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Knicks - Pelicans PG

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Re: Knicks - Pelicans PG 

Post#441 » by cgmw » Fri Apr 16, 2021 1:36 am

B8RcDeMktfxC wrote:
cgmw wrote:We should have tanked the minute we fired Fiz/traded Mook. We might have Lamelo rn. Matter of fact we never should have signed a million vet mercs once we missed on KD/Kyrie.

We should have tanked the Luka year too.

Idk why it’s so controversial. People love beating up on Obi, Knox and Frank when those same folks were cheering late season victories led by Trey Burke, Emmanuel Mudiay, Mo Harkless, and Bobby Portis.

It’s not some giant leap of logic to see that we should have one of these players on our roster by now:

Tatum
Luka
Trae Young
D. Fox
Lamelo

Edit: to be 100% clear it’s too damn late to tank 2021 and I’m NOT saying that would have been better than the Thibs playoff miracle, which is amazing yay ra ra rainbow skittle oreos or whatever.

Is 'rainbow skittle oreos' the contemporary 'honey nut cheerios'? :-?

Idk whatever the hell 3toheadmelo is gorging on.... oh! I see what you did there. KG = KnicksGod?
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Re: Knicks - Pelicans PG 

Post#442 » by Richard4444 » Fri Apr 16, 2021 1:36 am

HarthorneWingo wrote:
Richard4444 wrote:
cgmw wrote:It’ll be a trade. That’s the CAA-WWW inherent promise.

Plan A: We will grease the wheels to force Minnesota or Phoenix or DC or some small/mid market team to give up their franchise player. Same plan as Marbury and Melo.

Plan B: The Hardaway and Randle signings are clearly the Knicks go-to backup strategy of overpaying 24 year olds who maybe might take that next leap. Lonzo looks made to order for that.

Plan C: I could easily see Golden State or Portland finally giving up and reloading, and there wouldn’t be too many teams with better assets than us who also have a legit chance to compete willing to take on a 34 year old superstar making $35m+.

Plan D: There’s always John Wall. Brody too.

Maybe I’m wrong and Leon really is building from within on a 10 year timeline. But nothing about anything ever points that direction.

I predict Knick fans will be hype as hell for 2022 with some hope that in 2023 we’d be good enough to attract another major player. Honestly I wouldn’t rule out LeBron playing here when he’s 40 with a super team and Bronny or some such nonsense.


You are right. And plan A, B, C are really solid. It's the right move.


Okay. Does this includes extending Randle and, if so, at what price?


If Randle repeats this year's performance, he will get a max offer. The same one we would have paid to KP.
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Re: Knicks - Pelicans PG 

Post#443 » by B8RcDeMktfxC » Fri Apr 16, 2021 1:38 am

cgmw wrote:
Richard4444 wrote:
cgmw wrote:First of all, you post GIFs and talk about yourself and your snack habits daily, so pot kettle, my friend.

Secondly, it’s weird to me that anyone in 2021 could follow this team daily (for 30+ years) and NOT make it their personal mission to correct fans who defend the lousy owner. You want a better product? Get a better team owner. Or at least hold the mf’er accountable. Fans talking about “bad luck” and “pointless to blame Dolan” in 20 f*cking 21 FOH :lol:


He is the owner. If you can stand him, you have to get another team.

It sucks. But it is the reality.

Nope. Do you see Spike giving up his ticket? The team is just an idea. Dolan doesn’t really “own” it. We do. He’s the one who has to deal with us.

I know billions of dollars sounds great, but he has to live with knowing that millions of us justifiably loathe him for being a loser, including most of his own employees.

Anyway... because people think I’m negative:

I’m telling my fellow Knick fans: optimism is called for. Leon should be able to transform this year’s Thibs miracle into something special by 2023.

Sure it sounds heartless to trade RJ and Mitch, but believe me nobody will be complaining when Steph/Klay/Dame/KAT (or some such Starphking Frankenstein) take on Durant in the ECF.

