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Plan full rebuild

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dakomish23
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Re: Plan full rebuild 

Post#81 » by dakomish23 » Fri May 24, 2019 4:03 pm

VCBC wrote:
dakomish23 wrote:
VCBC wrote:
Hinkie took on how many bad contracts again?

New, old, whatever, it's going to be adopted league wide because Hinkie tanking strat doesn't work anymore with new odds, doesn't take a scientist to figure out that 50% less success of goal (#1 pick) is going to break that. You mitigate it by getting more FRPs with light protection or un to increase your aggregate odds.


Are you being serious? Hinkie took on plenty of bad contracts.

How did you think they got from 5 to 1 in 2017?

The SAC dump in 2017 gave them swap rights, so they went from 5 to 3.

They added the unprotected SAC 2019 pick they got in the same dump to go from 3 to 1.

Just one example. Here’s a list of all his transactions.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/executives/hinkisa99x.html

What did you think BKN has been doing since the new FO took over? What did CLE do last year? BOS after we beat them in 2013? Presti when he started in OKC???

This is far from a new innovative strategy and has nothing to do with the changing of the odds.
Your example is 1 trade where Kings cleared 13mn between 2 players or essentially 1 Courtney Lee. Think bigger...

Love Hinkie Homers who pretend to know his strat when in actuality don't understand the core principles and his pref.


First off, it’s not about the amount. It’s about the percentage of the cap that Hinkie absorbed. What was the cap in 2015? But who needs context?

This is hilarious. I don’t know his core strategy or beliefs? Sureeeee. It’s such a mystery. :lol:

I’ve been pitching this stuff for years here. You’re delusional thinking that taking on bad contracts is some cool new innovative strategy.

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Re: Plan full rebuild 

Post#82 » by DowNY » Sat May 25, 2019 2:33 am

No.
Porzingis is soft fam.
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Re: Plan full rebuild 

Post#83 » by blanko » Sun May 26, 2019 4:51 am

EricAnderson wrote:
br7knicks wrote:
Chanel Bomber wrote:I wouldn’t mind signing and slightly overpaying for role players who play the right way on both sides of the floor if we strike out in free agency (with the big name free agents). I’m against trading our picks and young players but I believe surrounding them with the right players and putting them in a position to compete every night will help their development, especially now with the flattened lottery odds. I personally don’t believe in Frank and Knox, but DSJ, Mitch and this year’s top 3 pick at the very least need to be put in a position to succeed with the right veteran players around them.

Also, trading down would be a major mistake in my opinion, unless Mills and Perry really believe the BEST player available is projected to be drafted lower in the lottery. But we can’t hedge our bets simply because we don’t trust our ability to pick the right player.


most people don't get this ^^^^^

they think you should just pay any decent player max contracts, and wins will come. i'm pretty sure we've learned that that **** doesn't happen.

not every position needs to have a superstar at it, and you actually need role players. look at philly. there's no reason they shouldn't have made it to the finals. they had so much firepower, in their starters. and had the wrong players not playing to their strengths.


some are so dumb, i don't get it.


Who said to pay any decent player max money? I think the majority of fans are on board that unless it’s a Kd and a Kyrie coming don’t give max money to the Kembas or Jimmy Butlers of the world

As for the Sixers they still have a great young core to build around who have a decade of their prime left legs not act like they’re whole plan is a failure already.



Embid has a decade left on his kees?
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Re: Plan full rebuild 

Post#84 » by blanko » Sun May 26, 2019 8:55 am

big three or not, i wouldn't mind buying another second rounder from philly and/or atl
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Re: Plan full rebuild 

Post#85 » by nedleeds » Sun May 26, 2019 2:54 pm

blanko wrote:
EricAnderson wrote:
br7knicks wrote:
most people don't get this ^^^^^

they think you should just pay any decent player max contracts, and wins will come. i'm pretty sure we've learned that that **** doesn't happen.

not every position needs to have a superstar at it, and you actually need role players. look at philly. there's no reason they shouldn't have made it to the finals. they had so much firepower, in their starters. and had the wrong players not playing to their strengths.


some are so dumb, i don't get it.


Who said to pay any decent player max money? I think the majority of fans are on board that unless it’s a Kd and a Kyrie coming don’t give max money to the Kembas or Jimmy Butlers of the world

As for the Sixers they still have a great young core to build around who have a decade of their prime left legs not act like they’re whole plan is a failure already.



Embid has a decade left on his kees?


