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Remember when some folks thought WHG could give the same production as Kanter could if he was given playing time lmao Kanter is a former 3rd overall draft pick. The man always had talent but needed to be in the right situation/team to thrive. The man just wears down teams in the post.

KnicksGod wrote:

seren wrote:I am sorry but if Kanter is playing any more role than say Zaza Pachulia on your team, you are not winning a championship. You simply can't play him against real competition.

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At least Enes and Zaza don't both have dreadlocks. But it seems pretty close to that.

My money is on Enes being one of those guys where the smart take is you don't need him and what he's doing is nothing special ... but the reality of the situation is that it's going to be pretty hard to find someone who is a better fit, performs better or gives you more bang for the buck.

My experience is that Grass is greener syndrome is heightened in sports. If a guy is working out well, you go with it and stop trying to find perfect players.

In any event, if Enes really makes effort on D his whole career, in what ways does he fall short of ideal? Not many.

Big issue is position. Love and Tristan never had issues with effort but we see the difficulty they are facing there against big time competition. KP and any other pure center who can't defend the perimeter is even a bigger problem. Kanter, if he can give a consistent defensive effort, can start along with KP and play around 24 minutes with most of his minutes coming against secondary teams who lack talent and take a step back against better teams. His presence doesn't negate our need of very high quality wings. In that way, he is a luxury at his current salary. If you can keep him at around a bit above 10 million and move your cheaper alternative in Willy for a high value asset, that is fine. Anything more than that, you are capping your KP era success.

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seren wrote:

KnicksGod wrote:

seren wrote:I am sorry but if Kanter is playing any more role than say Zaza Pachulia on your team, you are not winning a championship. You simply can't play him against real competition.

Sent from my XT1575 using RealGM mobile app

At least Enes and Zaza don't both have dreadlocks. But it seems pretty close to that.

My money is on Enes being one of those guys where the smart take is you don't need him and what he's doing is nothing special ... but the reality of the situation is that it's going to be pretty hard to find someone who is a better fit, performs better or gives you more bang for the buck.

My experience is that Grass is greener syndrome is heightened in sports. If a guy is working out well, you go with it and stop trying to find perfect players.

In any event, if Enes really makes effort on D his whole career, in what ways does he fall short of ideal? Not many.

Big issue is position. Love and Tristan never had issues with effort but we see the difficulty they are facing there against big time competition. KP and any other pure center who can't defend the perimeter is even a bigger problem. Kanter, if he can give a consistent defensive effort, can start along with KP and play around 24 minutes with most of his minutes coming against secondary teams who lack talent and take a step back against better teams. His presence doesn't negate our need of very high quality wings. In that way, he is a luxury at his current salary. If you can keep him at around a bit above 10 million and move your cheaper alternative in Willy for a high value asset, that is fine. Anything more than that, you are capping your KP era success.

Sent from my XT1575 using RealGM mobile app

You can take Kanter's cap room, spend it on the wrong guy and instantly have capped the KP era AND given yourself a lower ceiling. And the other thing is that KP himself has to be really good for the KP era to not be capped.

My point is that it's a gamble no matter what. There are a number of courses you could take and the majority of them will cap you ... that's how hard it is to build a championship roster.

But the ONE thing we sort of do know ... and it's rare to know anything with any great likelihood ... is that Kanter fits and is performing at a high level. This is all related to the picks and cap room hope ... they are unknowns so fans tend to like them. Because the possibilities are endless. Like a gambler walking into a casino for the first time. Then you have to actually play some hands.

Or you can keep your cap room and your picks and never really commit to a roster ... seems like a good idea but that too is an avenue that may cap out your ceiling. The clock is always running I'm afraid; time wins all battles.

Yes Kanter is limited in some ways but he's also performing at a really high level and adding wins. You don't have to keep him forever but discard him at your own risk lol.

KnicksGod wrote:

seren wrote:

KnicksGod wrote:
At least Enes and Zaza don't both have dreadlocks. But it seems pretty close to that.