Dolan really does own the franchise. Ask Supersonics fans and (if there were any) Vancouver fans if they still have a team to support.

Knicks fans, just like ManUtd fans, have to deal with the owner. Barca - no - the fans have control.

If whoever owns RealGM decides to shut the forum down you have no influence, despite your 17.75k posts over 18 years. That doesn't matter.
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Re: Knicks - Pelicans PG 

Post#444 » by cgmw » Fri Apr 16, 2021 1:42 am

Richard4444 wrote:
cgmw wrote:We should have tanked the minute we fired Fiz/traded Mook. We might have Lamelo rn. Matter of fact we never should have signed a million vet mercs once we missed on KD/Kyrie.

We should have tanked the Luka year too.

Idk why it’s so controversial. People love beating up on Obi, Knox and Frank when those same folks were cheering late season victories led by Trey Burke, Emmanuel Mudiay, Mo Harkless, and Bobby Portis.

It’s not some giant leap of logic to see that we should have one of these players on our roster by now:

Tatum
Luka
Trae Young
D. Fox
Lamelo

Edit: to be 100% clear it’s too damn late to tank 2021 and I’m NOT saying that would have been better than the Thibs playoff miracle, which is amazing yay ra ra rainbow skittle oreos or whatever.


That is ridiculous.

Who would we play if we cant play buns like Burke or Mud? We had 20% of winning ratio in last 30 games that season. We really tanked pretty hard and beautiful after losing KP. But it was not enough. Because a lot of teams tanked too. And we had many wins with KP.

Those bums were established NBA pros, or at the very least grown men. I personally chanted “Bobby Portis” at the Garden as he led us to fun but empty victories. I knew I was wrong but I was having too much fun to care.

We should have just played the hell out of our rookies and g-leaguers. I just as easily would have chanted “Iggy Brazzy.”
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Re: Knicks - Pelicans PG 

Post#445 » by Richard4444 » Fri Apr 16, 2021 1:47 am

Clyde_Style wrote:
cgmw wrote:We should have tanked the minute we fired Fiz/traded Mook. We might have Lamelo rn. Matter of fact we never should have signed a million vet mercs once we missed on KD/Kyrie.

We should have tanked the Luka year too.

Idk why it’s so controversial. People love beating up on Obi, Knox and Frank when those same folks were cheering late season victories led by Trey Burke, Emmanuel Mudiay, Mo Harkless, and Bobby Portis.

It’s not some giant leap of logic to see that we should have one of these players on our roster by now:

Tatum
Luka
Trae Young
D. Fox
Lamelo


I don't like beating up on Knox, Frank or Obi because it just feels dirty. It's not their fault they were drafted with the 8th pick in the draft. I had hopes for Frank, but him and Knox lack the fire you need to make it.

We should have a Luka or Lamelo by now. The reality is there enough Knicks fans who would have supported a full-blown tank to mitigate any public pressure on Dolan to win meaningless games. That's the real irony. He had a guaranteed income stream with little risk if he tanked, so the pressure to starphuck is more a fiction of the mind than a reality.


The games were won by the players. Not Dolan. Players don't tank.

And the players were not playing well last year. Randle was awful. Mitch was still a reserve. Bullock was shooting poorly. Harkless is a bum. Portis was lost in the system. Payton was playing surprisingly well. But he could run out of luck anytime because he has no talent at all. We did not have different makers that could win consistently single handed the games to jeopardize the tank. We would have 15 tough games left to properly tank if the pandemic did not have happened.
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Re: Knicks - Pelicans PG 

Post#446 » by Richard4444 » Fri Apr 16, 2021 1:53 am

cgmw wrote:
Richard4444 wrote:
cgmw wrote:We should have tanked the minute we fired Fiz/traded Mook. We might have Lamelo rn. Matter of fact we never should have signed a million vet mercs once we missed on KD/Kyrie.

We should have tanked the Luka year too.

