ImageImageImageImageImage

Knicks sign Trey Burke

Moderators: moocow007, magnumt, Capn'O, Knickstape1214, Thorn, King of Canada, GONYK, NoLayupRule, mrpoetryNmotion, Thugger HBC, Deeeez Knicks, j4remi

User avatar
GONYK
Forum Mod - Knicks
Forum Mod - Knicks
Posts: 50,555
And1: 14,564
Joined: Jun 27, 2003
Location: Frankie N Baby
   

Re: Knicks sign Trey Burke 

Post#461 » by GONYK » Thu Oct 12, 2017 3:09 pm

mpharris36 wrote:
GONYK wrote:
mpharris36 wrote:
what values were they instilling after losing 72 games? They were the laughing stock of the league. Sure Brown gets credit for holding the team together. But lets not overreact here. If the sixers don't make the playoffs you don't think Brown will be fired?

I'm pretty sure he will if they don't show massive improvement in terms of record.

Your record is your record. I get it you don't like Horny, he probably will get the boot next offseason too because its tough to find a coach willing to go through this type of a dreadful year.

Brown gets rave reviews but if he doesn't produce this year he will be fired regardless of all the "values he instilled".


Ask KJ McDaniel about the Sixers culture, since he felt like they were killing his career


I agree, this idea that the sixers were building culture is some BS...you don't go 10-72 and build culture. They were actively not playing a lot of players that would help them win just because they wanted to rack up more losses.

Sure brown gets however he is allowed to play to "play hard" but is that really what coaching has become...getting million dollar players who job is to play a game to "play hard". Its a results business. They had a losing culture for 4 god awful years. They did what they wanted to do...accumulate high draft choices. Can you name me one player outside of maybe Covington/Holmes that have actually proven to be NBA level talent on the sixers...the sixers just wanted to accumulate Embiid/Simmons/Fultz...that was from tanking...not building a culture.


Aside from the lotto picks who were missing seasons at a time, players "played hard" because they are all G-League call ups and 2nd rounders trying to make it in the league. The 17 win Knicks led by Amundson, Lance, and Shved played hard too.

This culture thing is a stretch.
User avatar
Deeeez Knicks
Forum Mod - Knicks
Forum Mod - Knicks
Posts: 26,029
And1: 9,478
Joined: Nov 12, 2004
Location: Bar stool

Re: Knicks sign Trey Burke 

Post#462 » by Deeeez Knicks » Thu Oct 12, 2017 3:10 pm

Tanking usually isn’t pretty. I am preparing for a real ugly season.

A big difference between us and the sixers is that we have a lot more vets, players in there prime and guys with huge contracts that will get Playing time. Gonna be harder to stomach watching those guys suck over cheaper younger players.

I hear the direction they speak of, but the roster we have just doesn’t jive with any plan at this point. Gonna be ugly even for a tank.
Mavs
C: Cody Zeller | Al Jeff | Jordan Bell
F: Giannis Antetokounmpo | Taj | JB
F: Ariza | Zipser | Babbitt
SG: Beal | Meeks | Derrick White
PG: Jrue Holiday | Yogi | Arcidiacono

IR
Solomon Hill
Stash
Williams-Goss
Vezenkov
User avatar
GONYK
Forum Mod - Knicks
Forum Mod - Knicks
Posts: 50,555
And1: 14,564
Joined: Jun 27, 2003
Location: Frankie N Baby
   

Re: Knicks sign Trey Burke 

Post#463 » by GONYK » Thu Oct 12, 2017 3:12 pm

Deeeez Knicks wrote:Tanking usually isn’t pretty. I am preparing for a real ugly season.

A big difference between us and the sixers is that we have a lot more vets, players in there prime and guys with huge contracts that will get Playing time. Gonna be harder to stomach watching those guys suck over cheaper younger players.

I hear the direction they speak of, but the roster we have just doesn’t jive with any plan at this point. Gonna be ugly even for a tank.


It will be a testament to Perry's competence to see how quickly this awkward roster construction takes to get resolved.
User avatar
NYKnicksFTW
Junior
Posts: 478
And1: 253
Joined: Jul 17, 2016
     

Re: Knicks sign Trey Burke 

Post#464 » by NYKnicksFTW » Thu Oct 12, 2017 3:15 pm

gavran wrote:
NYKnicksFTW wrote:
Wolfgang630 wrote:Idk who this is. The Knicks just signing every unknown or scrub person I feel like.



