There is reason why frank isn't starting and that is because jeff doesn't think he is ready per ian begley twitter

[NBA Fan 1234]

I don't think there was ever a need to protect Frank from being embarrassed.

[blueNorange]

The development is going on outside of the games. People throw the word development around but in actuality they really mean entertainment.

They just want to see him play. So they can over analyze every step he takes. They’ll stop watching the team and only watch the player. Come up with off the wall comparisons and fantasize about him becoming that player. All to have something to stand for on a forum. Like it’s politics.

Then in two years, they’ll get bored of that. They’ll lose faith because he doesn’t fulfill their over hyped fantasies. They’ll turn on him. And seek the next unknown to do it again. Likely some 2nd round pick. Or undrafted d leaguer.

That’s really what it’s all about. So why not just be real about it? That’s why you want the coach fired.

The proof is right here. Jeff is garbage for playing vets over young players. Right? Your not getting enough frank.

Same with Willy.

Yet. The most seasoned and accomplished vet on the team had to be sent away because he’s upset about not playing. A much younger player gets the nod.

You’d think that maybe,... that alone would kill that line of thinking.

The funny thing is, most people that frequent this forum, for once, were mostly in agreement. Noah is done and should not play. And that’s what happens. He bucks. And you want heads to roll? It was your idea!

Y’all don’t give a **** about frank. The kid isn’t comfortable. His legs have hurt off and on since he was drafted. You don’t care about his long term development. You just want to use him as a pawn in your agenda games.

And just like with the Noah situation. If frank goes out there, plays more and gets hurt. Or regresses. You’ll be calling for heads to roll. When it was your idea.


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

finally someone said it, they don't know that jeff is protecting frank from getting embarrassed.

If he needs to do that.. the kid ain't going to be that good anyway. If you have to shelter a player like that any player.. you're always going to have to do it.

sure if every player drafted comes from another country and english isn't your first language.

[ibraheim718]

finally someone said it, they don't know that jeff is protecting frank from getting embarrassed.

If he needs to do that.. the kid ain't going to be that good anyway. If you have to shelter a player like that any player.. you're always going to have to do it.

sure if every player drafted comes from another country and english isn't your first language.

So why would playing him off the bench change any of that? Do the 2nd second stringers know french?

I don't understand why you guys can't be truthful about it. All coaches approach these situations differently. Some of us choose to disagree with the way Jeff Hornacek is approaching it.

[ibraheim718]

I don't think there was ever a need to protect Frank from being embarrassed.

I don't get that line of thinking. Normally when you get embarrassed it prevents you from getting embarrassed a second time.. that's how you learn.

[NBA Fan 1234]

I don't think there was ever a need to protect Frank from being embarrassed.

I don't get that line of thinking. Normally when you get embarrassed it prevents you from getting embarrassed a second time.. that's how you learn.

Also, he's been playing professionally for a while now and was just playing in the playoffs before coming over. He's played in pressure situations, comes from a smart family, and plays with a mature head on his shoulders. I really never understood the need to baby him.

[Sark]

The development is going on outside of the games. People throw the word development around but in actuality they really mean entertainment.

They just want to see him play. So they can over analyze every step he takes. They’ll stop watching the team and only watch the player. Come up with off the wall comparisons and fantasize about him becoming that player. All to have something to stand for on a forum. Like it’s politics.

Then in two years, they’ll get bored of that. They’ll lose faith because he doesn’t fulfill their over hyped fantasies. They’ll turn on him. And seek the next unknown to do it again. Likely some 2nd round pick. Or undrafted d leaguer.

That’s really what it’s all about. So why not just be real about it? That’s why you want the coach fired.

The proof is right here. Jeff is garbage for playing vets over young players. Right? Your not getting enough frank.

Same with Willy.

Yet. The most seasoned and accomplished vet on the team had to be sent away because he’s upset about not playing. A much younger player gets the nod.

You’d think that maybe,... that alone would kill that line of thinking.

The funny thing is, most people that frequent this forum, for once, were mostly in agreement. Noah is done and should not play. And that’s what happens. He bucks. And you want heads to roll? It was your idea!