Idk why it’s so controversial. People love beating up on Obi, Knox and Frank when those same folks were cheering late season victories led by Trey Burke, Emmanuel Mudiay, Mo Harkless, and Bobby Portis.

It’s not some giant leap of logic to see that we should have one of these players on our roster by now:

Tatum
Luka
Trae Young
D. Fox
Lamelo

Edit: to be 100% clear it’s too damn late to tank 2021 and I’m NOT saying that would have been better than the Thibs playoff miracle, which is amazing yay ra ra rainbow skittle oreos or whatever.


That is ridiculous.

Who would we play if we cant play buns like Burke or Mud? We had 20% of winning ratio in last 30 games that season. We really tanked pretty hard and beautiful after losing KP. But it was not enough. Because a lot of teams tanked too. And we had many wins with KP.

Those bums were established NBA pros, or at the very least grown men. I personally chanted “Bobby Portis” at the Garden as he led us to fun but empty victories. I knew I was wrong but I was having too much fun to care.

We should have just played the hell out of our rookies and g-leaguers. I just as easily would have chanted “Iggy Brazzy.”


I was talking about 2018. And we get a G-league in Burke to play that year. And tankers blame him for getting Knox. Its not easy to lose in NBA. Any bun can be inspired and make a difference.
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Re: Knicks - Pelicans PG 

Post#447 » by Richard4444 » Fri Apr 16, 2021 2:04 am

B8RcDeMktfxC wrote:
cgmw wrote:
Richard4444 wrote:
He is the owner. If you can stand him, you have to get another team.

It sucks. But it is the reality.

Nope. Do you see Spike giving up his ticket? The team is just an idea. Dolan doesn’t really “own” it. We do. He’s the one who has to deal with us.

I know billions of dollars sounds great, but he has to live with knowing that millions of us justifiably loathe him for being a loser, including most of his own employees.

Anyway... because people think I’m negative:

I’m telling my fellow Knick fans: optimism is called for. Leon should be able to transform this year’s Thibs miracle into something special by 2023.

Sure it sounds heartless to trade RJ and Mitch, but believe me nobody will be complaining when Steph/Klay/Dame/KAT (or some such Starphking Frankenstein) take on Durant in the ECF.

Dolan really does own the franchise. Ask Supersonics fans and (if there were any) Vancouver fans if they still have a team to support.

Knicks fans, just like ManUtd fans, have to deal with the owner. Barca - no - the fans have control.

If whoever owns RealGM decides to shut the forum down you have no influence, despite your 17.75k posts over 18 years. That doesn't matter.


And Barça management sucks with fans at the command. Imagine Real Gm fans running the Knicks...
Frank getting the max...
Dotson and Baker getting 4-year deals...
Hayes being drafted...
Bertans getting a 80/4 deal...
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Re: Knicks - Pelicans PG 

Post#448 » by Clyde_Style » Fri Apr 16, 2021 2:25 am

Richard4444 wrote:
Clyde_Style wrote:
cgmw wrote:We should have tanked the minute we fired Fiz/traded Mook. We might have Lamelo rn. Matter of fact we never should have signed a million vet mercs once we missed on KD/Kyrie.

We should have tanked the Luka year too.

Idk why it’s so controversial. People love beating up on Obi, Knox and Frank when those same folks were cheering late season victories led by Trey Burke, Emmanuel Mudiay, Mo Harkless, and Bobby Portis.

It’s not some giant leap of logic to see that we should have one of these players on our roster by now:

Tatum
Luka
Trae Young
D. Fox
Lamelo


I don't like beating up on Knox, Frank or Obi because it just feels dirty. It's not their fault they were drafted with the 8th pick in the draft. I had hopes for Frank, but him and Knox lack the fire you need to make it.

We should have a Luka or Lamelo by now. The reality is there enough Knicks fans who would have supported a full-blown tank to mitigate any public pressure on Dolan to win meaningless games. That's the real irony. He had a guaranteed income stream with little risk if he tanked, so the pressure to starphuck is more a fiction of the mind than a reality.


