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2020-2021 College/Draft Thread Part 3

Moderators: King of Canada, Thugger HBC, NoLayupRule, Jeff Van Gully, Deeeez Knicks, GONYK, Capn'O, mpharris36, mrpoetryNmotion, j4remi, K-DOT

Who do you guys want the most assuming all of these players are within our range

James Bouknight
24
24%
Ayo Dosunmo
4
4%
Tre Mann
12
12%
Davion Mitchell
15
15%
Josh Giddey
21
21%
Jared Butler
6
6%
Ziaire Williams
5
5%
BJ Boston
2
2%
Moses Moody
4
4%
Sharife Cooper
8
8%
 
Total votes: 101

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Re: 2020-2021 College/Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#821 » by moocow007 » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:26 pm

Knicksfan1992 wrote:
mpharris36 wrote:
cgf wrote: 6'6" still isn't over 6'6" :wink:


Yeah I was taking the question as outside of guards like Green and Suggs who are guards that can create there own shot (then you have guys like Bouknight and Mann who are really good on the ball. Who was a wing that could create his own shot outside of Cade. Kuminga is probably up there.

Barnes in terms of creating for others...but his scoring game is so raw right now.


This is going to be hot takey a little bit but i'm not 100% sold on Cade's ability to create his own shot at the next level. I think his understanding of the game and reads out of pick and roll are outstanding and he has by far the highest floor in this draft, but as far as self creation is concerned i'm a tad bit worried about him at the next level. Maybe he ends up like Luka where he's so big that it doesn't even matter and he can just shoot over the top or bully his way in but i'm worried about his ability to separate going downhill.

I'm not saying I would take Jalen Green over him ( I wouldn't in any scenario), but I think there's a world where Jalen Green ends up being the better offensive player.


I agree. I would not want to be the guy that passed on Green if he lives up to what I think he can be in the NBA. From a pure NBA potential POV I think Green is the top guy. If I had the 1st overall pick it would be between these 2 guys.
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Re: 2020-2021 College/Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#822 » by cgf » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:27 pm

DaGawd wrote:
newyorker4ever wrote:https://theknickswall.com/knicks-should-hold-both-first-round-nba-draft-picks/

With a Julius Randle extension over the horizon and a pursuit of a superstar, the Knicks should keep both of their first-round NBA Draft picks this year.

For the first time since 2016, the New York Knicks aren’t picking in the top 10 of the NBA draft. I’m not quite sure how to feel about that. What I do know is that there’s no need to watch the NBA Draft Lottery, no need to sweat over ping-pong balls, and no need to get frustrated when the Knicks either remain in their original slot or move down. And there’s a bit of bonus compared to other seasons; thanks to the Tim Hardaway Jr. trade to Dallas, the Knicks have two first-round picks: 19th and 21st overall.

After receiving hands and feet from the Atlanta Hawks in the first round of NBA playoffs, the Knicks must now regroup and explore all options to improve their roster. Free agency will be the talk of the town as the Knicks sit back with nearly $50 million in cap space to spend. However, one popular move discussed has been to use both first-round picks to move up in the draft.



Consider me skeptical on the idea. I’m of the mind the Knicks should use their top three draft selections—picks 19, 21, 32—to attempt to improve the roster, both for now and for the future.

And while the class appears star-studded at the top, the drop-off starts about pick five or so, a range the Knicks can’t get into. The last trade involving two non-lottery picks for a lottery pick was the 2017 NBA Draft, where the Portland Trail Blazers moved the 15th and 20th selections to the Sacramento Kings for the 10th overall pick. It’s not an impossible task, but Portland had the first pick just outside the lottery, whereas New York is at 19th overall, quite a bit ways away.

So, let’s talk about why the Knicks should keep both of their first-round picks.

