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2018 Draft Thread (UPDATED POLL)

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Who ya wanna tank for?

Luka Doncic
70
53%
Marvin Bagley
16
12%
Michael Porter Jr
32
24%
Mohamed Bamba
2
2%
DeAndre Ayton
5
4%
Hamidou Diallo
1
1%
Kevin Knox
1
1%
Colin Sexton
1
1%
Miles Bridges
2
2%
Isaac Bonga
3
2%
 
Total votes: 133

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Re: 2018 Draft Thread (UPDATED POLL) 

Post#1101 » by El Poochio » Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:24 pm

Rasho Brezec wrote:
Read on Twitter


Tweet that to Luka please and tell him to refuse to work out with Revolting Bulls
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Re: 2018 Draft Thread (UPDATED POLL) 

Post#1102 » by Marty McFly » Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:25 pm

TankCommander17 wrote:
Marty McFly wrote:
TankCommander17 wrote:No he hasn't played against nba competition. He is playing against other athletically challenged players.

Simmons right now sucking at shooting seems to have elite skills for his size. If he learns to post up its over and they play him at the 1 its over for opposing teams. The rondo comparisons are not far off. And that is an elite elite talent.


I knew someone would bring the one game he played which he didn't play that well all things given.

Most of his highlights are against other athletically challenged euros. Not a good look.

lol. if you knew someone would mention it, why would you lie and say that he hasn't played against nba competition? he put up 3/5/ and 4 in 18 minutes, at the age of 17. that's bad, how?
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Re: 2018 Draft Thread (UPDATED POLL) 

Post#1103 » by Capn'O » Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:25 pm

Knickstape1214 wrote:
3toheadmelo wrote:who do u guys think is better

ben simmons or doncic

im going with doncic since he can shoot it lights out


Doncic. He's the best wing prospect as far back as I can remember.


If he keeps this up you might have to take "wing" out of that sentence. He's looking like the best prospect since Durant/Oden to me.
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Re: 2018 Draft Thread (UPDATED POLL) 

Post#1104 » by Rasho Brezec » Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:31 pm

Capn'O wrote:
Knickstape1214 wrote:
3toheadmelo wrote:who do u guys think is better

ben simmons or doncic

im going with doncic since he can shoot it lights out


Doncic. He's the best wing prospect as far back as I can remember.


If he keeps this up you might have to take "wing" out of that sentence. He's looking like the best prospect since Durant/Oden to me.

To be fair, his only consistent offensive move is the stepback 3. He needs to expand his arsenal and use those up and unders and floaters on a regular basis instead of the odd game.
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Re: 2018 Draft Thread (UPDATED POLL) 

Post#1105 » by Capn'O » Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:37 pm

Rasho Brezec wrote:
Capn'O wrote:
Knickstape1214 wrote:
Doncic. He's the best wing prospect as far back as I can remember.


If he keeps this up you might have to take "wing" out of that sentence. He's looking like the best prospect since Durant/Oden to me.

To be fair, his only consistent offensive move is the stepback 3. He needs to expand his arsenal and use those up and unders and floaters on a regular basis instead of the odd game.


That and the ol' Harden Flop.

It seems like he does have a good post game as well though I only see highlights.
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Re: 2018 Draft Thread (UPDATED POLL) 

Post#1106 » by El Poochio » Thu Oct 12, 2017 9:05 pm

Capn'O wrote:
Knickstape1214 wrote:
3toheadmelo wrote:who do u guys think is better

ben simmons or doncic

im going with doncic since he can shoot it lights out


Doncic. He's the best wing prospect as far back as I can remember.


If he keeps this up you might have to take "wing" out of that sentence. He's looking like the best prospect since Durant/Oden to me.


Actually I am with TankCommander to a degree, explosiveness for a white perimeter player in current NBA especially one coming from Europe is always a concern, which could limit his upside

Think about the superstar perimeter players, or sub superstars, Dragic is quite athletic, Hayward is only white in colour

This is the same concern with Frank, but his African origins gives me more confidence, and as a team our identity is so clear now I am not even concerned about Doncic, a better NBA proven Bodiroga who is gonna end up as the best European basketball player ever played the game, and a multiple title winner New York Knicks legend, or at worst it would be just crazy fun #EuroBall

Parker = Frank

Manu = Luka

Duncan = KP
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G: Donovan Mitchell | Rodney McGruder | D. Reed
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Re: 2018 Draft Thread (UPDATED POLL) 

Post#1107 » by 3toheadmelo » Thu Oct 12, 2017 9:09 pm

Rasho Brezec wrote:
Capn'O wrote:
Knickstape1214 wrote:
Doncic. He's the best wing prospect as far back as I can remember.