The games were won by the players. Not Dolan. Players don't tank.

And the players were not playing well last year. Randle was awful. Mitch was still a reserve. Bullock was shooting poorly. Harkless is a bum. Portis was lost in the system. Payton was playing surprisingly well. But he could run out of luck anytime because he has no talent at all. We did not have different makers that could win consistently single handed the games to jeopardize the tank. We would have 15 tough games left to properly tank if the pandemic did not have happened.


Players don't tank. Who you play is the topic though, right?

You can purposefully tank as a FO and coach by playing less experienced players who probably will win less games. And in the process they gain some experience regardless of whether they amount to anything as players in the future.
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Re: Knicks - Pelicans PG 

Post#449 » by digitaldropoff » Fri Apr 16, 2021 2:31 am

TheGreenArrow wrote:
Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


The culture is changing folks!!!

THE CULTURE IS CHANGING!!!!!


Said Minnesota three years ago...
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Re: Knicks - Pelicans PG 

Post#450 » by digitaldropoff » Fri Apr 16, 2021 2:34 am

3toheadmelo wrote:
cgmw wrote:
3toheadmelo wrote:i think we're more likely to go after lavine. we've been monitoring his situation since last summer. maybe they trade for him instead of waiting. dont think we've been linked to beal

You keep sweating Zach, but in what universe does Chicago not offer him the Max? Are you saying he’d take less money to come here? Or that he’d somehow demand a trade? I know he’s your boy, but that ship has sailed. Chicago not giving him up to build around Vuc.

Zach LaVine will become eligible to sign an extension with the Chicago Bulls in the offseason, but it will be limited to a four-year, $104 million contract. If LaVine waits until free agency in 2022, he could sign a four-year, $155 million deal with a rival team.


Knicks have a more promising future than the bulls. Why would he want to stay there over joining us?


Because they traded for him as their centerpiece and can pay him the most?
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Re: Knicks - Pelicans PG 

Post#451 » by cgmw » Fri Apr 16, 2021 2:34 am

Clyde_Style wrote:
Richard4444 wrote:
Clyde_Style wrote:
I don't like beating up on Knox, Frank or Obi because it just feels dirty. It's not their fault they were drafted with the 8th pick in the draft. I had hopes for Frank, but him and Knox lack the fire you need to make it.

We should have a Luka or Lamelo by now. The reality is there enough Knicks fans who would have supported a full-blown tank to mitigate any public pressure on Dolan to win meaningless games. That's the real irony. He had a guaranteed income stream with little risk if he tanked, so the pressure to starphuck is more a fiction of the mind than a reality.


The games were won by the players. Not Dolan. Players don't tank.

And the players were not playing well last year. Randle was awful. Mitch was still a reserve. Bullock was shooting poorly. Harkless is a bum. Portis was lost in the system. Payton was playing surprisingly well. But he could run out of luck anytime because he has no talent at all. We did not have different makers that could win consistently single handed the games to jeopardize the tank. We would have 15 tough games left to properly tank if the pandemic did not have happened.


Players don't tank. Who you play is the topic though, right?

You can purposefully tank as a FO and coach by playing less experienced players who probably will win less games. And in the process they gain some experience regardless of whether they amount to anything as players in the future.

Oh Clyde, as “luck” would have it the President and GM were scared for their jobs and the interim coach was under the assumption that only a miracle winning streak could save his job.

But I’m sure that had nothing to do with it. Like a clown car driving full speed into a brick wall then trying to douse the flames with seltzer. Stupid bad luck.
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Re: Knicks - Pelicans PG 

Post#452 » by GEOLINK » Fri Apr 16, 2021 2:35 am

digitaldropoff wrote:
TheGreenArrow wrote:
Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


The culture is changing folks!!!

THE CULTURE IS CHANGING!!!!!


