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Official NY Mets Thread

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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4641 » by reub » Sat Aug 11, 2018 1:37 am

HarthorneWingo wrote:
blueNorange wrote:
HarthorneWingo wrote:
That's right because - having played the game at a relatively high level and having been coached by an ex-MLB pitcher - I know that geeks like yourself who never played the game will therefore never full understand what the mental dynamics are like and the different permutations that players are confronted with during the course of a game. Yes, analytics are useful tools in baseball scouting. But knowledge of the game - of which you seem to have little - is more important. The down side to sabermatrics in baseball is that allows people like yourself to think they know something about the game when, in fact, they don't.

So I guess you want Sandy back, or hire a Sandy clone to replace him, because that's worked out so well for us. lol

if you actually had a clue(spoiler alert you don't) then you'd know sandy's thinking of how to construct a team isn't "new" anymore, it's old.

baseball has changed that sandy has a old school method. sandy only looked at obp and slugging, baseball is more than that now. a pioneer inspired many to improve an approach, and the mets are going backwards :lol:

the dodgers, astros, cubs, yankees, red sox are doing fine with new baseball approach. even tampa is great with their low salary, it's because their front office is top notch and knows talent that's not "the eye test".

so congrats on being an old timer that thinks their baseball was the best years, when in fact it wasn't.


Ok, so at least we established that you never played the game. Check.

With regarding to Yankees, Astros, Sox and Cubs, they're not doing anything special except drafting excellent baseball talent and making smart trades and FA signings. Nothing new to see here.

Why do you explain to me - chapter and verse - those specific differences in their "new scouting model" and how it led to changes in the specific players they chose to pursue and acquire. I want to learn EXACTLY how this new model has been implemented around baseball. I'll be waiting.


He's not going to tell you anything because he can't tell you anything.

Come on, young blorange, give your daddy back his account.
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4642 » by HarthorneWingo » Sat Aug 11, 2018 2:55 am

reub wrote:
HarthorneWingo wrote:
blueNorange wrote:if you actually had a clue(spoiler alert you don't) then you'd know sandy's thinking of how to construct a team isn't "new" anymore, it's old.

baseball has changed that sandy has a old school method. sandy only looked at obp and slugging, baseball is more than that now. a pioneer inspired many to improve an approach, and the mets are going backwards :lol:

the dodgers, astros, cubs, yankees, red sox are doing fine with new baseball approach. even tampa is great with their low salary, it's because their front office is top notch and knows talent that's not "the eye test".

so congrats on being an old timer that thinks their baseball was the best years, when in fact it wasn't.


Ok, so at least we established that you never played the game. Check.

With regarding to Yankees, Astros, Sox and Cubs, they're not doing anything special except drafting excellent baseball talent and making smart trades and FA signings. Nothing new to see here.

Why do you explain to me - chapter and verse - those specific differences in their "new scouting model" and how it led to changes in the specific players they chose to pursue and acquire. I want to learn EXACTLY how this new model has been implemented around baseball. I'll be waiting.


He's not going to tell you anything because he can't tell you anything.

Come on, young blorange, give your daddy back his account.


Ya know, when things like THIS happen, I sometimes think to myself "Maybe there really is a God."

bNo, you are my bitch! :lol: Now go fetch me my slippers.

https://www.cbssports.com/mlb/news/mets-reportedly-leaning-toward-hiring-old-school-gm-worried-about-being-too-analytics-driven/

Mets reportedly leaning toward hiring old-school GM, worried about being too 'analytics driven'
The Mets will be in the market for a new GM this winter, and here's what they want in their next one
R.J. Anderson

We already knew the New York Mets would hire a new general manager this winter, and now we're beginning to get a sense of what they'll be looking for in their candidates.