I'm 40 and have a better shot at ten years of good knees.
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Re: Plan full rebuild 

Post#86 » by DrCoach » Mon May 27, 2019 1:07 am

C- Mitch/Kornek
Pf-Vonleh/Ellenson
Sf-Knox/Dotson
Sg-R.J./Trier
Pg-DSJr/Frank

Bench
Lance
Mudiay?
Hezonja?
2Way
#55 Pick

This gives us 2 players to sign assuming we bring those guys back
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Re: Plan full rebuild 

Post#87 » by Richard4444 » Mon May 27, 2019 1:46 am

blanko wrote:big three or not, i wouldn't mind buying another second rounder from philly and/or atl


We dont have cap space avaliable to sign any second rounders if we dont trade someone or renounce Trier or Dotsons Cap Hold.
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Re: Plan full rebuild 

Post#88 » by ohboy109 » Mon May 27, 2019 7:44 am

Knicksfan20 wrote:idk....Knox and Frank look somewhat mediocre. DSJR looks like a good offensive player who isnt much of a game changer. Id trade the 3 of them if i could get a really good proven player. We have a chance to get 2 great players in Durant and Kyrie... I dont think we should pass that up either.


what u mean Knox looks mediocre he 19 dummie frank is not even mediocre he just bad..
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Re: Plan full rebuild 

Post#89 » by blanko » Mon May 27, 2019 8:24 am

Richard4444 wrote:
blanko wrote:big three or not, i wouldn't mind buying another second rounder from philly and/or atl


We dont have cap space avaliable to sign any second rounders if we dont trade someone or renounce Trier or Dotsons Cap Hold.
Dammit.. i am intrigued by porter, i can see him becoming an horford type player...

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Re: Plan full rebuild 

Post#90 » by kej718 » Mon May 27, 2019 6:57 pm

How far up the draft could we move up if we trade Frank and our 55th pick?
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Re: Plan full rebuild 

Post#91 » by robillionaire » Thu Jun 13, 2019 2:20 am

kej718 wrote:How far up the draft could we move up if we trade Frank and our 55th pick?


maybe we could get the 26th from cleveland
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Re: Plan full rebuild 

Post#92 » by Da_Mane_Man » Thu Jun 13, 2019 2:58 am

robillionaire wrote:Let’s say we don’t get KD or Kyrie and don’t waste our space to sign players like Kemba, Harris, Middleton etc

DSJ
RJ?
Frank
Knox
Mitch

Dotson and Trier off the bench

Use the cap space to sign 1 year reclamation projects or to absorb some bad contracts to obtain more draft picks, try to fill the rest of the roster with G Leaguers

Develop the young guys retain flexibility get more assets and tank again.


I'm team "KD & chill" but I'll play along here.

Frankie
Dotson
RJ
Knox
Mitch

Trade DSJ for a bag of donuts. Take on an expiring bad contract for the 10th,11th or 12th pick and draft Rui Hachimura.

Shoot a bunch of 3's.
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Re: Plan full rebuild 

Post#93 » by Chanel Bomber » Thu Jun 13, 2019 3:13 am

robillionaire wrote:Let’s say we don’t get KD or Kyrie and don’t waste our space to sign players like Kemba, Harris, Middleton etc

DSJ
RJ?
Frank
Knox
Mitch

Dotson and Trier off the bench

Use the cap space to sign 1 year reclamation projects or to absorb some bad contracts to obtain more draft picks, try to fill the rest of the roster with G Leaguers

Develop the young guys retain flexibility get more assets and tank again.

I believe we need to rebuild through the draft and that it is priority #1. I said it repeatedly back when everyone thought KD and Kyrie was a fait accompli and my position hasn't changed. However, I also believe these young guys need some level of guidance and need to play competitive basketball before they eat each other.

My point is, I'm not against signing the right vet for the right price. For these guys to develop, they need guys who don't dominate the ball, who can shoot, who can defend and who can show them how to be professionals. The last one is a basketball cliche but I believe it's also true.

I think Malcolm Brogdon fits that description moreso than any free agent.

Marcus Morris theoretically fits at the 4 from a basketball sense but I don't trust his character. He will jack it up without conscience because he's the vet, just like Arron Afflalo did a few years ago. Too bad because there's a hole at the 4. Maybe Paul Millsap on a one-year or two-year deal?

DSJ
Brogdon / Frank / Trier
RJ / Dotson
Millsap / Knox
Mitch

Obviously this squad is not ready to compete for the playoffs but they might win 30 games and give the young guys plenty of opportunities to prove themselves while playing entertaining and competitive basketball.
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Re: Plan full rebuild 

Post#94 » by Smithers » Thu Jun 13, 2019 3:31 am

Sign KD & let the young guys play out next season.
They most likely wouldn’t make the playoffs so we’d have another lottery pick.
We can try to trade for AD or just sign him next summer.
Then you’d have KD/AD & still a slew of young talent
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Re: Plan full rebuild 

Post#95 » by HarthorneWingo » Thu Jun 13, 2019 4:58 am

Chanel Bomber wrote:
robillionaire wrote:Let’s say we don’t get KD or Kyrie and don’t waste our space to sign players like Kemba, Harris, Middleton etc

DSJ
RJ?
Frank
Knox
Mitch

Dotson and Trier off the bench

Use the cap space to sign 1 year reclamation projects or to absorb some bad contracts to obtain more draft picks, try to fill the rest of the roster with G Leaguers

Develop the young guys retain flexibility get more assets and tank again.

I believe we need to rebuild through the draft and that it is priority #1. I said it repeatedly back when everyone thought KD and Kyrie was a fait accompli and my position hasn't changed. However, I also believe these young guys need some level of guidance and need to play competitive basketball before they eat each other.