How is he unknown? Dude was a top-10 pick and was one of the best players in Michigan history. ****, he has like 175,000 followers on Twitter.



Well, I mean Snooki has like 7 million followers and her 15 minutes have been up since she got arrested on the Shore in 2011...but still, Burke is known if you follow the NBA.

He did say 'or scrub'.


Yeah, but he also said he didn't know who he was
User avatar
NYKnicksFTW
Junior
Posts: 478
And1: 253
Joined: Jul 17, 2016
     

Re: Knicks sign Trey Burke 

Post#465 » by NYKnicksFTW » Thu Oct 12, 2017 3:16 pm

Wolfgang630 wrote:
NYKnicksFTW wrote:
Wolfgang630 wrote:Idk who this is. The Knicks just signing every unknown or scrub person I feel like.



How is he unknown? Dude was a top-10 pick and was one of the best players in Michigan history. ****, he has like 175,000 followers on Twitter.



Well, I mean Snooki has like 7 million followers and her 15 minutes have been up since she got arrested on the Shore in 2011...but still, Burke is known if you follow the NBA.


I said unknown or scrub.


"IDK who this is"
Wolfgang630
Analyst
Posts: 3,533
And1: 2,070
Joined: Feb 07, 2016
 

Re: Knicks sign Trey Burke 

Post#466 » by Wolfgang630 » Thu Oct 12, 2017 3:19 pm

NYKnicksFTW wrote:
Wolfgang630 wrote:
NYKnicksFTW wrote:

How is he unknown? Dude was a top-10 pick and was one of the best players in Michigan history. ****, he has like 175,000 followers on Twitter.



Well, I mean Snooki has like 7 million followers and her 15 minutes have been up since she got arrested on the Shore in 2011...but still, Burke is known if you follow the NBA.


I said unknown or scrub.


"IDK who this is"


I guess he's both to me. An unknown scrub.
User avatar
Deeeez Knicks
Forum Mod - Knicks
Forum Mod - Knicks
Posts: 26,029
And1: 9,478
Joined: Nov 12, 2004
Location: Bar stool

Re: Knicks sign Trey Burke 

Post#467 » by Deeeez Knicks » Thu Oct 12, 2017 3:28 pm

GONYK wrote:
Deeeez Knicks wrote:Tanking usually isn’t pretty. I am preparing for a real ugly season.

A big difference between us and the sixers is that we have a lot more vets, players in there prime and guys with huge contracts that will get Playing time. Gonna be harder to stomach watching those guys suck over cheaper younger players.

I hear the direction they speak of, but the roster we have just doesn’t jive with any plan at this point. Gonna be ugly even for a tank.


It will be a testament to Perry's competence to see how quickly this awkward roster construction takes to get resolved.


Yeah for sure. It’ll take a lot of work and I would not expect miracles (like moving Noah), but there will be other moves we should be able to make. It’ll take some time but hopefully we can make some improvements for the future by the end of the season.
Mavs
C: Cody Zeller | Al Jeff | Jordan Bell
F: Giannis Antetokounmpo | Taj | JB
F: Ariza | Zipser | Babbitt
SG: Beal | Meeks | Derrick White
PG: Jrue Holiday | Yogi | Arcidiacono

IR
Solomon Hill
Stash
Williams-Goss
Vezenkov
User avatar
K P 6
RealGM
Posts: 29,684
And1: 8,798
Joined: Jun 27, 2006
Location: Formerly Jayknickz11, Still a legend in my own right.
Contact:
       

Re: Knicks sign Trey Burke 

Post#468 » by K P 6 » Thu Oct 12, 2017 3:31 pm

I still say dont sleep. I think they will sure up some things and get better.
Image
Ntilikina Gang, don't fight it. SMFPB CMFGB SMFMB KMFPB FMFNB
User avatar
god shammgod
Knicks Forum Crazy Board Uncle
Posts: 80,530
And1: 33,348
Joined: Feb 18, 2006
Location: Current RealGM Heavyweight Champion of the World

