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Mills: Dolan Wants Us To Be Patient With Knicks' Rebuild

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Re: Mills: Dolan Wants Us To Be Patient With Knicks' Rebuild 

Post#161 » by Sark » Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:27 pm

camillepd wrote:
Sark wrote:Scott Perry gave out big contracts to Zach Randolph, Vince Carter, and George Hill before leaving Sacramento. I don't think he knows how to build a roster with veterans nor with youth.

But if you recall, when he did these signings last off season, they were widely lauded throughout the league as solid moves.



They also said Sacramento had a great draft, yet the team was as bad as it ever has been, and has no franchise player to speak of.
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Re: Steve Mills: James Dolan Wants Us To Be Patient With Knicks' Rebuild. per espn ian begley 

Post#162 » by NoLayupRule » Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:28 pm

dakomish23 wrote:
god shammgod wrote:then tank next year you stupid motherf*cker. he's giving you an out to suck for a minute. take it dummy.


If they did this, it would be great.

But the first 3 game winning streak, that approach is going out the window.

we've embraced the tank the last two years and ended up picking 9th

no matter what we do we can't be as bad as teams like BK, Phx, etc
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Re: Steve Mills: James Dolan Wants Us To Be Patient With Knicks' Rebuild. per espn ian begley 

Post#163 » by dakomish23 » Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:31 pm

god shammgod wrote:
Knicksfan1992 wrote:
god shammgod wrote:what viable veterans did brett brown have to play ? he didn't have any. that's the point. they dug up the bones of elton brand for leadership.


Thad Young, Evan Turner, and Spencer Hawes still on the roster. All viable rotation players at some point in their careers.


they were there for the 1st year of the rebuild (13-14) until they expired (thad young) or were traded during that year (tuner & hawes).


Would the Knicks ever distribute the minutes like PHI did in 15-16?

https://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/PHI/2016.html
Dkillanyk4lyf wrote:Melo is the reason why we are in the mess we are in now. Acquiring him was the biggest mistake in knicks history.


blueNorange wrote:good thing knicks have kanter because willy looking pedestrian af
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Re: Mills: Dolan Wants Us To Be Patient With Knicks' Rebuild 

Post#164 » by Red Vines » Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:31 pm

Why does every GM have some obvious flaw that can get them fired? For Perry it's declining to move up in the draft a spot or two this year because of "culture" which could hurt us. I'm not even talking about tanking after KP got hurt, I'm talking about the last couple wins that should've been avoided. And if that mindset continues into next season it could bite us again. I've said he's repeating the mistakes of the past thinking he can easily acquire the talent needed or improve players with serious flaws. You have to take advantage of being bad especially when you're getting a pass.
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Re: Steve Mills: James Dolan Wants Us To Be Patient With Knicks' Rebuild. per espn ian begley 

Post#165 » by mpharris36 » Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:33 pm

NoLayupRule wrote:
dakomish23 wrote:
god shammgod wrote:then tank next year you stupid motherf*cker. he's giving you an out to suck for a minute. take it dummy.


If they did this, it would be great.

But the first 3 game winning streak, that approach is going out the window.

we've embraced the tank the last two years and ended up picking 9th

no matter what we do we can't be as bad as teams like BK, Phx, etc


if we let KP sit out the whole year and traded lee...let kanter/KOQ walk...just drafted and brought in young players...we would be a top 3-5 worse record. Easily
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Re: Steve Mills: James Dolan Wants Us To Be Patient With Knicks' Rebuild. per espn ian begley 

Post#166 » by dakomish23 » Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:33 pm

NoLayupRule wrote:
dakomish23 wrote:
god shammgod wrote:then tank next year you stupid motherf*cker. he's giving you an out to suck for a minute. take it dummy.


If they did this, it would be great.

But the first 3 game winning streak, that approach is going out the window.

we've embraced the tank the last two years and ended up picking 9th

no matter what we do we can't be as bad as teams like BK, Phx, etc


Don’t see at all how we embraced the tank the last two seasons.

We made signings to win now. We were still playing vets to try to win games (ORL home game was the GOAT refusal to embrace the tank).