Y’all don’t give a **** about frank. The kid isn’t comfortable. His legs have hurt off and on since he was drafted. You don’t care about his long term development. You just want to use him as a pawn in your agenda games.

And just like with the Noah situation. If frank goes out there, plays more and gets hurt. Or regresses. You’ll be calling for heads to roll. When it was your idea.


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

finally someone said it, they don't know that jeff is protecting frank from getting embarrassed.

Can Jeff come here and protect you from embarrassment?

[dakomish23]

Basically, that's all he's doing right now is getting his feet wet. Look at the recent rookies who didn't even play in their rookie year due to injury, like Ben Simmons and Embiid, Blake Griffin. Then you got guys like James Harden who came off the bench and averaged only 2 minutes more per game than Frank in their rookie year. Harden turned out alright I would say. It's year 1 for Frank. If this was year 3 and we still were dealing with this then I could see there being a problem, but it's year 1 and the kid is 19 years old. People need to calm down.

Yeah, let’s take one of the few all stars who didn’t start at all during their rookie year as proof

How about

Lebron
Durant
Curry
Westbrook
Davis
Irving
George
Derozan
Wall
Beal
Lillard
Giannis
Cousins
Embid
Aldridge
KLove
Oladipo
Horford
Towns

KRISTPAS PORZINGAS?????

I want him to work the struggles and come out of the other side

I want him to develop chemistry with the other members of our future

If the Knicks did the opposite & were starting him now, you guys would be validating that decision with the opposite side of the argument.

Knicks can do no wrong.

All those dudes you named were flat out better prospects and better players and far more advanced in skill than Frank. Giannis wasn't a starter in his rookie year. I can put together a list too, that's no problem.

Jimmy Butler
Draymond Green
CJ McCollum
Kyle Lowry
Goran Dragic
Nikola Jokic
Jamal Murray
Gary Harris
Buddy Hield
Jaylen Brown
Dennis Schroeder
Zach Lavine
George Hill
Khris Middleton

And a whole bunch more, including players that were far better than Frank is right now. Before you worry about his "chemistry" you should first worry about his improvement in the summer and what he needs to work on to actually look like an NBA player. Once we get that out of the way then we can start concentrating on his chemistry with the guys around him. Until then, the kid has a lot of work to do in the summer. He's not good right now, simple and plain.

You opened up the “this person didn’t start as a rookie” dialogue by saying “Harden didn’t start as a rookie and he turned out fine”. So then I went down the current ALL STAR list of those who did start their rookie year. Giannis did start games his rookie year. You guys are saying that it’s fine that Frank won’t start all year.

Your list

Jimmy Butler - behind Korver on a contender
Lowry - behind Mighty Mouse
Dragic - behind Nash
Jokic - started 55 games
Jamal Murray - behind Gary Harris
Gary Harris - fine
Buddy Heild - started 55 games
Jaylen Brown - behind Bradley on a contender
Schroeder - behind Teague
Lavine - started 40 games
Hill - behind Parker on a contender
Middleton - fine

Look at your list of guys. Is Frank behind a good starter? Is Frank on a contender?

The excuses for those guys are not applicable to Frank’s situation.

Play the damn kids.

[dakomish23]

finally someone said it, they don't know that jeff is protecting frank from getting embarrassed.

If he needs to do that.. the kid ain't going to be that good anyway. If you have to shelter a player like that any player.. you're always going to have to do it.

sure if every player drafted comes from another country and english isn't your first language.

So why didn’t they do it for KP? Has them not doing it for KP hurt his progression?

[GONYK]

I don't think there was ever a need to protect Frank from being embarrassed.

I don't get that line of thinking. Normally when you get embarrassed it prevents you from getting embarrassed a second time.. that's how you learn.

Also, he's been playing professionally for a while now and was just playing in the playoffs before coming over. He's played in pressure situations, comes from a smart family, and plays with a mature head on his shoulders. I really never understood the need to baby him.

He's also risen to the occasion a few times this season when squared off against other top talent from his class.

I don't think the kid is afraid of the moment or adversity.

[Handledatruth]

The development is going on outside of the games. People throw the word development around but in actuality they really mean entertainment.

