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Official Mitchell Robinson Thread

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Re: Official Mitchell Robinson Thread 

Post#41 » by Juco24 » Mon Mar 11, 2019 11:42 pm

Context wrote:the problem with some of you is -you don't learn from past mistakes...CHEMISTRY is not guaranteed.
Championship teams aren't slapped together...There's a foundation and structure in place...

All I can hope for is that Boston empties their tank for this guy and Kyrie goes to LA because instant gratification will get this fan base every time...


See Boston Celtics 2008 or Lebrons Miami Heat
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Re: Official Mitchell Robinson Thread 

Post#42 » by BadNewsBarnes » Mon Mar 11, 2019 11:58 pm

thebuzzardman wrote:
BadNewsBarnes wrote:No way we trade Mitch...he's more of a unicorn than KP.


Because he blocks 3's and is athletic?

The league has had a lot of rim runner/defensive/shot blockers.

Obviously, he has GREAT footwork on the perimeter and covers a lot of ground, but it's not super unique.

Whiteside. Capella. Heck, young Chandler. Old Chandler. Younger DJ. Etc
Mitch has the perimeter D on them, but still.

Prospect hugging on here with Mitch. Trade that guy for AD any day, all day.


Granted...but I can make the argument that Mitch has more upside presently than AD. If Mitch ever gets a mid-range and beyond the arc game, he becomes the player you build around. Wont need AD or KD. Remember that after seeing a small sample size of Mitch, KP was gone...on the surface it was because KP didn't like the direction and Janus was a ****, but they saw Mitch could do more things than KP IMHO. And you can't have Mitch and KP on the same court on the same side...it would never have worked.
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Re: Official Mitchell Robinson Thread 

Post#43 » by Context » Tue Mar 12, 2019 12:10 am

Juco24 wrote:
Context wrote:the problem with some of you is -you don't learn from past mistakes...CHEMISTRY is not guaranteed.
Championship teams aren't slapped together...There's a foundation and structure in place...

All I can hope for is that Boston empties their tank for this guy and Kyrie goes to LA because instant gratification will get this fan base every time...


See Boston Celtics 2008 or Lebrons Miami Heat

Was waiting for that example- Pierce and Wade were fixtures by that point :wink:

Come on guys...you think I wouldnt want a chip however we could get it- NOTHING good comes easy...
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Re: Official Mitchell Robinson Thread 

Post#44 » by Juco24 » Tue Mar 12, 2019 12:25 am

Context wrote:
Juco24 wrote:
Context wrote:the problem with some of you is -you don't learn from past mistakes...CHEMISTRY is not guaranteed.
Championship teams aren't slapped together...There's a foundation and structure in place...

All I can hope for is that Boston empties their tank for this guy and Kyrie goes to LA because instant gratification will get this fan base every time...


See Boston Celtics 2008 or Lebrons Miami Heat

Was waiting for that example- Pierce and Wade were fixtures by that point :wink:

Come on guys...you think I wouldnt want a chip however we could get it- NOTHING good comes easy...


Lol.... those teams still were thrown together but I get what you mean
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Re: Official Mitchell Robinson Thread 

Post#45 » by thebuzzardman » Tue Mar 12, 2019 12:41 am

BadNewsBarnes wrote:
thebuzzardman wrote:
BadNewsBarnes wrote:No way we trade Mitch...he's more of a unicorn than KP.


Because he blocks 3's and is athletic?

The league has had a lot of rim runner/defensive/shot blockers.

Obviously, he has GREAT footwork on the perimeter and covers a lot of ground, but it's not super unique.

Whiteside. Capella. Heck, young Chandler. Old Chandler. Younger DJ. Etc
Mitch has the perimeter D on them, but still.

Prospect hugging on here with Mitch. Trade that guy for AD any day, all day.