They want to win now. The one time they truly embraced the tank was 14-15 (by mid season) and it got us KP.
Dkillanyk4lyf wrote:Melo is the reason why we are in the mess we are in now. Acquiring him was the biggest mistake in knicks history.


blueNorange wrote:good thing knicks have kanter because willy looking pedestrian af
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Re: Steve Mills: James Dolan Wants Us To Be Patient With Knicks' Rebuild. per espn ian begley 

Post#167 » by HEZI » Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:36 pm

Are We Ther Yet wrote:
HEZI wrote:
Are We Ther Yet wrote:
You do realize there are more than 1 PG on a team right? The only **** they threw at a wall was Mudiay. Perry giving Burke a chance at redemption isn't quite the same...but Yeah...they are looking to fill out a young roster. They only had Baker and Frank to work with. You're over thinking this. Frank was not coached by the FO. They have to fill out the team around what they already had. If Frank turns it out in thr future...and Mud shows anything...the team is that much better. Burke has 6th man value right now with a chance to improve that status. It's a solid way to build from the bottom up. It in no way is any sort of indictment on Frank. They have said as much. Patience dude.


Getting younger is not a plan or a direction. What is our identity? Don't tell me youth :lol:


Building around KP is our direction right now. Getting players that fit his timeline. That means getting younger. Developing youth and a defensive identity is the plan. This isn't 2k here. You have to actually use a thought process other then selecting names from a list and pressing a button.

We have SEVERAL young players to work with now. Finding out who sticks and filling in the gaps is the next phase. The HC will determine the actual identity around the roster they JUST STARTED putting together.

Frank/Burke/Timmy/Dotson/Baker/Troy/Kornet(?)/lottery pick/ high 2nd rd pick/KP healing. That's your foundation right now. Kanter is anyone's guess. The rest of the team we hope to contend with isn't here yet. Crawl...walk...run. That's the process. Patience.


We're building around KP by recycling role players? Great plan and direction. We're def. going places
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Re: Mills: Dolan Wants Us To Be Patient With Knicks' Rebuild 

Post#168 » by Da ThRONe » Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:38 pm

Why would Dolan say anything. He should be cutting checks. If Mills/Perry think they can put together a team quickly they should be allowed to do what they think is best.
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Re: Mills: Dolan Wants Us To Be Patient With Knicks' Rebuild 

Post#169 » by shtolky » Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:43 pm

Sark wrote:Scott Perry gave out big contracts to Zach Randolph, Vince Carter, and George Hill before leaving Sacramento. I don't think he knows how to build a roster with veterans nor with youth.



Vlade Divac was GM when those contracts were given out. If you're gonna mention Perry giving out those contracts, then you have to say he drafted KD (KD specifically said Perry drafted him FWIW) and built the Pistons championship team, since he worked for both organizations during those moments.

"The Pistons hired Perry as a college scout in 2000, and he joined their front office in 2002. With the Pistons, Perry aided in building an NBA power that advanced to six consecutive Eastern Conference finals, two NBA Finals and won the NBA championship in 2004."
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Re: Mills: Dolan Wants Us To Be Patient With Knicks' Rebuild 

Post#170 » by shtolky » Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:45 pm

Red Vines wrote:Why does every GM have some obvious flaw that can get them fired? For Perry it's declining to move up in the draft a spot or two this year because of "culture" which could hurt us. I'm not even talking about tanking after KP got hurt, I'm talking about the last couple wins that should've been avoided. And if that mindset continues into next season it could bite us again. I've said he's repeating the mistakes of the past thinking he can easily acquire the talent needed or improve players with serious flaws. You have to take advantage of being bad especially when you're getting a pass.



