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Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks

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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#61 » by VECTORMAN » Mon Sep 9, 2019 9:04 am

Clyde_Style wrote:I'm guessing it is Bill Pidto trying out a more congenial approach this time instead of signing up again and flaming the whole board on their first post like they usually do.


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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#62 » by Adelheid » Mon Sep 9, 2019 12:27 pm

bearadonisdna wrote:Derricks problem is that he became a ball stopper at the 1. Which is pretty tragic when you aren’t the number 1 option.

The triangle is geared to promote and accommodate a number 1 scorer, but honestly the main caveat is that the superstar has to be able to distribute as well.
It doesn’t have to be at a point guard level but as a way to dictate coverages. In a way I feel they just didn’t execute it well.
t
Coaches, players, Phil can all be at blame.


This is something that most of us knew near the end -- nobody has clean hands regarding the issue. Each group wants to run things their way. But personally, a huge potion of the blame here would and should go to Dolan for choosing execs that couldnt get the job done.
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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#63 » by malik959 » Mon Sep 9, 2019 12:31 pm

It was all Derrick Williams fault, he was supposed to be our savior
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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#64 » by prophet_of_rage » Mon Sep 9, 2019 1:24 pm

Clyde_Style wrote:
Capn'O wrote:
prophet_of_rage wrote:It's because he doesn't know offence. Any other system would have exposed him.

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If he were the coach, you'd have an argument, but not as the POBO.

IMO, he would have looked like a worse coach if they won a bunch of championships with the triangle, lesser talent, and Jeff Hornacek as the coach. So easy, anyone could do it!


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Here's why I disagree with your take. Phil Jackson came in to put his identity on the team. Phil Jackson only understands one offence well. Anything else and Phil would have been out of control. He couldn't be the architect behind a speedball offence and thus it wouldn't be his stamp. That's why he insisted Hornacek use the triangle and not a different offence.

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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#65 » by Knicksfan1992 » Mon Sep 9, 2019 1:33 pm

Phil should have just coached the team. It seems like the main issue was people were just uncomfortable with the triangle and didn't know how to run it non robotically... I know physically it would have been tough but he could have done all of the home games plus the atlantic division road games (besides Toronto) which are all just bus rides away. He would have ended up getting like 60 games in and he could have just had Hornacek/Fisher do the far road games until he felt comfortable enough with their coaching ability and ability to implement his system.
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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#66 » by Fat Kat » Mon Sep 9, 2019 1:42 pm

Knicksfan1992 wrote:Phil should have just coached the team. It seems like the main issue was people were just uncomfortable with the triangle and didn't know how to run it non robotically... I know physically it would have been tough but he could have done all of the home games plus the atlantic division road games (besides Toronto) which are all just bus rides away. He would have ended up getting like 60 games in and he could have just had Hornacek/Fisher do the far road games until he felt comfortable enough with their coaching ability and ability to implement his system.


A team goes nowhere without buy-in from their best player. Folks were complaining about the triangle, but the team barely ran it. That illustrates how the press shapes public opinion.

Phil thought that he could psychologically manipulate Melo. He couldn’t and that’s why he was doomed from the start. Melo’s rigidness is also why he’s out of the league.
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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#67 » by Stannis » Mon Sep 9, 2019 1:52 pm

BLACKFEET 2010 wrote:
F N 11 wrote:He violated Mills lols. Mills do seem like he try too hard.

He really did. I don’t think it’s fair he question the man’s “Blackness” without substantiating it some.

Some things you don’t question out loud in the media brother.

Is Mills not enough of a brotherman because he didn’t resign Rose to a gajillion Dolandollars?

I didn't see anything where Rose was questioning Mills "blackness"?
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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#68 » by Stannis » Mon Sep 9, 2019 1:57 pm

HerSports85 wrote:
And exactly WTF is wrong with Mills quote on quote talking “black dude stuff”?

Ugh NVM let me just get out this thread

Nothing wrong with it at all.

It just seems silly that Mills thinks that's going to make him closer to players.

As Rose said, just be yourself.
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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#69 » by Stannis » Mon Sep 9, 2019 2:05 pm

3toheadmelo wrote:It’s cool that Rose spoke highly of the Knicks to Taj Gibson. Noah too..even though I still don’t like him for not giving a damn when he was here
He claims that two unlikely sources provided positive reviews: ex-Bulls teammates Derrick Rose and Joakim Noah. Their respective stints in New York were disappointing, especially Noah’s.
“For years and years I’ve been asking about the Knicks. I always see different guys. My old teammates, Joakim, Derrick, they spoke highly of the Knicks even though things didn’t go the way they wanted to go. I just thought it was an opportunity. A lot of guys shy away from the opportunity. I didn’t shy away from it. I took it on.”