Granted...but I can make the argument that Mitch has more upside presently than AD. If Mitch ever gets a mid-range and beyond the arc game, he becomes the player you build around. Wont need AD or KD. Remember that after seeing a small sample size of Mitch, KP was gone...on the surface it was because KP didn't like the direction and Janus was a ****, but they saw Mitch could do more things than KP IMHO. And you can't have Mitch and KP on the same court on the same side...it would never have worked.


That's a long way to go to catch that upside.
That said, I like Mitch and mainly I was just being a pain in the ass. :D

I know it would be great for the Knicks to add that 3rd guy (if AD really wants anyone but Lakers....) but, with all the guys the Knicks would have to give up, and you'd have to think Mitch is on the list too, nah.
I mean, if Perry keeps Mitch, Zo and one of Frank/DSJr/Know in a trade for AD that doesn't include Zion, that's pretty impressive.
Also, obviously if it's Zion, just keep him.
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Re: Official Mitchell Robinson Thread 

Post#46 » by thebuzzardman » Tue Mar 12, 2019 12:47 am

B8RcDeMktfxC wrote:
thebuzzardman wrote:Anyway, of course I'd like to keep Mitch.

And I like DSJr, but it would be interesting to see a scenario built around the pick (if not Zion), DSJr and the Mavs picks and two more guys - but as B8RcDeMktfxC has pointed out, basically Knox or Frank has to be in there as well, along with some filler.

But if KP could net, AD...

KP (DSJr + Mav picks) + Knox + 2019#1 + THJr + CLee + Dot+ Ellenson for AD is the end result. (not sure if that hit enough money etc)

And Knicks keep Zo and Mitch and their own picks 2020 -> And Frank :-) (Assumption isn't pro Frank, it's that DSJr and Knox have more perceived value)


Sportrac numbers

Code: Select all

FRP#5:  6219600
Knox:   4380120
DSJ:    4463640
Dot:    1618520    
Henry:  1645357
Zo:     3551100
----------------------
Total: 21878337


Davis: 21674415 ( = 27093019 * 0.8 )
       


Sorry, have to wave good bye to Zo as well I'm afraid.


Kyrie
Frank/Jenkins
KD/?
AD/?
Mitch/?

Not to be a prospect hugger, but trying to round out the team is sort of rough.

Would the team have the MLE and LLE? IF Danny Green took the MLE and Broke Lopez the LLE (he took 3 million last year)

Kyrie
Frank/Jenkins
KD/Green
AD/?
Mitch/Lopez
rearranging your team a little. Allen for a min?


Damn. Would have to give up Zo.

On the other hand, imaging getting a guy in the 2nd round and it sweetens the deal to land AD. Still...eh, I'm still a fan...still prospect hugging. Save me.
* Frank and Mitch would really have to make jumps offensively. Green is there for reliable spacing with Jenkins though. Yes to Kadeem.
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Re: Official Mitchell Robinson Thread 

Post#47 » by awy » Tue Mar 12, 2019 1:40 am

what should mitch work on in the offseason.

corner 3 into attacking the closeout?
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Re: Official Mitchell Robinson Thread 

Post#48 » by B8RcDeMktfxC » Tue Mar 12, 2019 2:00 am

thebuzzardman wrote:
B8RcDeMktfxC wrote:Sportrac numbers

Code: Select all

FRP#5:  6219600
Knox:   4380120
DSJ:    4463640
Dot:    1618520    
Henry:  1645357
Zo:     3551100
----------------------
Total: 21878337


Davis: 21674415 ( = 27093019 * 0.8 )
       


Sorry, have to wave good bye to Zo as well I'm afraid.


Kyrie
Frank/Jenkins
KD/?
AD/?
Mitch/?

Not to be a prospect hugger, but trying to round out the team is sort of rough.

Would the team have the MLE and LLE? IF Danny Green took the MLE and Broke Lopez the LLE (he took 3 million last year)

Kyrie
Frank/Jenkins
KD/Green
AD/?
Mitch/Lopez
rearranging your team a little. Allen for a min?


