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Official NY Mets Thread

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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4041 » by Knickfan1982 » Wed Jul 18, 2018 3:05 am

Manhattan Project wrote:
blueNorange wrote:blow up how?

he’s under team control for 2 more years.


When your giving public ultimatums, it's time to make a move. Do you really expect the Mets to pay for a premium pitcher when the team is terrible and is carry a bunch of dead weight? We have no GM, we have an owner that fears a public outcry which means we'll end up doing nothing. So instead of making use of our most valuable asset, we'll get to continue to watch him dominate for a cellar dweller team.



I agree. They don't need to completely gut the team. But DeGrom is almost 30 and is wasted on a team that is fighting Miami for 4th place. And I saw the Braves firsthand at Yankee Stadium a week or so ago. We won 2 of 3 against them but they are a good team and they are young. They are just going to get better. With the right moves the Mets can retool and get back at them next year. Dealing DeGrom while his value is at its highest might be their best chance.
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4042 » by HarthorneWingo » Wed Jul 18, 2018 3:25 am

Knickfan1982 wrote:
Manhattan Project wrote:
blueNorange wrote:blow up how?

he’s under team control for 2 more years.


When your giving public ultimatums, it's time to make a move. Do you really expect the Mets to pay for a premium pitcher when the team is terrible and is carry a bunch of dead weight? We have no GM, we have an owner that fears a public outcry which means we'll end up doing nothing. So instead of making use of our most valuable asset, we'll get to continue to watch him dominate for a cellar dweller team.



I agree. They don't need to completely gut the team. But DeGrom is almost 30 and is wasted on a team that is fighting Miami for 4th place. And I saw the Braves firsthand at Yankee Stadium a week or so ago. We won 2 of 3 against them but they are a good team and they are young. They are just going to get better. With the right moves the Mets can retool and get back at them next year. Dealing DeGrom while his value is at its highest might be their best chance.


Our team has a core of non-pitcher talent to go along with what appears to be a developing elite starting rotation. That's the thing with baseball. Just like football, you can retool in the off season through free agency. The Wilpons just have to be willing to open up their tight wallets and make some smart decisions.
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4043 » by Knickfan1982 » Wed Jul 18, 2018 2:56 pm

HarthorneWingo wrote:
Our team has a core of non-pitcher talent to go along with what appears to be a developing elite starting rotation. That's the thing with baseball. Just like football, you can retool in the off season through free agency. The Wilpons just have to be willing to open up their tight wallets and make some smart decisions.



I completely disagree. You guys don't have an developing elite starting rotation. You had an elite starting rotation. When it was elite you were in the World Series and Steve Matz was your 4th best starter behind Harvey, DeGrom and Thor. Injuries and Harvey's implosion took that away. If Syndergard is healthy you still have a very good rotation though.

As for your core of non-pitcher talent. I just don't see it. Nimmo is having a good year but as an outfielder he's nothing special. Conforto could be something special but he's regressed tremendously this year The fan base has pretty much given up on Dominic Smith. Your catching situation was so bad a cast off from the Reds was a huge upgrade. Cespedes and Lagares are hurt so often its impossible to count on them. Amed Rosario doesn't look like much of a hitter. Wilmer Flores is at best a latino Ben Zobrist, a good hitter who plays mediocre defense at multiple positions. Your entire roster is held together by duct tape and hope and your minor league system isn't very highly ranked.

Compare that to the rosters and minor leagues of teams like Philly and Atlanta to the Mets. They have tons of talent young players and more looming in the minors. Philly's ownership is also more than willing to open their checkbooks. And the Washington Nationals are still a very good team despite their struggles. Maybe its just me being primarily a Yankees fan but I am not optimistic about your chances. Your owners are cheap and unless something big changes happen I see you guys turning into the Toronto Blue Jays of the NL East. A team good enough to fight for 3rd place.
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4044 » by HarthorneWingo » Wed Jul 18, 2018 3:47 pm

Knickfan1982 wrote:
HarthorneWingo wrote:
Our team has a core of non-pitcher talent to go along with what appears to be a developing elite starting rotation. That's the thing with baseball. Just like football, you can retool in the off season through free agency. The Wilpons just have to be willing to open up their tight wallets and make some smart decisions.



I completely disagree. You guys don't have an developing elite starting rotation. You had an elite starting rotation. When it was elite you were in the World Series and Steve Matz was your 4th best starter behind Harvey, DeGrom and Thor. Injuries and Harvey's implosion took that away. If Syndergard is healthy you still have a very good rotation though.

