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Jeff Van Gully wrote:

thebuzzardman wrote:

DaT WaVeY RiCaN wrote:Hes a brothas coach. If we can produce a winning basketball team players are gonna really **** with what we are doing. Im confident Fiz can be w X & O’s guy just from his stint with Miami under Pat and Spo.

Those Grizzlies teams werent to ba either. All Fiz needs is the right players. If Tyrone Lue can win it all then Im confident Fiz can.

Agreed. I mean, great coaches can elevate average players and MIGHT be the difference between teams that win a championship, or repeat, etc, but mostly the league is about talent, when it comes to winning. However, having a coach the players like to play for, for whatever the reason, is huge, like it's always been.

Stackhouse had those attributes too, and was a big reason why I wanted him hired. Good to see Fiz is looked at this way; should pay dividends.

word. no one questions fiz as a people person. he seems to have true leadership skills. we need to also see the basketball acumen. it's like two wings on a plane. you absolutely need both these days. we recognize the day of the curmudgeonous hardass coach is gone. but you can't not have the Xs and Os. as excited as i was to get fiz, i am highly alarmed by what i saw last season and am really hoping that was a function of the tank.

I keep comparing Fiz to Mike Tomlin for the Steelers

Yeah, players love him and he has great relationships, but when it comes down to actually playing the game, he needs high end talent to carry him, and even then they usually underperform. That's why the Steelers have never been able to get past the Patriots, hell, Tomlin even got outcoached in 2017 by Doug Marrone who isn't even a good coach

Fiz's style is gonna put a hard cap on the level of team success we have. He really needs Heatles level talent to win

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K-DOT wrote:

Jeff Van Gully wrote:

thebuzzardman wrote:
Agreed. I mean, great coaches can elevate average players and MIGHT be the difference between teams that win a championship, or repeat, etc, but mostly the league is about talent, when it comes to winning. However, having a coach the players like to play for, for whatever the reason, is huge, like it's always been.

Stackhouse had those attributes too, and was a big reason why I wanted him hired. Good to see Fiz is looked at this way; should pay dividends.

word. no one questions fiz as a people person. he seems to have true leadership skills. we need to also see the basketball acumen. it's like two wings on a plane. you absolutely need both these days. we recognize the day of the curmudgeonous hardass coach is gone. but you can't not have the Xs and Os. as excited as i was to get fiz, i am highly alarmed by what i saw last season and am really hoping that was a function of the tank.

I keep comparing Fiz to Mike Tomlin for the Steelers

Yeah, players love him and he has great relationships, but when it comes down to actually playing the game, he needs high end talent to carry him, and even then they usually underperform. That's why the Steelers have never been able to get past the Patriots, hell, Tomlin even got outcoached in 2017 by Doug Marrone who isn't even a good coach

Fiz's style is gonna put a hard cap on the level of team success we have. He really needs Heatles level talent to win

Sent from my SM-G965U using RealGM mobile app

Bro we havent even seen Fiz vision in fill effect yet. When he was in Memphis that team was already established.

Last year was clearly a throwaway season. Now this roster is all Pills and Fiz vision. We can’t really judge him until this season.

DaT WaVeY RiCaN wrote:

K-DOT wrote:

Jeff Van Gully wrote:
word. no one questions fiz as a people person. he seems to have true leadership skills. we need to also see the basketball acumen. it's like two wings on a plane. you absolutely need both these days. we recognize the day of the curmudgeonous hardass coach is gone. but you can't not have the Xs and Os. as excited as i was to get fiz, i am highly alarmed by what i saw last season and am really hoping that was a function of the tank.

I keep comparing Fiz to Mike Tomlin for the Steelers

Yeah, players love him and he has great relationships, but when it comes down to actually playing the game, he needs high end talent to carry him, and even then they usually underperform. That's why the Steelers have never been able to get past the Patriots, hell, Tomlin even got outcoached in 2017 by Doug Marrone who isn't even a good coach

Fiz's style is gonna put a hard cap on the level of team success we have. He really needs Heatles level talent to win

Sent from my SM-G965U using RealGM mobile app

Bro we havent even seen Fiz vision in fill effect yet. When he was in Memphis that team was already established.