Damn. Would have to give up Zo.

On the other hand, imaging getting a guy in the 2nd round** and it sweetens the deal to land AD. Still...eh, I'm still a fan...still prospect hugging. Save me.
* Frank and Mitch would really have to make jumps offensively. Green is there for reliable spacing with Jenkins though. Yes to Kadeem.

* I don't even know if they would. I mean, I do fully expect (Fiz apart) that they will, and I'm not sure how the reg season plays out with this thin a line up, but that is a pretty lit 9 man playoff rotation right there. If I'm the BadBoy Pistons I don't care how little Rodman*** and Salley give me on the offence end apart from rebounds.

** Who fell right through the 2nd round :lol:

*** [lol-B8Rc - lemme just footnote my footnotes] I watched a clip of Jordan talking about Rodman the other day. He swore Rodman was only 1/2 an inch taller than he was, maybe 6'6.5" max and 210lb (Jordan probably doesn't give up being 6'6" in public .. but that's not the point, the point is that he says Bulls-era Rodman was only a scrap larger than him, not 6'8", 225lb like he was typically listed). So .... that is Frank. Right? Right? So he's not going to make 34 rebounds in a game, but he is going to guard Giannis ... and Butler ... and Westbrook ...
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Re: Official Mitchell Robinson Thread 

Post#49 » by thebuzzardman » Tue Mar 12, 2019 2:04 am

B8RcDeMktfxC wrote:
thebuzzardman wrote:
B8RcDeMktfxC wrote:Sportrac numbers

Code: Select all

FRP#5:  6219600
Knox:   4380120
DSJ:    4463640
Dot:    1618520    
Henry:  1645357
Zo:     3551100
----------------------
Total: 21878337


Davis: 21674415 ( = 27093019 * 0.8 )
       


Sorry, have to wave good bye to Zo as well I'm afraid.

rearranging your team a little. Allen for a min?


Damn. Would have to give up Zo.

On the other hand, imaging getting a guy in the 2nd round** and it sweetens the deal to land AD. Still...eh, I'm still a fan...still prospect hugging. Save me.
* Frank and Mitch would really have to make jumps offensively. Green is there for reliable spacing with Jenkins though. Yes to Kadeem.

* I don't even know if they would. I mean, I do fully expect (Fiz apart) that they will, and I'm not sure how the reg season plays out with this thin a line up, but that is a pretty lit 9 man playoff rotation right there. If I'm the BadBoy Pistons I don't care how little Rodman and Salley give me on the offence end apart from rebounds.

** Who fell right through the 2nd round :lol:


Oh, meant Zo, as UDFA. Should put this pipe down. :D
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Re: Official Mitchell Robinson Thread 

Post#50 » by thebuzzardman » Tue Mar 12, 2019 1:41 pm

thebuzzardman wrote:
dakomish23 wrote:Is there anyone who would still trade him without hesitation for AD, if we sign KD & Irving?


Yes. Me. In a heartbeat. Goodbye nice 2nd round pick, hello future HOF'er.

No more prospect hugging around here. He rebounds well, blocks shots really well. AD does everything well. Goodbye.


Actually, it would be a really tough call. I say no, and use 2 out of the DSJr/Frank/Knox/2019#1 pool and one or two from the Jenkins/Ellenson "need to make salaries match" pool and find a "GOOD" player for 12-15 million. Have that guy be the "3rd player", and still have, at least, all Knick picks from 2020 forward (and maybe that 2019 player - never know!) and the Mavs picks.

Could make a trade for someone in year 2 of Kyrie\KD\3rd guy, also.

Knicks could get lucky and find a guy paid like THJr, but who is actually GOOD - well, a little less.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/contracts/players.html
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Re: Official Mitchell Robinson Thread 

Post#51 » by Knicksfan1992 » Tue Mar 12, 2019 1:59 pm

awy wrote:what should mitch work on in the offseason.

corner 3 into attacking the closeout?