They just want to see him play. So they can over analyze every step he takes. They’ll stop watching the team and only watch the player. Come up with off the wall comparisons and fantasize about him becoming that player. All to have something to stand for on a forum. Like it’s politics.

Then in two years, they’ll get bored of that. They’ll lose faith because he doesn’t fulfill their over hyped fantasies. They’ll turn on him. And seek the next unknown to do it again. Likely some 2nd round pick. Or undrafted d leaguer.

That’s really what it’s all about. So why not just be real about it? That’s why you want the coach fired.

The proof is right here. Jeff is garbage for playing vets over young players. Right? Your not getting enough frank.

Same with Willy.

Yet. The most seasoned and accomplished vet on the team had to be sent away because he’s upset about not playing. A much younger player gets the nod.

You’d think that maybe,... that alone would kill that line of thinking.

The funny thing is, most people that frequent this forum, for once, were mostly in agreement. Noah is done and should not play. And that’s what happens. He bucks. And you want heads to roll? It was your idea!

Y’all don’t give a **** about frank. The kid isn’t comfortable. His legs have hurt off and on since he was drafted. You don’t care about his long term development. You just want to use him as a pawn in your agenda games.

And just like with the Noah situation. If frank goes out there, plays more and gets hurt. Or regresses. You’ll be calling for heads to roll. When it was your idea.


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

finally someone said it, they don't know that jeff is protecting frank from getting embarrassed.

https://nypost.com/2017/07/17/hornaceks-ideal-knicks-changes-wont-start-with-the-triangle/

“We want to try to establish an identity. The identity has to become defense first,” Hornacek said.

“We have to also try to develop a mentality for them, that desire to get a stop. It’s not, ‘OK, he scored that time, I’ll guard him next time.’ You should be embarrassed. You should feel, ‘That guy can’t score on me.’ That’s the mentality you have every time you’re guarding the guy with the ball.”

Yet one of our best defenders rides the bench because he needs to be "protected". I'm surprised neither of you are bothered by this. I personally don't care if he turns the ball over and passes up shots if he gets over screens on defense and rotates properly. You don't create a defensive identity by rewarding lethargic defensive play with minutes. The biggest beneficiary being Jarrett Jack. This is why people want him fired...

[prophet_of_rage]

Your last sentence says it all. Frank has played well this season given his utter lack of experience, his age, and him learning a new culture. His per 36 numbers give a nice glimpse at the player he can be. 10 ppg, 6 apg, 4 rpg, 2 spg. This season for him was about getting his feet wet, showing us some potential, and staying healthy. So far so good.

Basically, that's all he's doing right now is getting his feet wet. Look at the recent rookies who didn't even play in their rookie year due to injury, like Ben Simmons and Embiid, Blake Griffin. Then you got guys like James Harden who came off the bench and averaged only 2 minutes more per game than Frank in their rookie year. Harden turned out alright I would say. It's year 1 for Frank. If this was year 3 and we still were dealing with this then I could see there being a problem, but it's year 1 and the kid is 19 years old. People need to calm down.

Yeah, let’s take one of the few all stars who didn’t start at all during their rookie year as proof

How about

Lebron
Durant
Curry
Westbrook
Davis
Irving
George
Derozan
Wall
Beal
Lillard
Giannis
Cousins
Embid
Aldridge
KLove
Oladipo
Horford
Towns

KRISTPAS PORZINGAS?????

I want him to work the struggles and come out of the other side

I want him to develop chemistry with the other members of our future

If the Knicks did the opposite & were starting him now, you guys would be validating that decision with the opposite side of the argument.

Knicks can do no wrong.

Frank Nkilitina is not on the level of any player you just listed there. He is a below average NBA rookie right now. He has not earned minutes on the court.

[Deeeez Knicks]

I don't think there was ever a need to protect Frank from being embarrassed.

Exactly. Jarret Jack as our starting PG is way more embarrassing

[thebuzzardman]

Jeff:
"I want to establish a defensive mentality"

Routinely starts:
Jack
THJr
Kanter

You can't make this sh*t up

[GONYK]

I don't think there was ever a need to protect Frank from being embarrassed.

Exactly. Jarret Jack as our starting PG is way more embarrassing

I think it is clear that Jeff is not trying to protect himself from embarrassment.