Really feel like we should get creative and either try and move up or package those picks for an established player. Thibs isn’t gonna play too many young guys at once

When Mitch got hurt our leaders in playing time (in order) were Randle, Barrett & Robinson...with IQ getting 20 a night on a playoff team, Obi getting a consistent shift despite not being ready for most of the season, and Thibs having given both Knox & Ntilikina shots to secure rotation spots that they failed to capitalize on.

...so why again are we assuming thibs isn't going to play & develop young players next season?
dogrufus wrote:Plus the win would put us at .500 and 5 straight wins, making every poster here cream in their pants.

We're Knicks fans. We never get to cream.


cgmw wrote:Basically, in conclusion: I'd like Dolan to get off my lawn.
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Re: 2020-2021 College/Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#823 » by DaGawd » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:29 pm

cgf wrote:
DaGawd wrote:
newyorker4ever wrote:https://theknickswall.com/knicks-should-hold-both-first-round-nba-draft-picks/

With a Julius Randle extension over the horizon and a pursuit of a superstar, the Knicks should keep both of their first-round NBA Draft picks this year.

For the first time since 2016, the New York Knicks aren’t picking in the top 10 of the NBA draft. I’m not quite sure how to feel about that. What I do know is that there’s no need to watch the NBA Draft Lottery, no need to sweat over ping-pong balls, and no need to get frustrated when the Knicks either remain in their original slot or move down. And there’s a bit of bonus compared to other seasons; thanks to the Tim Hardaway Jr. trade to Dallas, the Knicks have two first-round picks: 19th and 21st overall.

After receiving hands and feet from the Atlanta Hawks in the first round of NBA playoffs, the Knicks must now regroup and explore all options to improve their roster. Free agency will be the talk of the town as the Knicks sit back with nearly $50 million in cap space to spend. However, one popular move discussed has been to use both first-round picks to move up in the draft.



Consider me skeptical on the idea. I’m of the mind the Knicks should use their top three draft selections—picks 19, 21, 32—to attempt to improve the roster, both for now and for the future.

And while the class appears star-studded at the top, the drop-off starts about pick five or so, a range the Knicks can’t get into. The last trade involving two non-lottery picks for a lottery pick was the 2017 NBA Draft, where the Portland Trail Blazers moved the 15th and 20th selections to the Sacramento Kings for the 10th overall pick. It’s not an impossible task, but Portland had the first pick just outside the lottery, whereas New York is at 19th overall, quite a bit ways away.

So, let’s talk about why the Knicks should keep both of their first-round picks.

Really feel like we should get creative and either try and move up or package those picks for an established player. Thibs isn’t gonna play too many young guys at once

When Mitch got hurt our leaders in playing time (in order) were Randle, Barrett & Robinson...with IQ getting 20 a night on a playoff team, Obi getting a consistent shift despite not being ready for most of the season, and Thibs having given both Knox & Ntilikina shots to secure rotation spots that they failed to capitalize on.

...so why again are we assuming thibs isn't going to play & develop young players next season?

I didn’t say that but at some point you have more picks than roster spots even available. You need a mix of both gets and youth. The youth I feel should move the needle a bit if they’re gonna play and not play just because they’re young
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Re: 2020-2021 College/Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#824 » by Deeeez Knicks » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:31 pm

2010 wrote:
TheGreenArrow wrote:
Read on Twitter


Let’s gooooo!!!!!!

Giddey is my #1 target!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Word! And I was the 1st person to post/talk about Giddy soon as the college draft thread for 2020-21 was opened.

I’d be giddy about Giddey if he is selected.


Yea, I am on the Giddey train. Would love to move up and grab him.
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Re: 2020-2021 College/Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#825 » by cgf » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:32 pm

mpharris36 wrote:Yeah I haven't seen enough of Giddey outside a few clips to make a determination. Sounds like he has improved a lot in some key areas. But people do tend to fall in love with tall guys that can handle and pass...my concern is he doesn't look like a great athlete and his shot is ugly. I really don't see much off the dribble shooting in his future which always held rubio back as a player.

