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Thoughts on aggressive pursuit of Fred Van Vleet & Joe Harris/Davis Bertans

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Thoughts on aggressive pursuit of Fred Van Vleet & Joe Harris/Davis Bertans 

Post#1 » by Zerostatic » Fri Aug 21, 2020 12:07 am

What if we declined all of our player options and offered big long term deals to Fred Van Vleet and an elite shooter (Joe Harris or Davis Bertans)?

This would take us out of next year's free agency sweet stakes but would make us much better this year as those players would be perfect fits next to RJ and Mitch. Also with our youngsters, Mav's picks, or own picks we'd have enough ammo to make a package similar to the priciest of the superstar deals that just took place (Anthony Davis and Paul George) so we could be in the running for any disgruntled star that wants out (i.e. Kat, Bradley Beal, etc.).

Thoughts?
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Re: Thoughts on aggressive pursuit of Fred Van Vleet & Joe Harris/Davis Bertans 

Post#2 » by Hes_On_Fire » Fri Aug 21, 2020 12:30 am

Zerostatic wrote:What if we declined all of our player options and offered big long term deals to Fred Van Vleet and an elite shooter (Joe Harris or Davis Bertans)?

This would take us out of next year's free agency sweet stakes but would make us much better this year as those players would be perfect fits next to RJ and Mitch. Also with our youngsters, Mav's picks, or own picks we'd have enough ammo to make a package similar to the priciest of the superstar deals that just took place (Anthony Davis and Paul George) so we could be in the running for any disgruntled star that wants out (i.e. Kat, Bradley Beal, etc.).

Thoughts?


All this would do is put us back on track as a treadmill team. The Mavs pick(s) don’t seem to be enough of an asset to be depending on in terms of it getting you value in a trade.

Not to mention that Harris and Bertrand are role players that will be demanding to be paid more than they’re worth.

I think the only smart play here is to build through the draft. The problem is adding role players like this (Van Vleet is an upgrade but we will still be adding a role player to a premiere position that we’ve been unable to fill since Clyde left) will only give us worse draft picks, which would lessen the value of our picks if we decide to trade them or lessen the opportunity of picking at the top of the draft again, which is where you typically find those franchises-changing talents.
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Re: Thoughts on aggressive pursuit of Fred Van Vleet & Joe Harris/Davis Bertans 

Post#3 » by Oscirus » Fri Aug 21, 2020 12:35 am

We absolutlely need a shooter next year. But its gonna cost a pretty penny to lure those guys from playoff teams to come here.
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Re: Thoughts on aggressive pursuit of Fred Van Vleet & Joe Harris/Davis Bertans 

Post#4 » by Sark » Fri Aug 21, 2020 1:39 am

We really need to build from the ground up, and not pursue pricey free agents. All that would do is keep us right at that fringe level of team, where we might have a chance at the 8 seed if things all go our way but with no real chance at being a good team.
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Re: Thoughts on aggressive pursuit of Fred Van Vleet & Joe Harris/Davis Bertans 

Post#5 » by El Poochio » Fri Aug 21, 2020 1:42 am

None of them should fit our ideal timeline

No players over 23 should be allowed
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Re: Thoughts on aggressive pursuit of Fred Van Vleet & Joe Harris/Davis Bertans 

Post#6 » by NoLayupRule » Fri Aug 21, 2020 1:46 am

as always its all or nothing

I think Van Fleet has been amazing but I dont offer a massive contract to a guy that size in the NBA
nope

plus hes not leaving
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Re: Thoughts on aggressive pursuit of Fred Van Vleet & Joe Harris/Davis Bertans 

Post#7 » by Synciere » Fri Aug 21, 2020 1:47 am

We do need some shooting but I don’t like any of those guys to give big money deals to.
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Re: Thoughts on aggressive pursuit of Fred Van Vleet & Joe Harris/Davis Bertans 

Post#8 » by NY 567 » Fri Aug 21, 2020 2:19 am

Aggressive pursuing role players is what Scott Layden and Isiah Thomas did and what started our 20 plus year reign of mediocrity.
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Re: Thoughts on aggressive pursuit of Fred Van Vleet & Joe Harris/Davis Bertans 

Post#9 » by GONYK » Fri Aug 21, 2020 2:21 am

We should absolutely be pursuing those players on the shortest deals they would accept.

They will elevate the team and will be tradeable if needed.

Shooting is hard to find, but it makes everything easier in terms of roster construction.

FVV is also a worthwhile talent on his own.
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Re: Thoughts on aggressive pursuit of Fred Van Vleet & Joe Harris/Davis Bertans 

Post#10 » by Oscirus » Fri Aug 21, 2020 2:33 am

If we could give them one of those deals from last year, that would legit be awesome
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Re: Thoughts on aggressive pursuit of Fred Van Vleet & Joe Harris/Davis Bertans 

Post#11 » by Zerostatic » Fri Aug 21, 2020 2:44 am

Thanks for the feedback and I get where most of you are coming from however I really think it's a mistake to try and develop our two top young players (RJ and Mitch) on a team lacking the most important thing both of them need to maximize their games (shooting). They both need spacing to be effective and we are not giving it to them. Unless we trade for it, how else are we going to get shooting? This draft does not have any elite shooters. Our young players don't project to become great shooters.