Per the New York Post's Mike Puma, the Mets believe they might have leaned too heavily on analytics during Sandy Alderson's tenure. With that in mind, they may want more of an old-school type as their next GM:

There is thought among team officials that perhaps the Mets became [i]too analytics driven in recent seasons under Sandy Alderson's watch, and a veteran leader with a pure baseball background would help shift the organization toward the center. Puma mentions Gary LaRocque as someone whose name has came up so far. LaRocque used to be the Mets scouting director and has more recently served with the St. Louis Cardinals. It's unclear whether he'll actually receive an interview or consideration when the time comes, but Puma states the Mets will pay heed to Omar Minaya's voice during the search process.[/i]

There's nothing inherently wrong with hiring an old-school general manager provided that it's one who is willing to weigh all types of information. To hire an executive unwilling to consider analytics to any extent is a bad idea, however, given the direction of the league. Achieving a balance is ideal -- but remember, achieving a balance should be about making both the stats and scouting sides strong and equal, not prioritizing one above the other. If that's the Mets' intent, then perhaps this works out just fine.
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4643 » by HarthorneWingo » Sat Aug 11, 2018 2:59 am

reub wrote:
HarthorneWingo wrote:
blueNorange wrote:if you actually had a clue(spoiler alert you don't) then you'd know sandy's thinking of how to construct a team isn't "new" anymore, it's old.

baseball has changed that sandy has a old school method. sandy only looked at obp and slugging, baseball is more than that now. a pioneer inspired many to improve an approach, and the mets are going backwards :lol:

the dodgers, astros, cubs, yankees, red sox are doing fine with new baseball approach. even tampa is great with their low salary, it's because their front office is top notch and knows talent that's not "the eye test".

so congrats on being an old timer that thinks their baseball was the best years, when in fact it wasn't.


Ok, so at least we established that you never played the game. Check.

With regarding to Yankees, Astros, Sox and Cubs, they're not doing anything special except drafting excellent baseball talent and making smart trades and FA signings. Nothing new to see here.

Why do you explain to me - chapter and verse - those specific differences in their "new scouting model" and how it led to changes in the specific players they chose to pursue and acquire. I want to learn EXACTLY how this new model has been implemented around baseball. I'll be waiting.


He's not going to tell you anything because he can't tell you anything.

Come on, young blorange, give your daddy back his account.


He doesn't realize that I know more about baseball than I do about basketball. :lol:
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4644 » by Mecca » Sat Aug 11, 2018 3:05 am

HarthorneWingo wrote:
blueNorange wrote:
HarthorneWingo wrote:
That's right because - having played the game at a relatively high level and having been coached by an ex-MLB pitcher - I know that geeks like yourself who never played the game will therefore never full understand what the mental dynamics are like and the different permutations that players are confronted with during the course of a game. Yes, analytics are useful tools in baseball scouting. But knowledge of the game - of which you seem to have little - is more important. The down side to sabermatrics in baseball is that allows people like yourself to think they know something about the game when, in fact, they don't.

So I guess you want Sandy back, or hire a Sandy clone to replace him, because that's worked out so well for us. lol

if you actually had a clue(spoiler alert you don't) then you'd know sandy's thinking of how to construct a team isn't "new" anymore, it's old.

baseball has changed that sandy has a old school method. sandy only looked at obp and slugging, baseball is more than that now. a pioneer inspired many to improve an approach, and the mets are going backwards :lol:

the dodgers, astros, cubs, yankees, red sox are doing fine with new baseball approach. even tampa is great with their low salary, it's because their front office is top notch and knows talent that's not "the eye test".

so congrats on being an old timer that thinks their baseball was the best years, when in fact it wasn't.


Ok, so at least we established that you never played the game. Check.

With regarding to Yankees, Astros, Sox and Cubs, they're not doing anything special except drafting excellent baseball talent and making smart trades and FA signings. Nothing new to see here.

Why do you explain to me - chapter and verse - those specific differences in their "new scouting model" and how it led to changes in the specific players they chose to pursue and acquire. I want to learn EXACTLY how this new model has been implemented around baseball. I'll be waiting.