Re: Knicks sign Trey Burke 

Post#469 » by god shammgod » Thu Oct 12, 2017 3:39 pm

i don't know that the sixers really built anything yet. they basically showed that they're good when embid is healthy and they suck when he isn't. we'll have to see what happens this year. not sure why they're the example.

that being said, it would be better if you had a coach here who was teaching the young guys good defensive habits early in their career. otherwise they might not ever develop right. timmy seems to be a great example. he wasn't getting proper development here. in another situation he was forced to and now back here it seems he might regress. there is value to having the right coach for young players.

but nothing will happen. jeff is here for the year at least. and the guys in charge probably won't replace him with someone who's right either. the knicks are a trash organization, it's not likely to change. what can you do.
Image
Jeff Van Gully
RealGM
Posts: 11,004
And1: 4,935
Joined: Jul 31, 2010
Location: Harlem
       

Re: Knicks sign Trey Burke 

Post#470 » by Jeff Van Gully » Thu Oct 12, 2017 3:41 pm

GONYK wrote:
Jeff Van Gully wrote:
Greenie wrote:People are lost on what the group complaining actually wants.

Form an identity. Most of us want a hard nosed team. That’s not going to win games by itself. Look at the roster. However, our foundation and culture must be laid. No matter who you bring here they will fail if the organization doesn’t create the proper nurturing environment for youth.

Just look at KP...

-Defense isn’t were it could and should be. Post all the damn stats you want. I watch the games. He was better his rookie year.
-Offense is beyond inconsistent.
-People are already questioning his behavior and work ethic.
-He’s already on coach #3.


How is dude supposed to grow PROPERLY?
This is bull. Last night posters were talking about how KP is supposed to be doing what Embid is doing. That’s never going to happen here. We’re too busy tanking but not forging a solid culture around dude and taking his progression into account for this so called “rebuild”.

Don’t **** on the young guys already here in favor of some dudes that may or may not even end up on our team.

Tanking doesn’t come first in a rebuild. Making sure we’re nurturing our current youth is. “Tanking” is a byproduct of that unless you end up with the next LeBron.


Posters on this board don’t know what a damn rebuild is. That’s why they’re equating us being trash and possibly getting a high draft to a rebuild not seeing that this is how you turn into the Kings.


yeah. you need to brett brown through a tank. hornacek is getting his chance to see if he can replicate what he did with the overachieving suns when he got COY consideration.


This is a bit of a stretch. The Sixers weren't doing a damn thing but losing. There was no culture building. They were actively not playing players who were developing, like KJ McDaniel, because he was affecting their loss rate.

They didn't build an identity in the slightest.


you don't think brett brown was playing to win? i don't have any way to support the assertion of KJ not getting time because he was going to be the difference between wins and losses.

i think philly is going to do some winning now (maybe sneak into the playoffs) because of the coaching. they haven't had much in the way of win-ready talent. they've had terrible injury luck (which may be a curse for the tank strategy) but i never thought brett brown the coach was playing for Ls.

the sixers have been scrappy. bad, but scrappy. i admit that i don't check for them on league pass regularly, but when i did see them that was the vibe i got. they seem different from the revolving door of young suckitude they started out as.
que sera sera
Jeff Van Gully
RealGM
Posts: 11,004
And1: 4,935
Joined: Jul 31, 2010
Location: Harlem
       

Re: Knicks sign Trey Burke 

Post#471 » by Jeff Van Gully » Thu Oct 12, 2017 3:47 pm

Deeeez Knicks wrote:
GONYK wrote:
Deeeez Knicks wrote:Tanking usually isn’t pretty. I am preparing for a real ugly season.

A big difference between us and the sixers is that we have a lot more vets, players in there prime and guys with huge contracts that will get Playing time. Gonna be harder to stomach watching those guys suck over cheaper younger players.

I hear the direction they speak of, but the roster we have just doesn’t jive with any plan at this point. Gonna be ugly even for a tank.


It will be a testament to Perry's competence to see how quickly this awkward roster construction takes to get resolved.


Yeah for sure. It’ll take a lot of work and I would not expect miracles (like moving Noah), but there will be other moves we should be able to make. It’ll take some time but hopefully we can make some improvements for the future by the end of the season.


lee, lance, and maybe KO shipped out, i'm assuming.

love lee, but he's my top priority to move. but if we play him at the 3, it's not like he's blocking a prospect yet. and he's a good vet for the perimeter group in the meantime.

we don't need lance. even with all the heart he shows, if another team wants him for cap relief and maybe a 2nd rounder, you jump at the chance.