Yes, it leaves some hope for our future FA ventures.

With some of the garbage written this last summer, it's like they want everyone to think things are so bad and toxic that you can't even come here just to play basketball.
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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#70 » by prophet_of_rage » Mon Sep 9, 2019 2:11 pm

Stannis wrote:
HerSports85 wrote:
And exactly WTF is wrong with Mills quote on quote talking “black dude stuff”?

Ugh NVM let me just get out this thread

Nothing wrong with it at all.

It just seems silly that Mills thinks that's going to make him closer to players.

As Rose said, just be yourself.
Why isn't that Mills? Maybe you haven't noticed but since he took over the Knicks have been pretty Black. They are the only all Black front office. Just because he went to Princeton doesn't mean he isn't down.

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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#71 » by dakomish23 » Mon Sep 9, 2019 2:11 pm

blueNorange wrote:
dakomish23 wrote:
blueNorange wrote:lol melo’s pr trying their hardest to say it was the knicks, not melo’s fault and rose out here confirmed what every coach, gm, and exec thinks of melo!


That’s what you took away?

Shocking :lol:

a stubborn basketball player that doesn't buy in?

yes!

I played through it, 60-some games, but I could tell right away it wasn’t the season I was expecting. Lot of different priorities. Melo’s there. You know how he plays. Can’t change that. That’s what I realized being there. And he’s a great dude; I loved being around Melo. He ain’t gonna rub you the wrong way. Great dude, great spirit, great person, great teammate.

I don’t say much, but Phil could tell. Phil was telling me to be patient. He said I had a lot going on with the trial and all. He was honest with me. Everything he talked to me about, he was honest, I’ll say that.

Our relationship was a little weird, though. He was cool the whole time I was there, but he wanted that $60 million he was owed by the Knicks.

As for me, I liked Phil, but, come on, man, you’re still running the triangle? He was still forcing them to run it. I’m a slasher, a driving point guard. The triangle is okay, but not for the personnel we had. Melo couldn’t play that way, didn’t want to.

With me leaving Chicago, I really was into the game, really wanted to do something. New York with Jo and Phil and Melo and leaving Chicago, it just sounded like it was going to be special. Getting back to winning. I had high expectations and I wanted to perform. I felt the spark. But we never had a flow on the offensive or defensive end. I felt like being there we never did the extra things to win the game, make the hustle play or the extra pass. We played numerous games where we’d hit a point where it just all fell apart. We had an alright start, playing around .500 ball into December, but you could tell it was getting worse. We knew it was only a matter of time.

Coming in, especially in the East, a team like that you know can compete, a team with that talent. They were trying to do it for Melo; he didn’t want to start over so they wanted to get the veterans for him. But he can’t play with a lot of guys, he’s gotta be the main guy. Supposed to be a top-five team. You should just fall into winning games with that much talent, but we were struggling to stay in it at halftime. It was frustrating, but at the same time all of it was out of our control. Jo and I used to talk about that all the time. Phil wanted us to play a certain way and we had to listen. What can you do?


How are you not taking away the obvious delusion of DRose???????
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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#72 » by Knicksfan1992 » Mon Sep 9, 2019 2:40 pm

Fat Kat wrote:
Knicksfan1992 wrote:Phil should have just coached the team. It seems like the main issue was people were just uncomfortable with the triangle and didn't know how to run it non robotically... I know physically it would have been tough but he could have done all of the home games plus the atlantic division road games (besides Toronto) which are all just bus rides away. He would have ended up getting like 60 games in and he could have just had Hornacek/Fisher do the far road games until he felt comfortable enough with their coaching ability and ability to implement his system.


A team goes nowhere without buy-in from their best player. Folks were complaining about the triangle, but the team barely ran it. That illustrates how the press shapes public opinion.

Phil thought that he could psychologically manipulate Melo. He couldn’t and that’s why he was doomed from the start. Melo’s rigidness is also why he’s out of the league.


Well it didn't help that he surrounded Melo with chit too. Hard to buy in when the talent wasn't enough to win big consistently either and on top of that you had coaches who essentially had no idea what they were doing... Just a recipe for disaster especially when your top guy at that point couldn't elevate you enough to overcome some of it. It is what it is Melo had his faults but the organization did him no favors either as far as lineup construction went.
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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#73 » by Clyde_Style » Mon Sep 9, 2019 2:49 pm

Fat Kat wrote:
Knicksfan1992 wrote:Phil should have just coached the team. It seems like the main issue was people were just uncomfortable with the triangle and didn't know how to run it non robotically... I know physically it would have been tough but he could have done all of the home games plus the atlantic division road games (besides Toronto) which are all just bus rides away. He would have ended up getting like 60 games in and he could have just had Hornacek/Fisher do the far road games until he felt comfortable enough with their coaching ability and ability to implement his system.


