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Mitchell Robinson - Rim runners and the playoffs.

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Mitchell Robinson - Rim runners and the playoffs. 

Post#1 » by NoDopeOnSundays » Mon Aug 31, 2020 11:29 pm

I have to start out by saying I like Mitch and he's been a nice surprise, however a lot of people on here keep saying he could be like Gobert and whether that's true or not remains to be seen. What we do know is that right now Mitch is strictly a rim runner on offense much like Gobert, but we should be watching what's happening with Gobert as a cautionary tale. The entire scope of the series changed, not just because Jamal Murray has turned into a NBA 2k demigod, it's also because Mike Malone made the adjustment with Jokic taking more threes, he's up to 7 a game now on 49%. What that does is neutralizes Goberts defense pulling him from the hoop, and on the other end Gobert's lack of any real offensive skills or shooting kills their spacing. Gobert doesn't have any kind of offense to go at Jokic on the other end, no moves, no handle, no shooting, he literally just relies on putbacks and being set up.


Will Mitch develop into a better offensive player than Gobert? Does anyone here think he will be able to develop a consistent 3 pointer? I'm asking these questions because when Mitch starts, he will definitely put up some big numbers, which will lead to the big contract. I have reservations about that because I'm watching what's happening with Gobert, and because I've seen this movie before with DeAndre Jordan, Steven Adams, Clint Capella and Andre Drummond. I personally do not think you can have a defensive rim runner as a foundational piece of a team in todays NBA, you're better off finding a vet minimum guy to do that job like the Lakers, or a guy on a reasonable short term deal like the Clippers. If one of these rim runner types is taking up a substantial part of your cap you're not winning anything, they are fools gold during the regular season and liabilities in the playoffs when you're essentially playing 4 on 5 on offense.

I know we're not used to having young talent, and the immediate reaction is that we can't trade Mitch, but this is forward thinking and looking at where the league is going. If you told me Mitch would develop into a 35-38% three point shooter or an exceptional passer like Bam Adebayo I'd say keep him, but I can't help to think the player type he represents is a dying breed. If he is Gobert 2.0, I don't want that, because that always leads to the same place which.
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Re: Mitchell Robinson - Rim runners and the playoffs. 

Post#2 » by RHODEY » Mon Aug 31, 2020 11:34 pm

NoDopeOnSundays wrote:I have to start out by saying I like Mitch and he's been a nice surprise, however a lot of people on here keep saying he could be like Gobert and whether that's true or not remains to be seen. What we do know is that right now Mitch is strictly a rim runner on offense much like Gobert, but we should be watching what's happening with Gobert as a cautionary tale. The entire scope of the series changed, not just because Jamal Murray has turned into a NBA 2k demigod, it's also because Mike Malone made the adjustment with Jokic taking more threes, he's up to 7 a game now on 49%. What that does is neutralizes Goberts defense pulling him from the hoop, and on the other end Gobert's lack of any real offensive skills or shooting kills their spacing. Gobert doesn't have any kind of offense to go at Jokic on the other end, no moves, no handle, no shooting, he literally just relies on putbacks and being set up.


Will Mitch develop into a better offensive player than Gobert? Does anyone here think he will be able to develop a consistent 3 pointer? I'm asking these questions because when Mitch starts, he will definitely put up some big numbers, which will lead to the big contract. I have reservations about that because I'm watching what's happening with Gobert, and because I've seen this movie before with DeAndre Jordan, Steven Adams, Clint Capella and Andre Drummond. I personally do not think you can have a defensive rim runner as a foundational piece of a team in todays NBA, you're better off finding a vet minimum guy to do that job like the Lakers, or a guy on a reasonable short term deal like the Clippers. If one of these rim runner types is taking up a substantial part of your cap you're not winning anything, they are fools gold during the regular season and liabilities in the playoffs when you're essentially playing 4 on 5 on offense.