If he keeps this up you might have to take "wing" out of that sentence. He's looking like the best prospect since Durant/Oden to me.

To be fair, his only consistent offensive move is the stepback 3. He needs to expand his arsenal and use those up and unders and floaters on a regular basis instead of the odd game.

yeah i noticed that as well
i would like to see him use other moves to create shots, and improve his defense. for me, those are my concerns with him
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Re: 2018 Draft Thread (UPDATED POLL) 

Post#1108 » by El Poochio » Thu Oct 12, 2017 9:20 pm

3toheadmelo wrote:
Rasho Brezec wrote:
Capn'O wrote:
If he keeps this up you might have to take "wing" out of that sentence. He's looking like the best prospect since Durant/Oden to me.

To be fair, his only consistent offensive move is the stepback 3. He needs to expand his arsenal and use those up and unders and floaters on a regular basis instead of the odd game.

yeah i noticed that as well
i would like to see him use other moves to create shots, and improve his defense. for me, those are my concerns with him


If he can turn out to be this type of offensive juggernaught and carry the team's offense, his defense is fine due to his rebounding and awareness, cant expect to carry you on offense and lock up other team's biggest offensive stars like Kawhi or something
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Re: 2018 Draft Thread (UPDATED POLL) 

Post#1109 » by 3toheadmelo » Thu Oct 12, 2017 9:25 pm

El Poochio wrote:
3toheadmelo wrote:
Rasho Brezec wrote:To be fair, his only consistent offensive move is the stepback 3. He needs to expand his arsenal and use those up and unders and floaters on a regular basis instead of the odd game.

yeah i noticed that as well
i would like to see him use other moves to create shots, and improve his defense. for me, those are my concerns with him


If he can turn out to be this type of offensive juggernaught and carry the team's offense, his defense is fine due to his rebounding and awareness, cant expect to carry you on offense and lock up other team's biggest offensive stars like Kawhi or something

we'll see
if Hornacek does end up staying as the coach for even next season or longer, we really need to prioritize defensive minded players. it's better to have players who can play D rather than have Jeff try to teach them how to play defense
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Re: 2018 Draft Thread (UPDATED POLL) 

Post#1110 » by TankCommander17 » Fri Oct 13, 2017 1:12 am

Knickstape1214 wrote:
TankCommander17 wrote:
Knickstape1214 wrote:
That's just a projection, though. :wink: If I say that Doncic reminds me of a euro-T-Mac (less athleticism) meets Manu meets Roy, would you take him over Rondo?

No he hasn't played against nba competition. He is playing against other athletically challenged players.

Simmons right now sucking at shooting seems to have elite skills for his size. If he learns to post up its over and they play him at the 1 its over for opposing teams. The rondo comparisons are not far off. And that is an elite elite talent.


Other athletically challenged players? Why, because it's Europe? That's horse ****. He's killed it in games against guys who have played in the NBA / are playing in the NBA...as a teenager for the last couple of years. Deny Doncic's talent all you want, but it's dead wrong.

Simmons' sucking at shooting is bad, but there's also his issues finishing in paint, uselessness without the ball on offense (he STILL stands around waiting for it) poor defensive awareness, getting caught in air too often making passes... Funny thing is, he had the same issues at LSU...going against non-NBA talent.

The blind hatred / ignorance is real. :-?

You mean ex nba players who couldn't get another contract in the nba so they had to go to europe. Like Magic Randolph?

I don't hate Doncic. He has very good basketball IQ. He plays well. He is not a scrub. I just don't see his game translating to the nba due to the lack of athleticism. Now I know the usual rebuttal is that Dirk is not athletic at all. But he is 7 feet with one of the best jumpers ever. He doesn't need elite athleticism due to his size and position he plays.