KO is young enough to keep around, but we're got too many bigs. so i suppose we might as well cash him out.

i'd send beasley if he turns into a positive asset. kanter and mcdermott same. basically, if they look good, i'd showcase the lot. we're moving forward with KP, timmy, billy, dot, and frank. might as well clear the path for dotson in the starting lineup too. timmy can play 3. fug it.
que sera sera
dakomish23
RealGM
Posts: 20,937
And1: 10,552
Joined: Sep 22, 2013
Location: Empire State
     

Re: Knicks sign Trey Burke 

Post#472 » by dakomish23 » Thu Oct 12, 2017 4:00 pm

Just play the kids the overwhelming majority of the minutes & live with the outcome.

Or don't & waste a year of development.

Frank, Baker & KP have had injuries, so we have to wait to see how the playing time is given out. If it's still a lot of lineups with vets who suck, this organization has failed IMO

Frank Baker
THJ
Dotson MCD
KP
WHG KOQ
Dkillanyk4lyf wrote:Melo is the reason why we are in the mess we are in now. Acquiring him was the biggest mistake in knicks history.


blueNorange wrote:good thing knicks have kanter because willy looking pedestrian af
Ayt
RealGM
Posts: 47,133
And1: 3,063
Joined: Jun 27, 2005

Re: Knicks sign Trey Burke 

Post#473 » by Ayt » Thu Oct 12, 2017 4:31 pm

GONYK wrote:
mpharris36 wrote:
K P 6 wrote:They suck but Brent Brown is a solid coach. He instilled values. They were raving about him during those awful seasons.


what values were they instilling after losing 72 games? They were the laughing stock of the league. Sure Brown gets credit for holding the team together. But lets not overreact here. If the sixers don't make the playoffs you don't think Brown will be fired?

I'm pretty sure he will if they don't show massive improvement in terms of record.

Your record is your record. I get it you don't like Horny, he probably will get the boot next offseason too because its tough to find a coach willing to go through this type of a dreadful year.

Brown gets rave reviews but if he doesn't produce this year he will be fired regardless of all the "values he instilled".


Ask KJ McDaniel about the Sixers culture, since he felt like they were killing his career


I'd ask him why he's blaming the team that gave him a ton of PT as a rookie when he couldn't get off the bench for a different team during that same rookie season and has struggled for minutes since.
User avatar
stuporman
RealGM
Posts: 18,109
And1: 2,819
Joined: Nov 27, 2005
Location: realistic skeptical optimist

Re: Knicks sign Trey Burke 

Post#474 » by stuporman » Thu Oct 12, 2017 4:54 pm

Hit the road Jack and come back as a coach.....
Ugly win > Pretty loss
Those who'd rather see their team fail so they can be right are fans of their opinion not the team.
:meditate:
User avatar
Greenie
RealGM
Posts: 46,641
And1: 21,616
Joined: Feb 25, 2010
Location: Killigan's Island
     

Re: Knicks sign Trey Burke 

Post#475 » by Greenie » Thu Oct 12, 2017 5:01 pm

Ayt wrote:
GONYK wrote:
mpharris36 wrote:
what values were they instilling after losing 72 games? They were the laughing stock of the league. Sure Brown gets credit for holding the team together. But lets not overreact here. If the sixers don't make the playoffs you don't think Brown will be fired?

I'm pretty sure he will if they don't show massive improvement in terms of record.

Your record is your record. I get it you don't like Horny, he probably will get the boot next offseason too because its tough to find a coach willing to go through this type of a dreadful year.

Brown gets rave reviews but if he doesn't produce this year he will be fired regardless of all the "values he instilled".


Ask KJ McDaniel about the Sixers culture, since he felt like they were killing his career


I'd ask him why he's blaming the team that gave him a ton of PT as a rookie when he couldn't get off the bench for a different team during that same rookie season and has struggled for minutes since.