I know we're not used to having young talent, and the immediate reaction is that we can't trade Mitch, but this is forward thinking and looking at where the league is going. If you told me Mitch would develop into a 35-38% three point shooter or an exceptional passer like Bam Adebayo I'd say keep him, but I can't help to think the player type he represents is a dying breed. If he is Gobert 2.0, I don't want that, because that always leads to the same place which.


He's better than Gobert was his age. He just broke Wilt Chamberlain record. Lets see what we got before putting any limitations on him.
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Re: Mitchell Robinson - Rim runners and the playoffs. 

Post#3 » by NoDopeOnSundays » Mon Aug 31, 2020 11:38 pm

RHODEY wrote:
NoDopeOnSundays wrote:I have to start out by saying I like Mitch and he's been a nice surprise, however a lot of people on here keep saying he could be like Gobert and whether that's true or not remains to be seen. What we do know is that right now Mitch is strictly a rim runner on offense much like Gobert, but we should be watching what's happening with Gobert as a cautionary tale. The entire scope of the series changed, not just because Jamal Murray has turned into a NBA 2k demigod, it's also because Mike Malone made the adjustment with Jokic taking more threes, he's up to 7 a game now on 49%. What that does is neutralizes Goberts defense pulling him from the hoop, and on the other end Gobert's lack of any real offensive skills or shooting kills their spacing. Gobert doesn't have any kind of offense to go at Jokic on the other end, no moves, no handle, no shooting, he literally just relies on putbacks and being set up.


Will Mitch develop into a better offensive player than Gobert? Does anyone here think he will be able to develop a consistent 3 pointer? I'm asking these questions because when Mitch starts, he will definitely put up some big numbers, which will lead to the big contract. I have reservations about that because I'm watching what's happening with Gobert, and because I've seen this movie before with DeAndre Jordan, Steven Adams, Clint Capella and Andre Drummond. I personally do not think you can have a defensive rim runner as a foundational piece of a team in todays NBA, you're better off finding a vet minimum guy to do that job like the Lakers, or a guy on a reasonable short term deal like the Clippers. If one of these rim runner types is taking up a substantial part of your cap you're not winning anything, they are fools gold during the regular season and liabilities in the playoffs when you're essentially playing 4 on 5 on offense.

I know we're not used to having young talent, and the immediate reaction is that we can't trade Mitch, but this is forward thinking and looking at where the league is going. If you told me Mitch would develop into a 35-38% three point shooter or an exceptional passer like Bam Adebayo I'd say keep him, but I can't help to think the player type he represents is a dying breed. If he is Gobert 2.0, I don't want that, because that always leads to the same place which.


He's better than Gobert was his age. He just broke Wilt Chamberlain record. Lets see what we got before putting any limitations on him.


67% of his shots were assisted and at the same age 67% of Gobert's shots were assisted, the number of assisted shots will up when he plays with starters, and the FG percentage will come down.

DeAndre Jordan used to be in the low 70% as well, I don't care about records in relation to Wilt when Wilt was creating for himself. This is actually why I'm worried, people pointing to things like this, I need context in how he scores and whether or not he can space the floor eventually. I don't think he will be able to.
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Re: Mitchell Robinson - Rim runners and the playoffs. 

Post#4 » by 3toheadmelo » Mon Aug 31, 2020 11:38 pm

If Wiseman somehow drops to us, you take him and trade Mitch.
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Re: Mitchell Robinson - Rim runners and the playoffs. 

Post#5 » by Clyde_Style » Mon Aug 31, 2020 11:43 pm

Mitch is way more talented than Gobert. He has accomplished everything so far with no college and mostly terrible coaching.

With his upside and potential expansion of his skill set, Mitch represents a premium bet for further development into a true franchise center.

No center has the defensive range of Robinson except maybe Giannis. And look at GA's offensive game. He didn't have anything resembling an outside game in his first seasons and look at him now.

Way premature to think Mitch is not worth betting on.
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Re: Mitchell Robinson - Rim runners and the playoffs. 

