OT: Cops shoot and kill Daunte Wright

[HarthorneWingo]

Do you know how much money we could save by reducing the police force while making it more specialized and adding other specialized local government departments handle those things that cops aren’t equipped to do.

A lot. My work has a lot of interface with cops. Everyone on the force I know would rather be putting their time and resources into more impactful work that would cater more to their specific level of expertise. Like, busting actual criminal activity.

Right! Do police work. Investigate crimes. If someone has barricaded themselves, call in a SWAT team. Don't go in after them guns a-blazing?

Why would a cop want to deal with a mentally ill and/or drugged out zombie who they don't even want to understand? Let the professionals in those areas take the lead. If police backup is necessary fine, but let the professionals call the shots.

And traffic stops are the most scary for officers. They'll tell you that and I believe it. Makes total sense. That's why we eliminate the vehicle stops. We just these camera geeks in unmarked cars taking photos and information regarding the traffic violation. If there's an accident and people are injured, then the traffic officers and EMT respond with police as backup. Traffic and EMT control the scene.

We just have re-imagine what a new public safety department would look like. But they've been on this power trip ever since Reagan and, especially, since 9/11.

[KnicksGod]

Sweet move by Elf lol.

Sorry for this - misplaced post from the GT.

[HighRyzer83]

Cops are out of control but hiring tiny male and female cops who can't handle themselves and aren't well trained not helping either

Now your thinking logically despite the overwhelming PC wave recently. Thinking logically sometimes means overruling the diversity aspect of equal opportunity, such as this case with females in such a field, will undoubtedly upset the SWJs and call into question the aspect of competition.

[SelbyCobra]

Guys, guys, I think we need to take some focus off the officer here. She was obviously an overmatched rookie female who wasn't trained properly, and shouldn't have been put in that situation to...

...hold on, I'm getting an update

*touches earpiece*

Read on Twitter

(To be clear none of this mattered at all to me regarding what happened to Daunte Wright, but it certainly illustrates the ridiculousness of police culture in this country that much more clearly)

[Spot31]

Do you know how much money we could save by reducing the police force while making it more specialized and adding other specialized local government departments handle those things that cops aren’t equipped to do.

A lot. My work has a lot of interface with cops. Everyone on the force I know would rather be putting their time and resources into more impactful work that would cater more to their specific level of expertise. Like, busting actual criminal activity.

Right! Do police work. Investigate crimes. If someone has barricaded themselves, call in a SWAT team. Don't go in after them guns a-blazing?

Why would a cop want to deal with a mentally ill and/or drugged out zombie who they don't even want to understand? Let the professionals in those areas take the lead. If police backup is necessary fine, but let the professionals call the shots.

And traffic stops are the most scary for officers. They'll tell you that and I believe it. Makes total sense. That's why we eliminate the vehicle stops. We just these camera geeks in unmarked cars taking photos and information regarding the traffic violation. If there's an accident and people are injured, then the traffic officers and EMT respond with police as backup. Traffic and EMT control the scene.

We just have re-imagine what a new public safety department would look like. But they've been on this power trip ever since Reagan and, especially, since 9/11.

What about stolen vehicles and cars with fake temporary plates doing drive-by shootings? How do we mail photo tickets to unregistered vehicles?

[HarthorneWingo]

A lot. My work has a lot of interface with cops. Everyone on the force I know would rather be putting their time and resources into more impactful work that would cater more to their specific level of expertise. Like, busting actual criminal activity.

Right! Do police work. Investigate crimes. If someone has barricaded themselves, call in a SWAT team. Don't go in after them guns a-blazing?

Why would a cop want to deal with a mentally ill and/or drugged out zombie who they don't even want to understand? Let the professionals in those areas take the lead. If police backup is necessary fine, but let the professionals call the shots.

And traffic stops are the most scary for officers. They'll tell you that and I believe it. Makes total sense. That's why we eliminate the vehicle stops. We just these camera geeks in unmarked cars taking photos and information regarding the traffic violation. If there's an accident and people are injured, then the traffic officers and EMT respond with police as backup. Traffic and EMT control the scene.

We just have re-imagine what a new public safety department would look like. But they've been on this power trip ever since Reagan and, especially, since 9/11.

What about stolen vehicles and cars with fake temporary plates doing drive-by shootings? How do we mail photo tickets to unregistered vehicles?