Hard hit rate, fly ball rate, fly ball to HR, babip, FIP, swinging strike rate, etc.
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4645 » by Manhattan Project » Sat Aug 11, 2018 3:06 am

'Super Nerds' Are 'Killing The Game'
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4646 » by HarthorneWingo » Sat Aug 11, 2018 3:09 am

Mecca wrote:
HarthorneWingo wrote:
blueNorange wrote:if you actually had a clue(spoiler alert you don't) then you'd know sandy's thinking of how to construct a team isn't "new" anymore, it's old.

baseball has changed that sandy has a old school method. sandy only looked at obp and slugging, baseball is more than that now. a pioneer inspired many to improve an approach, and the mets are going backwards :lol:

the dodgers, astros, cubs, yankees, red sox are doing fine with new baseball approach. even tampa is great with their low salary, it's because their front office is top notch and knows talent that's not "the eye test".

so congrats on being an old timer that thinks their baseball was the best years, when in fact it wasn't.


Ok, so at least we established that you never played the game. Check.

With regarding to Yankees, Astros, Sox and Cubs, they're not doing anything special except drafting excellent baseball talent and making smart trades and FA signings. Nothing new to see here.

Why do you explain to me - chapter and verse - those specific differences in their "new scouting model" and how it led to changes in the specific players they chose to pursue and acquire. I want to learn EXACTLY how this new model has been implemented around baseball. I'll be waiting.


Hard hit rate, fly ball rate, fly ball to HR, babip, FIP, swinging strike rate, etc.


Nah, I'm talking about decisions on specific players. I'm talking about a level of analysis that bNo will not be able to give. In any event, the Mets are, thankfully, look for an "old-school" GM who knows baseball and baseball talent and who will be able to incorporate statistical analysis as a means of augmentation his acquired baseball acumen and not to be used as a Bible.
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4647 » by Manhattan Project » Sat Aug 11, 2018 3:10 am

With how incredible Wheeler has looked, it pains me to say this but is Wheeler on a innings limit? He pitched 86 innings last year, he's up to 134 on the season. You think the Mets are going to let him start the entire way out?
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4648 » by HarthorneWingo » Sat Aug 11, 2018 3:49 am

Manhattan Project wrote:With how incredible Wheeler has looked, it pains me to say this but is Wheeler on a innings limit? He pitched 86 innings last year, he's up to 134 on the season. You think the Mets are going to let him start the entire way out?


No, I don't. I think I heard Gary Cohen discuss that very issue with Ron and/or Keith. Gary seemed certain that given the past and how well things are going now - along with the fact that we're not competing for anything - a reasonably competent baseball staff would manage his innings carefully. As we closer to September, I'm expecting to see Ricco bring up some of our youngsters. Does that mean Peterson or Dunn? Who knows (except bNo, of course)? :lol: I read something about Peterson having a bit of a dead arm issue? Dunn is surging though. I went to BC so I'd love to see him succeed with our team.
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4649 » by reub » Sat Aug 11, 2018 4:05 am

HarthorneWingo wrote:
Manhattan Project wrote:With how incredible Wheeler has looked, it pains me to say this but is Wheeler on a innings limit? He pitched 86 innings last year, he's up to 134 on the season. You think the Mets are going to let him start the entire way out?


No, I don't. I think I heard Gary Cohen discuss that very issue with Ron and/or Keith. Gary seemed certain that given the past and how well things are going now - along with the fact that we're not competing for anything - a reasonably competent baseball staff would manage his innings carefully. As we closer to September, I'm expecting to see Ricco bring up some of our youngsters. Does that mean Peterson or Dunn? Who knows (except bNo, of course)? :lol: I read something about Peterson having a bit of a dead arm issue? Dunn is surging though. I went to BC so I'd love to see him succeed with our team.