Post#6 » by NYKnickerbocker » Mon Aug 31, 2020 11:45 pm

How many jokics will Mitch be running into in the east!
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Re: Mitchell Robinson - Rim runners and the playoffs. 

Post#7 » by NoDopeOnSundays » Mon Aug 31, 2020 11:50 pm

Clyde_Style wrote:Mitch is way more talented than Gobert. He has accomplished everything so far with no college and mostly terrible coaching.

With his upside and potential expansion of his skill set, Mitch represents a premium bet for further development into a true franchise center.

No center has the defensive range of Robinson except maybe Giannis. And look at GA's offensive game. He didn't have anything resembling an outside game in his first seasons and look at him now.

Way premature to think Mitch is not worth betting on.



I don't see how he's more talented than Gobert, you look enough and you'll see videos of Gobert hitting threes in practice. All of Gobert's defensive stats were showing he was elite even when he wasn't playing.

I disagree wholeheartedly too, Bam Adebayo is an elite defensive player and a year older than Mitch, the difference is Bam is an exceptional passer for his position. Come on man, we shouldn't be comparing him to Giannis in any shape or fashion offensively.


It's never too early to think about how a players progression will look, he's not a good freethrow shooter, so I don't see how he develops a 3.
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Re: Mitchell Robinson - Rim runners and the playoffs. 

Post#8 » by NoDopeOnSundays » Mon Aug 31, 2020 11:53 pm

NYKnickerbocker wrote:How many jokics will Mitch be running into in the east!



You don't need to run into Jokic, Brad Stevens is still in the east and has absolutely no respect for rim running centers, neither does Nurse or Spoelstra who will run a zone.


The future of the NBA is heading in the Rockets and Celtics direction, you can neutralize rim runners simply by switching on screens if you have enough wings. Steven Adams is almost unplayable against the Rockets.
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Re: Mitchell Robinson - Rim runners and the playoffs. 

Post#9 » by Capn'O » Mon Aug 31, 2020 11:56 pm

I think everybody knows what I want to post here.
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Re: Mitchell Robinson - Rim runners and the playoffs. 

Post#10 » by Clyde_Style » Mon Aug 31, 2020 11:58 pm

NoDopeOnSundays wrote:
Clyde_Style wrote:Mitch is way more talented than Gobert. He has accomplished everything so far with no college and mostly terrible coaching.

With his upside and potential expansion of his skill set, Mitch represents a premium bet for further development into a true franchise center.

No center has the defensive range of Robinson except maybe Giannis. And look at GA's offensive game. He didn't have anything resembling an outside game in his first seasons and look at him now.

Way premature to think Mitch is not worth betting on.



I don't see how he's more talented than Gobert, you look enough and you'll see videos of Gobert hitting threes in practice. All of Gobert's defensive stats were showing he was elite even when he wasn't playing.

I disagree wholeheartedly too, Bam Adebayo is an elite defensive player and a year older than Mitch, the difference is Bam is an exceptional passer for his position. Come on man, we shouldn't be comparing him to Giannis in any shape or fashion offensively.


It's never too early to think about how a players progression will look, he's not a good freethrow shooter, so I don't see how he develops a 3.


Mitch's physical abilities are pretty astounding. I see nothing about Gobert that compares in regards to athletic talent. And we've all seen Mitch stroke threes in practice too.

And I was not comparing to Mitch to GA. I was saying GA had no outside game and now he does and it took him years in the league to get there. I'd say Mitch has some time to expand his arsenal. But in terms of defensive range, Mitch is the best talent among centers in the NBA aside from Giannis.
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Re: Mitchell Robinson - Rim runners and the playoffs. 