He still needs to work on his body more than his skill. Needs to bulk a little more and get his conditioning up. Maybe eventually he gets a jumper but he still needs to become consistent at the things he's already good at before you start adding more stuff.
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Re: Official Mitchell Robinson Thread 

Post#52 » by awy » Tue Mar 12, 2019 2:12 pm

Knicksfan1992 wrote:
awy wrote:what should mitch work on in the offseason.

corner 3 into attacking the closeout?


He still needs to work on his body more than his skill. Needs to bulk a little more and get his conditioning up. Maybe eventually he gets a jumper but he still needs to become consistent at the things he's already good at before you start adding more stuff.

can be done at the same time. mitch needs the skill development time because of how little rep he has at basketball. it's the biggest upside play.
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Re: Official Mitchell Robinson Thread 

Post#53 » by Jalen Bluntson » Tue Mar 12, 2019 2:17 pm

thebuzzardman wrote:
B8RcDeMktfxC wrote:
thebuzzardman wrote:
Damn. Would have to give up Zo.

On the other hand, imaging getting a guy in the 2nd round** and it sweetens the deal to land AD. Still...eh, I'm still a fan...still prospect hugging. Save me.
* Frank and Mitch would really have to make jumps offensively. Green is there for reliable spacing with Jenkins though. Yes to Kadeem.

* I don't even know if they would. I mean, I do fully expect (Fiz apart) that they will, and I'm not sure how the reg season plays out with this thin a line up, but that is a pretty lit 9 man playoff rotation right there. If I'm the BadBoy Pistons I don't care how little Rodman and Salley give me on the offence end apart from rebounds.

** Who fell right through the 2nd round :lol:


Oh, meant Zo, as UDFA. Should put this pipe down. :D


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Re: Official Mitchell Robinson Thread 

Post#54 » by blackbishop » Tue Mar 12, 2019 2:31 pm

Context wrote:the problem with some of you is -you don't learn from past mistakes...CHEMISTRY is not guaranteed.
Championship teams aren't slapped together...There's a foundation and structure in place...

All I can hope for is that Boston empties their tank for this guy and Kyrie goes to LA because instant gratification will get this fan base every time...


I dont why anyone would still want a Player (AD) who bailed mid season on his team. What is to prevent him from bailing on the knicks if the knicks arent a top 8-10 team out the gate when he gets here even if he signs an extension.
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Re: Official Mitchell Robinson Thread 

Post#55 » by LeStud » Tue Mar 12, 2019 2:31 pm

B8RcDeMktfxC wrote:
thebuzzardman wrote:Anyway, of course I'd like to keep Mitch.

And I like DSJr, but it would be interesting to see a scenario built around the pick (if not Zion), DSJr and the Mavs picks and two more guys - but as B8RcDeMktfxC has pointed out, basically Knox or Frank has to be in there as well, along with some filler.

But if KP could net, AD...

KP (DSJr + Mav picks) + Knox + 2019#1 + THJr + CLee + Dot+ Ellenson for AD is the end result. (not sure if that hit enough money etc)

And Knicks keep Zo and Mitch and their own picks 2020 -> And Frank :-) (Assumption isn't pro Frank, it's that DSJr and Knox have more perceived value)


Sportrac numbers

Code: Select all

FRP#5:  6219600
Knox:   4380120
DSJ:    4463640
Dot:    1618520    
Henry:  1645357
Zo:     3551100
----------------------
Total: 21878337


Davis: 21674415 ( = 27093019 * 0.8 )
       


Sorry, have to wave good bye to Zo as well I'm afraid.


Kyrie
Frank/Jenkins
KD/?
AD/?
Mitch/?

Not to be a prospect hugger, but trying to round out the team is sort of rough.

Would the team have the MLE and LLE? IF Danny Green took the MLE and Broke Lopez the LLE (he took 3 million last year)

Kyrie
Frank/Jenkins
KD/Green
AD/?
Mitch/Lopez
rearranging your team a little. Allen for a min?