You obviously didn't watch the Cavs game to end the season if you think that win could have been avoided. Players don't throw games, that would be illegal. Hard to complain when the five who won that game were Burke, Frank, Dotson, Hicks, and Kornet. Unless you're actually saying somehow we could have forfeited the game or something ridiculous. Still baffling that people still insinuate that it's the team's fault when you win a game like that.
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Re: Mills: Dolan Wants Us To Be Patient With Knicks' Rebuild 

Post#171 » by Red Vines » Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:46 pm

Perry traded Oladipo for Ibaka...talk about patience.
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Re: Steve Mills: James Dolan Wants Us To Be Patient With Knicks' Rebuild. per espn ian begley 

Post#172 » by HarthorneWingo » Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:46 pm

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i get you. but the minutes he kind of always got (in the 20s consistently) would indicate that the plan was for him to always split with a vet.


I don't really think there was a plan to be honest. Jeff coached to win and Perry and Mills were fully aware he was going to do that and even encouraged that he do that. Just like with WHG, if they were really committed to him then they wouldn't have kept adding more centers and they would have encouraged Jeff to play him more. They traded him for a reason, not just because he asked to be traded but because they never really were sold on him. Remember these guys attend the practices as well, so it's not like they are just watching games like us to evaluate these players. They probably see these guys way more often than us. So just like with WHG, if they really cared about Frank's playing time like that, they would have sent the message to Jeff and let him know what he should do differently. That's why I say they have no plan, no vision and no direction.


if they weren't high on billy, then i really like the trade.

and we got kanter because we needed to move melo. wasn't nothing personal. billy should have played that cool. maybe he'd inherit a starting spot. instead he popped off like a star player, which also was concerning to me.

all that said, as much as i like billy, i am very much concerned about a frontcourt of he and KP in an NBA that is so fast and spaced. saying billy struggles on defense is putting it nicely. KO the only true center from the lot worth keeping, and even he might have to go.


I think Kyle's staying.
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Re: Mills: Dolan Wants Us To Be Patient With Knicks' Rebuild 

Post#173 » by shtolky » Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:48 pm

Red Vines wrote:Perry traded Oladipo for Ibaka...talk about patience.



No he didn't. Rob Hennigan, the GM, did. Stop making sh*t up.
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Re: Steve Mills: James Dolan Wants Us To Be Patient With Knicks' Rebuild. per espn ian begley 

Post#174 » by Jeff Van Gully » Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:48 pm

Are We Ther Yet wrote:
HEZI wrote:
Are We Ther Yet wrote:
You do realize there are more than 1 PG on a team right? The only **** they threw at a wall was Mudiay. Perry giving Burke a chance at redemption isn't quite the same...but Yeah...they are looking to fill out a young roster. They only had Baker and Frank to work with. You're over thinking this. Frank was not coached by the FO. They have to fill out the team around what they already had. If Frank turns it out in thr future...and Mud shows anything...the team is that much better. Burke has 6th man value right now with a chance to improve that status. It's a solid way to build from the bottom up. It in no way is any sort of indictment on Frank. They have said as much. Patience dude.


Getting younger is not a plan or a direction. What is our identity? Don't tell me youth :lol:


Building around KP is our direction right now. Getting players that fit his timeline. That means getting younger. Developing youth and a defensive identity is the plan. This isn't 2k here. You have to actually use a thought process other then selecting names from a list and pressing a button.

We have SEVERAL young players to work with now. Finding out who sticks and filling in the gaps is the next phase. The HC will determine the actual identity around the roster they JUST STARTED putting together.

Frank/Burke/Timmy/Dotson/Baker/Troy/Kornet(?)/lottery pick/ high 2nd rd pick/KP healing. That's your foundation right now. Kanter is anyone's guess. The rest of the team we hope to contend with isn't here yet. Crawl...walk...run. That's the process. Patience.


he said youth, athleticism, defense. seems like those things are prioritized so far.
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Re: Steve Mills: James Dolan Wants Us To Be Patient With Knicks' Rebuild. per espn ian begley 

Post#175 » by Are We Ther Yet » Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:49 pm

HEZI wrote:
Are We Ther Yet wrote:
HEZI wrote:
Getting younger is not a plan or a direction. What is our identity? Don't tell me youth :lol:


Building around KP is our direction right now. Getting players that fit his timeline. That means getting younger. Developing youth and a defensive identity is the plan. This isn't 2k here. You have to actually use a thought process other then selecting names from a list and pressing a button.