Post#11 » by Manhattan Project » Tue Sep 1, 2020 12:03 am

NoDopeOnSundays wrote:I have to start out by saying I like Mitch and he's been a nice surprise, however a lot of people on here keep saying he could be like Gobert and whether that's true or not remains to be seen. What we do know is that right now Mitch is strictly a rim runner on offense much like Gobert, but we should be watching what's happening with Gobert as a cautionary tale. The entire scope of the series changed, not just because Jamal Murray has turned into a NBA 2k demigod, it's also because Mike Malone made the adjustment with Jokic taking more threes, he's up to 7 a game now on 49%. What that does is neutralizes Goberts defense pulling him from the hoop, and on the other end Gobert's lack of any real offensive skills or shooting kills their spacing. Gobert doesn't have any kind of offense to go at Jokic on the other end, no moves, no handle, no shooting, he literally just relies on putbacks and being set up.


Will Mitch develop into a better offensive player than Gobert? Does anyone here think he will be able to develop a consistent 3 pointer? I'm asking these questions because when Mitch starts, he will definitely put up some big numbers, which will lead to the big contract. I have reservations about that because I'm watching what's happening with Gobert, and because I've seen this movie before with DeAndre Jordan, Steven Adams, Clint Capella and Andre Drummond. I personally do not think you can have a defensive rim runner as a foundational piece of a team in todays NBA, you're better off finding a vet minimum guy to do that job like the Lakers, or a guy on a reasonable short term deal like the Clippers. If one of these rim runner types is taking up a substantial part of your cap you're not winning anything, they are fools gold during the regular season and liabilities in the playoffs when you're essentially playing 4 on 5 on offense.

I know we're not used to having young talent, and the immediate reaction is that we can't trade Mitch, but this is forward thinking and looking at where the league is going. If you told me Mitch would develop into a 35-38% three point shooter or an exceptional passer like Bam Adebayo I'd say keep him, but I can't help to think the player type he represents is a dying breed. If he is Gobert 2.0, I don't want that, because that always leads to the same place which.


Except comparing Mitch Robinson and Rudy Gobert is foolish. The Jazz are built around him as the defensive anchor, Robinson can barely start on a team that sucks. While Robinson is a lot more atheltic than Gobert and can guard out to the perimeter, it wouldn't surprise me if the game plan is to let Jokic shoot three's to beat you. Having Gobert away from the middle exposes the rest of the team, so Jokic shooting three's is the lesser of two evils. The Jazz couldn't stop a nose bleed right now if their lives depend on it, the fact that Murray is on another level just threw a wrench into things. If Murray doesn't go balistic, the Nuggets simply don't have the depth to compete right now. Both teams have injuries that are showing right now in this series with Bogdanovich and Barton. If Murray doesn't score 50 and Jokic misses a few three's, the Nuggets lose. Just got to give credit to Murray for the past few games.

The way the Jazz use Gobert and the way the Knicks use Robinson couldn't be anymore different. Right now Gobert is still light years ahead of Robinson defensively, sure Robinson is flashy and raw, but he still lacks a lot of the fundamentals. You brought up Jordan, he was perfect with lob city because they had Paul and Griffin. Adams was the ultimate teammate to Westbrook, he let him grab the boards as Adams did all the dirty work. Capella, you don't think the Rockets could use him? They're starting Covington at center for crying out loud, that gimmick isn't going to get them nowhere. Drummond has been on the Pistons and well they've been just as bad as a franchise as we are. By the time these guys are getting ready to get paid, odds are they're kind of vital to your success and what you're doing and you just don't let that walk.

Robinson still has to be able to do more than rely on his athleticism and dunk the ball. We've seen the clips of him shooting, he says he's comfortable. However he also still needs to learn how to play defense, he leaves his feet way too often and on bad teams that cost them. He has all the tools/athleticism to be a DPOY candidate, it's up to him now.
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Re: Mitchell Robinson - Rim runners and the playoffs. 

Post#12 » by NoDopeOnSundays » Tue Sep 1, 2020 12:04 am

Clyde_Style wrote:
NoDopeOnSundays wrote:
Clyde_Style wrote:Mitch is way more talented than Gobert. He has accomplished everything so far with no college and mostly terrible coaching.