Unsure who posted that proposed deal but just for clarification, pretty sure most of those players in the deal must be renounced to get 2 max's.

Not only must #'s work in a salary match but timing is equally as important. NBA Draft occurs before July 1st therefore unsigned picks have a cap hold of 120% so peep below.

Noah $6,431,666
Frank $4,855,800
DSJ $4,463,640
Knox $4,385,640
Jenkins $1,988,119
Mitch $1,559,712
Dot $1,618,520
Henry $1,645,357
Trier $3,551,100
LT $1,000,000
19 1st $7,500,000
Holds $900,000
$900,000
$900,000
$900,000
Total $42,599,554

Based on those #'s even without a 120% cap hold, short 7mn for 2 max slots and that comes from renouncing Zo, Jenkins, Henry.

There's has been talk about Frank getting traded draft day and it makes sense because someone in that picture must go to actually get to 2 max slots which people have all but assumed was a foregone conclusion.
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Re: Official Mitchell Robinson Thread 

Post#56 » by thebuzzardman » Tue Mar 12, 2019 4:02 pm

LeStud wrote:
B8RcDeMktfxC wrote:
thebuzzardman wrote:Anyway, of course I'd like to keep Mitch.

And I like DSJr, but it would be interesting to see a scenario built around the pick (if not Zion), DSJr and the Mavs picks and two more guys - but as B8RcDeMktfxC has pointed out, basically Knox or Frank has to be in there as well, along with some filler.

But if KP could net, AD...

KP (DSJr + Mav picks) + Knox + 2019#1 + THJr + CLee + Dot+ Ellenson for AD is the end result. (not sure if that hit enough money etc)

And Knicks keep Zo and Mitch and their own picks 2020 -> And Frank :-) (Assumption isn't pro Frank, it's that DSJr and Knox have more perceived value)


Sportrac numbers

Code: Select all

FRP#5:  6219600
Knox:   4380120
DSJ:    4463640
Dot:    1618520    
Henry:  1645357
Zo:     3551100
----------------------
Total: 21878337


Davis: 21674415 ( = 27093019 * 0.8 )
       


Sorry, have to wave good bye to Zo as well I'm afraid.


Kyrie
Frank/Jenkins
KD/?
AD/?
Mitch/?

Not to be a prospect hugger, but trying to round out the team is sort of rough.

Would the team have the MLE and LLE? IF Danny Green took the MLE and Broke Lopez the LLE (he took 3 million last year)

Kyrie
Frank/Jenkins
KD/Green
AD/?
Mitch/Lopez
rearranging your team a little. Allen for a min?


Unsure who posted that proposed deal but just for clarification, pretty sure most of those players in the deal must be renounced to get 2 max's.

Not only must #'s work in a salary match but timing is equally as important. NBA Draft occurs before July 1st therefore unsigned picks have a cap hold of 120% so peep below.

Noah $6,431,666
Frank $4,855,800
DSJ $4,463,640
Knox $4,385,640
Jenkins $1,988,119
Mitch $1,559,712
Dot $1,618,520
Henry $1,645,357
Trier $3,551,100
LT $1,000,000
19 1st $7,500,000
Holds $900,000
$900,000
$900,000
$900,000
Total $42,599,554

Based on those #'s even without a 120% cap hold, short 7mn for 2 max slots and that comes from renouncing Zo, Jenkins, Henry.

There's has been talk about Frank getting traded draft day and it makes sense because someone in that picture must go to actually get to 2 max slots which people have all but assumed was a foregone conclusion.


Good point. B8RcDeMktfxC covered it here, has covered it several times around the forum.

I knew they had to renounce nearly everyone but I thought the guys under contract were ok, until he pointed it out. And you.
I figured when they gave contracts to the G-League guys it was to be able to put them in a trade. Obviously, since it's a team option, could have been nice way to give them some $ for bit. I guess both. Pay guys, have them available as filler IF a trade(s) happen.