A team goes nowhere without buy-in from their best player. Folks were complaining about the triangle, but the team barely ran it. That illustrates how the press shapes public opinion.

Phil thought that he could psychologically manipulate Melo. He couldn’t and that’s why he was doomed from the start. Melo’s rigidness is also why he’s out of the league.


It is what I called Phil's hubris. He thought he could mould Melo which was both wrong and conceited. For a guy who supposedly was a psychological mastermind to be so woefully incapable of diagnosing Melo's condition and then deluding himself into believing he'd be the one who cured Melo was a gigantic farce. It is why I went on the warpath when Phil made him the highest player in the league with a frigging NTC. I knew it doomed the franchise for years to come.
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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#74 » by Stannis » Mon Sep 9, 2019 2:59 pm

Clyde_Style wrote:It is what I called Phil's hubris. He thought he could mould Melo which was both wrong and conceited. For a guy who supposedly was a psychological mastermind to be so woefully incapable of diagnosing Melo's condition and then deluding himself into believing he'd be the one who cured Melo was a gigantic farce. It is why I went on the warpath when Phil made him the highest player in the league with a frigging NTC. I knew it doomed the franchise for years to come.

Do we really think Phil was going to keep his job if he let Melo walk?

He received 60 million dollars because Dolan thought he was a true magician. Phil tried to do with Melo what he did with Kobe and MJ because he had no choice. That just seemed like part of the deal when he agreed to the contract. Coming in and saying "Melo isn't the guy, don't resign him" was never going to happen. No matter who the GM/president was at the time.

Only other thing he could have done was maybe try to build a team like Glen Grunwald did for Melo.
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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#75 » by NYKAL » Mon Sep 9, 2019 3:05 pm

Knicksfan1992 wrote:Phil should have just coached the team. It seems like the main issue was people were just uncomfortable with the triangle and didn't know how to run it non robotically... I know physically it would have been tough but he could have done all of the home games plus the atlantic division road games (besides Toronto) which are all just bus rides away. He would have ended up getting like 60 games in and he could have just had Hornacek/Fisher do the far road games until he felt comfortable enough with their coaching ability and ability to implement his system.


that was my take all along. Either coach the team yourself or let the coach you hire do his thing. Shouldn't be both ways.

Dude really did rob Dolan. Was piss poor as a GM, falling asleep during free agent meetings and lampooning a guys trade value WHILE trying to trade him. Do the job you was hired for instead of walking onto the court, interrupting the coaches practice session to run an impromptu triangle classes on the principles of the triangle.
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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#76 » by Deeeez Knicks » Mon Sep 9, 2019 3:11 pm

It really was a disaster and doomed from the start. In a way it was different, but also the same as many of our other disasters. There is a common theme with all of them.
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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#77 » by HerSports85 » Mon Sep 9, 2019 3:16 pm

Met Mills when he was working with Magic here in Detroit to rebuild some struggling areas. Mills is more for the culture than Rose ever was and he doesn’t seem to be faking it. So that’s why I’m upset. How you know that’s not HIM

and I’m high key offended by some posters in this thread but I’m going to be quiet before I get suspended. Just don’t downplay or question someone’s blackness because you are unsure about yours. Fu!king clown
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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#78 » by 2010 » Mon Sep 9, 2019 3:16 pm

The ghostwriter is Sam Smith. A decorated author. He wrote "The Jordan Rules" among other best sellers. He has covered the Chicago Bulls for many years.
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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#79 » by 2010 » Mon Sep 9, 2019 3:27 pm

By now everyone should know Phil was only in it for the money. As Rose mentioned, he wanted to make sure he got every penny of that $60 million deal.

Phil was telling me to be patient. He said I had a lot going on with the trial and all. He was honest with me. Everything he talked to me about, he was honest, I’ll say that.

Our relationship was a little weird, though. He was cool the whole time I was there, but he wanted that $60 million he was owed by the Knicks.


What more needs to be said about Phil? :dontknow:
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Re: Derrick Rose authors a book with a chapter on the Knicks 

Post#80 » by Fat Kat » Mon Sep 9, 2019 3:48 pm

HerSports85 wrote:Met Mills when he was working with Magic here in Detroit to rebuild some struggling areas. Mills is more for the culture than Rose ever was and he doesn’t seem to be faking it. So that’s why I’m upset. How you know that’s not HIM

and I’m high key offended by some posters in this thread but I’m going to be quiet before I get suspended. Just don’t downplay or question someone’s blackness because you unsure about yours. **** clown


Agreed. It speaks to some people’s skewed interpretation of “blackness”. They view Rose as authentically black in his ignorance and antics. The comment is not only offensive, but extremely misguided.
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