I think its very challenging, no matter how big you are to be a suspect athlete and a poor shooting to have a big impact in todays NBA which is all about pace and space. You can survive without one but without both?

He's a really fun passer though.

What makes me more optimistic with him than I am my countryman Franz Wagner, is the progress that Giddey made as a shooter to close the year. With these young & raw kids, I feel like how quickly they are picking things up / adding to their game can be more important than what their game already has...and Giddey is one of the kids whose tape looked a lot more exciting when the season ended than when it began.

But yeah, I'm still not as high on him as I am Ziaire, Bouknight or Moody.
dogrufus wrote:Plus the win would put us at .500 and 5 straight wins, making every poster here cream in their pants.

We're Knicks fans. We never get to cream.


cgmw wrote:Basically, in conclusion: I'd like Dolan to get off my lawn.
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Re: 2020-2021 College/Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#826 » by WargamesX » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:32 pm

cgf wrote:
DaGawd wrote:
newyorker4ever wrote:https://theknickswall.com/knicks-should-hold-both-first-round-nba-draft-picks/

With a Julius Randle extension over the horizon and a pursuit of a superstar, the Knicks should keep both of their first-round NBA Draft picks this year.

For the first time since 2016, the New York Knicks aren’t picking in the top 10 of the NBA draft. I’m not quite sure how to feel about that. What I do know is that there’s no need to watch the NBA Draft Lottery, no need to sweat over ping-pong balls, and no need to get frustrated when the Knicks either remain in their original slot or move down. And there’s a bit of bonus compared to other seasons; thanks to the Tim Hardaway Jr. trade to Dallas, the Knicks have two first-round picks: 19th and 21st overall.

After receiving hands and feet from the Atlanta Hawks in the first round of NBA playoffs, the Knicks must now regroup and explore all options to improve their roster. Free agency will be the talk of the town as the Knicks sit back with nearly $50 million in cap space to spend. However, one popular move discussed has been to use both first-round picks to move up in the draft.



Consider me skeptical on the idea. I’m of the mind the Knicks should use their top three draft selections—picks 19, 21, 32—to attempt to improve the roster, both for now and for the future.

And while the class appears star-studded at the top, the drop-off starts about pick five or so, a range the Knicks can’t get into. The last trade involving two non-lottery picks for a lottery pick was the 2017 NBA Draft, where the Portland Trail Blazers moved the 15th and 20th selections to the Sacramento Kings for the 10th overall pick. It’s not an impossible task, but Portland had the first pick just outside the lottery, whereas New York is at 19th overall, quite a bit ways away.

So, let’s talk about why the Knicks should keep both of their first-round picks.

Really feel like we should get creative and either try and move up or package those picks for an established player. Thibs isn’t gonna play too many young guys at once

When Mitch got hurt our leaders in playing time (in order) were Randle, Barrett & Robinson...with IQ getting 20 a night on a playoff team, Obi getting a consistent shift despite not being ready for most of the season, and Thibs having given both Knox & Ntilikina shots to secure rotation spots that they failed to capitalize on.

...so why again are we assuming thibs isn't going to play & develop young players next season?


Yep, I got to agree. I crap on Thibs for his coaching issues but he does play the kids if they have something he trusts.

The biggest take away from next year and ways for us to analyze the draft is I expect them to draft kids who have skills that will work in the nba day one. I don’t see them going after upside projects.
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Re: 2020-2021 College/Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#827 » by Deeeez Knicks » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:35 pm

3toheadmelo wrote:Another hot take. Josh Giddey seems more like Tomas Satoransky than Lamelo Ball to me. I would take Bouknight, Tre Mann, Ayo Dosunmo over him.


Giddey isn't Ball but he isn't Tomas either....

I would take Giddey over all those guys
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Re: 2020-2021 College/Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#828 » by 3toheadmelo » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:37 pm

Bones Hyland is still someone I want badly. Lottery talent in my opinion

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Re: 2020-2021 College/Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#829 » by mpharris36 » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:37 pm

Deeeez Knicks wrote:
2010 wrote:
TheGreenArrow wrote:
Read on Twitter


Let’s gooooo!!!!!!