Basic super fundamental question. FA in basketball is AFTER the draft, right? Most times that feels annoying (opposed to NFL) but in the Knicks case seems beneficial. At least not harmful. I think.
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Re: Official Mitchell Robinson Thread 

Post#57 » by LeStud » Tue Mar 12, 2019 4:50 pm

thebuzzardman wrote:
LeStud wrote:
B8RcDeMktfxC wrote:
Sportrac numbers

Code: Select all

FRP#5:  6219600
Knox:   4380120
DSJ:    4463640
Dot:    1618520    
Henry:  1645357
Zo:     3551100
----------------------
Total: 21878337


Davis: 21674415 ( = 27093019 * 0.8 )
       


Sorry, have to wave good bye to Zo as well I'm afraid.

rearranging your team a little. Allen for a min?


Unsure who posted that proposed deal but just for clarification, pretty sure most of those players in the deal must be renounced to get 2 max's.

Not only must #'s work in a salary match but timing is equally as important. NBA Draft occurs before July 1st therefore unsigned picks have a cap hold of 120% so peep below.

Noah $6,431,666
Frank $4,855,800
DSJ $4,463,640
Knox $4,385,640
Jenkins $1,988,119
Mitch $1,559,712
Dot $1,618,520
Henry $1,645,357
Trier $3,551,100
LT $1,000,000
19 1st $7,500,000
Holds $900,000
$900,000
$900,000
$900,000
Total $42,599,554

Based on those #'s even without a 120% cap hold, short 7mn for 2 max slots and that comes from renouncing Zo, Jenkins, Henry.

There's has been talk about Frank getting traded draft day and it makes sense because someone in that picture must go to actually get to 2 max slots which people have all but assumed was a foregone conclusion.


Good point. B8RcDeMktfxC covered it here, has covered it several times around the forum.

I knew they had to renounce nearly everyone but I thought the guys under contract were ok, until he pointed it out. And you.
I figured when they gave contracts to the G-League guys it was to be able to put them in a trade. Obviously, since it's a team option, could have been nice way to give them some $ for bit. I guess both. Pay guys, have them available as filler IF a trade(s) happen.

Basic super fundamental question. FA in basketball is AFTER the draft, right? Most times that feels annoying (opposed to NFL) but in the Knicks case seems beneficial. At least not harmful. I think.
FA is a week or so after the draft. And yes, draft before is good for Perry.

The draft will be telling and great place for prop bet action. If you see Dan or Perry drafting strangely then you can quickly surmise that an AD trade is verbal and Kyrie is going to either team.

So many moving parts and who know a KP trade would provide this much optionality.
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Re: Official Mitchell Robinson Thread 

Post#58 » by B8RcDeMktfxC » Tue Mar 12, 2019 5:17 pm

LeStud wrote:Unsure who posted that proposed deal but just for clarification, pretty sure most of those players in the deal must be renounced to get 2 max's.


I saw this because Thebuzzardman quoted it.

The scenario under discussion is that the Knicks get the #5 pick and pick up Dot, Henry and Trier's team options.

(Yesterday I went through (back of the envelope, but afaics correct) calculations about whose team options the Knicks can and cannot pick up if they pick #1 to #5.)

Let's try the numbers (as far as I can source them) - as far as I understand them aorn - to see what the situation actually is. (I didn't find a salary number for Jenkins myself - it doesn't affect the main scenario we're talking about anyway, but let me take LeStud's number on faith.)

Headline number: Expected salary cap (as announced by the NBA): $109,000,000

(Note: it is possible the league flexes the total salary cap - presumably upwards.)

