PG: Game thread: Heat @ Knicks:1/27/19 aka: "We want Kanter"

[HerSports85]

You would think the Suns would be better. They’re such a disappointment

[BBALLER4FR]

Whenever Burke gets minutes, Knox plays like sh*t

Yup. I notice that. I also notice Knox remains stationary and sometimes doesn't even look for the ball. Is that Burke's fault? Because when Knox was replaced, the offense, with Burke, started to churn. It's odd that everyone wants to blame every young players downfall on the vets even though the young guys don't want to get at it. Think about how easy it should be for Frank to beat out this bum so many speak of In Burke. And in what world should we be concerned with Knox if he's gonna give his minutes to Hezonja? Madness. Knox was his own worst enemy today, and has been for a stretch now. When the vets come out to play and the rooks crumble, then they don't have the balls or the heart to have those spots. Because if they can't take it from "lesser" players on the team, how are they gonna fare when mediocre teams come hard at them.

[thebuzzardman]

So is it socially acceptable to say the team runs better when Frank is playing yet or nah?

I think so, but here's a diplomatic answer

The ball moves better as he has good IQ and I think the players know he'll get them the ball, but also if they reset and he gets it, it'll move again. Trust.

That said, Frank needs work all over the place. Asserting his will on the offense, in terms of "run this play". Making jumpers. Driving. Driving coming along, slowly. Jumper will come. Probably next year.

So, those things are good. It also speaks to how Burke and to an extent Mudiay, just really aren't that good at running a team, or at least a style conducive to team basketball. That's on offense. On defense there's no argument to make.

Mudiay I wouldn't mind as a cheap backup PG, as he's still got potential, his drive game is unlocking, and while he's not maybe as low key smart running a team like frank - not implying Frank is a genius or doing anything special, he's just very sound in a certain way, Mudiay tries to involve others. Meaning, he's sort of score first PG, but there's enough facilitating skills.
Burke is a nice scorer off the bench, but, nah, let another team who needs that have it.

I +1 too many of your posts, mostly because it saves on me typing.

I think the trust thing is, perhaps bizarrely, the key thing. I mean, it's the pros, the players shouldn't need to have rah-rah emotions effecting their play. But, actually, it's a game theory better situation for the other players to be in. So it's not really a rah-rah thing at all - it's simply in their interests.

On the other "PGs":

Burke is simply not a PG, he's a tiny SG who plays hardish on D, but is too small in almost all situations. I can't see how the money works out for him to be on the team next year, but if he is it has to be as a back up SG (& presumably we've shipped Timmy & Courtney away?).

Mudiay, maybe you're right. I'm a little less optimistic that he can run any team offence. But, shrug, maybe he can to some extent.

Trier ... again he's a SG just starting to think about if/how he could be a better facilitator. As yet I don't believe that he believes that is really how to play basketball/how he can have a role in the league. And that might be right .. he may be better off as a "pure scoring threat" or whatever .. but there isn't really enough evidence either way to be conclusive.

my left field idea from the game thread. Mario. Obviously not going to be a permanent PG, and his handle isn't great. But he probably could be encouraged to run the offence/be a Luka-light ... at a real stretch. (And not at all because they are from the same part of the world.) If Frank is also out for a couple of weeks I definitely think that could be something to explore.

Lets keep the mutual love fest going.

Your point on Mario. The way to use this guy, to maximize him, is let him play point...whatever - SG/SF/PF, as it involves him and he's good at it.

It's one of the things I was thinking, and might have said in the game thread, about a lineup that made sense and had roles.

Trier - primary scorer, break down the D, can shoot, some facilitating but not enough, not good but willing defender
CLee - knocks down open shots, moves the ball, good and willing defender
Dotson - Knock down jumpers, good and willing defender
Mario - Here it is - so so shooter, comes and goes, NECESSARY other facilitator for Trier, not good defender but willing
Mitch - anchoring the backline, good and willing defender

One primary scorer. Knows his role. 3 other guys who can spread the floor and shoot, but one only ok, but Mario makes up with point skills. 3 good defenders, but at least the other two aren't trash and try.

And Knox could be out there, but I think he has to be paired with Frank, as the defense takes a hit with Knox, for now.

Fiz really played a sensible lineup, for once.
I also could be a little high and things seem a little extra impressive.

[robillionaire]

You would think the Suns would be better. They’re such a disappointment

well, ayton is injured and they don't even have a pg on the roster

[thebuzzardman]

Which is why to me that with anyone with half a brain that watches this team consistently (not box score watching) can say that Frank
a) has the physical tools to play
B) shows a high basketball high iq
C) has a largely positive impact on the court
D) especially defensively
E) is clearly saw raw offensively

At age 20- this is someone you hold on to and try to develop and if he gets it offensively he becomes a special player.