As for your core of non-pitcher talent. I just don't see it. Nimmo is having a good year but as an outfielder he's nothing special. Conforto could be something special but he's regressed tremendously this year The fan base has pretty much given up on Dominic Smith. Your catching situation was so bad a cast off from the Reds was a huge upgrade. Cespedes and Lagares are hurt so often its impossible to count on them. Amed Rosario doesn't look like much of a hitter. Wilmer Flores is at best a latino Ben Zobrist, a good hitter who plays mediocre defense at multiple positions. Your entire roster is held together by duct tape and hope and your minor league system isn't very highly ranked.

Compare that to the rosters and minor leagues of teams like Philly and Atlanta to the Mets. They have tons of talent young players and more looming in the minors. Philly's ownership is also more than willing to open their checkbooks. And the Washington Nationals are still a very good team despite their struggles. Maybe its just me being primarily a Yankees fan but I am not optimistic about your chances. Your owners are cheap and unless something big changes happen I see you guys turning into the Toronto Blue Jays of the NL East. A team good enough to fight for 3rd place.


Thanks for ruining my day. :lol:
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4045 » by Lord Commander » Wed Jul 18, 2018 6:21 pm

As a Mets fan, I will be so pissed if they trade deGrom for anything less than a package headlined by the other teams TOP prospect. This is true ESPECIALLY in the Yankee's case. Because of who they are and where they play, the have to pay more...sorry.
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4046 » by Knickfan1982 » Wed Jul 18, 2018 9:19 pm

HarthorneWingo wrote:
Knickfan1982 wrote:
HarthorneWingo wrote:
Our team has a core of non-pitcher talent to go along with what appears to be a developing elite starting rotation. That's the thing with baseball. Just like football, you can retool in the off season through free agency. The Wilpons just have to be willing to open up their tight wallets and make some smart decisions.



I completely disagree. You guys don't have an developing elite starting rotation. You had an elite starting rotation. When it was elite you were in the World Series and Steve Matz was your 4th best starter behind Harvey, DeGrom and Thor. Injuries and Harvey's implosion took that away. If Syndergard is healthy you still have a very good rotation though.

As for your core of non-pitcher talent. I just don't see it. Nimmo is having a good year but as an outfielder he's nothing special. Conforto could be something special but he's regressed tremendously this year The fan base has pretty much given up on Dominic Smith. Your catching situation was so bad a cast off from the Reds was a huge upgrade. Cespedes and Lagares are hurt so often its impossible to count on them. Amed Rosario doesn't look like much of a hitter. Wilmer Flores is at best a latino Ben Zobrist, a good hitter who plays mediocre defense at multiple positions. Your entire roster is held together by duct tape and hope and your minor league system isn't very highly ranked.

Compare that to the rosters and minor leagues of teams like Philly and Atlanta to the Mets. They have tons of talent young players and more looming in the minors. Philly's ownership is also more than willing to open their checkbooks. And the Washington Nationals are still a very good team despite their struggles. Maybe its just me being primarily a Yankees fan but I am not optimistic about your chances. Your owners are cheap and unless something big changes happen I see you guys turning into the Toronto Blue Jays of the NL East. A team good enough to fight for 3rd place.


Thanks for ruining my day. :lol:


Its my duty as a Yankees fan lol.
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4047 » by Knickfan1982 » Wed Jul 18, 2018 9:23 pm

Lord Commander wrote:As a Mets fan, I will be so pissed if they trade deGrom for anything less than a package headlined by the other teams TOP prospect. This is true ESPECIALLY in the Yankee's case. Because of who they are and where they play, the have to pay more...sorry.



Gleyber Torres and Miguel Andujar no longer qualify as prospects and are not listed as such on MLB.com's prospect rankings. So technically my offer was even better than your ask because it included the Yankees #1 prospect and a cheap, young and productive major league regular. You're welcome :lol:
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4048 » by blueNorange » Wed Jul 18, 2018 11:08 pm

the mets terrible system now has 3 prospects in ba’s latest top 100

gimenez #68
alonso #77
kelenic #81
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4049 » by NYKnickerbocker » Thu Jul 19, 2018 1:24 am

yea, a lot of the recent draft picks and international signings are starting to show their promise