Code: Select all

Noah    $6,431,666
LT      $1,000,000
----------------------------
Frank   $4,855,800
DSJ     $4,463,640
Knox    $4,385,640
Mitch   $1,559,712
----------------------------
KD      $38,150,000
KI      $32,700,000
----------------------------
So far  $93,546,458

-------------------------------

5 holds : $4,485,790

-------------------------------

So far + 5 : $98,032,248
-------------------------------------------

Rookie salaries for 2019-2020 per RealGM: https://basketball.realgm.com/nba/info/rookie_scale/2020
* First round picks can sign for as much as 120% and as little as 80% of the rookie scale.

Code: Select all

Pick, raw salary, salary * 1.2

1   $8,120,700   9,744,840
2   $7,265,800   8,718,960
3   $6,524,900   7,829,880
4   $5,882,800   7,059,360
5   $5,327,300   6,392,760
6   $4,838,500   5,806,200
7   $4,417,000   5,300,400
8   $4,046,500   4,855,800
9   $3,719,500   4,463,400
10  $3,533,500   4,240,200


(who knows, maybe the Knicks trade down)

----------------------------------------

Running total: So far + FRP#5 + 5 holds : $104,425,008

----------------------------------------

Space left for picking up options: $4,574,992

-----------------------------------------

Code: Select all

Player, Salary hit, Cap hit "cost" to add ( Salary - $897,158)

Dot      $1,618,520    721,362
Henry    $1,645,357    748,199
Trier    $3,551,100   2,653,942
Jenkins  $1,988,119   1,090,961


Total adjustment if picking up these combinations of team options:

Dot + Henry + Trier : $4,123,503
Dot + Jenkins + Trier : 4,466,265
Henry + Jenkins + Trier : 4,493,102

As 4,123,503 < 4,574,992 it is viable (afaics) to pick up the options for Dot + Henry + IsoZo if the Knicks get the #5 pick.

(Similarly for the other combinations.)


Based on those #'s even without a 120% cap hold, short 7mn for 2 max slots and that comes from renouncing Zo, Jenkins, Henry.

There's has been talk about Frank getting traded draft day and it makes sense because someone in that picture must go to actually get to 2 max slots which people have all but assumed was a foregone conclusion.


So, no, this seems like a bad take.

------------------------

Fwiw, the remaining space for picking up options (calculated as per the example for FRP#5 above) is

Knicks pick, remaining space, possible option pick-up combinations

Code: Select all

#4    $3,908,392  (Trier + one of Dot/Henry; or Dot+Henry+Jenkins)
#3    $3,137,872  (Trier; or Dot+Henry+Jenkins)
#2    $2,248,792  (Any two of Dot, Henry and Jenkins)
#1    $1,222,912  (Any one of Dot, Henry and Jenkins)


---

1) It bugs the **** out of me that there seems no way of making tables on this site

2) Ofc, as always I'm happy to have for any/everyone to point out/correct any errors/misconceptions . But please do be specific.
B8RcDeMktfxC
General Manager
Posts: 8,196
And1: 5,355
Joined: Nov 23, 2018
Location: C'MON, COME GET THE FUKKIN BALL

Re: Official Mitchell Robinson Thread 

Post#59 » by B8RcDeMktfxC » Tue Mar 12, 2019 5:22 pm

thebuzzardman wrote:Good point. B8RcDeMktfxC covered it here, has covered it several times around the forum.

I knew they had to renounce nearly everyone but I thought the guys under contract were ok, until he pointed it out. And you.
I figured when they gave contracts to the G-League guys it was to be able to put them in a trade. Obviously, since it's a team option, could have been nice way to give them some $ for bit. I guess both. Pay guys, have them available as filler IF a trade(s) happen.

See my post above for a detailed attempt on the #s.
LeStud
Sophomore
Posts: 132
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Joined: Mar 02, 2019

Re: Official Mitchell Robinson Thread 

Post#60 » by LeStud » Tue Mar 12, 2019 5:35 pm

B8RcDeMktfxC wrote:
LeStud wrote:Unsure who posted that proposed deal but just for clarification, pretty sure most of those players in the deal must be renounced to get 2 max's.