Doncic is going to have an awful time guarding 2s and 3s. And even now he doesn't blow by other athletically challenged people. He uses his IQ and craftiness to get his buckets. But that will only get so far here.
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Re: 2018 Draft Thread (UPDATED POLL) 

Post#1111 » by TankCommander17 » Fri Oct 13, 2017 1:15 am

Knickstape1214 wrote:Simmons finished ~55% of his finishes in the paint at LSU (and it doesn't look anywhere near that high during preseason)...Rondo was at 55% as a rookie.

Rondo also played with Pierce his rookie season that took all of the defense away from him.

Simmons is the focal point of the offense for the most part when Embiid is not playing which has been most of the preseason. Let's be fair in the comparisons.
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Re: 2018 Draft Thread (UPDATED POLL) 

Post#1112 » by Marty McFly » Fri Oct 13, 2017 1:54 am

TankCommander17 wrote:
Knickstape1214 wrote:Simmons finished ~55% of his finishes in the paint at LSU (and it doesn't look anywhere near that high during preseason)...Rondo was at 55% as a rookie.

Rondo also played with Pierce his rookie season that took all of the defense away from him.

Simmons is the focal point of the offense for the most part when Embiid is not playing which has been most of the preseason. Let's be fair in the comparisons.


pierce was a perimeter player though. embiid, while plenty capable of hitting 3's and other outside shots, is going to do most of his damage in the paint, which is about the only place simmons is going to make any sort of dent as a scorer.
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Re: 2018 Draft Thread (UPDATED POLL) 

Post#1113 » by EchelonNYK » Fri Oct 13, 2017 2:02 am

I guarantee you some of these big men won't live up to expectations. Either they under perform or get hurt and piss away their draft stock. i wish more elite guard prospects was in this upcoming class.
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Re: 2018 Draft Thread (UPDATED POLL) 

Post#1114 » by TankCommander17 » Fri Oct 13, 2017 5:45 am

Marty McFly wrote:
TankCommander17 wrote:
Knickstape1214 wrote:Simmons finished ~55% of his finishes in the paint at LSU (and it doesn't look anywhere near that high during preseason)...Rondo was at 55% as a rookie.

Rondo also played with Pierce his rookie season that took all of the defense away from him.

Simmons is the focal point of the offense for the most part when Embiid is not playing which has been most of the preseason. Let's be fair in the comparisons.


pierce was a perimeter player though. embiid, while plenty capable of hitting 3's and other outside shots, is going to do most of his damage in the paint, which is about the only place simmons is going to make any sort of dent as a scorer.

I am talking about this preseason. The teams keyed in on him. He will have this problem all season because Embiid will be limited in minutes and games.

Rondo never had such an issue. But I agree that Simmons has to get a lot better at finishing but we shall see. I am a believer.
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Re: RE: Re: 2018 Draft Thread (UPDATED POLL) 

Post#1115 » by Rasho Brezec » Fri Oct 13, 2017 6:44 am

El Poochio wrote:
Capn'O wrote:
Knickstape1214 wrote:
Doncic. He's the best wing prospect as far back as I can remember.


If he keeps this up you might have to take "wing" out of that sentence. He's looking like the best prospect since Durant/Oden to me.


Actually I am with TankCommander to a degree, explosiveness for a white perimeter player in current NBA especially one coming from Europe is always a concern, which could limit his upside

Think about the superstar perimeter players, or sub superstars, Dragic is quite athletic, Hayward is only white in colour

This is the same concern with Frank, but his African origins gives me more confidence, and as a team our identity is so clear now I am not even concerned about Doncic, a better NBA proven Bodiroga who is gonna end up as the best European basketball player ever played the game, and a multiple title winner New York Knicks legend, or at worst it would be just crazy fun #EuroBall

Parker = Frank

Manu = Luka

Duncan = KP

I agree with most of this, but have to point out that Ginobili was a great athlete for a white guy. Better than Hayward.
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Re: 2018 Draft Thread (UPDATED POLL) 

Post#1116 » by Knickstape1214 » Fri Oct 13, 2017 11:39 am

TankCommander17 wrote:
Knickstape1214 wrote:Simmons finished ~55% of his finishes in the paint at LSU (and it doesn't look anywhere near that high during preseason)...Rondo was at 55% as a rookie.

Rondo also played with Pierce his rookie season that took all of the defense away from him.

Simmons is the focal point of the offense for the most part when Embiid is not playing which has been most of the preseason. Let's be fair in the comparisons.