Last year was clearly a throwaway season. Now this roster is all Pills and Fiz vision. We can’t really judge him until this season.

Sure

K-DOT wrote:

DaT WaVeY RiCaN wrote:

K-DOT wrote:I keep comparing Fiz to Mike Tomlin for the Steelers

Yeah, players love him and he has great relationships, but when it comes down to actually playing the game, he needs high end talent to carry him, and even then they usually underperform. That's why the Steelers have never been able to get past the Patriots, hell, Tomlin even got outcoached in 2017 by Doug Marrone who isn't even a good coach

Fiz's style is gonna put a hard cap on the level of team success we have. He really needs Heatles level talent to win

Sent from my SM-G965U using RealGM mobile app

Bro we havent even seen Fiz vision in fill effect yet. When he was in Memphis that team was already established.

Last year was clearly a throwaway season. Now this roster is all Pills and Fiz vision. We can’t really judge him until this season.

Sure

I just think its too soon for that kinda comparison. At the end of the day Tomlin is a hall of fame coach with one superbowl under his resume. So if that is the case I would be fine with that tbh lol.

DaT WaVeY RiCaN wrote:

K-DOT wrote:

Jeff Van Gully wrote:
word. no one questions fiz as a people person. he seems to have true leadership skills. we need to also see the basketball acumen. it's like two wings on a plane. you absolutely need both these days. we recognize the day of the curmudgeonous hardass coach is gone. but you can't not have the Xs and Os. as excited as i was to get fiz, i am highly alarmed by what i saw last season and am really hoping that was a function of the tank.

I keep comparing Fiz to Mike Tomlin for the Steelers

Yeah, players love him and he has great relationships, but when it comes down to actually playing the game, he needs high end talent to carry him, and even then they usually underperform. That's why the Steelers have never been able to get past the Patriots, hell, Tomlin even got outcoached in 2017 by Doug Marrone who isn't even a good coach

Fiz's style is gonna put a hard cap on the level of team success we have. He really needs Heatles level talent to win

Sent from my SM-G965U using RealGM mobile app

Bro we havent even seen Fiz vision in fill effect yet. When he was in Memphis that team was already established.

Last year was clearly a throwaway season. Now this roster is all Pills and Fiz vision. We can’t really judge him until this season.

The main reason last year was a throwaway season was because Fiz chose not to implement a system on either end or hold anyone accountable for anything.

DaT WaVeY RiCaN wrote:

K-DOT wrote:

DaT WaVeY RiCaN wrote:Bro we havent even seen Fiz vision in fill effect yet. When he was in Memphis that team was already established.

Last year was clearly a throwaway season. Now this roster is all Pills and Fiz vision. We can’t really judge him until this season.

Sure

I just think its too soon for that kinda comparison. At the end of the day Tomlin is a hall of fame coach with one superbowl under his resume. So if that is the case I would be fine with that tbh lol.

Right, because we should only judge coaches on the results of a season, not how they got there or if their team underperformed

Unless they're Fiz, who we all know is actually a really good coach and we shouldn't judge him on any of his history at all because reasons

GONYK wrote:

DaT WaVeY RiCaN wrote:

K-DOT wrote:I keep comparing Fiz to Mike Tomlin for the Steelers

Yeah, players love him and he has great relationships, but when it comes down to actually playing the game, he needs high end talent to carry him, and even then they usually underperform. That's why the Steelers have never been able to get past the Patriots, hell, Tomlin even got outcoached in 2017 by Doug Marrone who isn't even a good coach

Fiz's style is gonna put a hard cap on the level of team success we have. He really needs Heatles level talent to win

Sent from my SM-G965U using RealGM mobile app

Bro we havent even seen Fiz vision in fill effect yet. When he was in Memphis that team was already established.