I only saw this because Thebuzzardman quoted it.

The scenario under discussion is that the Knicks get the #5 pick and pick up Dot, Henry and Trier's team options.

(Yesterday I went through (back of the envelope, but afaics correct) calculations about whose team options the Knicks can and cannot pick up if they pick #1 to #5.)

Let's try the numbers (as far as I can source them) - as far as I understand them aorn - to see what the situation actually is. (I didn't find a salary number for Jenkins myself - it doesn't affect the main scenario we're talking about anyway, but let me take LeStud's number on faith.)

Headline number: Expected salary cap (as announced by the NBA): $109,000,000

(Note: it is possible the league flexes the total salary cap - presumably upwards.)

Code: Select all

Noah    $6,431,666
LT      $1,000,000
----------------------------
Frank   $4,855,800
DSJ     $4,463,640
Knox    $4,385,640
Mitch   $1,559,712
----------------------------
KD      $38,150,000
KI      $32,700,000
----------------------------
So far  $93,546,458

-------------------------------

5 holds : $4,485,790

-------------------------------

So far + 5 : $98,032,248
-------------------------------------------

Rookie salaries for 2019-2020 per RealGM: https://basketball.realgm.com/nba/info/rookie_scale/2020
* First round picks can sign for as much as 120% and as little as 80% of the rookie scale.

Code: Select all

Pick, raw salary, salary * 1.2

1   $8,120,700   9,744,840
2   $7,265,800   8,718,960
3   $6,524,900   7,829,880
4   $5,882,800   7,059,360
5   $5,327,300   6,392,760
6   $4,838,500   5,806,200
7   $4,417,000   5,300,400
8   $4,046,500   4,855,800
9   $3,719,500   4,463,400
10  $3,533,500   4,240,200


(who knows, maybe the Knicks trade down)

----------------------------------------

Running total: So far + FRP#5 + 5 holds : $104,425,008

----------------------------------------

Space left for picking up options: $4,574,992

-----------------------------------------

Code: Select all

Player, Salary hit, Cap hit "cost" to add ( Salary - $897,158)

Dot      $1,618,520    721,362
Henry    $1,645,357    748,199
Trier    $3,551,100   2,653,942
Jenkins  $1,988,119   1,090,961


Total adjustment if picking up these combinations of team options:

Dot + Henry + Trier : $4,123,503
Dot + Jenkins + Trier : 4,466,265
Henry + Jenkins + Trier : 4,493,102

As 4,123,503 < 4,574,992 it is viable (afaics) to pick up the options for Dot + Henry + IsoZo if the Knicks get the #5 pick.

(Similarly for the other combinations.)


Based on those #'s even without a 120% cap hold, short 7mn for 2 max slots and that comes from renouncing Zo, Jenkins, Henry.

There's has been talk about Frank getting traded draft day and it makes sense because someone in that picture must go to actually get to 2 max slots which people have all but assumed was a foregone conclusion.


So, no, this seems like a bad take.

------------------------

Fwiw, the remaining space for picking up options (calculated as per the example for FRP#5 above) is

Knicks pick, remaining space, possible option pick-up combinations

Code: Select all

#4    $3,908,392  (Trier + one of Dot/Henry; or Dot+Henry+Jenkins)
#3    $3,137,872  (Trier; or Dot+Henry+Jenkins)
#2    $2,248,792  (Any two of Dot, Henry and Jenkins)
#1    $1,222,912  (Any one of Dot, Henry and Jenkins)


---

1) It bugs the **** out of me that there seems no way of making tables on this site

2) Ofc, as always I'm happy to have for any/everyone to point out/correct any errors/misconceptions . But please do be specific.
You're disregarding timing which is very important.

Draft happens first, teams options become guaranteed Jul 1st, FA starts Jul 1st w a grace period before deals go live.

My original post is a "projection" as of Jul 1st. With that, those guys must get renounced.

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