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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks
Posted: Mon Sep 9, 2019 12:36 am
by HarthorneWingo
VECTORMAN wrote:I guess Rose didn't use a ghost writer or a co-author. Not the smoothest read.
But of course... anyone with half a brain knows Melo was probably our biggest problem, despite all of Rose's flaws, despite Noah being too lit, and despite the triangle fiasco. I've always maintained, it was Melo's refusal to share the ball that doomed us more than anything. No defense and no teamwork from your "best player" = no chance.
Haha, I had written that myself in my OP but then decided to see what others had to say first. It was so poorly written.
Just a bunch of stream of consciousness thoughts put together which weren't coherent for all of the reasons posted in this thread by everyone here.
For me, I just liked reading the Melo parts because they support my narrative of what I've been complaining of during his tenure. Couldn't agree with you more on him. Too bad you never got to meat one on former Melo supporter who is no longer with us.
(This just happens to be the color of the emoji. I didn't change it, I swear. It only comes in green.)
Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks
Posted: Mon Sep 9, 2019 12:43 am
by malik959
Here's my take on the whole issue:
1) We have an owner that knows nothing about running an organization and how to put experienced workers around him
2) We had a President that knew nothing about building and running a team
3) We had a coach that knew nothing about running a triangle offense yet was was forced to do so.
4) We had run and gun/motion players that were forced to play in an offense they were never suited for.
5) Our players refused to even try to change, really don't blame them
6) When the coach allowed his players to play outside of the triangle and actually looked good the president scolded to coach for allowing the team to change.
Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks
Posted: Mon Sep 9, 2019 2:11 am
by prophet_of_rage
Capn'O wrote:dakomish23 wrote:Glad he dragged Pjax for what he was. His way or the highway
His triangle obsession was one of the weirdest things I've seen in sports. Really undermined Fish too. I figured he'd eventually figure out he wasn't the coach and move past it but he didn't.
It's because he doesn't know offence. Any other system would have exposed him.
Sent from my SM-N970W using Tapatalk
Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks
Posted: Mon Sep 9, 2019 2:13 am
by robillionaire
I don't really care. Past is the past and it's nothing we didn't already suspect anyway
Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks
Posted: Mon Sep 9, 2019 2:17 am
by Capn'O
prophet_of_rage wrote:Capn'O wrote:dakomish23 wrote:Glad he dragged Pjax for what he was. His way or the highway
His triangle obsession was one of the weirdest things I've seen in sports. Really undermined Fish too. I figured he'd eventually figure out he wasn't the coach and move past it but he didn't.
It's because he doesn't know offence. Any other system would have exposed him.
Sent from my SM-N970W using Tapatalk
If he were the coach, you'd have an argument, but not as the POBO.
IMO, he would have looked like a worse coach if they won a bunch of championships with the triangle, lesser talent, and Jeff Hornacek as the coach. So easy, anyone could do it!
Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks
Posted: Mon Sep 9, 2019 2:51 am
by Clyde_Style
Capn'O wrote:prophet_of_rage wrote:Capn'O wrote:
His triangle obsession was one of the weirdest things I've seen in sports. Really undermined Fish too. I figured he'd eventually figure out he wasn't the coach and move past it but he didn't.
It's because he doesn't know offence. Any other system would have exposed him.
Sent from my SM-N970W using Tapatalk
If he were the coach, you'd have an argument, but not as the POBO.
IMO, he would have looked like a worse coach if they won a bunch of championships with the triangle, lesser talent, and Jeff Hornacek as the coach. So easy, anyone could do it!
Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks
Posted: Mon Sep 9, 2019 2:52 am
by BKlutch
No offense, but no offense.
Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks
Posted: Mon Sep 9, 2019 2:55 am
by Clyde_Style
BKlutch wrote:No offense, but no offense.
Sir, with all due respect
Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks
Posted: Mon Sep 9, 2019 3:10 am
by malik959
D.Rose was the ONLY one that felt that jumping on a team that won 32 games the previous year with Aaron Afflalo as your second scorer, who was dropped and C.Lee became the "better addition" along with a drunk party animal (Noah). Outside of Melo, Rose and a Rookie Porzingis, who did he think was going to help them make the playoffs?
Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks
Posted: Mon Sep 9, 2019 3:23 am
by malik959
B8RcDeMktfxC wrote:Capn'O wrote:So, you think the part where he says the team should have extended and traded him is just fine? Or where he could have stayed on as a mentor?
I'm sorry, his entire self evaluation in that passage is absolutely delusional.
This one too. Many of the things Rose said arrow straight to the heart of many of the problems. But he's absolutely delusional about his own role. [Albeit, that may be necessary for him mentally, at this point, in order to keep being able to play in the league.]
Aaaaaah when a quitter wants to mentor a rookie
Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks
Posted: Mon Sep 9, 2019 3:31 am
by blueNorange
lol melo’s pr trying their hardest to say it was the knicks, not melo’s fault and rose out here confirmed what every coach, gm, and exec thinks of melo!
Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks
Posted: Mon Sep 9, 2019 3:33 am
by HarthorneWingo
malik959 wrote:D.Rose was the ONLY one that felt that jumping on a team that won 32 games the previous year with Aaron Afflalo as your second scorer, who was dropped and C.Lee became the "better addition" along with a drunk party animal (Noah). Outside of Melo, Rose and a Rookie Porzingis, who did he think was going to help them make the playoffs?
Anybody got any good Noah partying stories?
Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks
Posted: Mon Sep 9, 2019 4:42 am
by YouthMovement
And i remember being hyped we were 16-13 that year smh
Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks
Posted: Mon Sep 9, 2019 4:46 am
by Clyde_Style
HarthorneWingo wrote:malik959 wrote:D.Rose was the ONLY one that felt that jumping on a team that won 32 games the previous year with Aaron Afflalo as your second scorer, who was dropped and C.Lee became the "better addition" along with a drunk party animal (Noah). Outside of Melo, Rose and a Rookie Porzingis, who did he think was going to help them make the playoffs?
Anybody got any good Noah partying stories?
Will a drunk Noah video do?
Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks
Posted: Mon Sep 9, 2019 5:01 am
by F N 11
He violated Mills lols. Mills do seem like he try too hard.
Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks
Posted: Mon Sep 9, 2019 5:42 am
by BLACKFEET 2010
F N 11 wrote:He violated Mills lols. Mills do seem like he try too hard.
He really did. I don’t think it’s fair he question the man’s “Blackness” without substantiating it some.
In an ironic spin for Mr Rose particularly it’s like calling someone weak or a quitter without context or consideration—which the Knicks (at least publicly) didn’t when he upped and left without notifying the team.
Some things you don’t question out loud in the media brother.
Is Mills not enough of a brotherman because he didn’t resign Rose to a gajillion Dolandollars?
Kinda unfair for Rose to throw that out there like that.
Unfair and irresponsible.
That’s bigger than hooping.
Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks
Posted: Mon Sep 9, 2019 6:16 am
by dakomish23
HarthorneWingo wrote:VECTORMAN wrote:I guess Rose didn't use a ghost writer or a co-author. Not the smoothest read.
But of course... anyone with half a brain knows Melo was probably our biggest problem, despite all of Rose's flaws, despite Noah being too lit, and despite the triangle fiasco. I've always maintained, it was Melo's refusal to share the ball that doomed us more than anything. No defense and no teamwork from your "best player" = no chance.
Haha, I had written that myself in my OP but then decided to see what others had to say first. It was so poorly written.
Just a bunch of stream of consciousness thoughts put together which weren't coherent for all of the reasons posted in this thread by everyone here.
For me, I just liked reading the Melo parts because they support my narrative of what I've been complaining of during his tenure. Couldn't agree with you more on him. Too bad you never got to meat one on former Melo supporter who is no longer with us.
(This just happens to be the color of the emoji. I didn't change it, I swear. It only comes in green.)
Everyone knows why you started the thread
Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks
Posted: Mon Sep 9, 2019 6:18 am
by dakomish23
blueNorange wrote:lol melo’s pr trying their hardest to say it was the knicks, not melo’s fault and rose out here confirmed what every coach, gm, and exec thinks of melo!
That’s what you took away?
Shocking
Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks
Posted: Mon Sep 9, 2019 6:44 am
by blueNorange
dakomish23 wrote:blueNorange wrote:lol melo’s pr trying their hardest to say it was the knicks, not melo’s fault and rose out here confirmed what every coach, gm, and exec thinks of melo!
That’s what you took away?
Shocking
a stubborn basketball player that doesn't buy in?
yes!
I played through it, 60-some games, but I could tell right away it wasn’t the season I was expecting. Lot of different priorities. Melo’s there. You know how he plays. Can’t change that. That’s what I realized being there. And he’s a great dude; I loved being around Melo. He ain’t gonna rub you the wrong way. Great dude, great spirit, great person, great teammate.
I don’t say much, but Phil could tell. Phil was telling me to be patient. He said I had a lot going on with the trial and all. He was honest with me. Everything he talked to me about, he was honest, I’ll say that.
Our relationship was a little weird, though. He was cool the whole time I was there, but he wanted that $60 million he was owed by the Knicks.
As for me, I liked Phil, but, come on, man, you’re still running the triangle? He was still forcing them to run it. I’m a slasher, a driving point guard. The triangle is okay, but not for the personnel we had. Melo couldn’t play that way, didn’t want to.
With me leaving Chicago, I really was into the game, really wanted to do something. New York with Jo and Phil and Melo and leaving Chicago, it just sounded like it was going to be special. Getting back to winning. I had high expectations and I wanted to perform. I felt the spark. But we never had a flow on the offensive or defensive end. I felt like being there we never did the extra things to win the game, make the hustle play or the extra pass. We played numerous games where we’d hit a point where it just all fell apart. We had an alright start, playing around .500 ball into December, but you could tell it was getting worse. We knew it was only a matter of time.
Coming in, especially in the East, a team like that you know can compete, a team with that talent. They were trying to do it for Melo; he didn’t want to start over so they wanted to get the veterans for him. But he can’t play with a lot of guys, he’s gotta be the main guy. Supposed to be a top-five team. You should just fall into winning games with that much talent, but we were struggling to stay in it at halftime. It was frustrating, but at the same time all of it was out of our control. Jo and I used to talk about that all the time. Phil wanted us to play a certain way and we had to listen. What can you do?
Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks
Posted: Mon Sep 9, 2019 8:05 am
by bearadonisdna
Derricks problem is that he became a ball stopper at the 1. Which is pretty tragic when you aren’t the number 1 option.
The triangle is geared to promote and accommodate a number 1 scorer, but honestly the main caveat is that the superstar has to be able to distribute as well.
It doesn’t have to be at a point guard level but as a way to dictate coverages. In a way I feel they just didn’t execute it well.
Coaches, players, Phil can all be at blame.