My money is on Enes being one of those guys where the smart take is you don't need him and what he's doing is nothing special ... but the reality of the situation is that it's going to be pretty hard to find someone who is a better fit, performs better or gives you more bang for the buck.

My experience is that Grass is greener syndrome is heightened in sports. If a guy is working out well, you go with it and stop trying to find perfect players.

In any event, if Enes really makes effort on D his whole career, in what ways does he fall short of ideal? Not many.

Big issue is position. Love and Tristan never had issues with effort but we see the difficulty they are facing there against big time competition. KP and any other pure center who can't defend the perimeter is even a bigger problem. Kanter, if he can give a consistent defensive effort, can start along with KP and play around 24 minutes with most of his minutes coming against secondary teams who lack talent and take a step back against better teams. His presence doesn't negate our need of very high quality wings. In that way, he is a luxury at his current salary. If you can keep him at around a bit above 10 million and move your cheaper alternative in Willy for a high value asset, that is fine. Anything more than that, you are capping your KP era success.

Sent from my XT1575 using RealGM mobile app

You can take Kanter's cap room, spend it on the wrong guy and instantly have capped the KP era AND given yourself a lower ceiling. And the other thing is that KP himself has to be really good for the KP era to not be capped.

My point is that it's a gamble no matter what. There are a number of courses you could take and the majority of them will cap you ... that's how hard it is to build a championship roster.

But the ONE thing we sort of do know ... and it's rare to know anything with any great likelihood ... is that Kanter fits and is performing at a high level. This is all related to the picks and cap room hope ... they are unknowns so fans tend to like them. Because the possibilities are endless. Like a gambler walking into a casino for the first time. Then you have to actually play some hands.

Or you can keep your cap room and your picks and never really commit to a roster ... seems like a good idea but that too is an avenue that may cap out your ceiling. The clock is always running I'm afraid; time wins all battles.

Yes Kanter is limited in some ways but he's also performing at a really high level and adding wins. You don't have to keep him forever but discard him at your own risk lol.

This is a classic case of looking for greener pastures. When you finally get a guy who pretty much locks down his position and gives you reliable production you would think you've found yourself a piece to build with.

KnicksGod wrote:

seren wrote:

KnicksGod wrote:
At least Enes and Zaza don't both have dreadlocks. But it seems pretty close to that.

My money is on Enes being one of those guys where the smart take is you don't need him and what he's doing is nothing special ... but the reality of the situation is that it's going to be pretty hard to find someone who is a better fit, performs better or gives you more bang for the buck.

My experience is that Grass is greener syndrome is heightened in sports. If a guy is working out well, you go with it and stop trying to find perfect players.

In any event, if Enes really makes effort on D his whole career, in what ways does he fall short of ideal? Not many.

Big issue is position. Love and Tristan never had issues with effort but we see the difficulty they are facing there against big time competition. KP and any other pure center who can't defend the perimeter is even a bigger problem. Kanter, if he can give a consistent defensive effort, can start along with KP and play around 24 minutes with most of his minutes coming against secondary teams who lack talent and take a step back against better teams. His presence doesn't negate our need of very high quality wings. In that way, he is a luxury at his current salary. If you can keep him at around a bit above 10 million and move your cheaper alternative in Willy for a high value asset, that is fine. Anything more than that, you are capping your KP era success.

Sent from my XT1575 using RealGM mobile app

You can take Kanter's cap room, spend it on the wrong guy and instantly have capped the KP era AND given yourself a lower ceiling. And the other thing is that KP himself has to be really good for the KP era to not be capped.

My point is that it's a gamble no matter what. There are a number of courses you could take and the majority of them will cap you ... that's how hard it is to build a championship roster.

But the ONE thing we sort of do know ... and it's rare to know anything with any great likelihood ... is that Kanter fits and is performing at a high level. This is all related to the picks and cap room hope ... they are unknowns so fans tend to like them. Because the possibilities are endless. Like a gambler walking into a casino for the first time. Then you have to actually play some hands.