Taking defense away? They weren't doubling Pierce when Rondo was driving - the lane was still clogged with defenders and Rondo was still able to finish. I've been watching Simmons in preseason and they're not sending another help defender over - he's going 1 on 1 in his drives and he's still not finishing. It was the same thing in college too...this isn't new with him. As of right now, he has no touch in the paint.

TankCommander17 wrote:
Knickstape1214 wrote:
TankCommander17 wrote:No he hasn't played against nba competition. He is playing against other athletically challenged players.

Simmons right now sucking at shooting seems to have elite skills for his size. If he learns to post up its over and they play him at the 1 its over for opposing teams. The rondo comparisons are not far off. And that is an elite elite talent.


Other athletically challenged players? Why, because it's Europe? That's horse ****. He's killed it in games against guys who have played in the NBA / are playing in the NBA...as a teenager for the last couple of years. Deny Doncic's talent all you want, but it's dead wrong.

Simmons' sucking at shooting is bad, but there's also his issues finishing in paint, uselessness without the ball on offense (he STILL stands around waiting for it) poor defensive awareness, getting caught in air too often making passes... Funny thing is, he had the same issues at LSU...going against non-NBA talent.

The blind hatred / ignorance is real. :-?

You mean ex nba players who couldn't get another contract in the nba so they had to go to europe. Like Magic Randolph?

I don't hate Doncic. He has very good basketball IQ. He plays well. He is not a scrub. I just don't see his game translating to the nba due to the lack of athleticism. Now I know the usual rebuttal is that Dirk is not athletic at all. But he is 7 feet with one of the best jumpers ever. He doesn't need elite athleticism due to his size and position he plays.

Doncic is going to have an awful time guarding 2s and 3s. And even now he doesn't blow by other athletically challenged people. He uses his IQ and craftiness to get his buckets. But that will only get so far here.


And I completely disagree...it's simply wrong. You're ignoring guys over the summer he plays against who are in the NBA and the other guys who might not be NBA players but are still good athletes. Sure, he's going to have issues guarding 2s and 3s, but pairing him next to a defensive player and putting a scheme around him that helps cover for him would help him and the team out a huge amount. He also doesn't have to "blow by" other people - he sees the game better, understands angles, has great body control, can finish in the paint, has a damn good jumper, and his IQ is unbelievably high.

Anyways, the bias is clear and I see there's no point in discussing Luka with you anymore, so I'm bowing out. No point in discussing this further.
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Re: 2018 Draft Thread (UPDATED POLL) 

Post#1117 » by TankCommander17 » Fri Oct 13, 2017 1:00 pm

Knickstape1214 wrote:
TankCommander17 wrote:
Knickstape1214 wrote:Simmons finished ~55% of his finishes in the paint at LSU (and it doesn't look anywhere near that high during preseason)...Rondo was at 55% as a rookie.

Rondo also played with Pierce his rookie season that took all of the defense away from him.

Simmons is the focal point of the offense for the most part when Embiid is not playing which has been most of the preseason. Let's be fair in the comparisons.


Taking defense away? They weren't doubling Pierce when Rondo was driving - the lane was still clogged with defenders and Rondo was still able to finish. I've been watching Simmons in preseason and they're not sending another help defender over - he's going 1 on 1 in his drives and he's still not finishing. It was the same thing in college too...this isn't new with him. As of right now, he has no touch in the paint.

TankCommander17 wrote:
Knickstape1214 wrote:
Other athletically challenged players? Why, because it's Europe? That's horse ****. He's killed it in games against guys who have played in the NBA / are playing in the NBA...as a teenager for the last couple of years. Deny Doncic's talent all you want, but it's dead wrong.

Simmons' sucking at shooting is bad, but there's also his issues finishing in paint, uselessness without the ball on offense (he STILL stands around waiting for it) poor defensive awareness, getting caught in air too often making passes... Funny thing is, he had the same issues at LSU...going against non-NBA talent.

The blind hatred / ignorance is real. :-?

You mean ex nba players who couldn't get another contract in the nba so they had to go to europe. Like Magic Randolph?

I don't hate Doncic. He has very good basketball IQ. He plays well. He is not a scrub. I just don't see his game translating to the nba due to the lack of athleticism. Now I know the usual rebuttal is that Dirk is not athletic at all. But he is 7 feet with one of the best jumpers ever. He doesn't need elite athleticism due to his size and position he plays.