What do police normally do when there's a drive-by shooting? I guess, someone calls 9-1-1. If there's a witness, the information will be provided to police when they arrive. Nothing really changes. Detectives are brought in after the fact, the mobile crime unit cordons off the scene and collects evidence, detectives take witness statements and do their investigation. I'm not taking that part of the police department away. Regular police investigation remain and crimes will be prosecuted. There will still be vice units going after guns and illegal narcotics and economic schemes. But they involve investigations like the feds do. In fact, we could increase the budgets for those units while still saving money and devoting the savings to the specialized units which will, in turn, save the taxpayers of the community money in liability settlements/verdicts. It just makes too much sense. But it's difficult to persuade a lot of people who are not educated on the subject matter to agree to sweeping changes even if they agree with the changes.

Look at what's happening in Ithaca, NY where they are totally dismantling the police department and establishing a new justice system. Camden, NJ remade their entire police department and Camden is one of the most dangerous cities in the country. It's now a model police department.

[HarthorneWingo]

Guys, guys, I think we need to take some focus off the officer here. She was obviously an overmatched rookie female who wasn't trained properly, and shouldn't have been put in that situation to...

...hold on, I'm getting an update

*touches earpiece*

Read on Twitter

(To be clear none of this mattered at all to me regarding what happened to Daunte Wright, but it certainly illustrates the ridiculousness of police culture in this country that much more clearly)

[Rasho Brezec]

My theory is that action movies have desensitized us all to the point we can't comprehend how insanely stressful police work actually is, especially in situations that involve the use of firearms.

Police officers need better training, especially psychological training.

Would there be less unnecessary situations like this if police were trained to be less trigger happy? Probably.

Is such training feasible in a country with the highest gun ownership per capita? Unlikely.

[RShahNyC89]

The idea that someone running from a traffic stop needs to be murdered is mind boggling. In today's day and age there is enough tracking/automation that these people can be found and violations can be enforced (leaving or not stopping forfeits right to fight in court). The only people who should be prevented from leaving by force are murderers and felony assaults (rape +). Even then, the force should be non-lethal if possible. If you can bring in McLovin after a shooting spree at a synagogue or mall or a school, you can bring in a minority the same way.

bUHT jUSt CoMPlY crowd is wylin.

[NYKAL]

Watch the video with the volume up. You can hear the female officer make the deadly mistake.

Horrible but now what?

Just seems crazy to accidentally shoot him but it does sound exactly like that is what happened.

So she is going to be arrested, tried, and convicted of manslaughter cause if not then it doesn’t matter what she thought she was doing. She killed him and will walk.

Oops I killed someone is not an excuse

criminal negligence

[CharlesOakley]

My theory is that action movies have desensitized us all to the point we can't comprehend how insanely stressful police work actually is, especially in situations that involve the use of firearms.

Police officers need better training, especially psychological training.

Would there be less unnecessary situations like this if police were trained to be less trigger happy? Probably.

Is such training feasible in a country with the highest gun ownership per capita? Unlikely.

I have a buddy who has been Portland PD for 20 years. He gets 8 hours of training per year on how to physically detail someone. I train bjj and can tell you that 8 months of training would be reasonable for basic competency. 8 hours of training and the deadly force is your only option.

A normal day for him now is a couple people spitting on him, a couple people trying to bite or hit him, a couple people throwing things at his head and a lot of middle fingers. Somehow my buddy is still a teddy bear but I would think psychological training should be mandatory.

We don't want to pay for the type of police officer we need. Training needs to last two years and involve extensive psychological testing and training. I also would like to see every cop be required to be the equivalent of a bjj blue belt which takes about two years of regular training. Here is the difference when an officer has the right tools to do the job [url]

Watch on YouTube

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[KnicksGod]

The video from Arizona is beyond belief. Like a game of Simon Says with a psychotic person.

[nedleeds]

Do you know how much money we could save by reducing the police force while making it more specialized and adding other specialized local government departments handle those things that cops aren’t equipped to do.

A lot. My work has a lot of interface with cops. Everyone on the force I know would rather be putting their time and resources into more impactful work that would cater more to their specific level of expertise. Like, busting actual criminal activity.

We could save even more if we ended the "war on drugs" at the federal level. Disbanded the DEA and it's multi-billion dollar budget. Disband the ATF and all the other duplicative federal agencies that have grown into a monstrous onion since prohibition. Then local police won't be tasked with enforcing the failed war on drugs. Young men won't go to jail for 5 years for doing something that's legal 2 states over leaving their families behind. The police can focus on violent crime like robberies, rapes, murder and assault. They can walk their beat without the pressure to frisk every person for weed or smack. About half the violent crime in cities is either direct or indirectly the result of drugs. In rural areas it's been rising over the last 10 years as the meth / opioid crisis has grown. Forcing quotas on local cops to enforce federal laws on recreational drug use is a stain on this country and the root of a ton of these problems.