Or you can keep your cap room and your picks and never really commit to a roster ... seems like a good idea but that too is an avenue that may cap out your ceiling. The clock is always running I'm afraid; time wins all battles.

Yes Kanter is limited in some ways but he's also performing at a really high level and adding wins. You don't have to keep him forever but discard him at your own risk lol.

at this point, best thing that can happen for knicks is kanter opt in. because if he opts out, he's going to cost more money and years. he might walk and you get nothing.

it's like we want to win a tank race. the point of the game is to play basketball and win. getting naturally good at basketball is part of the process. kanter looks like a cornerstone piece so far. not easily replaced.

i completely understand the argument that the money is better spent elsewhere. except we kind of have no money to spend until noah is off the books.

if we can lock in kanter, KP, tim, and frank, then by the time noah and other contracts come off the books we have both a core and money to spend. then maybe your veteran team can compete.

JohnStarksTheDunk wrote:

Are We Ther Yet wrote:Right now...we have 3 talented starters 25 and under. Timmy/KP/Kanter. Need 2 more studs.

That's going to be a rather difficult task, since those 3 players combined will take up almost three-quarters of the cap.

I love Kanter's attitude, hustle, and what he has brought to this team, but the Knicks can't afford to include him in the future, unless he agrees to a pretty steep pay cut.

It isn't easy that's for sure. It doesn't change the fact we need 2 more starting caliber players. PG/SF is up for grabs. As for Kanter...a steep paycut? We don't have max players at any position yet and KP is the only one on the roster right now.

We need to nail a couple of picks. Whatever it takes. Perry has work to do.

KnicksGod wrote:

seren wrote:I am sorry but if Kanter is playing any more role than say Zaza Pachulia on your team, you are not winning a championship. You simply can't play him against real competition.

Sent from my XT1575 using RealGM mobile app

At least Enes and Zaza don't both have dreadlocks. But it seems pretty close to that.

My money is on Enes being one of those guys where the smart take is you don't need him and what he's doing is nothing special ... but the reality of the situation is that it's going to be pretty hard to find someone who is a better fit, performs better or gives you more bang for the buck.

My experience is that Grass is greener syndrome is heightened in sports. If a guy is working out well, you go with it and stop trying to find perfect players.

In any event, if Enes really makes effort on D his whole career, in what ways does he fall short of ideal? Not many.

Enes is way better than Robin and some mythologized Lopez as a perfect fit.

Yes he made 40% less, but we saw the benefit to KP in his first season of playing alongside a guy who does the heavy lifting in the paint.

And Kanter's D is coming along very nicely so he is basically a 2-way player now and Robin was not comparable at all on offense or the boards. Kanter is worth his current price tag.

Lopez was almost scared to score inside the paint.

Spree2Houston wrote:Remember when some folks thought WHG could give the same production as Kanter could if he was given playing time lmao Kanter is a former 3rd overall draft pick. The man always had talent but needed to be in the right situation/team to thrive. The man just wears down teams in the post.

enes kanter a f@#%$!n BULLYYYYYYY!!!!!

Bill Pidto wrote:

BKlutch wrote:

Bill Pidto wrote:
I don't believe in jinxes anyway, so I don't mind saying I believe this fully.

KP has lacked strength and stamina in his first couple seasons, as a young, LANKY AF, 7'3" dude. Sure. But he has been durable to say the least. When you compare him to other guys his size...

We've seen him take some serious spills. Even saw all 340 pounds of Melo fall right on his neck in his rookie year. Dude pops right back up. I'm impressed. Missed the game tonight but saw the picture of that 90 degree angle. Lucky he didn't f*ck his sh*t up!

He Bill Pidto, be fair. Melo lost weight playing in his hoodie last summer, and is def below 300 now.

Hold up... are we talking about Melo's weight? Or those player rankings ESPN put up before the season?

"YO P! They say I gotta come off the bench now!"

TKKnicks1 wrote:Dougie is a baller. We need to be utilizing him off screens Kyle Korver style. We are wasting this dude's shooting talents.