Last year was clearly a throwaway season. Now this roster is all Pills and Fiz vision. We can’t really judge him until this season.

The main reason last year was a throwaway season was because Fiz chose not to implement a system on either end or hold anyone accountable for anything.

Balderdash

You just can't comprehend the genius of Fiz's "play hard" system, it's so intricate that to even attempt to describe it in words would be impossible, and Knox himself said he has been held accountable, so of course he was

GONYK wrote:

DaT WaVeY RiCaN wrote:

K-DOT wrote:I keep comparing Fiz to Mike Tomlin for the Steelers

Yeah, players love him and he has great relationships, but when it comes down to actually playing the game, he needs high end talent to carry him, and even then they usually underperform. That's why the Steelers have never been able to get past the Patriots, hell, Tomlin even got outcoached in 2017 by Doug Marrone who isn't even a good coach

Fiz's style is gonna put a hard cap on the level of team success we have. He really needs Heatles level talent to win

Sent from my SM-G965U using RealGM mobile app

Bro we havent even seen Fiz vision in fill effect yet. When he was in Memphis that team was already established.

Last year was clearly a throwaway season. Now this roster is all Pills and Fiz vision. We can’t really judge him until this season.

The main reason last year was a throwaway season was because Fiz chose not to implement a system on either end or hold anyone accountable for anything.

I think Zion was the main reason

But I agree we def need more Accountability this season

DaT WaVeY RiCaN wrote:

K-DOT wrote:

Jeff Van Gully wrote:
word. no one questions fiz as a people person. he seems to have true leadership skills. we need to also see the basketball acumen. it's like two wings on a plane. you absolutely need both these days. we recognize the day of the curmudgeonous hardass coach is gone. but you can't not have the Xs and Os. as excited as i was to get fiz, i am highly alarmed by what i saw last season and am really hoping that was a function of the tank.

I keep comparing Fiz to Mike Tomlin for the Steelers

Yeah, players love him and he has great relationships, but when it comes down to actually playing the game, he needs high end talent to carry him, and even then they usually underperform. That's why the Steelers have never been able to get past the Patriots, hell, Tomlin even got outcoached in 2017 by Doug Marrone who isn't even a good coach

Fiz's style is gonna put a hard cap on the level of team success we have. He really needs Heatles level talent to win

Sent from my SM-G965U using RealGM mobile app

Bro we havent even seen Fiz vision in fill effect yet. When he was in Memphis that team was already established.

Last year was clearly a throwaway season. Now this roster is all Pills and Fiz vision. We can’t really judge him until this season.

last year was filled with a lot of guys on 1 year deals.

this year this team is filled with a lot of guys on 1 year deals.

it's going to be the same chit, different season.

blueNorange wrote:

DaT WaVeY RiCaN wrote:

K-DOT wrote:I keep comparing Fiz to Mike Tomlin for the Steelers

Yeah, players love him and he has great relationships, but when it comes down to actually playing the game, he needs high end talent to carry him, and even then they usually underperform. That's why the Steelers have never been able to get past the Patriots, hell, Tomlin even got outcoached in 2017 by Doug Marrone who isn't even a good coach

Fiz's style is gonna put a hard cap on the level of team success we have. He really needs Heatles level talent to win

Sent from my SM-G965U using RealGM mobile app

Bro we havent even seen Fiz vision in fill effect yet. When he was in Memphis that team was already established.

Last year was clearly a throwaway season. Now this roster is all Pills and Fiz vision. We can’t really judge him until this season.

last year was filled with a lot of guys on 1 year deals.

this year this team is filled with a lot of guys on 1 year deals.

it's going to be the same chit, different season.