We have SEVERAL young players to work with now. Finding out who sticks and filling in the gaps is the next phase. The HC will determine the actual identity around the roster they JUST STARTED putting together.

Frank/Burke/Timmy/Dotson/Baker/Troy/Kornet(?)/lottery pick/ high 2nd rd pick/KP healing. That's your foundation right now. Kanter is anyone's guess. The rest of the team we hope to contend with isn't here yet. Crawl...walk...run. That's the process. Patience.


We're building around KP by recycling role players? Great plan and direction. We're def. going places


I remember why your on my list...you are forever a contrarian and you spin BS to suit your sad sack attitude. Whatever. Your opinion is a miserable one.
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Re: Mills: Dolan Wants Us To Be Patient With Knicks' Rebuild 

Post#176 » by Jeff Van Gully » Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:51 pm

shtolky wrote:
Red Vines wrote:Why does every GM have some obvious flaw that can get them fired? For Perry it's declining to move up in the draft a spot or two this year because of "culture" which could hurt us. I'm not even talking about tanking after KP got hurt, I'm talking about the last couple wins that should've been avoided. And if that mindset continues into next season it could bite us again. I've said he's repeating the mistakes of the past thinking he can easily acquire the talent needed or improve players with serious flaws. You have to take advantage of being bad especially when you're getting a pass.



You obviously didn't watch the Cavs game to end the season if you think that win could have been avoided. Players don't throw games, that would be illegal. Hard to complain when the five who won that game were Burke, Frank, Dotson, Hicks, and Kornet. Unless you're actually saying somehow we could have forfeited the game or something ridiculous. Still baffling that people still insinuate that it's the team's fault when you win a game like that.


people forget that the record is season-long and really look at the last week like you're supposed to be doing anything other than trying to win a basketball game. losses come from circumstance of being the worse competitor on a given night. that's it. only at a high level can you set your team up to be more likely to lose. but at tip-off... there's nothing more to be done.
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Re: Mills: Dolan Wants Us To Be Patient With Knicks' Rebuild 

Post#177 » by Red Vines » Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:56 pm

Let's be honest, Perry thought last season would go better and he's kind of pretending that the rebuild is starting now, for real this time. Fans will be patient but start the clock already.
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Re: Mills: Dolan Wants Us To Be Patient With Knicks' Rebuild 

Post#178 » by HarthorneWingo » Mon Apr 16, 2018 8:02 pm

Red Vines wrote:Let's be honest, Perry thought last season would go better and he's kind of pretending that the rebuild is starting now, for real this time. Fans will be patient but start the clock already.


Well, he has until the summer of 2020. Then it's free agent bonanza time.
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Re: Mills: Dolan Wants Us To Be Patient With Knicks' Rebuild 

Post#179 » by vallen » Mon Apr 16, 2018 8:03 pm

camillepd wrote:
Sark wrote:Scott Perry gave out big contracts to Zach Randolph, Vince Carter, and George Hill before leaving Sacramento. I don't think he knows how to build a roster with veterans nor with youth.

But if you recall, when he did these signings last off season, they were widely lauded throughout the league as solid moves.


none of those moves were anything but hole fillers to sell tickets. they werent creating any sort of a building blocks. they signed over the hill players with name recognition to sell tickets. in business terms only were they solid moves. nothing to do with building a functional basketball team.
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Re: Steve Mills: James Dolan Wants Us To Be Patient With Knicks' Rebuild. per espn ian begley 

Post#180 » by Iron Mantis » Mon Apr 16, 2018 8:06 pm

NoLayupRule wrote:
dakomish23 wrote:
god shammgod wrote:then tank next year you stupid motherf*cker. he's giving you an out to suck for a minute. take it dummy.


If they did this, it would be great.

But the first 3 game winning streak, that approach is going out the window.

we've embraced the tank the last two years and ended up picking 9th

no matter what we do we can't be as bad as teams like BK, Phx, etc

The tank has never been embraced.

This is the first full Melo-less season and yet still there were hella vets on this team getting major minutes all year.

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