Said Minnesota three years ago...

Jules and RJ seem like they have a better work ethic than KAT.
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Re: Knicks - Pelicans PG 

Post#453 » by digitaldropoff » Fri Apr 16, 2021 2:57 am

GEOLINK wrote:
digitaldropoff wrote:
TheGreenArrow wrote:
Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


The culture is changing folks!!!

THE CULTURE IS CHANGING!!!!!


Said Minnesota three years ago...

Jules and RJ seem like they have a better work ethic than KAT.


RJ maybe, Randle is playing a lot of minutes, it doesn't mean he's giving more effort than KAT. He's tired though, so that's a thing. My point still stands, Thibs came in and basically delivered exactly what NY is getting right now. His track record is proven, but maybe NY will break his cycle?
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Re: Knicks - Pelicans PG 

Post#454 » by GEOLINK » Fri Apr 16, 2021 2:59 am

digitaldropoff wrote:
GEOLINK wrote:
digitaldropoff wrote:
Said Minnesota three years ago...

Jules and RJ seem like they have a better work ethic than KAT.


RJ maybe, Randle is playing a lot of minutes, it doesn't mean he's giving more effort than KAT. He's tired though, so that's a thing. My point still stands, Thibs came in and basically delivered exactly what NY is getting right now. His track record is proven, but maybe NY will break his cycle?

Playing more minutes isn't an excuse. He has fundamentally improved his game this season. That comes with work ethic in the summer and through the season.

Jimmy Butler already let the cat out of the bag when he was in Minnesota of how soft KAT is.

KAT's been in the league for how long? When is he gonna take that next step?
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Re: Knicks - Pelicans PG 

Post#455 » by El Poochio » Fri Apr 16, 2021 3:11 am

Clyde_Style wrote:
El Poochio wrote:
Clyde_Style wrote:
Try taking off your Quaalude-Colored glasses


Clyde need your help does the acheulean bifaces of polycene epoch shed a light on the age of verbarsagitta or do we have to vinyl chloride trace it through sub genes of autochthonous oval headed therianthropes?


Yes

Pro-crustacean apologetics from the Pre-digestible era of amoratory shellfish gyrations were predicated on epistolatory etudes composed on bushwacked antipodal farfisa organs assembled from the ravaged vestigal remains of the antideluvian smorgasboard of entrails typically found in the posterior of yours truly.


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Re: Knicks - Pelicans PG 

Post#456 » by Clyde_Style » Fri Apr 16, 2021 3:25 am

cgmw wrote:
Clyde_Style wrote:
Richard4444 wrote:
The games were won by the players. Not Dolan. Players don't tank.

And the players were not playing well last year. Randle was awful. Mitch was still a reserve. Bullock was shooting poorly. Harkless is a bum. Portis was lost in the system. Payton was playing surprisingly well. But he could run out of luck anytime because he has no talent at all. We did not have different makers that could win consistently single handed the games to jeopardize the tank. We would have 15 tough games left to properly tank if the pandemic did not have happened.


Players don't tank. Who you play is the topic though, right?

You can purposefully tank as a FO and coach by playing less experienced players who probably will win less games. And in the process they gain some experience regardless of whether they amount to anything as players in the future.

Oh Clyde, as “luck” would have it the President and GM were scared for their jobs and the interim coach was under the assumption that only a miracle winning streak could save his job.

But I’m sure that had nothing to do with it. Like a clown car driving full speed into a brick wall then trying to douse the flames with seltzer. Stupid bad luck.


I'm not sure you always recognize when someone is trying to agree with you :lol:
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Re: Knicks - Pelicans PG 

Post#457 » by Clyde_Style » Fri Apr 16, 2021 3:30 am

El Poochio wrote:
Clyde_Style wrote:
El Poochio wrote:
Clyde need your help does the acheulean bifaces of polycene epoch shed a light on the age of verbarsagitta or do we have to vinyl chloride trace it through sub genes of autochthonous oval headed therianthropes?