Giddey is my #1 target!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Word! And I was the 1st person to post/talk about Giddy soon as the college draft thread for 2020-21 was opened.

I’d be giddy about Giddey if he is selected.


Yea, I am on the Giddey train. Would love to move up and grab him.



Tough to believe the tweet when he doesn't even spell his name right :lol:
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Re: 2020-2021 College/Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#830 » by 3toheadmelo » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:40 pm

Deeeez Knicks wrote:
3toheadmelo wrote:Another hot take. Josh Giddey seems more like Tomas Satoransky than Lamelo Ball to me. I would take Bouknight, Tre Mann, Ayo Dosunmo over him.


Giddey isn't Ball but he isn't Tomas either....

I would take Giddey over all those guys

I wouldn’t
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Re: 2020-2021 College/Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#831 » by cgf » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:43 pm

DaGawd wrote:
cgf wrote:
DaGawd wrote:Really feel like we should get creative and either try and move up or package those picks for an established player. Thibs isn’t gonna play too many young guys at once

When Mitch got hurt our leaders in playing time (in order) were Randle, Barrett & Robinson...with IQ getting 20 a night on a playoff team, Obi getting a consistent shift despite not being ready for most of the season, and Thibs having given both Knox & Ntilikina shots to secure rotation spots that they failed to capitalize on.

...so why again are we assuming thibs isn't going to play & develop young players next season?

I didn’t say that but at some point you have more picks than roster spots even available. You need a mix of both gets and youth. The youth I feel should move the needle a bit if they’re gonna play and not play just because they’re young

That's fair, but a) I don't think if we're there yet...especially if we have a tougher time bringing our supporting cast back without sacrificing our flexibility than we all hope...and b) with where we're at, I think it's ok if we draft more for the future this year and our picks end up mostly redshirting their rookie seasons before being ready to step into the rotation for 2022-2023.

Especially since we could easily be gutting all of our veteran depth next summer to make space for a big FA if Julius proves that last season wasn't a fluke, RJ takes a step, and we get an elf upgrade this summer...at which point having cheap internal depth ready to step in, would be crucial to continuing our forward momentum.
dogrufus wrote:Plus the win would put us at .500 and 5 straight wins, making every poster here cream in their pants.

We're Knicks fans. We never get to cream.


cgmw wrote:Basically, in conclusion: I'd like Dolan to get off my lawn.
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Re: 2020-2021 College/Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#832 » by cgf » Fri Jun 11, 2021 4:45 pm

3toheadmelo wrote:Bones Hyland is still someone I want badly. Lottery talent in my opinion

Read on Twitter

If we go for upside at 32 I want him or BJ Boston. Still hoping for Trey Murphy there, but if we go with two safer picks in the first, gimme Hyland or Boston at 32.
dogrufus wrote:Plus the win would put us at .500 and 5 straight wins, making every poster here cream in their pants.

We're Knicks fans. We never get to cream.


cgmw wrote:Basically, in conclusion: I'd like Dolan to get off my lawn.
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Re: 2020-2021 College/Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#833 » by WargamesX » Fri Jun 11, 2021 5:00 pm

cgf wrote:
3toheadmelo wrote:Bones Hyland is still someone I want badly. Lottery talent in my opinion

Read on Twitter

If we go for upside at 32 I want him or BJ Boston. Still hoping for Trey Murphy there, but if we go with two safer picks in the first, gimme Hyland or Boston at 32.

Nice to see you on the Trey Murphy Train... :nod:
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Re: 2020-2021 College/Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#834 » by 3toheadmelo » Fri Jun 11, 2021 5:06 pm

WargamesX wrote:
cgf wrote:
3toheadmelo wrote:Bones Hyland is still someone I want badly. Lottery talent in my opinion

Read on Twitter

If we go for upside at 32 I want him or BJ Boston. Still hoping for Trey Murphy there, but if we go with two safer picks in the first, gimme Hyland or Boston at 32.