I agree. Wheeler should be shut down at some point and one or two youngsters should be given a shot. Dunn would be my choice too but I haven't consulted my calculator so I might be wrong.
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4650 » by HarthorneWingo » Sat Aug 11, 2018 4:30 am

reub wrote:
HarthorneWingo wrote:
Manhattan Project wrote:With how incredible Wheeler has looked, it pains me to say this but is Wheeler on a innings limit? He pitched 86 innings last year, he's up to 134 on the season. You think the Mets are going to let him start the entire way out?


No, I don't. I think I heard Gary Cohen discuss that very issue with Ron and/or Keith. Gary seemed certain that given the past and how well things are going now - along with the fact that we're not competing for anything - a reasonably competent baseball staff would manage his innings carefully. As we closer to September, I'm expecting to see Ricco bring up some of our youngsters. Does that mean Peterson or Dunn? Who knows (except bNo, of course)? :lol: I read something about Peterson having a bit of a dead arm issue? Dunn is surging though. I went to BC so I'd love to see him succeed with our team.


I agree. Wheeler should be shut down at some point and one or two youngsters should be given a shot. Dunn would be my choice too but I haven't consulted my calculator so I might be wrong.


Who else is there? I'd love to see Mejia pitch again, just because. :lol: When do the rosters expand to 40? Sometime around Labor Day?
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4651 » by blueNorange » Sat Aug 11, 2018 4:53 am

HarthorneWingo wrote:
reub wrote:
HarthorneWingo wrote:
Ok, so at least we established that you never played the game. Check.

With regarding to Yankees, Astros, Sox and Cubs, they're not doing anything special except drafting excellent baseball talent and making smart trades and FA signings. Nothing new to see here.

Why do you explain to me - chapter and verse - those specific differences in their "new scouting model" and how it led to changes in the specific players they chose to pursue and acquire. I want to learn EXACTLY how this new model has been implemented around baseball. I'll be waiting.


He's not going to tell you anything because he can't tell you anything.

Come on, young blorange, give your daddy back his account.


Ya know, when things like THIS happen, I sometimes think to myself "Maybe there really is a God."

bNo, you are my bitch! :lol: Now go fetch me my slippers.

https://www.cbssports.com/mlb/news/mets-reportedly-leaning-toward-hiring-old-school-gm-worried-about-being-too-analytics-driven/

Mets reportedly leaning toward hiring old-school GM, worried about being too 'analytics driven'
The Mets will be in the market for a new GM this winter, and here's what they want in their next one
R.J. Anderson

We already knew the New York Mets would hire a new general manager this winter, and now we're beginning to get a sense of what they'll be looking for in their candidates.

Per the New York Post's Mike Puma, the Mets believe they might have leaned too heavily on analytics during Sandy Alderson's tenure. With that in mind, they may want more of an old-school type as their next GM:

There is thought among team officials that perhaps the Mets became [i]too analytics driven in recent seasons under Sandy Alderson's watch, and a veteran leader with a pure baseball background would help shift the organization toward the center. Puma mentions Gary LaRocque as someone whose name has came up so far. LaRocque used to be the Mets scouting director and has more recently served with the St. Louis Cardinals. It's unclear whether he'll actually receive an interview or consideration when the time comes, but Puma states the Mets will pay heed to Omar Minaya's voice during the search process.[/i]

There's nothing inherently wrong with hiring an old-school general manager provided that it's one who is willing to weigh all types of information. To hire an executive unwilling to consider analytics to any extent is a bad idea, however, given the direction of the league. Achieving a balance is ideal -- but remember, achieving a balance should be about making both the stats and scouting sides strong and equal, not prioritizing one above the other. If that's the Mets' intent, then perhaps this works out just fine.

excepts the mets have been anything but analytic driven.
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4652 » by blueNorange » Sat Aug 11, 2018 4:54 am

HarthorneWingo wrote:
reub wrote:
HarthorneWingo wrote:
Ok, so at least we established that you never played the game. Check.