My point is, I'm not against signing the right vet for the right price. For these guys to develop, they need guys who don't dominate the ball, who can shoot, who can defend and who can show them how to be professionals. The last one is a basketball cliche but I believe it's also true.

I think Malcolm Brogdon fits that description moreso than any free agent.

Marcus Morris theoretically fits at the 4 from a basketball sense but I don't trust his character. He will jack it up without conscience because he's the vet, just like Arron Afflalo did a few years ago. Too bad because there's a hole at the 4. Maybe Paul Millsap on a one-year or two-year deal?

DSJ
Brogdon / Frank / Trier
RJ / Dotson
Millsap / Knox
Mitch

Obviously this squad is not ready to compete for the playoffs but they might win 30 games and give the young guys plenty of opportunities to prove themselves while playing entertaining and competitive basketball.



This
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Re: Plan full rebuild 

Post#96 » by robillionaire » Thu Jun 13, 2019 11:46 am

Chanel Bomber wrote:
robillionaire wrote:Let’s say we don’t get KD or Kyrie and don’t waste our space to sign players like Kemba, Harris, Middleton etc

DSJ
RJ?
Frank
Knox
Mitch

Dotson and Trier off the bench

Use the cap space to sign 1 year reclamation projects or to absorb some bad contracts to obtain more draft picks, try to fill the rest of the roster with G Leaguers

Develop the young guys retain flexibility get more assets and tank again.

I believe we need to rebuild through the draft and that it is priority #1. I said it repeatedly back when everyone thought KD and Kyrie was a fait accompli and my position hasn't changed. However, I also believe these young guys need some level of guidance and need to play competitive basketball before they eat each other.

My point is, I'm not against signing the right vet for the right price. For these guys to develop, they need guys who don't dominate the ball, who can shoot, who can defend and who can show them how to be professionals. The last one is a basketball cliche but I believe it's also true.

I think Malcolm Brogdon fits that description moreso than any free agent.

Marcus Morris theoretically fits at the 4 from a basketball sense but I don't trust his character. He will jack it up without conscience because he's the vet, just like Arron Afflalo did a few years ago. Too bad because there's a hole at the 4. Maybe Paul Millsap on a one-year or two-year deal?

DSJ
Brogdon / Frank / Trier
RJ / Dotson
Millsap / Knox
Mitch

Obviously this squad is not ready to compete for the playoffs but they might win 30 games and give the young guys plenty of opportunities to prove themselves while playing entertaining and competitive basketball.


Y’all really don’t think the Bucks would match Brogdon’s offer? I feel like they would
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Re: Plan full rebuild 

Post#97 » by FlashFlood » Thu Jun 13, 2019 1:21 pm

Realistically, the Knicks aren't going to pick up any restricted free agents, especially from teams in the playoffs.

They also should not send any offers to KD, who will be out for 1 year, and over 30 by the time he is 100%.

Accordingly, a lone max-cat won't be enough, and only hampers the Knicks ability to draft well, and make more free agency pickups in the future.

The best play is foregoing the FA sweepstakes, drafting whoever falls to 3rd between Zion, Ja Morant, and RJ Barrett, shuffling the roster for more high-potential players and picks in the draft.

Next season, you hope that with the roster more balanced because the chuckers and ballhogs are gone, the youth develops enough that the Knicks can be watchable. With Mitch, Barrett, and the will-they wont-they make the leap drama around Frank and Knox, I think they will be just about watchable.
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Re: Plan full rebuild 

Post#98 » by Meat » Thu Jun 13, 2019 1:43 pm

FlashFlood wrote:Realistically, the Knicks aren't going to pick up any restricted free agents, especially from teams in the playoffs.

They are also should not send any offers to KD, who will be out for 1 year, and over 30 by the time he is 100%.

Accordingly, a lone max-cat won't be enough, and only hampers the Knicks ability to draft well, and make more free agency pickups in the future.

The best play is foregoing the FA sweepstakes, drafting whoever falls to 3rd between Zion, Ja Morant, and RJ Barrett, shuffling the roster for more high-potential players and picks in the draft.

Next season, you hope that with the roster more balanced because the chuckers and ballhogs are gone, the youth develops enough that the Knicks can be watchable. With Mitch, Barrett, and the will-they wont-they make the leap drama around Frank and Knox, I think they will be just about watchable.

what??????
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Re: Plan full rebuild 

Post#99 » by FlashFlood » Thu Jun 13, 2019 2:04 pm

Whoa 6 question marks. This guy's super confused :D
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Re: Plan full rebuild 

Post#100 » by VCBC » Thu Jun 13, 2019 2:16 pm

1. There's a NBA salary floor, 90% of cap.
2. KD is out a season so teams aren't clamoring for 2 max slots.
3. Little 2 max slots demand means no bad contracts to take on for Perry.
4. No bad contracts = no assets to accumulate for rebuild.
5. Salary floor and no bad contracts means a rinse and repeat of spending cap on Mudiay, Noah, Mario etc.

Conclusion: Knicks are going to suck again next year proving that this collection of youth is garbage and all the while lose out on the #1.

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