Nice to see you on the Trey Murphy Train... :nod:

I like Murphy too. I think I was the first to mention him here a couple months ago
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Re: 2020-2021 College/Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#835 » by damedash09 » Fri Jun 11, 2021 5:11 pm

Read on Twitter
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Re: 2020-2021 College/Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#836 » by cgf » Fri Jun 11, 2021 5:18 pm

WargamesX wrote:
cgf wrote:
3toheadmelo wrote:Bones Hyland is still someone I want badly. Lottery talent in my opinion

Read on Twitter

If we go for upside at 32 I want him or BJ Boston. Still hoping for Trey Murphy there, but if we go with two safer picks in the first, gimme Hyland or Boston at 32.

Nice to see you on the Trey Murphy Train... :nod:

I've been on the Trey Murphy train since melo brought him up months ago...I just want to grab him with that Pistons pick, rather than one of our firsts :wink:
dogrufus wrote:Plus the win would put us at .500 and 5 straight wins, making every poster here cream in their pants.

We're Knicks fans. We never get to cream.


cgmw wrote:Basically, in conclusion: I'd like Dolan to get off my lawn.
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Re: 2020-2021 College/Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#837 » by WargamesX » Fri Jun 11, 2021 5:19 pm

3toheadmelo wrote:
WargamesX wrote:
cgf wrote:If we go for upside at 32 I want him or BJ Boston. Still hoping for Trey Murphy there, but if we go with two safer picks in the first, gimme Hyland or Boston at 32.

Nice to see you on the Trey Murphy Train... :nod:

I like Murphy too. I think I was the first to mention him here a couple months ago

Very likely, I heard about him here and did the research. After the Hawks series I went from “I like his skills” to “We could really use his skills”

He should be there at our 1st round picks unless he dominates the combine. I don’t think he falls to the second round based on his physical profile but you never know.
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Re: 2020-2021 College/Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#838 » by 3toheadmelo » Fri Jun 11, 2021 5:23 pm

WargamesX wrote:
3toheadmelo wrote:
WargamesX wrote:Nice to see you on the Trey Murphy Train... :nod:

I like Murphy too. I think I was the first to mention him here a couple months ago

Very likely, I heard about him here and did the research. After the Hawks series I went from “I like his skills” to “We could really use his skills”

He should be there at our 1st round picks unless he dominates the combine. I don’t think he falls to the second round based on his physical profile but you never know.

I’ve been comparing him to DeAndre Hunter actually. He would definitely be a good piece here
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Re: 2020-2021 College/Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#839 » by cgf » Fri Jun 11, 2021 5:33 pm

3toheadmelo wrote:
WargamesX wrote:
3toheadmelo wrote:I like Murphy too. I think I was the first to mention him here a couple months ago

Very likely, I heard about him here and did the research. After the Hawks series I went from “I like his skills” to “We could really use his skills”

He should be there at our 1st round picks unless he dominates the combine. I don’t think he falls to the second round based on his physical profile but you never know.

I’ve been comparing him to DeAndre Hunter actually. He would definitely be a good piece here

DeAndre showed some nice playmaking & real self-creation potential in that final season. I don't think Trey showed that in college, but I do love his potential as a more pure 3&D guy, especially if he becomes a good motion shooter as he matures.
dogrufus wrote:Plus the win would put us at .500 and 5 straight wins, making every poster here cream in their pants.

We're Knicks fans. We never get to cream.


cgmw wrote:Basically, in conclusion: I'd like Dolan to get off my lawn.
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Re: 2020-2021 College/Draft Thread Part 3 

Post#840 » by louisorr » Fri Jun 11, 2021 5:42 pm

whatever happened to the hype around Jason Preston or "poor man's lamelo"
kinda looked more globetrotter than nba to me, but there was lots o hype.

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