Electing judges and DAs is the other big problem.

[nedleeds]

The idea that someone running from a traffic stop needs to be murdered is mind boggling. In today's day and age there is enough tracking/automation that these people can be found and violations can be enforced (leaving or not stopping forfeits right to fight in court). The only people who should be prevented from leaving by force are murderers and felony assaults (rape +). Even then, the force should be non-lethal if possible. If you can bring in McLovin after a shooting spree at a synagogue or mall or a school, you can bring in a minority the same way.

bUHT jUSt CoMPlY crowd is wylin.

It's not running. It's going back into your car and reaching into your center console.

mAyBe hE doEsNT hAvE a gUN, gUesS i'LL wAiT n' seE !

for your $35k a year your supposed to see if he has a gun or knife in the car? If the dude had straight ran off into the woods he'd probably still be alive. Same with Blake, Blake got killed for digging around on the floor boards and getting back in the car.

[8516knicks]

I've posted a ton of anti-Chavin opinions on here (and the trial is nailing him) and obviously think it's tragic when a 20 year old (or anyone) is killed in a traffic stop (without aggressive behavior). The a**h*le cops in VA assaulting the LT. is just another in a long series of affronts hitting minorites the worst. But in watching the Daunte vid, (and Mr.Floyd's) there's a residual feeling apart from the police violence -- of why they're (the civilians) doing weird stuff and not just following simple directions - like Daunte tearing away as he's about to be handcuffed. Didn't Chris Rock put out a vid on this stuff? I'd be scared **** to do that with cops given their gunner reputations of late. Thought on the other side, I've seen a lot of vids where the cops have to deal with straight-out a**h*les also. Too many idiots all over. However, the time to fight over if cops have the right to arrest you isn't when it's going down (and they can kill you). It's in court. And I also think it's not straight out (Klan type) racism but a combo of several things including economic class, education and cop/superman ego all combining in a witches brew of volatile chaos but in our capitalist society the news media and pundits scrub economic class from the equation leaving a crucial part of the solutions off the table.

[KnicksGadfly]

even if cops made the mistake, homie should of just took the arrest. Never run away from cops. even if you lose in court, your life isnt worth the fight.

Do you not know that people die when they listen to cops, too? Or when they don't? And when they're sleeping? You think your solution fixes this problem?

[nyczlegacy]

even if cops made the mistake, homie should of just took the arrest. Never run away from cops. even if you lose in court, your life isnt worth the fight.

Do you not know that people die when they listen to cops, too? Or when they don't? And when they're sleeping? You think your solution fixes this problem?

[8516knicks]

Prosecutor destroying Chauvin use of force expert = "So trying to breath is being non-compliant?"

[Synciere]

So you guys are saying these cops killing unarmed civilians is justified because the civilians didn’t comply 100%? So if a cop says put your hands in the air but you sit still it’s justified that they kill you?

[HarthorneWingo]

Do you know how much money we could save by reducing the police force while making it more specialized and adding other specialized local government departments handle those things that cops aren’t equipped to do.

A lot. My work has a lot of interface with cops. Everyone on the force I know would rather be putting their time and resources into more impactful work that would cater more to their specific level of expertise. Like, busting actual criminal activity.

We could save even more if we ended the "war on drugs" at the federal level. Disbanded the DEA and it's multi-billion dollar budget. Disband the ATF and all the other duplicative federal agencies that have grown into a monstrous onion since prohibition. Then local police won't be tasked with enforcing the failed war on drugs. Young men won't go to jail for 5 years for doing something that's legal 2 states over leaving their families behind. The police can focus on violent crime like robberies, rapes, murder and assault. They can walk their beat without the pressure to frisk every person for weed or smack. About half the violent crime in cities is either direct or indirectly the result of drugs. In rural areas it's been rising over the last 10 years as the meth / opioid crisis has grown. Forcing quotas on local cops to enforce federal laws on recreational drug use is a stain on this country and the root of a ton of these problems.

Electing judges and DAs is the other big problem.

Public campaign financing laws. If the money is limited by law and comes from one coffer, then (1) candidates won't have to campaign for 75% of their time in office; (2) the length of the campaigns start on Day A and end on Election Day (I'd make it 3 months for the primary and another 3 for the general. I think Europe has something like this in place.

Judges should be appointed based on merit selection based on reports from the local bar associations.