, he didn't heal the world, he didn't prevent 9/11, he didn't turn this team into a powerhouse contending team, all his fault.

[moocow007]

Marbury was a cancer to this organization, an embarrassment and the poster boy of the failed Isiah Thomas regime.

You MUST be related to him.

[Jstarks3]

logged in just to say -

bravo, moocow.

[Mr_Perfect]

Marbury was a cancer to this organization, an embarrassment and the poster boy of the failed Isiah Thomas regime.

You MUST be related to him.

Nope, but you must be to be defending him so defiantly.

The man got coaches fired, players traded, fought with said teammates and coaches, acted like an idiot and was probably on drugs while doing interviews, QUIT ON HIS TEAM when Isiah told him to come off the bench, banged interns in trucks, flexed his "juice card" in the organization to the detriment of the team and we're sitting here trying to change his history. Trying to distort the truth and change the facts of that really happened. It boggles the mind to see a thread like this. Nobody cares whether Stephon Marbury is a "nice guy". Jerome James was a nice guy too. Almost everybody is. Marbury wasn't a "nice guy" when it came to basketball and his team. To say he gave effort when most of the time he was fighting with Knicks staff and players and putting towels over his head is quite simply a lie.

I'm half-expecting an "Isiah wasn't all that bad" thread or a "Dolan is one of the best owners of all-time" thread coming very soon.

[god shammgod]

i never understood the obsession with the towel over his head. why was this such an issue ?

[dantian]

Coming over as a long time Suns fan, I always liked Marbury. However, seeing how mad and condescending fans on Suns boards talked about Marbury while in his mess in NY, I realize how powerful media bias/hype can be. After all, Marbury did nothing wrong in Phoenix. Actually, he almost won them the 1st round PO series vs Spurs by schooling a young Tony Parker at will until getting that shoulder injury.

[Grinditout]

Coming over as a long time Suns fan, I always liked Marbury. However, seeing how mad and condescending fans on Suns boards talked about Marbury while in his mess in NY, I realize however powerful media bias can be. After all, Marbury did nothing wrong in Phoenix. Actually, he almost won them the 1st round PO series vs Spurs by schooling a young Tony Parker at will until getting that shoulder injury.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eBS9hH9c4_s[/youtube]

I forgot Stoudemire played with Marbury. I even heard that Stat even looked up to him at one point.

[Capn'O]

As you can see, even the thread topic fans old flames

In many ways, Marbury's actions were symbolic of the dysfunction within the franchise.

In addition to what has been said, Marbury was the signature move of the Isiah era. Though we didn't give up anything much of substance, we gave up a ton of flexibility and took on Penny Hardaway's HUGE salary. This killed any hope of rebuilding through free agency or the draft.

In disputes, the org always sided with Steph instead of holding him in line when he was acting bat **** crazy. No accountability - and even he knew he was the "escapegoat" for all of that. Certainly, some of the problems were directly his fault. But a lot of it wasn't. A better culture and approach to teambuilding likely would have yielded a better (though probably not great) result.



Though there is still a lot of anger directed towards him, Marbury has become a more sympathetic figure given his more recent life trajectory and the team's improved trajectory. In years following, it became very clear that Marbury wasn't ever in a good mental state. Obviously, there was his live, online, public meltdown but he was obviously a mess before that. It's pretty clear that - like Francis and Iverson - he abused alcohol throughout his career and other substances later on.

I know he started seeing a shrink around his Celtics stint. Marbury in his 30s seems like a more peaceful, grounded person - certainly the way his Chinese teammates and coaches viewed him was much different from who he was in his time here. He seems to trust himself and the people around him more and it's good to see because he was obviously going down a bad path.

[I_Love_NYK]

Marbury had a ton of talent and just by looking at the back of his basketball card you woulda thought he had a good career. He was not a good locker room guy and even bumped heads with teammates. Marbury was not a good leader and was very stubborn and did not get a long with his coaches. He cared about getting 20ppg and 8apg more than anything else. Even with a better roster the Knicks would have been no more than a7th or 8th seed during his tenure with the Knicks.

Isiah Thomas also did not build a good team also.

Eddy Curry was more of a disappointing trade than Marbury. Guy did not play defense, over weight and Knicks gave two lottery picks to get him.Not many teams will win with Eddy Curry as your starting Center, on a good team maybe 1st round playoff exit. But Eddy Curry was a poor rebounder for his size, he also did not average a bpg.

Jamal Crawford's tenure with the Knicks saw him grow up. When he first cameto the Knicks he was very raw, ala J.R. Smith but he was a lot worse on the defensive end and his shot selection. Jamal Crawford was not a starter in this league. Crawford playing a 6th man role was a lot better for him and is now one of the better 6th man's in the league. Crawford also matured a lot more and actually plays some defense.

Quentin Richardson, I don't know why the boards loved him all because he fought with Marbury but the guy coudln't even shoot over 40% from the field with Steve Nash as his PG. Look at his teams after the Knicks guy could barely get big minutes as a bench player.