It's not exactly the same as last year. Those guys on 1 year deals didn't have a team option, so it was a bit silly to try and rehab Mudiay for example only most likely let him walk. Most of the guys on the team have the team option for 2020-21, and with a horrible FA class that summer, there is no reason why we wouldn't exercise those options. Only Morris really has a one year deal with no real shot or incentive to sign him to a long term deal.

blueNorange wrote:

DaT WaVeY RiCaN wrote:

K-DOT wrote:I keep comparing Fiz to Mike Tomlin for the Steelers

Yeah, players love him and he has great relationships, but when it comes down to actually playing the game, he needs high end talent to carry him, and even then they usually underperform. That's why the Steelers have never been able to get past the Patriots, hell, Tomlin even got outcoached in 2017 by Doug Marrone who isn't even a good coach

Fiz's style is gonna put a hard cap on the level of team success we have. He really needs Heatles level talent to win

Sent from my SM-G965U using RealGM mobile app

Bro we havent even seen Fiz vision in fill effect yet. When he was in Memphis that team was already established.

Last year was clearly a throwaway season. Now this roster is all Pills and Fiz vision. We can’t really judge him until this season.

last year was filled with a lot of guys on 1 year deals.

this year this team is filled with a lot of guys on 1 year deals.

it's going to be the same chit, different season.

Lol I dont see it that way. Last year we knew we had to tank since KP had a pretty serious injury. I think the plan all along was to sit him out all year and tank so we can get another young star (Zion) to play with KP. Obviously the KP plans changed.

Last season just felt more like a tryout season more than anything. We see who we wanted for the future (Mitch,Zo, Knox) Also hopefully Frank is in our long term plans. Now we got rid of all the replaceable guys and replaced em with better players.

Now we have an actual respectable Nba roster. We started Trey Burke, Tim Hardaway Jr and Noah Vonlegh last season. Lmao its not really that hard to comprehend that Fiz and Mills realized this roster is trash and that we needed to tank.

You think they dont see all that hate amongst nba fans and the media? I think we know we have to actually try to win now. No more tanking.

Dot doesnt every coach need "Heatles" level talent or similar to win a title or come close? Look at the last 5 years conference championship participants rosters, especially in the West. And in the East, at bare minimum, it took having at least 3 top 50 guys on those Hawks teams.

Coaching ain't chit without talent and i dont think we can make a full conclusion on Fiz when he's really only had 1 full season with competent talent on the floor for him. It's possible he may not have elevated last year's squad but what was the realistic ceiling of last year's team anyway? Any better than the record indicates? I highly doubt that considering almost everyone who left the team signed for a near minimum contract this summer..

lol excuses for fiz, so far he's been god awful as a coach.

if he didn't really "coach" anything last year then that shows he's a loser and not right for the job. he was brought here only because he's popular amongst the free agents and nothing to do with his coaching ability.

blueNorange wrote:lol excuses for fiz, so far he's been god awful as a coach.

if he didn't really "coach" anything last year then that shows he's a loser and not right for the job. he was brought here only because he's popular amongst the free agents and nothing to do with his coaching ability.

How do you what he was brought here for?

Knicksfan1992 wrote:Dot doesnt every coach need "Heatles" level talent or similar to win a title or come close? Look at the last 5 years conference championship participants rosters, especially in the West. And in the East, at bare minimum, it took having at least 3 top 50 guys on those Hawks teams.

Coaching ain't chit without talent and i dont think we can make a full conclusion on Fiz when he's really only had 1 full season with competent talent on the floor for him. It's possible he may not have elevated last year's squad but what was the realistic ceiling of last year's team anyway? Any better than the record indicates? I highly doubt that considering almost everyone who left the team signed for a near minimum contract this summer..

Obviously talent is the most important thing, especially in the NBA

But if you have a bad coach, going into a 7 game series you have to be the more talented team by a fair margin, where a good coach will win a series with equal talent or even lesser talent

I think you shouldn't settle on a coach because during the playoffs, it can matter. I'm not judging Fiz on record, but on what I saw in games. You can say he was tanking, but that's 50/50. His coaching style was the same in Memphis as last year, so I lean towards that's just who he is. He could get away with that stuff more in Memphis cause they had a PG who knew how to run an offense extremely well, and the guys had played together for years to develop that chemistry and would hold themselves accountable on defense, none of which applies to us

I didn't see him do anything last year that would translate into us winning more games when we're trying. He's not the worst coach in the league, but unless the plan is to beat every other team over the head with superior talent, we're gonna need a better coach to get the team to reach its potential

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DaT WaVeY RiCaN wrote:

blueNorange wrote:lol excuses for fiz, so far he's been god awful as a coach.

if he didn't really "coach" anything last year then that shows he's a loser and not right for the job. he was brought here only because he's popular amongst the free agents and nothing to do with his coaching ability.