Doncic is going to have an awful time guarding 2s and 3s. And even now he doesn't blow by other athletically challenged people. He uses his IQ and craftiness to get his buckets. But that will only get so far here.


And I completely disagree...it's simply wrong. You're ignoring guys over the summer he plays against who are in the NBA and the other guys who might not be NBA players but are still good athletes. Sure, he's going to have issues guarding 2s and 3s, but pairing him next to a defensive player and putting a scheme around him that helps cover for him would help him and the team out a huge amount. He also doesn't have to "blow by" other people - he sees the game better, understands angles, has great body control, can finish in the paint, has a damn good jumper, and his IQ is unbelievably high.

Anyways, the bias is clear and I see there's no point in discussing Luka with you anymore, so I'm bowing out. No point in discussing this further.

How are you going to say I have bias just because I don't agree with you? You don't see you also have a bias of "he is the greatest win prospect, etc, etc.". And whoever doesn't agree is biased against this kid. Who says you are right? Like how is what you say bible and what I say not?

He has great bball IQ for a young player. Absolutely. Does he see angles most kids his age don't? Absolutely. But he doesn't have the elite athleticism to be and ELITE not just good or very good but ELITE player in the league imo. I am looking for an elite or close to elite prospect in this draft becuase that is what we need.

That is not bias. That is me watching the kid and see the good and bad in his game. And how will that translate into the nba.
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Re: RE: Re: 2018 Draft Thread (UPDATED POLL) 

Post#1118 » by TankCommander17 » Fri Oct 13, 2017 1:05 pm

Rasho Brezec wrote:
El Poochio wrote:
Capn'O wrote:
If he keeps this up you might have to take "wing" out of that sentence. He's looking like the best prospect since Durant/Oden to me.


Actually I am with TankCommander to a degree, explosiveness for a white perimeter player in current NBA especially one coming from Europe is always a concern, which could limit his upside

Think about the superstar perimeter players, or sub superstars, Dragic is quite athletic, Hayward is only white in colour

This is the same concern with Frank, but his African origins gives me more confidence, and as a team our identity is so clear now I am not even concerned about Doncic, a better NBA proven Bodiroga who is gonna end up as the best European basketball player ever played the game, and a multiple title winner New York Knicks legend, or at worst it would be just crazy fun #EuroBall

Parker = Frank

Manu = Luka

Duncan = KP

I agree with most of this, but have to point out that Ginobili was a great athlete for a white guy. Better than Hayward.

Manu was a better athlete at a young age than Doncic. It's not even close.
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Re: RE: Re: 2018 Draft Thread (UPDATED POLL) 

Post#1119 » by El Poochio » Fri Oct 13, 2017 1:21 pm

Rasho Brezec wrote:
El Poochio wrote:
Capn'O wrote:
If he keeps this up you might have to take "wing" out of that sentence. He's looking like the best prospect since Durant/Oden to me.


Actually I am with TankCommander to a degree, explosiveness for a white perimeter player in current NBA especially one coming from Europe is always a concern, which could limit his upside

Think about the superstar perimeter players, or sub superstars, Dragic is quite athletic, Hayward is only white in colour

This is the same concern with Frank, but his African origins gives me more confidence, and as a team our identity is so clear now I am not even concerned about Doncic, a better NBA proven Bodiroga who is gonna end up as the best European basketball player ever played the game, and a multiple title winner New York Knicks legend, or at worst it would be just crazy fun #EuroBall

Parker = Frank

Manu = Luka

Duncan = KP

I agree with most of this, but have to point out that Ginobili was a great athlete for a white guy. Better than Hayward.


Yeah and Frank is the exact opposite of Parker, our core is fundamental based besides Duncan is fundamental god and KP is just a freak

Frank to be the vital cog just like how Parker was the driving force of the Spurs Machine, KP as the dominant force just by consistent 2wayness alone as Duncan, and like Manu, Luka as the ultimate wildcard to solve puzzles, get you through the high level bosses, and the ultimate difference maker between a really solid team and a championship level one that can get through every obstacle
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Re: 2018 Draft Thread (UPDATED POLL) 

Post#1120 » by Knickstape1214 » Fri Oct 13, 2017 1:47 pm

NCAA starts one month from today. :D

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