With his upside and potential expansion of his skill set, Mitch represents a premium bet for further development into a true franchise center.

No center has the defensive range of Robinson except maybe Giannis. And look at GA's offensive game. He didn't have anything resembling an outside game in his first seasons and look at him now.

Way premature to think Mitch is not worth betting on.



I don't see how he's more talented than Gobert, you look enough and you'll see videos of Gobert hitting threes in practice. All of Gobert's defensive stats were showing he was elite even when he wasn't playing.

I disagree wholeheartedly too, Bam Adebayo is an elite defensive player and a year older than Mitch, the difference is Bam is an exceptional passer for his position. Come on man, we shouldn't be comparing him to Giannis in any shape or fashion offensively.


It's never too early to think about how a players progression will look, he's not a good freethrow shooter, so I don't see how he develops a 3.


Mitch's physical abilities are pretty astounding. I see nothing about Gobert that compares in regards to athletic talent. And we've all seen Mitch stroke threes in practice too.

And I was not comparing to Mitch to GA. I was saying GA had no outside game and now he does and it took him years in the league to get there. I'd say Mitch has some time to expand his arsenal. But in terms of defensive range, Mitch is the best talent among centers in the NBA aside from Giannis.


Gobert is a 2 time DPOY, and has been neutralized every year in the playoffs, his defense can't make up the ground that his offense loses. Whether they win or lose tomorrow, he's running into the exact same issues DeAndre Jordan had. Does Mitch project out to being better offensive players than them? Doubtful. Will his defense be enough to offset whatever negative impact he has on offense?

Giannis at 21 was already taking threes and outside shots at 21-22, it's still not comparable. I just don't see the offense coming around that quickly, certainly not anymore than DeAndre Jordan or Rudy. I'd have to say Bam is the best defensive talent that age, he's doing in the playoffs.
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Re: Mitchell Robinson - Rim runners and the playoffs. 

Post#13 » by Clyde_Style » Tue Sep 1, 2020 12:07 am

Capn'O wrote:I think everybody knows what I want to post here.


RESPONSE OPTION # 1:
Spoiler:
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And/Or

RESPONSE OPTION # 2:
Spoiler:
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Re: Mitchell Robinson - Rim runners and the playoffs. 

Post#14 » by Clyde_Style » Tue Sep 1, 2020 12:09 am

NoDopeOnSundays wrote:
Clyde_Style wrote:
NoDopeOnSundays wrote:

I don't see how he's more talented than Gobert, you look enough and you'll see videos of Gobert hitting threes in practice. All of Gobert's defensive stats were showing he was elite even when he wasn't playing.

I disagree wholeheartedly too, Bam Adebayo is an elite defensive player and a year older than Mitch, the difference is Bam is an exceptional passer for his position. Come on man, we shouldn't be comparing him to Giannis in any shape or fashion offensively.


It's never too early to think about how a players progression will look, he's not a good freethrow shooter, so I don't see how he develops a 3.


Mitch's physical abilities are pretty astounding. I see nothing about Gobert that compares in regards to athletic talent. And we've all seen Mitch stroke threes in practice too.

And I was not comparing to Mitch to GA. I was saying GA had no outside game and now he does and it took him years in the league to get there. I'd say Mitch has some time to expand his arsenal. But in terms of defensive range, Mitch is the best talent among centers in the NBA aside from Giannis.


Gobert is a 2 time DPOY, and has been neutralized every year in the playoffs, his defense can't make up the ground that his offense loses. Whether they win or lose tomorrow, he's running into the exact same issues DeAndre Jordan had. Does Mitch project out to being better offensive players than them? Doubtful. Will his defense be enough to offset whatever negative impact he has on offense?

Giannis at 21 was already taking threes and outside shots at 21-22, it's still not comparable. I just don't see the offense coming around that quickly, certainly not anymore than DeAndre Jordan or Rudy. I'd have to say Bam is the best defensive talent that age, he's doing in the playoffs.