Meh Korver, I think this kid could be a Rip Hamilton type gem

Capn'O wrote:If mostly healthy, this looks like a .500 team to me. The fact that we have a "This is a playoff team" and "This is not a playoff team" thread alternately emerging seems like good indicator of it

we are a playoff team... but the point is that we are in a need of another top lottery pick

Besart19 wrote:

Capn'O wrote:If mostly healthy, this looks like a .500 team to me. The fact that we have a "This is a playoff team" and "This is not a playoff team" thread alternately emerging seems like good indicator of it

we are a playoff team... but the point is that we are in a need of another top lottery pick

Well, we're probably not gonna get one. Management will have to pull some rabbits with the picks they have. Always talent all over the draft.

Capn'O wrote:

Besart19 wrote:

Capn'O wrote:If mostly healthy, this looks like a .500 team to me. The fact that we have a "This is a playoff team" and "This is not a playoff team" thread alternately emerging seems like good indicator of it

we are a playoff team... but the point is that we are in a need of another top lottery pick

Well, we're probably not gonna get one. Management will have to pull some rabbits with the picks they have. Always talent all over the draft.

Cavs were #9 in the East when they got Wiggins

Besart19 wrote:

Capn'O wrote:

Besart19 wrote:
we are a playoff team... but the point is that we are in a need of another top lottery pick

Well, we're probably not gonna get one. Management will have to pull some rabbits with the picks they have. Always talent all over the draft.

Cavs were #9 in the East when they got Wiggins

Cavs have amazing lottery luck, we don't. Besides if we make the playoffs, we don't even get the lottery ticket

Before Kanter came to New York ,Kanter took a lot of mid range shots face up shots and off the dribble moves .Remember he started out playing with Favors (Jazz) and then with Adams (OKC), both who played more in the paint than Kanter. Kanter learned to run with Westbrook and run the PNR with Westbrook which he doesn't do much because the Knicks lack a good PNR PG.
Anyways he still shot above .500% for a career.

With the Knicks he's shooting almost strictly in the paint which is by design to keep defenders from cheating on KP.I think slowly and surely Kanter will get a liitle more freedom to use his whole offensive repertoire.

The Knicks have a decent starting four but we need a small forward like nobodys business

tleikheen wrote:Before Kanter came to New York ,Kanter took a lot of mid range shots face up shots and off the dribble moves .Remember he started out playing with Favors (Jazz) and then with Adams (OKC), both who played more in the paint than Kanter. Kanter learned to run with Westbrook and run the PNR with Westbrook which he doesn't do much because the Knicks lack a good PNR PG.
Anyways he still shot above .500% for a career.

With the Knicks he's shooting almost strictly in the paint which is by design to keep defenders from cheating on KP.I think slowly and surely Kanter will get a liitle more freedom to use his whole offensive repertoire.

If he does all that plus what he's doing now with his back to the basket he will be an absolute monster.

Frank should be capable of running those PnR's with him so over time they can start to click.

Oscirus wrote:

Besart19 wrote:

Capn'O wrote:
Well, we're probably not gonna get one. Management will have to pull some rabbits with the picks they have. Always talent all over the draft.

Cavs were #9 in the East when they got Wiggins

Cavs have amazing lottery luck, we don't. Besides if we make the playoffs, we don't even get the lottery ticket

7 teams are a lock for the playoffs. We are still in a position to get that lottery ticket with Indiana, Orlando, Miami and Charlotte also fighting for that #8 seed...

As for the Cavs, its probably the biggest sign that the league is riged.

2011: 1st overall (Irving, Duke)
2012: 4th overall (Waiters, Syracuse)
2013: 1st overall (Bennet, Nevada)
2014: 1st overall (Wiggins, Kansas)

Oscirus wrote:The Knicks have a decent starting four but we need a small forward like nobodys business

Doncic is struggling in Euroleague. Bring us Porter Jr. With his injury and with our natural January meltdown, we might get him at 4-7 range