D
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4050 » by Knickfan1982 » Thu Jul 19, 2018 1:43 am

blueNorange wrote:the mets terrible system now has 3 prospects in ba’s latest top 100

gimenez #68
alonso #77
kelenic #81


First of all, I don't want to turn this into a ____ waving session. I may be a Yankees fan but I also like the Mets. I root for all NY teams except for the Brooklyn Nets because they still have the stink of New Jersey on them. But there are a couple points here. Firstly, when you're talking about a top 100 list of prospects out of a the minor leagues of 30 MLB teams its very likely a team will have at least one prospect. Some teams are bound to have more than one. For instance, the Yankees also have three players in the top 100 and for the most part they are significantly higher than the Mets players. Estevan Florial #37, Justis Sheffield #39 and Albert Abreu #60. Also, there are a couple prospects who the Yankees traded this time last year that still appear on the top 100 list (#71 Jorge Mateo and #80 Blake Rutherford). So we're talking about 5 guys who came up through the Yankees system in the top 100. The final point on the top 100 rankings to consider is that the rankings were updated to reflect current player status. As such two guys (Miguel Andujar and Gleyber Torres) who were ranked in the top 100 of the preseason list are no longer qualified to be listed as prospects. With that being said, having a bunch of guys in the top 100 doesn't qualify you as having a great minor league system. It might just mean your system is very top heavy. A quality farm system doesn't just have top tier talent it has depth throughout the system. One way to measure a teams depth is the Rule 5 draft. If you have a deep system you're going to struggle to protect talent from the annual rule 5 draft. In this draft all 30 teams minor league systems were vulnerable to being poached by one of the other teams. Last year 43 players were selected in the Major league portion of the Rule 5 draft and of those 43 players 4 of them came out of the Yankees system.

7. Braves: RHP Anyelo Gomez (Yankees)
9. Orioles: LHP Nestor Cortes (Yankees)
11. Mariners: IF Mike Ford (Yankees)
18. Orioles: RHP Jose Mesa (Yankees)

Another 2 Yankees were selected in the Triple A portion of the Rule 5.
18. Twins: RHP Yancarlos Baez (Yankees)
32. Marlins: C Sharif Othman (Yankees)


Conversely the Mets had one player selected and it was in the Triple A portion of the draft. (Jose Medina who went to the Padres).
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4051 » by blueNorange » Thu Jul 19, 2018 3:37 am

Knickfan1982 wrote:
blueNorange wrote:the mets terrible system now has 3 prospects in ba’s latest top 100

gimenez #68
alonso #77
kelenic #81


First of all, I don't want to turn this into a ____ waving session. I may be a Yankees fan but I also like the Mets. I root for all NY teams except for the Brooklyn Nets because they still have the stink of New Jersey on them. But there are a couple points here. Firstly, when you're talking about a top 100 list of prospects out of a the minor leagues of 30 MLB teams its very likely a team will have at least one prospect. Some teams are bound to have more than one. For instance, the Yankees also have three players in the top 100 and for the most part they are significantly higher than the Mets players. Estevan Florial #37, Justis Sheffield #39 and Albert Abreu #60. Also, there are a couple prospects who the Yankees traded this time last year that still appear on the top 100 list (#71 Jorge Mateo and #80 Blake Rutherford). So we're talking about 5 guys who came up through the Yankees system in the top 100. The final point on the top 100 rankings to consider is that the rankings were updated to reflect current player status. As such two guys (Miguel Andujar and Gleyber Torres) who were ranked in the top 100 of the preseason list are no longer qualified to be listed as prospects. With that being said, having a bunch of guys in the top 100 doesn't qualify you as having a great minor league system. It might just mean your system is very top heavy. A quality farm system doesn't just have top tier talent it has depth throughout the system. One way to measure a teams depth is the Rule 5 draft. If you have a deep system you're going to struggle to protect talent from the annual rule 5 draft. In this draft all 30 teams minor league systems were vulnerable to being poached by one of the other teams. Last year 43 players were selected in the Major league portion of the Rule 5 draft and of those 43 players 4 of them came out of the Yankees system.

7. Braves: RHP Anyelo Gomez (Yankees)
9. Orioles: LHP Nestor Cortes (Yankees)
11. Mariners: IF Mike Ford (Yankees)
18. Orioles: RHP Jose Mesa (Yankees)

Another 2 Yankees were selected in the Triple A portion of the Rule 5.
18. Twins: RHP Yancarlos Baez (Yankees)
32. Marlins: C Sharif Othman (Yankees)


Conversely the Mets had one player selected and it was in the Triple A portion of the draft. (Jose Medina who went to the Padres).


i’m not reading this long winded post, that post wasnt directed at you at all.

lol at you writing an essay.
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4052 » by Knickfan1982 » Thu Jul 19, 2018 3:57 am

blueNorange wrote:
i’m not reading this long winded post, that post wasnt directed at you at all.

lol at you writing an essay.