With regarding to Yankees, Astros, Sox and Cubs, they're not doing anything special except drafting excellent baseball talent and making smart trades and FA signings. Nothing new to see here.

Why do you explain to me - chapter and verse - those specific differences in their "new scouting model" and how it led to changes in the specific players they chose to pursue and acquire. I want to learn EXACTLY how this new model has been implemented around baseball. I'll be waiting.


He's not going to tell you anything because he can't tell you anything.

Come on, young blorange, give your daddy back his account.


He doesn't realize that I know more about baseball than I do about basketball. :lol:

you've shown nothing about baseball other than the eye test.
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4653 » by blueNorange » Sat Aug 11, 2018 4:56 am

HarthorneWingo wrote:
Mecca wrote:
HarthorneWingo wrote:
Ok, so at least we established that you never played the game. Check.

With regarding to Yankees, Astros, Sox and Cubs, they're not doing anything special except drafting excellent baseball talent and making smart trades and FA signings. Nothing new to see here.

Why do you explain to me - chapter and verse - those specific differences in their "new scouting model" and how it led to changes in the specific players they chose to pursue and acquire. I want to learn EXACTLY how this new model has been implemented around baseball. I'll be waiting.


Hard hit rate, fly ball rate, fly ball to HR, babip, FIP, swinging strike rate, etc.


Nah, I'm talking about decisions on specific players. I'm talking about a level of analysis that bNo will not be able to give. In any event, the Mets are, thankfully, look for an "old-school" GM who knows baseball and baseball talent and who will be able to incorporate statistical analysis as a means of augmentation his acquired baseball acumen and not to be used as a Bible.

you know what franchise decided to go to an old school approach?

the tigers.

but the wilpons caters to people like you that still think bunting is a great idea.
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4654 » by HarthorneWingo » Sat Aug 11, 2018 6:20 am

blueNorange wrote:
HarthorneWingo wrote:
reub wrote:
He's not going to tell you anything because he can't tell you anything.

Come on, young blorange, give your daddy back his account.


He doesn't realize that I know more about baseball than I do about basketball. :lol:

you've shown nothing about baseball other than the eye test.


:lol: But I know what I'm doing. Jesus, the article said that Sandy was too much into the stats. What more do you need?

So what do you think of this "old school" St. Louie GM? Does he meet with your sabermetric approval? Are there advanced stats on his GM-fWAR rating? :lol:

How about his VORP? Does he have good VORP?
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4655 » by blueNorange » Sat Aug 11, 2018 6:46 am

HarthorneWingo wrote:
blueNorange wrote:
HarthorneWingo wrote:
He doesn't realize that I know more about baseball than I do about basketball. :lol:

you've shown nothing about baseball other than the eye test.


:lol: But I know what I'm doing. Jesus, the article said that Sandy was too much into the stats. What more do you need?

So what do you think of this "old school" St. Louie GM? Does he meet with your sabermetric approval? Are there advanced stats on his GM-fWAR rating? :lol:

How about his VORP? Does he have good VORP?

ARE YOU BLIND??

did you not read the wilpon hit piece that was published a month ago? this is the wilpons passing the blame on sandy and his "analytics". the wilpons always put the blame on someone else. you must be on a new level if you think sandy's approach is the reason the mets suck :lol: he signed jay bruce yet bruce doesn't fill what sandy cares about, that move is a wilpon special.

sandy was hired by the mets for 3 things.

1. take the hit for cutting the payroll
2. take the blame when things get tough
3. become the scapegoat

those are 3 things the new gm will also agree too, why do you think the wilpons want an old school head? :lol: so he can push his opinion more with an old dumbass that knows what he wants.

i mean for crying out loud jeff used sandy's cancer as a reason to fire him.

why do you think reyes is on the roster and playing?
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4656 » by Stannis » Sat Aug 11, 2018 8:11 am

DeGrom, Wheeler, and Thor still on for next season.