[dakomish23]

Basically, that's all he's doing right now is getting his feet wet. Look at the recent rookies who didn't even play in their rookie year due to injury, like Ben Simmons and Embiid, Blake Griffin. Then you got guys like James Harden who came off the bench and averaged only 2 minutes more per game than Frank in their rookie year. Harden turned out alright I would say. It's year 1 for Frank. If this was year 3 and we still were dealing with this then I could see there being a problem, but it's year 1 and the kid is 19 years old. People need to calm down.

Yeah, let’s take one of the few all stars who didn’t start at all during their rookie year as proof

How about

Lebron
Durant
Curry
Westbrook
Davis
Irving
George
Derozan
Wall
Beal
Lillard
Giannis
Cousins
Embid
Aldridge
KLove
Oladipo
Horford
Towns

KRISTPAS PORZINGAS?????

I want him to work the struggles and come out of the other side

I want him to develop chemistry with the other members of our future

If the Knicks did the opposite & were starting him now, you guys would be validating that decision with the opposite side of the argument.

Knicks can do no wrong.

Frank Nkilitina is not on the level of any player you just listed there. He is a below average NBA rookie right now. He has not earned minutes on the court.

He mentioned Harden an all star guard. I did the same for those who started their rookie year.

I’m not comparing Frank to Lebron or anyone on that list Streets of Rage

[HEZI]

Yeah, let’s take one of the few all stars who didn’t start at all during their rookie year as proof

How about

Lebron
Durant
Curry
Westbrook
Davis
Irving
George
Derozan
Wall
Beal
Lillard
Giannis
Cousins
Embid
Aldridge
KLove
Oladipo
Horford
Towns

KRISTPAS PORZINGAS?????

I want him to work the struggles and come out of the other side

I want him to develop chemistry with the other members of our future

If the Knicks did the opposite & were starting him now, you guys would be validating that decision with the opposite side of the argument.

Knicks can do no wrong.

All those dudes you named were flat out better prospects and better players and far more advanced in skill than Frank. Giannis wasn't a starter in his rookie year. I can put together a list too, that's no problem.

Jimmy Butler
Draymond Green
CJ McCollum
Kyle Lowry
Goran Dragic
Nikola Jokic
Jamal Murray
Gary Harris
Buddy Hield
Jaylen Brown
Dennis Schroeder
Zach Lavine
George Hill
Khris Middleton

And a whole bunch more, including players that were far better than Frank is right now. Before you worry about his "chemistry" you should first worry about his improvement in the summer and what he needs to work on to actually look like an NBA player. Once we get that out of the way then we can start concentrating on his chemistry with the guys around him. Until then, the kid has a lot of work to do in the summer. He's not good right now, simple and plain.

You opened up the “this person didn’t start as a rookie” dialogue by saying “Harden didn’t start as a rookie and he turned out fine”. So then I went down the current ALL STAR list of those who did start their rookie year. Giannis did start games his rookie year. You guys are saying that it’s fine that Frank won’t start all year.

Your list

Jimmy Butler - behind Korver on a contender
Lowry - behind Mighty Mouse
Dragic - behind Nash
Jokic - started 55 games
Jamal Murray - behind Gary Harris
Gary Harris - fine
Buddy Heild - started 55 games
Jaylen Brown - behind Bradley on a contender
Schroeder - behind Teague
Lavine - started 40 games
Hill - behind Parker on a contender
Middleton - fine

Look at your list of guys. Is Frank behind a good starter? Is Frank on a contender?

The excuses for those guys are not applicable to Frank’s situation.

Play the damn kids.

You obviously missed the whole point and just want to keep crying for the sake of crying. Some of your points aren't even accurate but I'm not gonna waste my time going over them with you. You're still gonna whine no matter what.

[Handledatruth]

Jeff:
"I want to establish a defensive mentality"

Routinely starts:
Jack
THJr
Kanter

You can't make this sh*t up

Crazy right?

“We’re going to do some things this year a little bit different than last year, in terms of something internally that guys will be able to see,” Hornacek said. “We want to be a team that’s scrappy, a team that’s diving on balls, taking charges. We didn’t do a whole lot of that last year, especially taking charges. … We want to become a team that does that. That’s how you win ballgames. We’re not going to go out and outscore teams. We want to get back to the type of defense that the guys are putting it out there every single night. There’s going to be nights you don’t shoot the ball very well. You can still win games. That’s the mentality we have to start with.”