Yes

Pro-crustacean apologetics from the Pre-digestible era of amoratory shellfish gyrations were predicated on epistolatory etudes composed on bushwacked antipodal farfisa organs assembled from the ravaged vestigal remains of the antideluvian smorgasboard of entrails typically found in the posterior of yours truly.


Ita putavit gratias ago


interrogate et accipies
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Re: Knicks - Pelicans PG 

Post#458 » by Richard4444 » Fri Apr 16, 2021 3:35 am

digitaldropoff wrote:
3toheadmelo wrote:
cgmw wrote:You keep sweating Zach, but in what universe does Chicago not offer him the Max? Are you saying he’d take less money to come here? Or that he’d somehow demand a trade? I know he’s your boy, but that ship has sailed. Chicago not giving him up to build around Vuc.

Zach LaVine will become eligible to sign an extension with the Chicago Bulls in the offseason, but it will be limited to a four-year, $104 million contract. If LaVine waits until free agency in 2022, he could sign a four-year, $155 million deal with a rival team.


Knicks have a more promising future than the bulls. Why would he want to stay there over joining us?


Because they traded for him as their centerpiece and can pay him the most?


The money difference is not so big (5 years against 4 years and 8% against 5% of increase each year). Besides, a bigger market contender can give him more money on side deals and a better shot in winning a title.

He also can threaten to walk and force a trade to a bigger market/better contender.
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Re: Knicks - Pelicans PG 

Post#459 » by BKlutch » Fri Apr 16, 2021 3:38 am

cgmw wrote:KG, any argument over development is moot. Thibs is here and the Knicks have done a phenomenal job of developing Randle into an All Star and RJ into a bonafide starter and key contributor at only 20 y/o.

If I’m Lonzo Ball or any 4-5 year vet whose been underperforming All Star potential, I’m wondering if Thibs can do the same for me. To me, that counts as development. I just don’t think MSG has much patience for teenagers at this point. Their “timeline” is 2021, 2022, and 2023.

If Alec Burks is more reliable right now, then Burks gets touches over IQ period, end of story. Doesn’t matter how good IQ might be later. Our “timeline” is NOW.

That’s always been what Dolan wanted. It’s just taken him a long ass time to find management and coaching who could deliver.

I remember very well a previous era on this board where you were very vocal in your defense of Dolan, which made me want to vomit. We’ve made great progress as fans to properly identify and hold accountable the root cause of our unnecessary misery these past 20 years, and I hope we don’t walk it back now just because we’re poised to make the Pandemic Playoffs.

Maximum public pressure on Dolan is the best possible thing for our Knicks. There are only 2 scenarios that should change that:

1) He sells;
2) We win.

Otherwise Dolan is public enemy number one. Again, I’m cautiously optimistic about Leon and Thibs being the right guys for the job, and this year has been a huge leap forward. But phase 2 of the plan will be in Leon’s hands, and we shall see what he does. Previous regimes have crumbled when it came time to spend Dolan’s money and deliver on the inherent promise of landing star players.

Best thing you’ve written in a long time
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Re: Knicks - Pelicans PG 

Post#460 » by El Poochio » Fri Apr 16, 2021 3:43 am

Clyde_Style wrote:
El Poochio wrote:
Clyde_Style wrote:
Yes

Pro-crustacean apologetics from the Pre-digestible era of amoratory shellfish gyrations were predicated on epistolatory etudes composed on bushwacked antipodal farfisa organs assembled from the ravaged vestigal remains of the antideluvian smorgasboard of entrails typically found in the posterior of yours truly.


Ita putavit gratias ago


interrogate et accipies


May you rub Kuzma's head one day and fortune bestow upon
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B: L. Doncic | J. Carter | D. Banton
B: D. Melton | A. Burks
B: B. Ingram | K. Oubre | J. Tate
B: Z. Williamson | DJJ | K. Lofton Jr
B: KP | D. Powell

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