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god shammgod wrote:i can't think of a high profile player on a rookie deal who ever asked out recently to test this theory either way. marbury did it but i don't remember what the rookie deals were like back then. if there even was a qo. but he demanded a trade out of minny and specifically to the ny area and got his wish. but as i keep saying i don't think kp is gonna do this. not this quick at least.

Rookie scale came during the lockout in 1998-1999, which was after the Marbury initial rookie contract

The past is the past. At least we have our draft picks and a developing corp of young talent.

Does anybody really care about this anymore? Let's just move forward.

Phish Tank wrote:There's a difference between Kyrie asking for a trade after already making money from his first extension and KP asking for a trade before his first major payday.

No sane person would leave millions of dollars like that. It's not sound business

He can still get all his money if he's traded on his rookie deal.

If he asks out next summer & says I won't extend, what do they do?

dakomish23 wrote:

Phish Tank wrote:There's a difference between Kyrie asking for a trade after already making money from his first extension and KP asking for a trade before his first major payday.

No sane person would leave millions of dollars like that. It's not sound business

He can still get all his money if he's traded on his rookie deal.

If he asks out next summer & says I won't extend, what do they do?

Nothing. Call the bluff He'll give in. If he won't extend, then you know who's the real fool.

dakomish23 wrote:

Sark wrote:

dakomish23 wrote:
I don't trust PJax trade assesment skills, so I would not doubt him being amenable to a less than amazing trade.

Dolan cares about having a draw to sell tickets IMO. He won't move KP unless he's going to have another big name to market.

Whether you trust Phil or not, is irrelevant because every report said he was asking for a King's ransom that no one was willing to pay.

If you put your anti Phil bias aside for a moment, you'd probably come to the realization that the Melo trade to Houston was most likely the one vetoed, since the parameters of the deal were in place, and even Melo thought it was done.

Whether I trust PJax or not is relevant, because you brought up the possibility of Dolan turning down 4 1st round picks. I'm saying PJax wouldn't of even held out for that based on his track record.

Dolan said no to Ryan Anderson but was ok with Kanter? What does this imaginary anti Phil bias have to do with that logic?

I give credit to PJax for the few things he did right. I hold him accountable for the avalanche of things he did wrong. There's no bias either way.

Dolan had nothing to do with either trade. Dolan vetoed Phil buying Melo out.

Perry vetoed Anderson, and Kanter, while not great, is a much better deal.

dakomish23 wrote:

Phish Tank wrote:There's a difference between Kyrie asking for a trade after already making money from his first extension and KP asking for a trade before his first major payday.

No sane person would leave millions of dollars like that. It's not sound business

He can still get all his money if he's traded on his rookie deal.

If he asks out next summer & says I won't extend, what do they do?

If they are smart, call his bluff, and see if he's willing to lose hundreds of millions of dollars over the course of his career.

Let's hope our young guys develop this season and we get a stud in the draft next season and add another young promising piece so the excitement for this team could be like what it is for teams like Denver and Philly. Gotta catch some breaks...

dakomish23 wrote:

Phish Tank wrote:There's a difference between Kyrie asking for a trade after already making money from his first extension and KP asking for a trade before his first major payday.

No sane person would leave millions of dollars like that. It's not sound business

He can still get all his money if he's traded on his rookie deal.

If he asks out next summer & says I won't extend, what do they do?

You interested in that bet I offered?

It’s mostly right except contradictory in one area: Phil didn’t change the culture but he didn’t have his own people in the front office. Duh. In that sense, that’s not bashing Phil but kind of defending him.

Phil not talking to other GMs but Mills. That’s Mills’ job as the GM not Phil.

I liked the pod in terms of i think these dudes are real connected and gave some info that i didnt know of before. It had some juicy details but how do you do a Knicks pod and not mention Frank once or Wily? 2 of our best pieces. It had a negative tone but that was mostly towards Phil which we knew was coming. Woj did a chit job here to be honest. I expect better in terms of actual analysis and future rumors/direction talk.

NYKnicksTAPE wrote:so glad Phil is gone...who knows what 2 more years of his nonsense would've done

Two more lottery picks at the least.

Players (FA's) didn't want to come here because of a triangle. They heard from the guys IN the team, that it is awful.

Eh... I'm not sure if this is meant to bash Phil or not... But if it is, you can turn it around and blame this one on the players. Why would the guys IN team go around talking to other players about how bad the triangle is? Wouldn't you want to be more inviting if you truly want to better your team? If you don't like it, just keep your mouth shut about it to the public and other teams.

Tanking takes a big hit on the players and coaching. Will be a big test for everyone if teams is terrible.