I guess we haven't started yet.

[thebuzzardman]

Jeff:
"I want to establish a defensive mentality"

Routinely starts:
Jack
THJr
Kanter

You can't make this sh*t up

Crazy right?

“We’re going to do some things this year a little bit different than last year, in terms of something internally that guys will be able to see,” Hornacek said. “We want to be a team that’s scrappy, a team that’s diving on balls, taking charges. We didn’t do a whole lot of that last year, especially taking charges. … We want to become a team that does that. That’s how you win ballgames. We’re not going to go out and outscore teams. We want to get back to the type of defense that the guys are putting it out there every single night. There’s going to be nights you don’t shoot the ball very well. You can still win games. That’s the mentality we have to start with.”

I guess we haven't started yet.

Jeff got one thing from Phil and that's "Mindfulness", so right now, in practice the Knicks meditate and visualize this, but won't implement it in the physical realm until next year.

[Sark]

Jeff:
"I want to establish a defensive mentality"

Routinely starts:
Jack
THJr
Kanter

You can't make this sh*t up

Crazy right?

“We’re going to do some things this year a little bit different than last year, in terms of something internally that guys will be able to see,” Hornacek said. “We want to be a team that’s scrappy, a team that’s diving on balls, taking charges. We didn’t do a whole lot of that last year, especially taking charges. … We want to become a team that does that. That’s how you win ballgames. We’re not going to go out and outscore teams. We want to get back to the type of defense that the guys are putting it out there every single night. There’s going to be nights you don’t shoot the ball very well. You can still win games. That’s the mentality we have to start with.”

I guess we haven't started yet.

Jeff with a classic bait and switch right there

[dakomish23]

All those dudes you named were flat out better prospects and better players and far more advanced in skill than Frank. Giannis wasn't a starter in his rookie year. I can put together a list too, that's no problem.

Jimmy Butler
Draymond Green
CJ McCollum
Kyle Lowry
Goran Dragic
Nikola Jokic
Jamal Murray
Gary Harris
Buddy Hield
Jaylen Brown
Dennis Schroeder
Zach Lavine
George Hill
Khris Middleton

And a whole bunch more, including players that were far better than Frank is right now. Before you worry about his "chemistry" you should first worry about his improvement in the summer and what he needs to work on to actually look like an NBA player. Once we get that out of the way then we can start concentrating on his chemistry with the guys around him. Until then, the kid has a lot of work to do in the summer. He's not good right now, simple and plain.

You opened up the “this person didn’t start as a rookie” dialogue by saying “Harden didn’t start as a rookie and he turned out fine”. So then I went down the current ALL STAR list of those who did start their rookie year. Giannis did start games his rookie year. You guys are saying that it’s fine that Frank won’t start all year.

Your list

Jimmy Butler - behind Korver on a contender
Lowry - behind Mighty Mouse
Dragic - behind Nash
Jokic - started 55 games
Jamal Murray - behind Gary Harris
Gary Harris - fine
Buddy Heild - started 55 games
Jaylen Brown - behind Bradley on a contender
Schroeder - behind Teague
Lavine - started 40 games
Hill - behind Parker on a contender
Middleton - fine

Look at your list of guys. Is Frank behind a good starter? Is Frank on a contender?

The excuses for those guys are not applicable to Frank’s situation.

Play the damn kids.

You obviously missed the whole point and just want to keep crying for the sake of crying. Some of your points aren't even accurate but I'm not gonna waste my time going over them with you. You're still gonna whine no matter what.

Please show me where I am not accurate.

You brought up Harden, an all star, as an example of a great player who didn’t start as a rookie.

I went down the list of 2018 all stars who were starters.

You listed a bunch of guys who weren’t starters, many of whom are not all stars like Harden is.

I showed that most were either on a contender or behind a good starter.

It’s not whining. It’s not crying. It’s debating what you said and you don’t like the results. You really used Dragic & Hill, two guys who were understudies to HOF PGs as examples?