SEE ^ REPLY TO CAP ABOVE

I choose Option # 1

and if you try to trade Mitch,

I will also choose Option # 2
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Re: Mitchell Robinson - Rim runners and the playoffs. 

Post#15 » by NoDopeOnSundays » Tue Sep 1, 2020 12:15 am

Clyde_Style wrote:
NoDopeOnSundays wrote:
Clyde_Style wrote:
Mitch's physical abilities are pretty astounding. I see nothing about Gobert that compares in regards to athletic talent. And we've all seen Mitch stroke threes in practice too.

And I was not comparing to Mitch to GA. I was saying GA had no outside game and now he does and it took him years in the league to get there. I'd say Mitch has some time to expand his arsenal. But in terms of defensive range, Mitch is the best talent among centers in the NBA aside from Giannis.


Gobert is a 2 time DPOY, and has been neutralized every year in the playoffs, his defense can't make up the ground that his offense loses. Whether they win or lose tomorrow, he's running into the exact same issues DeAndre Jordan had. Does Mitch project out to being better offensive players than them? Doubtful. Will his defense be enough to offset whatever negative impact he has on offense?

Giannis at 21 was already taking threes and outside shots at 21-22, it's still not comparable. I just don't see the offense coming around that quickly, certainly not anymore than DeAndre Jordan or Rudy. I'd have to say Bam is the best defensive talent that age, he's doing in the playoffs.


SEE ^ REPLY TO CAP ABOVE

I choose Option # 1

and if you try to trade Mitch,

I will also choose Option # 2

He'd be on the first plane out of JFK :lol: and I been training for knife fights

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Re: Mitchell Robinson - Rim runners and the playoffs. 

Post#16 » by RShahNyC89 » Tue Sep 1, 2020 12:17 am

I think Mitch has better hands and might be able to do a bit more if we let him.
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Re: Mitchell Robinson - Rim runners and the playoffs. 

Post#17 » by thebuzzardman » Tue Sep 1, 2020 12:18 am

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Re: Mitchell Robinson - Rim runners and the playoffs. 

Post#18 » by Clyde_Style » Tue Sep 1, 2020 12:20 am

NoDopeOnSundays wrote:
Clyde_Style wrote:
NoDopeOnSundays wrote:
Gobert is a 2 time DPOY, and has been neutralized every year in the playoffs, his defense can't make up the ground that his offense loses. Whether they win or lose tomorrow, he's running into the exact same issues DeAndre Jordan had. Does Mitch project out to being better offensive players than them? Doubtful. Will his defense be enough to offset whatever negative impact he has on offense?

Giannis at 21 was already taking threes and outside shots at 21-22, it's still not comparable. I just don't see the offense coming around that quickly, certainly not anymore than DeAndre Jordan or Rudy. I'd have to say Bam is the best defensive talent that age, he's doing in the playoffs.


SEE ^ REPLY TO CAP ABOVE

I choose Option # 1

and if you try to trade Mitch,

I will also choose Option # 2

He'd be on the first plane out of JFK :lol: and I been training for knife fights

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Re: Mitchell Robinson - Rim runners and the playoffs. 

Post#19 » by Appleshampoo » Tue Sep 1, 2020 12:21 am

This is true. Gobert lack of skillset limits the offense; Tyson Chandler. I'm optimistic about Kenny Payne and Johnnie Bryant. They have history of developing players.. fix up an offensive toolset that fits Mitch.

Robinson with a jump shot and his athleticism is an all-star. A lot like Ben Simmons - the only way to see is to try it. Marc Gasol is about as good at 3's as Bobby Portis. Still good enough for Toronto to space the floor.
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Re: Mitchell Robinson - Rim runners and the playoffs. 

Post#20 » by thebuzzardman » Tue Sep 1, 2020 12:22 am

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