Bingo.
Some players just are not good. That’s the whole purpose of playing them so you can find out.
BAF - Pistons
F:Cauley-Stein(28)|Baynes(20)|Onuaku
F:Morris(28)|Patterson(20)|Scott
F:Thompson(32)|Swaggy(12)|Williams
G:Brogdon(30)|Richardson(20)|Vaughn
G:Hill(30)|Joseph(20)|Baldwin
Head Coach - Stan Van Gundy
Jeff Van Gully
RealGM
Posts: 11,004
And1: 4,935
Joined: Jul 31, 2010
Location: Harlem
       

Re: Knicks sign Trey Burke 

Post#476 » by Jeff Van Gully » Thu Oct 12, 2017 5:23 pm

Greenie wrote:
Ayt wrote:
GONYK wrote:
Ask KJ McDaniel about the Sixers culture, since he felt like they were killing his career


I'd ask him why he's blaming the team that gave him a ton of PT as a rookie when he couldn't get off the bench for a different team during that same rookie season and has struggled for minutes since.

Bingo.
Some players just are not good. That’s the whole purpose of playing them so you can find out.


yeah, KJ is one of those guys we've all been intrigued with because of his tools, but he never found a way to put them together as a basketball player. he's had chances. that's why i said i couldn't say KJ didn't play because he was going to win too many games. where has he gone and been a significant contributor? teams seem to like his talent, but he can't earn minutes.

he's still only 24, which is crazy to think. but no one has valued him yet. there's opportunity in toronto now. we'll see.
que sera sera
dakomish23
RealGM
Posts: 20,937
And1: 10,552
Joined: Sep 22, 2013
Location: Empire State
     

Re: Knicks sign Trey Burke 

Post#477 » by dakomish23 » Thu Oct 12, 2017 5:35 pm

Greenie wrote:
Ayt wrote:
GONYK wrote:
Ask KJ McDaniel about the Sixers culture, since he felt like they were killing his career


I'd ask him why he's blaming the team that gave him a ton of PT as a rookie when he couldn't get off the bench for a different team during that same rookie season and has struggled for minutes since.

Bingo.
Some players just are not good. That’s the whole purpose of playing them so you can find out.


Paging MCD
Dkillanyk4lyf wrote:Melo is the reason why we are in the mess we are in now. Acquiring him was the biggest mistake in knicks history.


blueNorange wrote:good thing knicks have kanter because willy looking pedestrian af
User avatar
GONYK
Forum Mod - Knicks
Forum Mod - Knicks
Posts: 50,555
And1: 14,564
Joined: Jun 27, 2003
Location: Frankie N Baby
   

Re: RE: Re: Knicks sign Trey Burke 

Post#478 » by GONYK » Thu Oct 12, 2017 6:12 pm

dakomish23 wrote:
Greenie wrote:
Ayt wrote:
I'd ask him why he's blaming the team that gave him a ton of PT as a rookie when he couldn't get off the bench for a different team during that same rookie season and has struggled for minutes since.

Bingo.
Some players just are not good. That’s the whole purpose of playing them so you can find out.


Paging MCD
He's blaming them because they were something like +11 with him on the floor, so they would reduce his minutes.

He might have never become a talent that stuck, but the Sixers definitely put their tank over his development at the time.
User avatar
moocow007
Global Mod
Global Mod
Posts: 89,622
And1: 15,855
Joined: Jan 07, 2002
Location: In front of the computer, where else?
       

Re: Knicks sign Trey Burke 

Post#479 » by moocow007 » Thu Oct 12, 2017 6:14 pm

Greenie wrote:People are lost on what the group complaining actually wants.

Form an identity. Most of us want a hard nosed team. That’s not going to win games by itself. Look at the roster. However, our foundation and culture must be laid. No matter who you bring here they will fail if the organization doesn’t create the proper nurturing environment for youth.

Just look at KP...

-Defense isn’t were it could and should be. Post all the damn stats you want. I watch the games. He was better his rookie year.
-Offense is beyond inconsistent.
-People are already questioning his behavior and work ethic.
-He’s already on coach #3.


How is dude supposed to grow PROPERLY?
This is bull. Last night posters were talking about how KP is supposed to be doing what Embid is doing. That’s never going to happen here. We’re too busy tanking but not forging a solid culture around dude and taking his progression into account for this so called “rebuild”.

Don’t **** on the young guys already here in favor of some dudes that may or may not even end up on our team.