It probably took you longer to turn on your computer and open up realgm than it would take you to read what I wrote. If you don't want to read it then don't respond. Silence is always preferred to proud expressions of willful ignorance.
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4053 » by blueNorange » Thu Jul 19, 2018 4:06 am

Knickfan1982 wrote:
blueNorange wrote:
i’m not reading this long winded post, that post wasnt directed at you at all.

lol at you writing an essay.


It probably took you longer to turn on your computer and open up realgm than it would take you to read what I wrote. If you don't want to read it then don't respond. Silence is always preferred to proud expressions of willful ignorance.

but in this case you thought i was talking to you when in fact i wasn’t. you quoted me, not the other way around.

my post was for guys like MP and hawthorne who think there’s nothing.

not you.
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4054 » by reub » Thu Jul 19, 2018 4:35 am

I do think that now is the time to trade Degrom, providing we can get proper value in return. Andujar, Frazier and Sheffield is proper value.
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4055 » by blueNorange » Thu Jul 19, 2018 6:57 am

reub wrote:I do think that now is the time to trade Degrom, providing we can get proper value in return. Andujar, Frazier and Sheffield is proper value.

no it's not.
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4056 » by Stannis » Thu Jul 19, 2018 9:22 am

I just hope that the Mets don't try to stay in any middle ground. If they are going to have a fire sale, have a fire sale and trade all the pitchers for the best prospects you got.

If they think they will have better luck next year, then hold onto what you got. The pitching is starting to come around it looks like. Matz and Wheeler are looking good.

And it looks like they should have been more patient with Matt Harvey. It was his contract year, so they could have took a high-risk/high-reward move and waited to trade him at the deadline.

I'm not sure how the Wilpon's wallet is looking, but they can't keep relying on Cespedes to be healthy. At this point, it looks like he's just an untradable peace with his injury proneness, no trade-clause, and contract. So much holes in the batting lineup if you want to go on one last ride....
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4057 » by Stannis » Thu Jul 19, 2018 9:24 am

Lord Commander wrote:As a Mets fan, I will be so pissed if they trade deGrom for anything less than a package headlined by the other teams TOP prospect. This is true ESPECIALLY in the Yankee's case. Because of who they are and where they play, the have to pay more...sorry.

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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4058 » by GEOLINK » Thu Jul 19, 2018 10:22 am

blueNorange wrote:
reub wrote:I do think that now is the time to trade Degrom, providing we can get proper value in return. Andujar, Frazier and Sheffield is proper value.

no it's not.

What exactly are you looking for then? No team is trading a Gleyber Torres here.
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4059 » by Knickfan1982 » Thu Jul 19, 2018 11:54 am

blueNorange wrote:
Knickfan1982 wrote:
blueNorange wrote:
i’m not reading this long winded post, that post wasnt directed at you at all.

lol at you writing an essay.


It probably took you longer to turn on your computer and open up realgm than it would take you to read what I wrote. If you don't want to read it then don't respond. Silence is always preferred to proud expressions of willful ignorance.

but in this case you thought i was talking to you when in fact i wasn’t. you quoted me, not the other way around.

my post was for guys like MP and hawthorne who think there’s nothing.

not you.



Then don't respond. Simple. As I said, silence is always preferable to proud statements of willful ignorance.
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4060 » by Manhattan Project » Thu Jul 19, 2018 12:18 pm

blueNorange wrote:but in this case you thought i was talking to you when in fact i wasn’t. you quoted me, not the other way around.

my post was for guys like MP and hawthorne who think there’s nothing.

not you.


This time last year we have Rosario who was considered a top five prospect and Dominic Smith who was ranked higher than Alonso is right now. So now we have two guys who are years away because we'll never fast track them and Alonso. I'd feel better if Smith showed anything, there wasn't talks of Cespedes playing the first and the dead weight that is Bruce.

All of our pitching is years away, at least we addressed that in recent drafts. It had to be because we had a ton of questions about our once 1 billion dollar pitching staff. Guys like Flexen, Oswalt and the Irish dude wasn't going to cut it and it appears that Lugo and Gsellman are better suited in the bullpen.

So we still have two guys in the top 100 and we added the sixth overall pick into that mix. It's still nothing. You can argue we have one player that might make an impact on our team in the near future. Being a top prospect doesn't mean anything at the end of the day, but I don't see how anyone could argue that we're in a good position with our farm system right now when den Dekker and Kelly are guys that we call up.
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