There's really nothing else to do at this point with all these superteams. There's no way the Knicks can be competitive within the next 3-4 years. You stack up on high picks and eventually the talent will play to their max potential once you find the right coach and players who are sick of losing.

So...we put stock in **** that I have read trolls post on here because 2 dudes with less connections than my avatar ranted on a podcast?

I could probably cross reference this board with that breakdown I just read and call BS that these dudes have any inside scoop all of a sudden. This is a sinking media monopoly that resorts to Clickbait TMZ tactics and political BS to keep afloat.

Believe what you want. These guys don't report news. They play off the temp of sheepish social media frenzy.

No way they can validate any of what I just read.

Stannis wrote:

Players (FA's) didn't want to come here because of a triangle. They heard from the guys IN the team, that it is awful.

Eh... I'm not sure if this is meant to bash Phil or not... But if it is, you can turn it around and blame this one on the players. Why would the guys IN team go around talking to other players about how bad the triangle is? Wouldn't you want to be more inviting if you truly want to better your team? If you don't like it, just keep your mouth shut about it to the public and other teams.

Tanking takes a big hit on the players and coaching. Will be a big test for everyone if teams is terrible.

There's really nothing else to do at this point with all these superteams. There's no way the Knicks can be competitive within the next 3-4 years. You stack up on high picks and eventually the talent will play to their max potential once you find the right coach and players who are sick of losing.

I mean they say players didn't want to come because of the triangle, but how many players wanted to come here before the triangle?

Sark wrote:

Stannis wrote:

Players (FA's) didn't want to come here because of a triangle. They heard from the guys IN the team, that it is awful.

Eh... I'm not sure if this is meant to bash Phil or not... But if it is, you can turn it around and blame this one on the players. Why would the guys IN team go around talking to other players about how bad the triangle is? Wouldn't you want to be more inviting if you truly want to better your team? If you don't like it, just keep your mouth shut about it to the public and other teams.

Tanking takes a big hit on the players and coaching. Will be a big test for everyone if teams is terrible.

There's really nothing else to do at this point with all these superteams. There's no way the Knicks can be competitive within the next 3-4 years. You stack up on high picks and eventually the talent will play to their max potential once you find the right coach and players who are sick of losing.

I mean they say players didn't want to come because of the triangle, but how many players wanted to come here before the triangle?

We never had cap space.

Nothing we didn't already know. It seems like most of this is dwelling on the past too. I'd rather move on.

Ntili-killa wrote:Woj been ant-knicks for a minute. Tired of the negativity from the media.

We suck, we know we suck, FOH

this

GONYK wrote:

dakomish23 wrote:

Phish Tank wrote:There's a difference between Kyrie asking for a trade after already making money from his first extension and KP asking for a trade before his first major payday.

No sane person would leave millions of dollars like that. It's not sound business

He can still get all his money if he's traded on his rookie deal.

If he asks out next summer & says I won't extend, what do they do?

If they are smart, call his bluff, and see if he's willing to lose hundreds of millions of dollars over the course of his career.

It's 76 million more that the Knicks could offer to him (based on the cap right now), if he qualifies for the super max.

That takes into account the 5th year the knicks could offer, but doesn't count year one of a brand new contract with another team at 30%.

I don't think it's even close to hundreds of millions of dollars.

Yep. They could still call his bluff. He wouldn't be the first to willingly choose to walk away from it though.

Sark wrote:

dakomish23 wrote:

Phish Tank wrote:There's a difference between Kyrie asking for a trade after already making money from his first extension and KP asking for a trade before his first major payday.

No sane person would leave millions of dollars like that. It's not sound business

He can still get all his money if he's traded on his rookie deal.

If he asks out next summer & says I won't extend, what do they do?

You interested in that bet I offered?

That he takes the money? I didn't say he wouldn't.

dakomish23 wrote:

GONYK wrote:

dakomish23 wrote:
He can still get all his money if he's traded on his rookie deal.

If he asks out next summer & says I won't extend, what do they do?

If they are smart, call his bluff, and see if he's willing to lose hundreds of millions of dollars over the course of his career.

It's 76 million more that the Knicks could offer to him (based on the cap right now), if he qualifies for the super max.

That takes into account the 5th year the knicks could offer, but doesn't count year one of a brand new contract with another team at 30%.

I don't think it's even close to hundreds of millions of dollars.

Yep. They could still call his bluff. He wouldn't be the first to willingly choose to walk away from it though.

I said over the course of his career.

If he were to take the QO, his bird rights will reset, which will cost him his SUPERMAX on his second deal as well, since he would lose the option is sign a "designated player exception".

So if he loses $76M on his first extension, and another $76M (at least) on his second deal then he's clearly losing hundreds of millions.

He would absolutely be the first player to walk away from that type of money.