Tanking doesn’t come first in a rebuild. Making sure we’re nurturing our current youth is. “Tanking” is a byproduct of that unless you end up with the next LeBron.


Posters on this board don’t know what a damn rebuild is. That’s why they’re equating us being trash and possibly getting a high draft pick to a rebuild not seeing that this is how you turn into the Kings.


Yeah agreed.
BAF 1.0 - Celtics
1.James Harden|Lance Stephenson|DJ Augustin
2.Tony Allen|Alec Burks|Jordan Crawford
3.Stanley Johnson|Dante Cunningham
4.Blake Griffin|Quincy Acy|Tony Bradley
5.Andre Drummond|Cristiano Felicio|Andrew Bogut
x.Ike Anigbogu
User avatar
moocow007
Global Mod
Global Mod
Posts: 89,622
And1: 15,855
Joined: Jan 07, 2002
Location: In front of the computer, where else?
       

Re: Knicks sign Trey Burke 

Post#480 » by moocow007 » Thu Oct 12, 2017 6:18 pm

blueNorange wrote:
moocow007 wrote:
E-Balla wrote:Nate was drafted by the Suns at 21, David Lee was drafted at 30, and Camby/McGrady were great picks. Let's be real here if that was meant as an insult Pooch screwed himself (pun intended) on that one.


Especially TMac. TMac was a steal in one of the thinnest drafts in NBA history. Other than Tim Duncan (who was about as obvious a choice as you can get) going 1st, the only other player besides Duncan and McGrady (who was taken 9th overall) that reached any sort of star level was Chauncey Billups (3rd overall).

The rest? LOL...talk about just an absolutely BRUTAL draft. Adonal "Tin" Foyle 8th overall. Yikes. Here's the rest of the lottery picks:

2 Keith Van Horn PF United States Philadelphia 76ers Utah (Sr.)
4 Antonio Daniels PG United States Vancouver Grizzlies Bowling Green (Sr.)
5 Tony Battie C/F United States Denver Nuggets Texas Tech (Jr.)
6 Ron Mercer SF United States Boston Celtics (from Dallas) Kentucky (So.)
7 Tim Thomas SF United States New Jersey Nets Villanova (Fr.)
8 Adonal Foyle C Saint Vincent and the Grenadines Golden State Warriors Colgate (Jr.)
10 Danny Fortson PF United States Milwaukee Bucks Cincinnati (Jr.)
11 Tariq Abdul-Wahad SF France Sacramento Kings San Jose State (Sr.)
12 Austin Croshere PF United States Indiana Pacers Providence (Sr.)
13 Derek Anderson SG United States Cleveland Cavaliers Kentucky (Sr.)
14 Maurice Taylor PF United States Los Angeles Clippers Michigan (Jr.)

Talk about ugly as frick LOL. When Danny Fortson is the guy with the highest PER in the group, you know you're in trouble.

And it's not like there were any other gems in this draft. The only "steal" would be Captain Jack (Stephen Jackson) in the 2nd round. Brevin Knight (16th overall) and Bobby Jackson (23rd overall) were about the only other guys of any significant merit in this entire draft.

Robinson was also a terrific pick at 21, just as David Lee was a terrific pick at 30. Both these guys (especially Lee) I had mentioned before the draft as possible sleepers. Why? Because they showed that they have a specific thing (or things) they do that is NBA caliber. Doesn't mean they are going to be stars, but means it's highly likely that they'll find minutes in the NBA. Gotta have NBA level talent in something to be able to play in the NBA. More likely for a guy that is bad at things and great at things to find a role than a guy that is good at a lot but not great at anything.

i wonder how keith van horn would do a stretch 4 in todays nba, not dealing with athletic small forwards.

would probably still suck defensively but more of a scorer.


KVH probably would have fit better in today's nba. He's basically the ideal stretch 4. Not only can he shoot but he can actually create some shots and rebound a little. Defense still bad but most stretch 4's are bad defenders.
BAF 1.0 - Celtics
1.James Harden|Lance Stephenson|DJ Augustin
2.Tony Allen|Alec Burks|Jordan Crawford
3.Stanley Johnson|Dante Cunningham
4.Blake Griffin|Quincy Acy|Tony Bradley
5.Andre Drummond|Cristiano Felicio|Andrew Bogut
x.Ike Anigbogu

Return to New York Knicks