How do you what he was brought here for?

he wasn't brought in because he's a good x's and o's guy.

he was brought in because of that quote from dsj.

I think some of you guys expected to much from a trash ass roster last season

DaT WaVeY RiCaN wrote:

K-DOT wrote:

Jeff Van Gully wrote:
word. no one questions fiz as a people person. he seems to have true leadership skills. we need to also see the basketball acumen. it's like two wings on a plane. you absolutely need both these days. we recognize the day of the curmudgeonous hardass coach is gone. but you can't not have the Xs and Os. as excited as i was to get fiz, i am highly alarmed by what i saw last season and am really hoping that was a function of the tank.

I keep comparing Fiz to Mike Tomlin for the Steelers

Yeah, players love him and he has great relationships, but when it comes down to actually playing the game, he needs high end talent to carry him, and even then they usually underperform. That's why the Steelers have never been able to get past the Patriots, hell, Tomlin even got outcoached in 2017 by Doug Marrone who isn't even a good coach

Fiz's style is gonna put a hard cap on the level of team success we have. He really needs Heatles level talent to win

Sent from my SM-G965U using RealGM mobile app

Bro we havent even seen Fiz vision in fill effect yet. When he was in Memphis that team was already established.

Last year was clearly a throwaway season. Now this roster is all Pills and Fiz vision. We can’t really judge him until this season.

That doesn't explain playing Emmanuel Effing Mudiay like he was the second coming of Walt Jesus Frazier!

K-DOT wrote:

Knicksfan1992 wrote:Dot doesnt every coach need "Heatles" level talent or similar to win a title or come close? Look at the last 5 years conference championship participants rosters, especially in the West. And in the East, at bare minimum, it took having at least 3 top 50 guys on those Hawks teams.

Coaching ain't chit without talent and i dont think we can make a full conclusion on Fiz when he's really only had 1 full season with competent talent on the floor for him. It's possible he may not have elevated last year's squad but what was the realistic ceiling of last year's team anyway? Any better than the record indicates? I highly doubt that considering almost everyone who left the team signed for a near minimum contract this summer..

Obviously talent is the most important thing, especially in the NBA

But if you have a bad coach, going into a 7 game series you have to be the more talented team by a fair margin, where a good coach will win a series with equal talent or even lesser talent

I think you shouldn't settle on a coach because during the playoffs, it can matter. I'm not judging Fiz on record, but on what I saw in games. You can say he was tanking, but that's 50/50. His coaching style was the same in Memphis as last year, so I lean towards that's just who he is. He could get away with that stuff more in Memphis cause they had a PG who knew how to run an offense extremely well, and the guys had played together for years to develop that chemistry and would hold themselves accountable on defense, none of which applies to us

I didn't see him do anything last year that would translate into us winning more games when we're trying. He's not the worst coach in the league, but unless the plan is to beat every other team over the head with superior talent, we're gonna need a better coach to get the team to reach its potential

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The Fizdale I saw last season was a worse version of Mike Woodson who is not a good coach. If we see us playing like a Ruckers League offense I hope they fire him by mid-season.

I cant judge Fiz on last season because I wanted them to tank as hard as possibly. Mission accomplished, just the lotto balls didn't take care their end of the deal.

This year I do think he has more to work with so I do expect more from a win loss standpoint. I do also think the team will compete a little better than last due to acquisitions and internal growth.

For me Fiz will be judged on a 30 win projectory that I do think they'll reach.