A lot of things probably won't go there way, but a lot of things probably can. There can be some magic.

It's a shame, any other owner than the Wilpons, and this team can contend easily.
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4657 » by reub » Sat Aug 11, 2018 12:24 pm

HarthorneWingo wrote:
blueNorange wrote:
HarthorneWingo wrote:
He doesn't realize that I know more about baseball than I do about basketball. :lol:

you've shown nothing about baseball other than the eye test.


:lol: But I know what I'm doing. Jesus, the article said that Sandy was too much into the stats. What more do you need?

So what do you think of this "old school" St. Louie GM? Does he meet with your sabermetric approval? Are there advanced stats on his GM-fWAR rating? :lol:

How about his VORP? Does he have good VORP?


When my VORP goes bad I immediately run to the doctor. He has been able to fix it with a change in diet and exercise so far.
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4658 » by blueNorange » Sat Aug 11, 2018 6:58 pm

more wilpons/manager not on the same page nonsense.

can it be anymore obvious the mets don't want alonso to kick ass and then go through next spring getting negative press after naming jay bruce the 1b??

According to Mike Puma of the New York Post, the Mets are leaning towards not calling up Peter Alonso on September 1. This report comes just hours after Mickey Callaway said, “He’s an interesting kid. He’s a hard worker, we found that out in Spring Training. He’s been willing to do everything that he can do to improve every day.”

According to Puma, reasons for the lack of a promotion for Alonso are a preexisting log-jam at first base (Wilmer Flores, Jay Bruce, Dominic Smith), and that Alonso doesn’t need to be on the 40-Man roster until after the 2019 season and there’s no urgency in having to add him to the 40-Man roster now. The Mets have been hesitant to call on Alonso all season long, and continue to show more of the same here.

Alonso, MLB Pipeline’s No. 63 prospect, is the first player in all of professional baseball to reach 100 RBIs on the season. The righty-swinging slugger is hitting .286/.402/.565 in 475 plate appearances between Double-A Binghamton and Triple-A Las Vegas.

Alonso, 23, is the Mets’ No. 2 prospect according to MLB Pipeline and was recently ranked No. 4 by our team at MetsMinors.net. He was recently named organizational defensive player of the month for July.
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4659 » by reub » Mon Aug 13, 2018 12:22 am

We've got a 3B at St. Lucie who has great defensive ability and look at his swing!

;feature=youtu.be
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Re: Official NY Mets Thread 

Post#4660 » by reub » Mon Aug 13, 2018 12:23 am

blueNorange wrote:more wilpons/manager not on the same page nonsense.

can it be anymore obvious the mets don't want alonso to kick ass and then go through next spring getting negative press after naming jay bruce the 1b??

According to Mike Puma of the New York Post, the Mets are leaning towards not calling up Peter Alonso on September 1. This report comes just hours after Mickey Callaway said, “He’s an interesting kid. He’s a hard worker, we found that out in Spring Training. He’s been willing to do everything that he can do to improve every day.”

According to Puma, reasons for the lack of a promotion for Alonso are a preexisting log-jam at first base (Wilmer Flores, Jay Bruce, Dominic Smith), and that Alonso doesn’t need to be on the 40-Man roster until after the 2019 season and there’s no urgency in having to add him to the 40-Man roster now. The Mets have been hesitant to call on Alonso all season long, and continue to show more of the same here.

Alonso, MLB Pipeline’s No. 63 prospect, is the first player in all of professional baseball to reach 100 RBIs on the season. The righty-swinging slugger is hitting .286/.402/.565 in 475 plate appearances between Double-A Binghamton and Triple-A Las Vegas.

Alonso, 23, is the Mets’ No. 2 prospect according to MLB Pipeline and was recently ranked No. 4 by our team at MetsMinors.net. He was recently named organizational defensive player of the month for July.

We should be seeing him on September 1st, I'm guessing.

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