And some others who only look at box scores don’t realize that there’s so many players in this league putting up 13-19 points per game that contribute to the game in any other area that they just become replacement level players

I guess. It could be glass half full/empty, in that his game has real flaws still and if someone locks in on that, it's not untrue.
Ok, I was going to type more, but don't want get into the varying reasons of pros and cons. They are like politics, all over the place, some make sense, quite a bit of emotional stuff that is just believed.

I hear you and it’s frustrating to me that he can’t score either and it doesn’t appear he’ll ever become a scorer.
But then you go around the league and you see that on all these championship level teams there are players contributing on a 30 a minute a night basis where there role isn’t to be a scorer but to do everything else and while they may be putting the ball in the basketball better than Frank is it’s not hard to fathom him scoring at that level in the near future (ex: Marcus Smart, Shaun Livingston, Batum (in the past) and there’s a ton more

Agreed. He HAS to get some reliability on the jumper to be a part of a decent team, in terms of staring/rotation minutes. But roster construction. There's a place for him with the right other guys.

If Fiz wasn't locked into playing Count Chuckaway, the starting guards should be Frank/Trier. They compliment each other. I'm far from the first to say it. Might have been Greenie. She was beating that drum hard even 25 games ago.

[thebuzzardman]

Ok, I better give the keyboard a rest but last point.

That moment where Frank was rising up to try and block the shot and there was Mitch, alongside, blocking the shot? When they replayed it in slow motion?

That was the best 3 seconds of the night.

[Garbagelo]

THJ is gonna get Fizdale fired.

[awy]

Two things:

1.WHEW!!!!

2. Is it just me wondering if those "Knick fans" chanting: "we want Kanter" trolling? or were they serious?

well uh, if you look close, kanter is sort of TANKER

[Strick]

I've said it once and I'll continue to say it. Trier is what Trey Burke wishes he was.

[Polk377]

I’m not a fake news/media generates hate type of person but everyone part of the media saying the Knicks miss Kanter or are tanking by not playing Kanter is seriously just a hater and is purposely trying to stir up drama because it’s absolutely ridiculous as they all know how little positive he brings to the basketball court on a nightly basis which is clearly apparent in the Knicks overall play since he’s been on the bench that I can’t stop rambling about this and never going to finish this sentence cause it gets me so freaking mad

Kanter does 2 things well and they are rebounding on both ends and scoring around the basket. Knicks are lacking in both those areas without him. Tank on team.

[mpharris36]

I've said it once and I'll continue to say it. Trier is what Trey Burke wishes he was.

its the difference of 6'5 200 to 6' 170

its why trier is more effective in his role and more efficient because he can use his size to get closer to the rim and finish there.

[Garbagelo]

I've said it once and I'll continue to say it. Trier is what Trey Burke wishes he was.

I can't think of one thing Burke and THJ does better than Trier.

[mpharris36]

KT they giving you props on Knicks Fan TV....you gotta pop on to talk draft with them

[B8RcDeMktfxC]

That moment where Frank was rising up to try and block the shot and there was Mitch, alongside, blocking the shot? When they replayed it in slow motion?

That was the best 3 seconds of the night.

And, the point is that Frank rode the guy all the way in on the drive, without fouling, and made him delay the shot so long that (i) it probably would have missed (again) anyway and (ii) Mitch has a clear path for the foul free block.

[B8RcDeMktfxC]

Rumour: Lakers, Warriors & ? are interested in Burke per Knicksfantv? Really? Is that a real thing?

[Jose7]

What did fiz say about frank?

and whats franks updatE?

thanks fellas and ladies

[The KnicksFix]

forever tanks

[The KnicksFix]

i honestly feel, we could tank three straight years and finish dead last, but with the change in rules we would always end up with the worst possible outcome

a next team could tank ONCE and get the highest pick to change their franchise, we could do it in consecutive years and still have nothing lol...

[B8RcDeMktfxC]

What did fiz say about frank?

and whats franks updatE?

thanks fellas and ladies

Sounded like he was explicitly claiming/recognizing Frank was the key to such success as the Knicks had in the first half on both offence and defence.

No update on Frank. Games tomorrow (Monday) and Wednesday .. I'd personally be very doubtful about either of those .. but it's too early for news from the team.

[Capn'O]

What did fiz say about frank?

and whats franks updatE?

thanks fellas and ladies

Sounded like he was explicitly claiming/recognizing Frank was the key to such success as the Knicks had in the first half on both offence and defence.

No update on Frank. Games tomorrow (Monday) and Wednesday .. I'd personally be very doubtful about either of those .. but it's too early for news from the team.

He's been a bit less soundbyte-y lately.