I guess if we really want to keep the cap flexibility we could sign someone like Danillo Gallinari to a big 1 year deal (ala what Philly used to do with Reddick). I'm not sure who else is out there that would take this kind of deal. I doubt FVV would do this. Joe Harris and Davis Bertans might do 1 year deals but we'd have to be giving an insane amount to have them agree to that.
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Re: Thoughts on aggressive pursuit of Fred Van Vleet & Joe Harris/Davis Bertans 

Post#12 » by moocow007 » Fri Aug 21, 2020 4:14 am

FVV is not the type of player the Knicks need to be looking to lock up with max contacts. He's a great fit and a quality player on a team that's already built to win. That ain't the Knicks. He'd struggle to carry the load the Knicks would need a max cat to carry and...because he's not that type of player...fail and get the Bob Barker treatment when Knicks fans who should have already known what he can and can't do somehow become surprised when he can't do what the wanted and needed him to. Same with Bertans and Harris unless you can get them for cheap. There is only one guy on the Raptors that has the potential to significantly move the needle if he were a Knick and its not FVV. Since there's no way the Knicks can get that guy, the other guys the Knicks may be able to acquire in a trade is OG Anunoby. Thats really the only other Raptor that would make sense for this team.

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Re: Thoughts on aggressive pursuit of Fred Van Vleet & Joe Harris/Davis Bertans 

Post#13 » by sol537 » Fri Aug 21, 2020 4:18 am

Draft Vassel and get FVV on a fair deal that doesn’t compromise 2021 max slot and I’m ok with it. Just adding those two would make us light years more competitive.
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Re: Thoughts on aggressive pursuit of Fred Van Vleet & Joe Harris/Davis Bertans 

Post#14 » by knickstape21 » Fri Aug 21, 2020 4:19 am

Absolutely not. Stay the course. Develop the young players. Play for 2021 loaded draft and loaded FA.
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Re: Thoughts on aggressive pursuit of Fred Van Vleet & Joe Harris/Davis Bertans 

Post#15 » by spree2kawhi » Fri Aug 21, 2020 5:39 am

They are interesting targets, but I don't think you should get three of them. I'd like two, or maybe even only FVV. The outcome would be an average team and this has more to do with who's there already rather than who you add as the reality is that, sadly, RJ doesn't look like a guy who can carry a team, but also not like a good enough shooter to be a top level role player. He's stuck in between and that's how far we'll go.
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Re: Thoughts on aggressive pursuit of Fred Van Vleet & Joe Harris/Davis Bertans 

Post#16 » by thebuzzardman » Fri Aug 21, 2020 9:45 am

At this point, draft Vessel and sign Jerami Grant. Development of RJ and Mitch, boosting useful role player base. Try again and fail again in draft next year
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Re: Thoughts on aggressive pursuit of Fred Van Vleet & Joe Harris/Davis Bertans 

Post#17 » by -YogiBiz- » Fri Aug 21, 2020 10:00 am

No love for Juancho. Sad. I think we should try and snatch him from Minny
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Re: Thoughts on aggressive pursuit of Fred Van Vleet & Joe Harris/Davis Bertans 

Post#18 » by thebuzzardman » Fri Aug 21, 2020 10:29 am

spree2kawhi wrote:They are interesting targets, but I don't think you should get three of them. I'd like two, or maybe even only FVV. The outcome would be an average team and this has more to do with who's there already rather than who you add as the reality is that, sadly, RJ doesn't look like a guy who can carry a team, but also not like a good enough shooter to be a top level role player. He's stuck in between and that's how far we'll go.


Agreed. All interesting targets, all needed in one way or another. I'd add in Jerami Grant as well.

Which one do they need the most? Depends on who they draft.

If Vessel, then not Harris

If the Knicks decide to draft a PG, even if it's one that can shoot, then they'd still need to fill shooting at SG and PF

I'd say add one of these players or players like them, but only one or two and the cheapest one or two, use some money to take on sh*t contract(s) for draft picks, ideally one more in this year's draft and another in the next two years.

Having 3 picks in this draft means the Knicks could strategically move up a few spots, and I mean say if they get another pick and it's at...19, but there is a player still on the board at 17, they could burn the #27 pick but get that guy Perrin had ID'd as THE guy they want with the 2nd pick.

I don't think the Knicks would be able to package picks\players (lol) to move up for Melo, even if he slides to 3 or 4
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Re: Thoughts on aggressive pursuit of Fred Van Vleet & Joe Harris/Davis Bertans 

Post#19 » by thebuzzardman » Fri Aug 21, 2020 10:29 am

-YogiBiz- wrote:No love for Juancho. Sad. I think we should try and snatch him from Minny



IF Minny drafts Edwards, wouldn't that make Beasley or Rancho more available?
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Re: Thoughts on aggressive pursuit of Fred Van Vleet & Joe Harris/Davis Bertans 

Post#20 » by -YogiBiz- » Fri Aug 21, 2020 11:10 am

thebuzzardman wrote:
-YogiBiz- wrote:No love for Juancho. Sad. I think we should try and snatch him from Minny



IF Minny drafts Edwards, wouldn't that make Beasley or Rancho more available?


I think they're trading for Booker. So they'll probably S&T Beasley.

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