PG: Knicks vs Wizards

[Chanel Bomber]

Here's the dirty secret about Westbrook: he was always a losing player. It's just becoming more obvious.

I disagree with that.

He worked miracles during his MVP season, that team had no business making the playoffs.

He was also good in OKC for a long period of time.

I think his style of play just puts a ceiling on his team, and that ceiling happens to have dropped significantly over the past few years.

A star can get by with a lot during the regular season.

By the time the playoffs rolled around, we all knew Playoff Russ was a problem...and not the good kind.

I mean, OKC did reach the Finals and the Conference Finals with prime Westbrook at the point several times.

Did he hurt his team eventually? Sure, to some extent. But clearly he didn't prevent his team from going far in the playoffs.

After KD left, I think prime Westbrook surrounded by shooters and an elite roll man could've led a team to the 2nd or 3rd round. After all, he did lead OKC to the playoffs with an unimpressive cast.

But against the elite of the elite, I think his game became a problem, for sure.

I just don't think "losing player" applies here. Although I think the combination of his usage and lack of off-ball shooting ability put a ceiling on his teams, which is flexible depending on the cast, age, injuries etc. I do think his ceiling has dropped to the point where he's a losing player today.

[Chanel Bomber]

Play Obi at the 5, and the whole team identity collapses and Thibs loses credibility in front of his players.

It's not reasonable to do that. Like at all.

Obi needs to find ways to help the team, period.

[Clyde_Style]

a lot of this frank stuff is just the "hey, you like a guy a lot that i don't like as much so let me attempt to annoy you about his shortcomings" sh*t that we all participate in. you really can't stop it.

[Tron Carter]

anything happen with mitch this game? or was it that taj was just playing too good?

[prophet_of_rage]

Go for it. All I know is last week he had his best game of the season and it didn't derail the thread. It wasn't 50 pages of Frank.

Nobody is stopping anyone from bringing up Frank, but it's the people who want to bash him that are complaining that the thread has become about him.

I'm just pointing out who bring him up and derails.

Thalt's not really true, though. Both sides bring Frank up. The pro Frank have a tactic about saying it's only the antip-Franks that taplk about him that ignores four years of threads being about him. Look what happened in my thread two years ago about Mitch Robinsin. Mphaprris comes in talking about Frank. So there is a backlash pro Frank fans will have to take and the rest of have to endure.

Sent from my SM-N970W using Tapatalk

If you want to hold a grudge about this board's enthusiasm for Frank, knock yourself out.

All I'm saying is that you can't have your cake and eat it to. Either bring Frank up and be prepared for the board to talk about him or don't.

The anti-Feank doesn't complain when people respond. The pro-Frank raise this argument when they have nothing left. That's the tactic. It's very dishonest.

If you don't like the noise don't answer.

I don't care one way or the other. Frank sucks. People know it. How they cope with it is on them. I'm just glad the truth is out.

Sent from my SM-N970W using Tapatalk

[prophet_of_rage]

enough about frank, hate ande drummond more. mods make it happen.

My new theory is that Drummond, Payton, Oladipo and Wall are the Four Horsemen and that judgment is upon us.

the combination of drummond and payton taking and missing endless shots at the basket will be too much for me. i don't think i can watch too many of these games live if that happens. i'm gonna have to dvr and just watch the good parts.

It will be the greatest. 50 offensive rebounds and 2 points scored! The analytics heads will explode!

Sent from my SM-N970W using Tapatalk

[mpharris36]

I don't know how Rose talked Thibs into Obi, but I can't think of a player Tom must have wanted less with our pick.

That's why they are basically making him a 3. Because Tom will never play him at the 5.

I don't know, I think Obi was kind of the prospect Thibs likes

Older, went to a smaller school, had gaudy numbers, high floor guy (allegedly)

Pretty easy to talk yourself into him being good right away without needing development, which I believe is similar to why Thibs took Dunn 5th over Murray in 2016

Plus if the report is true that Thibs wasn't sold on Randle before the season started (which isn't unrealistic, let's be honest), then it kinda makes sense.

I dont know didn't Thibs personally fly down to see Vassell and Kira. Those seems like more thibs guys. A great defender with shooting potential and a lightening quick guard that gets into the paint.

I mean thibs did love Boozer so there was a chance...but that screamed Leon making a stamp on the org...he even wanted to trade up for him.

[HEZI]

Need more Stinkilikina talk and less hot dog face slapping

Really not helpful.

Helpful with what?

[prophet_of_rage]

Game in two minutes.

Sent from my SM-N970W using Tapatalk

[Jalen Bluntson]

ok....

Must have been rolling your eyes when you were reading that post.

Don't shake your head at me!! dude said Beal never had a legit all star. I replied with John Wall. You responded who never said he was an all star. Obviously... the post you responded to. Come on man!

[Chanel Bomber]

Play Obi at the 5, and the whole team identity collapses and Thibs loses credibility in front of his players.

It's not reasonable to do that. Like at all.

Obi needs to find ways to help the team, period.

Fire post Chanel, you're very wise.

[prophet_of_rage]

a lot of this frank stuff is just the "hey, you like a guy a lot that i don't like as much so let me attempt to annoy you about his shortcomings" sh*t that we all participate in. you really can't stop it.

Feels more malicious both ways.

Sent from my SM-N970W using Tapatalk

[GONYK]

I don't know how Rose talked Thibs into Obi, but I can't think of a player Tom must have wanted less with our pick.

That's why they are basically making him a 3. Because Tom will never play him at the 5.

I don't know, I think Obi was kind of the prospect Thibs likes

Older, went to a smaller school, had gaudy numbers, high floor guy (allegedly)

Pretty easy to talk yourself into him being good right away without needing development, which I believe is similar to why Thibs took Dunn 5th over Murray in 2016

Plus if the report is true that Thibs wasn't sold on Randle before the season started (which isn't unrealistic, let's be honest), then it kinda makes sense.

I dont know didn't Thibs personally fly down to see Vassell and Kira. Those seems like more thibs guys. A great defender with shooting potential and a lightening quick guard that gets into the paint.

I mean thibs did love Boozer so there was a chance...but that screamed Leon making a stamp on the org...he even wanted to trade up for him.

Isn't it well documented that Thibs did not love Boozer? He certainly never played him when the game really mattered.

That was Taj time.

[j4remi]

Read on Twitter

I really enjoyed that win last night...hated 3 quarters of it, but that just made the victory at the end sweet. I imagine it's a microcosm of what a Knicks championship would feel like. Decades of mostly subpar basketball that turn into pure euphoria.

Anyway, lots of Gibson and Barrett love. Mitch got too amped is my theory, because he was shaky. Payton and Frank were bad. Randle did that thing legit stars do where they can miss a ton of shots but then make the big baskets when the game is on the line. This was a fun one to write-up.

[Deeeez Knicks]

a lot of this frank stuff is just the "hey, you like a guy a lot that i don't like as much so let me attempt to annoy you about his shortcomings" sh*t that we all participate in. you really can't stop it.

Should have expected an insufferable thread after this game. melo curse strikes again.

[god shammgod]

a lot of this frank stuff is just the "hey, you like a guy a lot that i don't like as much so let me attempt to annoy you about his shortcomings" sh*t that we all participate in. you really can't stop it.

Feels more malicious both ways.

Sent from my SM-N970W using Tapatalk

does it ? i don't know. it's just part of how this place operates. we participate in extreme hyperbole as much as nuanced analysis and frankly that's what makes this place good. the combination of both. frank is not the first guy to get this treatment and he won't be the last.

[3toheadmelo]

a lot of this frank stuff is just the "hey, you like a guy a lot that i don't like as much so let me attempt to annoy you about his shortcomings" sh*t that we all participate in. you really can't stop it.

Should have expected an insufferable thread after this game. melo curse strikes again.

glad to hear you're suffering

[3toheadmelo]

Read on Twitter

[mpharris36]

I don't know, I think Obi was kind of the prospect Thibs likes

Older, went to a smaller school, had gaudy numbers, high floor guy (allegedly)

Pretty easy to talk yourself into him being good right away without needing development, which I believe is similar to why Thibs took Dunn 5th over Murray in 2016

Plus if the report is true that Thibs wasn't sold on Randle before the season started (which isn't unrealistic, let's be honest), then it kinda makes sense.

I dont know didn't Thibs personally fly down to see Vassell and Kira. Those seems like more thibs guys. A great defender with shooting potential and a lightening quick guard that gets into the paint.

I mean thibs did love Boozer so there was a chance...but that screamed Leon making a stamp on the org...he even wanted to trade up for him.

Isn't it well documented that Thibs did not love Boozer? He certainly never played him when the game really mattered.

That was Taj time.

He just stuck around a long time in CHI (4 years) if he disliked him so much. But it always did feel that Thibs trusted Taj more in crunch time.

[Deeeez Knicks]

a lot of this frank stuff is just the "hey, you like a guy a lot that i don't like as much so let me attempt to annoy you about his shortcomings" sh*t that we all participate in. you really can't stop it.

Should have expected an insufferable thread after this game. melo curse strikes again.

glad to hear you're suffering

Thank you. After a great come back win i needed it. Can't have too many moments of joy around here